The Moral Imperative For Drilling

[Al_Masetti]

Also according to Energy Information Admistration the oil would only last 9 years (if we still use other suppliers)? There is approximately 20 billion barrels of oil consumed every day by the U.S. and according to surveys there is only 16 billion barrels available there in ANWAR (Anwyar survey anwr.org/features/kaktovik.htm) What do we do after that?

These claims that the reserves would run out in nine years [or whatever] have been repeated over and over for more than 50 years. And yet, the oil and gas just keep coming.

What it means is that the reserves are very conservatively estimated.

What happens is that the reserves are much larger than estimated AND it also means that new technology is constantly being developed to extract more and more of the oil and gas.

Deep ocean oil and gas development is relatively new.

There was some kind of estimate that only a tiny percentage of oil and gas were recoverable from the reserves. Then the oil and gas drillers figured out how to use directional drilling, and very precise horizontal drilling. They can make 90 degree turns from vertical to horizontal and then drill branches to reach more oil and gas.

Then they can fracture rock formations such as some of the dense tight shales using very high pressure water … a million gallons of water with suspended sand or special “spacers” to force the rock open and keep it open.

This is now routine.

Do a search for Barnett shale. It’s amazing what they can do routinely now. But the naysayers deny what is actually being accomplished on a real basis on a day to day basis.

---

managedpetroleum.com/Engl…rnettshale.htm

How to frac Barnett shale.

findarticles.com/p/articles/m…n25381811/pg_3

One of many articles on how they frac Bakken shale.

This one may be better:

findarticles.com/p/articles/m…n25381811/pg_3

---

In addition, there are vast quantities of methane available in the ocean, on the ocean floor, etc.

All kinds of drilling and development can be done, but the naysayers are denying us permission to drill and develop.

 

[leftistdestroye]

Al Masetti;3802120]

These claims that the reserves would run out in nine years [or whatever] have been repeated over and over for more than 50 years. And yet, the oil and gas just keep coming.

No, he meant that the oil in ANWAR will only last 9 years.

 

[leftistdestroye]

Yerusalyim;3802059]

While this is, in part, true, calling WILL do good. The reason the Environazis are listened to is because they make the most noise…the squeky wheel get’s oiled. We who have common sense need to start making more noise.

YOur last sentace is 100% spot on.

Calling a Liberal Senator will do no good. The left wins all the time, because they actually take to the streets and yell. They are involved ALL THE TIME, unlik our side who only go to forums and whine. I have been begging my side to march up the hill forever but I cannot find many who are willing to give up the time. While you are correct that we need to make more noise, an easy useless phone call is not enough. We can begin by marching to our Rep or Senators local office and get some media attention. Remember, any press is good press. We need to get mad and get loud. REAL LOUD! That is how the left wins. Now it’s our turn. And don’t give me the same old **** about “lowering ourselves to their level” because that is lazy nonsense. (not YOU, but you know what I mean)

 

[Al_Masetti]

Al Masetti;3802120]

No, he meant that the oil in ANWAR will only last 9 years.

But they say that about ALL oil deposits.

There is no more reason to believe that the ANWR oil will last only nine years than to believe that any other oil or gas deposit will only last nine years.

My point is that the projections and predictions are notoriously unreliable.

 

[josephdavid]

But they say that about ALL oil deposits.

There is no more reason to believe that the ANWR oil will last only nine years than to believe that any other oil or gas deposit will only last nine years.

My point is that the projections and predictions are notoriously unreliable.

But what if they are right (for once haha)? For past 30 years experts have been saying that sooner than later the supply will be outsripped by demand and here are are that point. Why not be innovative as we were before as an industrial country?

Also if not the supply of oil lets look at the potentially dangerous vehicle emissions which include:

Carbon monoxide
Nitrogen dioxide
Sulphur dioxide
Benzene
Formaldehyde
Polycyclic hydrocarbons
Lead

Why not continue to develop and invest heavily into renewable and clean energies and our public transit system. Now that gas is so high Americans are using Public Transportation at an increase of 32%, and most transit systems in U.S. can not handle this.

Get the idiots that currently run Amtrak and put people in place who know how to run a business and not bunch of beaurocrats!. I just took the train from Chicago to St. Louis and it was awsome. I spent $60 dollars less in gas. It took me same amount of time as driving BUT I was able to work at the same time!

 

[josephdavid]

Yerusalyim;3802059]

YOur last sentace is 100% spot on.

Calling a Liberal Senator will do no good. The left wins all the time, because they actually take to the streets and yell. They are involved ALL THE TIME, unlik our side who only go to forums and whine. I have been begging my side to march up the hill forever but I cannot find many who are willing to give up the time. While you are correct that we need to make more noise, an easy useless phone call is not enough. We can begin by marching to our Rep or Senators local office and get some media attention. Remember, any press is good press. We need to get mad and get loud. REAL LOUD! That is how the left wins. Now it’s our turn. And don’t give me the same old **** about “lowering ourselves to their level” because that is lazy nonsense. (not YOU, but you know what I mean)

Calling any Senator will do no good. Both sides either support Big business or the far left. Nothing in between. Each blames just one issue as part of the problem and not looking at the big picture. Why? To get votes and to get that nice salary and the perks that come with it. Our Congress for the past 18 plus years has done nothing while our we invest less in our infastructure (bridges in need or repairs, shotty roads, bad schools etc.)
SO I agree it is pointless at the moment. Hopefully soon it will change and there will be some reason.

 

[josephdavid]

josephdavid;3801009]

While true, remember, we only import like 10% of our oil from the Middle East, so that is not the issue.

At the expense of the environment and health.

 

[leftistdestroye]

josephdavid;3803218]

But what if they are right (for once haha)? For past 30 years experts have been saying that sooner than later the supply will be outsripped by demand and here are are that point. Why not be innovative as we were before as an industrial country?

Nothing wrong with being innovative. Conservatives are not afraid of that by any means. We are simply saying, why not take the pressue off at the same time? Why is it one or the other? And supply is not so much at a low point, refining it is. But we are not allowed to build any refineries, thaks to the enviro nazis. The last one we built, was in 1976 or 79. Why can’t we simply drill for more right now? Why are they NOT letting us?

Also if not the supply of oil lets look at the potentially dangerous vehicle emissions which include:

Carbon monoxide
Nitrogen dioxide
Sulphur dioxide
Benzene
Formaldehyde
Polycyclic hydrocarbons
Lead

Why not continue to develop and invest heavily into renewable and clean energies and our public transit system. Now that gas is so high Americans are using Public Transportation at an increase of 32%, and most transit systems in U.S. can not handle this.

Get the idiots that currently run Amtrak and put people in place who know how to run a business and not bunch of beaurocrats!. I just took the train from Chicago to St. Louis and it was awsome. I spent $60 dollars less in gas. It took me same amount of time as driving BUT I was able to work at the same time!

Not everybody is able to take the train to work. I can’t unless they put me in Chicago to work. The roads are filled for a reason, many, many HAVE to drive. All of what you mentioned can and should be done, but there is no reason NOT to take the oil pressue off as soon as possible. It should have been done 10 years ago, but the Democrats have set us up for this problem for years now. RIGHT NOW, we do not have the best technology for alternative fuels, but we will. But we need to take off th ehandcuffs RIGHT NOW, for the short term.

 

[leftistdestroye]

josephdavid;3803227]

Calling any Senator will do no good. Both sides either support Big business or the far left. Nothing in between. Each blames just one issue as part of the problem and not looking at the big picture. Why? To get votes and to get that nice salary and the perks that come with it. Our Congress for the past 18 plus years has done nothing while our we invest less in our infastructure (bridges in need or repairs, shotty roads, bad schools etc.)
SO I agree it is pointless at the moment. Hopefully soon it will change and there will be some reason.

That is not neccessarily true. Republicans want to drill in ANWAR, the Dems won’t let them. Drilling would help us. And Republicans, we are not about what the government can do for us, and I am not either. I want them out of my/our lives. And plenty of states can deal with infastructure, but choose to pay for liberal social programs first, and that, is to create dependancy and thereby, to get votes. And you want the gov to pay attention and be less corrupt? Yeah, me too. Then take the money out of DC. ALL the money. But that won’t happen because too many people have their hands out looking for more table scraps from the taxpayers, who are primarily, big business.

 

[leftistdestroye]

josephdavid;3803259

eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/p…nt/import.html

What are you saying?

At the expense of more American workers

How so? I said the market will find more efficiant cars. That is good for the worker.

And a Republican controlled congress did not fight to override the veto.

That’s because Clinton vetoed the entire bill if they kept drilling in it. The administration of U.S. President George W. Bush pushed to perform exploratory drilling for oil and gas in and around the refuge. The House of Representatives voted in mid-2000 to allow drilling. In April 2002, the Senate rejected it.

Arctic Refuge drilling was again approved by the House of Representatives as part of the Energy Bill on April 21, 2005,[8] but the **Arctic Refuge provision was later removed **by the House-Senate conference committee. The Senate passed Arctic Refuge drilling on March 16, 2005 as part of the federal budget resolution for fiscal year 2006.[9] That Arctic Refuge provision was removed during the reconciliation process, due to Democrats in the House of Representatives who signed a letter stating they would oppose any version of the budget that had Arctic Refuge drilling in it.[10]

On December 15, 2005, Sen. Ted Stevens (R-AK) attached an Arctic Refuge drilling amendment to the annual defense appropriations bill. **A group of Democratic Senators led a successful filibustering of the bill **on December 21, 2005, and the language was subsequently removed from the bill.

AND WE STILL CAN’T GET IT!

At the expense of the environment and health.

Then do not complain about gas prices. Don’t say a word.

 

[josephdavid]

josephdavid;3803227]

That is not neccessarily true. Republicans want to drill in ANWAR, the Dems won’t let them. Drilling would help us. And Republicans, we are not about what the government can do for us, and I am not either. I want them out of my/our lives. And plenty of states can deal with infastructure, but choose to pay for liberal social programs first, and that, is to create dependancy and thereby, to get votes. And you want the gov to pay attention and be less corrupt? Yeah, me too. Then take the money out of DC. ALL the money. But that won’t happen because too many people have their hands out looking for more table scraps from the taxpayers, who are primarily, big business.

We have had almost 10 years of less government and look what has happened… Decrease in wages, increase in inflation, high fuel prices, no money for schools, no money to keep bridges from collapsing and a highway system in deteration. I am not saying the government is the sole solution but looks what has happened with out them. It takes concerted effort of business, government and american people do this.

 

[leftistdestroye]

We have had almost 10 years of less government and look what has happened… Decrease in wages, increase in inflation, high fuel prices, no money for schools, no money to keep bridges from collapsing and a highway system in deteration. I am not saying the government is the sole solution but looks what has happened with out them. It takes concerted effort of business, government and american people do this.

I just read that there was an increase in wages.

A slight increase in inflation after 10 years of zero increase in inflation.

High gas prices are not because of government, unless you count the Dems who refuse to let us get some more. But the economics of it, is not related to the government.

Schools are funded primarily by state and local funds. The Feds give a tiny amount.

In Illinois, they are contatnly working on roads here. So much, that the traffic they create is such a pain in the butt. In chicago, we have three seasons: Winter, summer, and construction, lol That bridge you are talking about, is the states fault, not the Feds.
Minnesota Department of Transportation is to blame. Minnesota is ran by Liberals. Just like New Orleans was and who did not spend their money on the levies, like they should have.

 

[KathleenElsie]

I’m not big on petitions of this nature, rather, CONTACT your congressman and senator.

Do both we did.

 

[Swan]

We have had almost 10 years of less government and look what has happened… Decrease in wages, increase in inflation, high fuel prices, no money for schools, no money to keep bridges from collapsing and a highway system in deteration. I am not saying the government is the sole solution but looks what has happened with out them. It takes concerted effort of business, government and american people do this.

I agree with you 100%. The problem is that more drilling just puts a bandaid on the wound - it doesn’t address the issue of finding a way to do without so much oil. I also agree with your earlier post about the oil companies making a fortune and the need to increase fuel standards and help the auto industry redesign for the new paradigm. More drilling just postpones the inevitable. It is very short sighted in many ways and, yes, there will be inevitable damage to the environment. Of course, the oil companies are all for it - and that alone should tell you something.

 

[leftistdestroye]

I agree with you 100%. The problem is that more drilling just puts a bandaid on the wound - it doesn’t address the issue of finding a way to do without so much oil. I also agree with your earlier post about the oil companies making a fortune and the need to increase fuel standards and help the auto industry redesign for the new paradigm. More drilling just postpones the inevitable. It is very short sighted in many ways and, yes, there will be inevitable damage to the environment. Of course, the oil companies are all for it - and that alone should tell you something.

Oh, ok, then let the gas go up to $15.00 a gallon while we are looking for alternatives. And do nothing about the prices right now. And continue to burn coal at an astouding rate so you can plug your cars in to charge, until the environazis close them down, and then we have nothing. And you rcomments about the oil companies is just plain liberal socialist BS. I do not work for the oil companies and I am all for drilling. And you should show a little more respect, they have allowed people to live better than any other time in history, yet you stab them in the back. What an arrogant attitude. If you believed all that nonsense, then dump your car, and any other product you have in your house that is made from oil. Don’t be a hypocrite.

 

[Al_Masetti]

We have had almost 10 years of less government and look what has happened.

Absolutely not true.

Government now is bigger than at any time in the past.

It is the government, our bureaucracy and our Liberal Congress, that has prohibited us from drilling AND that has both encouraged and financed lawsuits by advocacy groups that have combined to stop development of drilling and of building new refineries.

We have far more government and more intrusive government now than at any time in the past.

The courts are making decisions that are none of their business. Just recently, courts in one of the midwestern states decided that they can’t build a coal-fired electric generating plant.

More money is being spent on schools than ever before, but we have far far less to show for it. More bureaucracy. The education of the kids takes second place to propagandizing the kids.

If you want to read something really horrific, read None Dare Call It Treason by John A. Stormer.

Click here and then mouse around for his other books.

amazon.com/None-Dare-Call-Treason-Stormer/dp/0899667252

He published an update 25 years later.

But seriously, read that book. He names names.

Hopefully, it will get your blood properly boiling.

 

[Al_Masetti]

That bridge you are talking about, is the states fault, not the Feds.
Minnesota Department of Transportation is to blame. Minnesota is ran by Liberals. Just like New Orleans was and who did not spend their money on the levies, like they should have.

This is correct, but it gets worse.

Some have said that we need more taxes on gasoline … so that we can pay more for road work.

THE PROBLEM is that the states and the cities don’t spend the money on fixing the roads and bridges.

What they do is divert the money to other projects. Such as mass transportation. So they build rail transit that has low ridership because it goes from where the people are not to where the people don’t want to go.

And then there is not enough money to spend on fixing the roads and bridges.

Plenty of money is generated, but the money is “diverted”.

---

There is another problem with the roads and bridges, also.

The folks who do the ratings say that the infrastructure is “indadequate”.

But that could be from anything. It could be that the parapet walls are not high enough (according to some new standard of what is high enough). Or the bridge doesn’t have a shoulder that is wide enough. Etc.

OR, it could be that the bridge is ready to fall down.

All of the various categories are lumped into the category of “inadequate”. So when the politicians submit their budget estimates, there is NO WAY that anyone can tell what really needs work NOW to prevent collapse and what is really something that can be put off.

And we have bureaucrats making these determinations.

The more you analyze all this stuff the worse it gets.

What we need is more drilling. And some shakeup of the bureaucrats.

[ha!]

The bureaucrats just don’t care. They get their annual raises. And their vacations. And their pensions. And they fight over ceiling tiles [that’s how you measure the size of your cubicle.] And are immune from layoffs and firings. They avoid going out to the field with a passion. They have inflexible procedures that are so abstract that no one can make any headway.

:banghead:

 

[drafdog]

I was in grade three (1955-56) when I first learned where oil and coal came from. My first thought was that given the source, there was no way to replace what we took out. We were going to run out of the stuff. I asked myself what would we do when that happened. Needless to say the teacher had no answer when I asked about it. You’ll note that I was a weird kid. Maybe weird isn’t so bad after all.

Matthew

 

[Al_Masetti]

I was in grade three (1955-56) when I first learned where oil and coal came from. My first thought was that given the source, there was no way to replace what we took out. We were going to run out of the stuff. I asked myself what would we do when that happened. Needless to say the teacher had no answer when I asked about it. You’ll note that I was a weird kid. Maybe weird isn’t so bad after all.

Matthew

Are you all watching those new series on television? There’s three series’ I think.

Planet Earth

Miracle Planet

Fearless Planet

Amazing photography.

Don’t get taken in by the voiceover’s forecast of what is to come, but just take a look at what the Earth has been through so far.

We have NO IDEA how many ice ages the Earth has experienced. Or how many collisions the planet has had with other celestial bodies. Or how many volcanoes there are. The undersea / under ocean photography is spectacular.

And … to think … that this planet is absolutely perfectly situated to support human life. If the orbit was the tiniest bit further from the sun or closer to the sun, it would be inhospitable.

It’s not a Big Blue Marble; it is a red hot, 4000 degree, ball of liquid rock that explodes constantly … that is spinning at 1000 mph at the equator … with a powerful magnetic field that protects it from the bombardments from outer space.

And it has a paper thin solid crust that we walk on and a very thin layer of water that recycles itself. And the crust actually moves around (the Continental Drift and Tectonic Plates).

This planet is 7000 miles in diameter. Our explorations are literally only a tiny scratch on part of the surface. Maybe a mile deep in some cases. A couple of miles in others.

The Earth has been exploded, impacted, frozen, boiled … and yet we still have this amazing breathable atmosphere.

And some folks think that the Earth will only survive if we commit suicide … as if to appease the gods. Like one of those cults that used to throw human sacrifices into the volcanoes.

Think of all the new things we have learned about the Earth and all the new things we are learning.

We are learning new things all the time about the Earth. Finding new natural resources. Even with all the oil that we have extracted, proven reserves have continuously increased. And we are finding more and more natural gas.

Let’s quit saying we know everything already and quit drawing lines on a graph to determine the future.

The first six words of the Declaration of Independence are “We are endowed by our Creator …”

Let’s not forget that.

God created the Planet Earth and we are only just now beginning to appreciate how much natural resources he put here.

 

[TNT]

The Moral Imperative For Drilling

Is there not a certain hypocrisy and demeaning of the values for Producing Countries when, we go to them and encourage MORE output, aka more drilling?
Yet, if they were to ask us, “well what about OUR enviroment preservation?” What would be the Liberal’s reply? Or should they ask, “If we drill and produce MORE, will YOU drill and produce more?”
Our answer so far is “NO”, because it will effect OUR enviroment preservation. Their preservation is apparently on some subordinated level.
HYPOCRITES R US.​

Now, unless we propose that new Drilling in OUR country will NEVER be allowed, we must face the FACT that at SOME price we wiil go on and do it.
What price is that?
That’s the question. No other.
Every price increase must of necessity, put some citizens beyond the margin of affordable energy, be it transportation, or utilities.
Each succeeding rise in price pushes an ever larger group of citizens outside the margin.
For instance, a $1.00 rise may push .01% outside the margin of affordability. A $5.00 rise may push 8% outside the margin… an 800% increase.
The first to get pushed out are the ones from the bottom of the disposable income scale and rises from there.
Another useful example is the recent explosion of “toll ways”. Otherwise known as the Highway of the Wealthy.
So, there is a moral imperative for drilling. It is to subdue the unatural discrimination against the citizens in the lowest disposable income bracket.
However, Liberals, the essence of practical hypocrites, will never be persuaded that the very citizens to which they claim heartfelt advocacy, are the very ones they are pushing further into the economic swamp.
Which leads me to my newest definition of:
Liberalism:
A brain disease that causes irreparable Truth decay.