The Mormon View of Jesus Christ

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OK, so then, according to Mormonism, God is an exalted man, this is still doctrine, but it’s just not discussed anymore, at least not with outsiders? Do I have that right?
Hi Melanie, greetings!

This is not right. God is an exalted man is not doctrine. It was an idea presented by church leadership as speculation but was never sustained. This means, that the leaders had this idea, conferred the matter to God by the power of the Holy Spirit and received an answer that this is not something we need at this point in time in the matter of our salvation.

So, as of today, we still don’t know exactly what “gathering of intelligences” entail, just like we don’t know exactly how God created the earth. And that this is not something we need to attain perfection and sit in the presence of God in the end of days.

Hope this makes sense.

To the OP, the only difference between Catholics and Mormons about Jesus Christ is that Mormons do not hold to the Trinitarian concept of God.
 
In response to Parker’s, Jesus appeared to the apostles in His resurrected state. He instituted the sacrament of confession, He continued to teach them in a manner of evangelism professional Catholics are taught…as in the walk to Emmaus where He was not recognized until after He disappeared. There is in tradition that He appeared to other faithful followers, to Mary and the holy women. At Pentecost, people think the Holy Spirit came down on the apostles and Mary, when in fact there were over a hundred that had tongues of fire over them…

But one would tend to think that His post-resurrection appearances would all work for the marks of the Church – one, holy, universal/Catholic — a manner applicable to all peoples, and apostolic.

The mystics say that Christ gave us His divinity in the Sacraments and we gave Him His humanity. But we do not be God, but as God…when you look at the history of this world, it is marked by so much inhumanity to man. The great work of mankind is when we love each other as brethren.
 
Why me…Mary did not come down from heaven.

She came from Joachim and Anna. But her immaculate conception was authored by God alone.

Christ came to give us power over the flesh. He provides all the grace necessary for us to avoid sin…it is the flesh that leads us to sin.
 
Why me…Mary did not come down from heaven.

She came from Joachim and Anna. But her immaculate conception was authored by God alone.

Christ came to give us power over the flesh. He provides all the grace necessary for us to avoid sin…it is the flesh that leads us to sin.
Why me…Mary did not come down from heaven.

She came from Joachim and Anna. But her immaculate conception was authored by God alone.

Christ came to give us power over the flesh. He provides all the grace necessary for us to avoid sin…it is the flesh that leads us to sin.
Hi Kathleen, greetings!

If I’m not mistaken, why me is talking about Mary’s apparitions.
 
But to answer your question, Mormon understanding of Jesus is actually pretty close to the Biblical one. The Bible teaches somewhat contradictory things about Jesus Christ. There are passages which suggest that He was created and had a beginning:

Colossians 1:

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
The Greek term for “firstborn,” prototokos, need not refer to a literal moment of birth in time. It can be, and in this context is, a legal title designating the son who is heir. For instance, if an eldest son dies, the second son is then called prototokos, contrary to what we would expect from the word’s literal etymology. On that basis other people besides Christ are called “firstborn,” such as David (Ps 89:27), the tribe of Ephraim (Jer 31:9) and all of Israel (Ex 4:24; Sir 36:12). In the Septuagint, the term protokos is used in each of these verses.

The doctrine of Colossians centers on Christ’s double role as creator and redeemer. Because the Father created all things through the Son, it is the Son who restores all things to the Father, by taking possession of them in the resurrection. So by virtue of being creator, he ends up also being inheritor, and that is what firstborn means here.

In the verse following the text you quote, Paul continues, “for by him all things were created…and he is before all things, and by him all things consist.” Notice the “for” in this sentence. Paul is interpreting “firstborn” to mean that Jesus is creator. Whereas men are created in God’s image, Christ himself “is the image” through which all things are. In the redemption of man, Christ creates his people through his own resurrection as “firstborn from the dead.” On this basis Paul concludes that as redeemer and creator, “It has pleased the Father that in him should all fullness dwell.”

Reading “firstborn” to indicate redeemer/creator under the aspect of Christ’s inheritance of the Kingdom from God makes complete sense of the whole passage, totally agreeable to Trinitarian theology. But what if we take it as “firstborn in the spirit”? If you follow the Mormon view, how much sense does the verse make? Let’s see: “He is the first spirit-child created by Elohim in the preexistence, for by him all things were created…” Is not the incongruity obvious? The whole point of calling Christ “firstborn” is to say that we have an intrinsic relation of dependence on him for our existence, which is precisely what the Mormon reading of this verse denies, because it centers the act of creating upon Elohim by making Christ an object of creation rather than the source. There is nothing unclear about this verse: Christ precedes creation, and hence in uncreated.
Revelations 3:
14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God.
[/INDENT]
In what sense to you understand “beginning”? Do you mean to say that Christ is the first created being? That is an almost impossible way to read the Greek text. The word rendered here as “beginning” is arche, which refers to a beginning in the sense of a source or a ruler. Hence, Christ is both the source and ruler of creation, in complete agreement with Colossians.

Both of these texts show that redemption in Christ depends on creation by him. Because of this relation, we do not truly acknowledge him as redeemer if we do not acknowledge him as Creator first. Anything we do that lessens our view of his creatorship is a barrier to accepting him as Redeemer. This shows not only why the Catholic position is true but why it important: your spirit brother cannot save you, but your Creator can.
 
Hi Melanie, greetings!

This is not right. God is an exalted man is not doctrine. It was an idea presented by church leadership as speculation but was never sustained. This means, that the leaders had this idea, conferred the matter to God by the power of the Holy Spirit and received an answer that this is not something we need at this point in time in the matter of our salvation.

So, as of today, we still don’t know exactly what “gathering of intelligences” entail, just like we don’t know exactly how God created the earth. And that this is not something we need to attain perfection and sit in the presence of God in the end of days.

Hope this makes sense.

To the OP, the only difference between Catholics and Mormons about Jesus Christ is that Mormons do not hold to the Trinitarian concept of God.
Please show where the LDS church has officially denounced Smith’s teachings, and every Mormon “prophet” after him.

Joseph Smith taught: “It is the first principle of the Gospel to know
for a certainty the Character of God. … He was once a man like us;
… God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as
Jesus Christ himself did” (Gospel Principles Manual, p279, 2009)

The quoted portions comes from Smith’s King Follet Sermon, which clearly teaches your god is nothing more than a man with super powers, aka, the mormon “priesthood”.
 
Pinay,

If Mormons consider the Catholic Church an abomination, then even referring or explaining Mary is moot at this point.
 
Please show where the LDS church has officially denounced Smith’s teachings, and every Mormon “prophet” after him.

Joseph Smith taught: “It is the first principle of the Gospel to know
for a certainty the Character of God. … He was once a man like us;
… God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as
Jesus Christ himself did” (Gospel Principles Manual, p279, 2009)

The quoted portions comes from Smith’s King Follet Sermon, which clearly teaches your god is nothing more than a man with super powers, aka, the mormon “priesthood”.
Indeed.

And I have personally heard Mormon missionaries speculate about the whole business of exaltation. For example, they wondered whether they would have to be crucified as Jesus was as part of their eternal “progression” to attain the rank of “God” of their own planet. And while they never mentioned whether God/Heavenly Father had to do this too, it is implicit in their belief that the process of Mormon exaltation involves just such a process.

What I can’t understand is why something can be taught as doctrine for years and then it is withdrawn. And now we’ve seen it that perhaps doctrines aren’t withdrawn at all, but just withdrawn from publications freely available to people.

It would seem to me that God is either eternal or He is not. And God’s ways are either eternal or they are not. But it cannot be that sometimes God was once an ordinary man, and now that’s not true or that once God’s “eternal” ways were one way, and now they’re something else. 🤷
 
Please show where the LDS church has officially denounced Smith’s teachings, and every Mormon “prophet” after him.

Joseph Smith taught: “It is the first principle of the Gospel to know
for a certainty the Character of God. … He was once a man like us;
… God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as
Jesus Christ himself did” (Gospel Principles Manual, p279, 2009)

The quoted portions comes from Smith’s King Follet Sermon, which clearly teaches your god is nothing more than a man with super powers, aka, the mormon “priesthood”.
And from a more recent apostle:
“The Father is a glorified, perfected, resurrected, exalted man who worked out his salvation by obedience to the same laws he has given to us so that we may do the same,” (Bruce R. McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Company, 1985, p. 64).
 
What I can’t understand is why something can be taught as doctrine for years and then it is withdrawn. And now we’ve seen it that perhaps doctrines aren’t withdrawn at all, but just withdrawn from publications freely available to people.
The LDS speculation I see on this is that people aren’t ready to hear this “deep doctrine”, so it isn’t taught until people are ready. I’ve heard the same speculation for the Adam-God doctrine.

Those that don’t want to believe one or both, go Pinay’s direction, and say it was never sustained. Oh, the fun exercise it would be to go through a LDS gospel doctrine manual and mark what is being taught but has never been “sustained”.

LDS have sustained their prophet, seer and revelator, and as such, everything they teach. This is the part they leave out.
It would seem to me that God is either eternal or He is not. And God’s ways are either eternal or they are not. But it cannot be that sometimes God was once an ordinary man, and now that’s not true or that once God’s “eternal” ways were one way, and now they’re something else. 🤷
Their god is not eternally God.
 
The LDS speculation I see on this is that people aren’t ready to hear this “deep doctrine”, so it isn’t taught until people are ready. I’ve heard the same speculation for the Adam-God doctrine.

Those that don’t want to believe one or both, go Pinay’s direction, and say it was never sustained. Oh, the fun exercise it would be to go through a LDS gospel doctrine manual and mark what is being taught but has never been “sustained”.

LDS have sustained their prophet, seer and revelator, and as such, everything they teach. This is the part they leave out.

Their god is not eternally God.
A god that is not eternally God is not a god at all!

Not to be offensive, but this “progression” sounds more like some sort of club where you move up the ranks step by step, or like some kind of self-defense method where you start out as a neophyte and ultimately can advance to the rank of “black belt”. It cannot be that God was once a man who then progressed to be a god. Otherwise He would not be God. This is just common sense.
 
A god that is not eternally God is not a god at all!

Not to be offensive, but this “progression” sounds more like some sort of club where you move up the ranks step by step, or like some kind of self-defense method where you start out as a neophyte and ultimately can advance to the rank of “black belt”. It cannot be that God was once a man who then progressed to be a god. Otherwise He would not be God. This is just common sense.
Agreed, and this is the difference between the mormon Jesus and true Christianity. For LDS Jesus is just like them, a spirit baby of a god and goddess who progressed to god, first, by obtaining a body at birth. Because if you’re going to be a god, you gotta have one.
 
Hi Melanie, greetings!

This is not right. God is an exalted man is not doctrine. It was an idea presented by church leadership as speculation but was never sustained.

Not true. It was given as fact by Joseph Smith…who claimed to talk to God all the time. It was repeated by later LDS Prophets…see what I mean, Melanie?

This means, that the leaders had this idea, conferred the matter to God by the power of the Holy Spirit and received an answer that this is not something we need at this point in time in the matter of our salvation.

This means, since it is fringe belief, it is considered fact, but not discussed.,…even denied…like polygamy

So, as of today, we still don’t know exactly what “gathering of intelligences” entail, just like we don’t know exactly how God created the earth. And that this is not something we need to attain perfection and sit in the presence of God in the end of days.

So, Joseph Smith lied. Got it
 
Agreed, and this is the difference between the mormon Jesus and true Christianity. For LDS Jesus is just like them, a spirit baby of a god and goddess who progressed to god, first, by obtaining a body at birth. Because if you’re going to be a god, you gotta have one.
This reminds me of something. I know that “heavenly mother” is rarely discussed but does anyone know if mentioning her is part of what is told to potential converts? either now or in the past? I would imagine that such a discussion would be alarming to many who might otherwise be more amenable to Mormon doctrines.
 
Not true. It was given as fact by Joseph Smith…who claimed to talk to God all the time. It was repeated by later LDS Prophets…see what I mean, Melanie?

This means, since it is fringe belief, it is considered fact, but not discussed.,…even denied…like polygamy

So, as of today, we still don’t know exactly what “gathering of intelligences” entail, just like we don’t know exactly how God created the earth. And that this is not something we need to attain perfection and sit in the presence of God in the end of days.

So, Joseph Smith lied. Got it
GOT IT! 👍
 
This reminds me of something. I know that “heavenly mother” is rarely discussed but does anyone know if mentioning her is part of what is told to potential converts? either now or in the past? I would imagine that such a discussion would be alarming to many who might otherwise be more amenable to Mormon doctrines.
🤷 Who knows, some may be, some may not. I have no idea why a Christian would be amenable to accepting any of this.
 
🤷 Who knows, some may be, some may not. I have no idea why a Christian would be amenable to accepting any of this.
I agree. But talking about God/Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother having a bunch of spirit children, including Jesus, and then populating Earth with these spirits, might be enough to set off a few alarm bells despite all the warm fuzzy “families are forever” business. For that reason, I suspect it is not something that is ever discussed with prospective converts, although I have no confirmation of that.
 
I agree. But talking about God/Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother having a bunch of spirit children, including Jesus, and then populating Earth with these spirits, might be enough to set off a few alarm bells despite all the warm fuzzy “families are forever” business. For that reason, I suspect it is not something that is ever discussed with prospective converts, although I have no confirmation of that.
No “mother in heaven” is mentioned in their “Gospel Principles” or “Preach My Gospel” manuals, which are the manuals used for proselytizing.

There’s a whole lot in mormonism that should set off a few alarm bells.
 
This reminds me of something. I know that “heavenly mother” is rarely discussed but does anyone know if mentioning her is part of what is told to potential converts? either now or in the past? I would imagine that such a discussion would be alarming to many who might otherwise be more amenable to Mormon doctrines.
That we were born to heavenly parents is not a secret in the mormon church. And what would be alarming to know that we have heavenly parents. I think that it is rather comforting to know that I am very much loved by such parents. And that we are brothers and sisters to such parents.

I like that idea better than that we came from dirt or dust.
 
This reminds me of something. I know that “heavenly mother” is rarely discussed but does anyone know if mentioning her is part of what is told to potential converts? either now or in the past? I would imagine that such a discussion would be alarming to many who might otherwise be more amenable to Mormon doctrines.
I can’t find any mention of Heavenly Mother in the Preach My Gospel manual so she’s not part of the lesson plan as far as I can tell.

Added: I see Rebecca beat me:)
 
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