The Mormon Jesus

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The Jesus as known by the LDS is so different, the Catholic Church does not recognize their baptism as valid even though they use “In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit”. The Church knows that even though they use those words, they mean something very different than what the Catholic Church or even other Trinitarian Christians mean.

We have seen above their concept of the passion and sacrifice of our Lord is extremely different than all Christian theology. I have no idea what their belief is on the resurrection and ascension.
 
Yes, and the Mormons I’ve spoken with say Kolob is next to what we know as Heaven.
 
Mormons aren’t Trinitarians. They believe that when Catholic and Protestant Christians refer to "the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost that we are worshipping 3 gods.
 
Joe Smith merely described Kolob as the star nearest the Throne of God.
 
YHWH_Christ said:
What about the part with the power of the Holy Spirit coming over her as Gabriel said?
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They believe that nobody can be in the presence of God without the power of the Holy Ghost present. It was necessary for the Holy Ghost to overshadow Mary merely so she could be in his presence without being consumed.
 
Lemuel said:
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YHWH_Christ:
But more than that they actually teach that Jesus is the literal Son of God in the flesh in that they believe Jesus was artificially conceived with God the Father’s sperm in Mary’s womb through the Holy Spirit.
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I was a Mormon for 57 years and I never heard that. I was always taught that God the Father inseminated Mary through sexual intercourse, the same as people do it naturally. There was nothing artificial about it.
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This is shocking to me. In more ways than one. I think my brain just fried.
 
There’s an old Sunday School manual from the Mormon church that describes it is pretty basic terms. It shows an upside down triangle with Mother and Father at the top two corners and Baby at the bottom corner. Then it shows another triangle with God and Mary at the two top corners and Jesus on the bottom. Why do you think they taught the Mormon kids it was basically the same thing if it was not?
 
The early Mormon leadership (Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, etc.) said a lot of really crazy things that they just made up out of thin air and taught as doctrine to the membership of the church. That’s the problem with revering your prophets so much that you take everything they as gospel truth, as most Mormons still do today with their current leaders. It’s always entertaining hearing the defenses and excuses LDS apologists and groups like Fair Mormon make on their behalf. In a way I actually feel a little sorry for them having to bend over backwards doing mental gymnastics as they come up with ridiculously laughable explanations for these things. It’s both comical and tragic at once.
 
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YHWH_Christ said:
For Christians, although the agony in the Garden of Gethsemane certainly plays a role in the atonement, we believe Jesus suffered his greatest agony on the cross and that it is the core of the atonement where it was fully made. For Mormons it’s pretty much the other way around, the cross plays a role in the atonement in your faith but ultimately your faith teaches it principally occurred in Gethsemane. Your faith is antithetical to Christianity.
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Even though we may disagree where Christ experienced the greatest agony, at least we can both be grateful that He wrought an atonement on our behalf. Take care and God bless you.
 
I know that, which is why I said they believe something very different when they baptize in the name of the father, son, and holy spirit.
 
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YHWH_Christ said:
“We believe Jesus died for our sins too on the cross.” Again, while this is partly true, Mormons actually teach most of the atonement took place in Gethsemane and not on the cross, and had Jesus not been crucified after suffering for a little in Gethsemane there would be full atonement for all sins. There was really no need for the cross in Mormonism.
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Mormons refer to Gethsemane as “the wine press”. Just as grapes produce wine while subjected to great pressure, similarly, it was in the Garden of Gethsemane where Jesus took upon himself the sins of the world. In other words, the pressure upon him was so tremendous that he sweat drops of blood through his pores, likening the blood of Christ to the wine of the grapes. The atonement took place in the Garden. The cross was just the finish of his earthly mission and has no great symbolism, which is why you rarely see crosses in the Mormon churches or temples or why you rarely see Mormons wearing the crosses.
 
YHWH_Christ said:
Mormons often use half truths to lead you into their cult, do not fall for it.
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They call it milk before meat. They don’t want to tell you how it is when you’re just starting out. They know it would freak most people out and scare them away. You really don’t get the full Monty until you’ve been a member for at least a year and go to the Mormon temple. And then, it’s still not the whole story. New members won’t know anything about the second anointing which is reserved for the Mormon elect, i.e., those who have a personal witness of Christ.
 
Lemuel said:
Mormons refer to Gethsemane as “the wine press”.
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“Gethsemane” literally means “olive press”. This can be found in both Latter-day Saint and Catholic sources.
Lemuel said:
Just as grapes produce wine while subjected to great pressure, similarly, it was in the Garden of Gethsemane where Jesus took upon himself the sins of the world. In other words, the pressure upon him was so tremendous that he sweat drops of blood through his pores, likening the blood of Christ to the wine of the grapes. The atonement took place in the Garden. The cross was just the finish of his earthly mission and has no great symbolism, which is why you rarely see crosses in the Mormon churches or temples or why you rarely see Mormons wearing the crosses.
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You are correct that the atonement was likened to a wine press. This can be found in both Latter-day Saint scripture (D&C 76:107) and the Bible (Isaiah 63:3).

I hope this helps…
 
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So why the focus Gethsemane? I looked at the four gospels again yesterday after learning about the LDS belief. In the gospels there are only a few verses given to the events in the garden. John’s gospel only speaks to the arrest of Jesus, not his suffering there. However there are chapters in all four about what happens next, Christ’s Passion.

Not to diminish Christ’s suffering in the garden, but the reality is his suffering only grew worse through the course of the night and next day. How anyone can ignore the cross of Jesus as the ultimate symbol of his sacrifice is something I just don’t understand.

So again, why the focus on just Gethsemane?
 
Speaking as a former Mormon, I’ll answer it the way I would have when I was Mormon.

Think about the greatest sin you have ever committed and try to remember the emotional pain you suffered. If you’re like most of us, you were tormented for a time over what you did, especially if it hurt someone else. Can you feel the pain? Now, imagine it multiplied billions of times. Jesus, by proxy, took upon himself the sins of every person who came to this earth and literally became guilty of those sins. The pain was so intense that it caused him to bleed from his pores. I’m no physician but my understanding is that such intense pain would cause sure death to any mortal. Jesus even pleaded to his Father to let this cup pass. Nevertheless, not my will but Thy will be done. One can only imagine the last 24 hours of his life and at which point he suffered the most. But it was in Gethsemane where he took upon himself our sins. Not on the cross.

Again, that’s my former Mormon perspective. It does not represent my current views.
 
One day I was at our local library looking for a Book of Mormon. With the help of the librarian we finally found it among the fiction books.
 
Thank you for the explanation. I know Gazelam won’t answer my question because he never does. While I have no wish to minimize his suffering in the garden I believe some of it was a little more figurative rather than literal. Jesus was God at the time of his passion, he knew what was going to happen, he knew he was taking on the sins of the world. When he speaks about the cup being taken away, but not his will but the father’s will, there is no “pleading”. Jesus knows that can’t happen, rather he is surrendering all his humanity to the divine.

The apostles falling asleep means we as Christians should not let ourselves go lax in our worship of our Lord, we need to stay watchful for him.

So what do they say about the cross and what leads up to it? What about the Resurrection? Pentecost? Any of what happened after?
 
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