The most depressing thing about Catholicism - no mystics living on earth

[nodito]

OK, then if my human daddy stopped talking to me and never talked to me again, I’d say he’s angry at me.

The same with my Heavenly Daddy.

But again, it’s not a good comparison. Your earthly parents had physical bodies which created your physical body, and they are likely still here on earth. God the Father never had a physical body, and God the Son is already in heaven.

Suppose your dad’s job required him to move somewhere far away where there weren’t any telephones. Would you assume he was angry with you if you didn’t hear his voice?

BobCatholic:

I thought God was not outdone by generosity (must have missed the fine print, that actually talking to me is not counted as generosity…)

I’m ignoring the sarcasm. God is not outdone by generosity. All the good things you have in life are from God. Your wife is a gift to you from God. The problem is that you are demanding a very specific thing that God does not will for you or for your relationship with him. Sort of like if I became angry at God for not letting me hug him physically. How dare he withhold his body from me! How dare he refuse to embrace me! But really, is that just? To be angry at someone for creating you, sustaining your life, giving you all the good gifts you have, and merely asking in return that you meet him on his terms instead of yours?

 

[nodito]

OK, that’s one lay-couple.

How many others?

Compare that number to the number of religious order folks and clergy?

You asked for an example and I gave you one. Do you need fifty examples of holiness if there’s one that speaks to you? But there’s also St.Monica, St. Thomas More, St. Gianna Beretta Molla, and a host of others.

Traditionally more religious and clergy have been canonized because the petition process took time and effort that religious orders were more equipped and motivated to participate in.

 

[BobCatholic]

But again, it’s not a good comparison. Your earthly parents had physical bodies which created your physical body, and they are likely still here on earth. God the Father never had a physical body, and God the Son is already in heaven.

Suppose your dad’s job required him to move somewhere far away where there weren’t any telephones. Would you assume he was angry with you if you didn’t hear his voice?

e-mail. snail mail. A carrier pidgeon. Heck, someone could hand deliver a letter back and forth. SOME form of communication is still possible in today’s society.

And this is just ordinary technology. My Heavenly Daddy’s technology far outranks that!

The problem is that you are demanding a very specific thing that God does not will for you or for your relationship with him.

The question is why. Maybe I’m doomed and he knows not to waste his time trying to talk to me.

It also assumes I have a personal relationship with him, I have a corporate relationship, and am not sure of more. CCC837.

 

[Gertabelle]

It also assumes I have a personal relationship with him, I have a corporate relationship, and am not sure of more. CCC837.

I assume you’ll just throw this comment out without consideration as you have with all the others… But if you think you only have a “corporate relationship” with God, you might want to meditate, the next time you receive Holy Communion, that the King and Creator of all has just become one with you.

And yeah, He becomes one with me as well. But that doesn’t diminish the fact that He becomes one with you – yup, you – unless you insist on focusing more on everything other than Him in that moment.

Not corporate. Intimate in the extreme.

Still praying for you.

 

[chimo]

To me prayer is a monologue. The answer usually is “no” or no answer at all, so I now only pray for others, since anything I cannot count on anything good I ask for.

I know about the scam artists who ask for money like that, I’ll avoid them like the plague.

How I can actually have a personal relationship with someone who refuses to talk to me? (namely Him) If my wife never talked to me again (by her choice), that does not tell me my marriage is doing fine. To me, God being silent is like giving me the silent treatment, that he’s angry or disappointed in me. Or he thinks I’ll never make it to heaven, so why bother?

I’ve gotten conflicting and contradictory messages from people who are not having 2 way conversations with God.

Perhaps God is seeing some good in you that needs to come out. When our Lord is silent and you are trying to seek Him out than His silence does not mean He is rejecting you. On the contrary He is accepting you even more. The Lord is not like a mother hen when we come to Him. He is a father to us. This Father than is trying to train us. This training in fact will involve silence. There are many saints who were trying what you are going through. God allows this silence in order to train you better. Do not think any silence is a rejection from Him. It is never a rejection. The silence must prelude His overflowing graces which He will impart in time to you. Look st St. Maria Faustina and St. Seraphim of Sarov who had to face this silence. God had given this to them to be part of their training. Look at Job and Elijah who also had to face the silence of God. Remembe that silence is not to be seen as a judgment but rather an opportunity for you to grow. If He is doing this to you or anyone else that means He has looked on you with favor. You may not sense this but it is true. My advice is to stick with your quest, do not give up and learn to persist and God will see it through for you.

 

[BobCatholic]

The silence must prelude His overflowing graces which He will impart in time to you. Look st St. Maria Faustina and St. Seraphim of Sarov who had to face this silence.

I read St. Maria Faustina’s diary.

She had regular conversations with Jesus, and also consolations too, BEFORE the silence and dark nights. St. John of the Cross said that these always come before the Dark Nights.

BEFORE.

I. Never. Had. This.

Thus, this cannot be a Dark Night or any prelude to something good.

 

[nodito]

e-mail. snail mail. A carrier pidgeon. Heck, someone could hand deliver a letter back and forth. SOME form of communication is still possible in today’s society.

And this is just ordinary technology. My Heavenly Daddy’s technology far outranks that!

No, God is communicating with you. It’s just that you don’t like the form of communication he has chosen and are instead demanding that he talk to you, using out loud words that you hear. Scripture is a love letter that he’s written for you. He writes to you directly: “For I know well the plans I have in mind for you. Plans for your welfare, not for woe. Plans to give you a future full of hope.” (Jer 29: 11-14) and "See what love the Lord has bestowed on us, that we may be called children of God, and so we are. "( 1 John 3:1) And yet you read those letters to you and somehow interpret it as, “Oh, he must be mad at me.” ???

 

[AKDee]

I read St. Maria Faustina’s diary.

She had regular conversations with Jesus, and also consolations too, BEFORE the silence and dark nights. St. John of the Cross said that these always come before the Dark Nights.

BEFORE.

I. Never. Had. This.

Thus, this cannot be a Dark Night or any prelude to something good.

No one has exactly the same experiences. You need to trust that God loves you, and that God wants what is best for you. Whatever you are going through right now in relation to Him is how it needs to be for you to grow in your faith and love for Him. Everyone goes through low points in this journey.

What things are you doing regularly to grow closer to God? You have posted that you have tried things, but if I may be so bold, what is your daily and weekly routine when it comes to God? The things you do without fail and continue to do even as you struggle through this?

 

[Casilda]

Well, I learned that God does not call me up on the phone or booms his voice down from heaven to answer my questions. But…He has answered them while I am reading scriptures or listening to my priest’s homily or Father Richard Simon on the radio. I don’t get the whole answer at a time, either, just those little snippets, that keep me listening and reading. He is there in the breeze when I step out in the morning, in the warm sunshine that hits my face, in the sound of the birds chirping good morning. Are you listening with ALL your senses?

 

[Memaw]

The real question is if you ran into one who claimed to be a mystic and spoke to God, would you believe them? I probably would have a hard time believing them even if it was true. How would I know? I know they exist. But I probably would have a hard time believing it if I ran into one. Kind of ironic.

I’d have to wait till the Church said so and by then they would probably be in Heaven already. I have known some very Holy people but I don’t think I would call them Mystics. God Bless, Memaw

 

[dsfgsadfgsdfg]

"No, God is communicating with you. It’s just that you don’t like the form of communication he has chosen and are instead demanding that he talk to you, using out loud words that you hear. "

Bob, you said: Faith is not blind, it helps one see. But first, I need my spiritual eyes healed. That means a personal relationship with God.

A personal relationship with God does NOT mean that you both sit down at a table. He is not human. He is God. Perhaps I am misunderstanding but it seems as if you’ve thrown down the gauntlet and said–ok, God, if you really care about me then knock on my door so we can have a talk, man to man, because I’ve got some problems here and I don’t get it. Please accept my apology if this is incorrect. But He’s not the person who didn’t hire you. He’s not the person who didn’t give you a break. Those were men. He is God.

I can’t even begin to tell you how sorry I am that you are going through such problems. I am just so sorry. If you want a personal relationship with God, then open the dialogue. And don’t open with–ok, &^%$#, look at all the problems You’ve caused. And telling Him that He needs to come down here and explain Himself–wouldn’t open with that one either.

Bob, my father was a marine, and in every true sense of that word. He had a wife and 4 children. He was also a CPA-I think you have said you are one too. If he was put in the position of not finding work, feeling like he had jumped through every dang hoop out there, and still wasn’t able to take care of things the way he wanted to, it would have just broken his heart. I do understand, Bob. I do know we can get to a point where we just want to scream our lungs out and shake our fists. The level of frustration would be at the highest of marks. Man, I get it.

I’m so sorry you are struggling right now. Please hang on, Bob. Hang on.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

Yes, there are tons of them living in heaven.

But none on earth.

I wanted to talk to someone who had a connection with God so I could ask questions to God through them. God won’t talk to me, but maybe I could talk to God through them.

There are no living mystics on earth.

This is depressing.

This means there is no way for me to ever have a two-way conversation with God.

Oh, BUT don’t forget that there are also no Anchorites or Stylites, I guess because if the church ever had any these days, they’d have to send them to a psychiatrist and heavily medicate them because its so abnormal to do anything out of the ordinary for God with their lives. Obviously people like this have severe mental problems.

St. Columba did not encounter the Loch Ness Monster. Obviously, that whole notion is a farce.

St. George never did fight and kill a dragon. Hey! Its a proverbial " dragon " he fought and killed!

There never was a sainted dog named Guinefort, who actually tried to protect her human family. Silly people, animals don’t go to heaven! They don’t have minds to actually care and love or choose to do moral things! We eat animals. They have no feelings.

St. Christopher, who supposedly for ages was patron of safe travels, who supposedly carried a very heavy Christ child on his shoulders over troubled waters, never existed. Its just a cute little story we tell ourselves to make ourselves feel better and wear a little metal around our neck because, heck, its a cute story.

Genesis account is not literal, is just a story and evolution is 100% true. The Bible is full of fallacy and ancient fables. We are so much better educated these days. Margarine is healthier than butter,… no wait, butter is healthier than margarine… no wait, margarine is better than butter.

How the heck can someone be born from a virgin anyway? Sinless… even after turning tables like a mad man in a temple? Wow, that’s really insane-the guy is an obvious nut making a passionate ruckus in public like that, Gawd! Rising from the dead? Hell, if you believe that I’ve got a bridge I’d like to sell you…

---

… On and on and on and on and on and on. Anyone else see how this unravels? Take one tenant, make light of it, and just start to pull it apart until its ALL meaningless. Be sure and tell your kids about it! It will be fun to watch them grow up godless!

No wonder kids do not believe and young adults are not coming back to the church. What is left of actual believing? (Besides the fact they are looking for space aliens.)

 

[BobCatholic]

No, God is communicating with you. It’s just that you don’t like the form of communication he has chosen and are instead demanding that he talk to you,

So if God is talking to me in Chinese, gives me a command, and I can’t understand Chinese, so then I fail to do the command and I’m doomed. What a setup to fail

using out loud words that you hear. Scripture is a love letter that he’s written for you. He writes to you directly: “For I know well the plans I have in mind for you. Plans for your welfare, not for woe. Plans to give you a future full of hope.” (Jer 29: 11-14) and "See what love the Lord has bestowed on us, that we may be called children of God, and so we are. "( 1 John 3:1) And yet you read those letters to you and somehow interpret it as, “Oh, he must be mad at me.” ???

Good, then why hasn’t he said yes to my prayers where I ask for second chances for failures I did in the past? I don’t pray for evil things.

No one has exactly the same experiences.

St. John of the Cross is the authority on the dark nights. This is the pattern revealed. I’m not going to say he’s wrong.

What things are you doing regularly to grow closer to God? You have posted that you have tried things, but if I may be so bold, what is your daily and weekly routine when it comes to God? The things you do without fail and continue to do even as you struggle through this?

Every night I pray 3 different sets of prayers for others. 1 set for the souls in purgatory, 1 set for conversion of sinners (including the chief of sinners, me) and 1 set for the intentions of a local prayer warrior’s list. Each week and holy day I go to mass. I go to confession once a month or two months. Each day I read passages from a book titled “Divine Intimacy” (doesn’t work so far, this was written for religious orders, so it makes it impossible for me to get there).

 

[BobCatholic]

Are you listening with ALL your senses?

I am a senseless person. As a result, I can’t make sense of lots of things. So even if I were listening, I could not understand.

Bob, you said: Faith is not blind, it helps one see. But first, I need my spiritual eyes healed. That means a personal relationship with God.

And I have no way of knowing if I have one. The only thing I’m sure of is a corporate relationship.

Perhaps I am misunderstanding but it seems as if you’ve thrown down the gauntlet and said–ok, God, if you really care about me then knock on my door so we can have a talk, man to man, because I’ve got some problems here and I don’t get it.

More like "I don’t understand something, please teach me. Can I please get a status update, am I on the wrong road? "

If you want a personal relationship with God, then open the dialogue. And don’t open with–ok, &^%$#, look at all the problems You’ve caused. And telling Him that He needs to come down here and explain Himself–wouldn’t open with that one either.

… On and on and on and on and on and on. Anyone else see how this unravels? Take one tenant, make light of it, and just start to pull it apart until its ALL meaningless. Be sure and tell your kids about it! It will be fun to watch them grow up godless!

No wonder kids do not believe and young adults are not coming back to the church. What is left of actual believing? (Besides the fact they are looking for space aliens.)

I have no idea what you’re saying.

I believe the Catholic faith, I’m just struggling with if God actually still wants me.

 

[nodito]

So if God is talking to me in Chinese, gives me a command, and I can’t understand Chinese, so then I fail to do the command and I’m doomed. What a setup to fail

My Bible is in English. Isn’t yours?

Good, then why hasn’t he said yes to my prayers where I ask for second chances for failures I did in the past? I don’t pray for evil things.

You’re praying for do-overs? Time travel?

 

[AKDee]

Every night I pray 3 different sets of prayers for others. 1 set for the souls in purgatory, 1 set for conversion of sinners (including the chief of sinners, me) and 1 set for the intentions of a local prayer warrior’s list. Each week and holy day I go to mass. I go to confession once a month or two months. Each day I read passages from a book titled “Divine Intimacy” (doesn’t work so far, this was written for religious orders, so it makes it impossible for me to get there).

That’s very good, may I suggest adding the following:
Each morning pray to God and ask him to bless you with the graces you need to grow in faith, hope, charity and humility and then ask Our Lady to dispense these graces to you (as she is the Mediatrix of all Graces).

And pray the rosary daily.

Mary is amazing at helping us grow closer to God. In the wedding at Cana, Mary brought the problem of the bride and groom to Jesus to solve. She will do the same for you- ask Our Lady before you say the Rosary what intentions you are praying for and to take your intentions to the Lord and to ask Him for help in resolving your problems.

And finally, don’t forget to thank God periodically throughout the day for your blessings. Not only is this important for your faith journey, but also it is important psychologically because it forces you to think about what you do have, what blessings you have received, what graces you have received help with. Otherwise it’s all too easy to only focus on the things that are going wrong.

God bless you. I am adding you to my intentions when I say the Rosary at night.

 

[chimo]

I read St. Maria Faustina’s diary.

She had regular conversations with Jesus, and also consolations too, BEFORE the silence and dark nights. St. John of the Cross said that these always come before the Dark Nights.

BEFORE.

I. Never. Had. This.

Thus, this cannot be a Dark Night or any prelude to something good.

No it wasn’t before the silence. You forget in the first part of the book when the saint (Maria Faustina) went through the strangest yet most incredible rejection if you can say from God in her life. You seem to forget that part. She went through this for over three years. This incredible darkness and silence was preparing her for something greater.I do not think every saint is right and St. John of the Cross had his share of bouts but I do not believe he is right every time. The darkness or silence if you want to call it is God’s doing or God is permitting it. Every saint might go through it differently so I wouldn’t rely only on St. John of the Cross in this case since it doesn’t apply to you. Look for instance at other saints. Every darkness or silence is telling you not to give up. What God is trying to do is for you not to give up. Perhaps it is your attitude that needs to change here. God needs you to change it for I said earlier He is not a mother hen to come to you every time you are demanding Him too. We forget we are the creatures and He is God. He needs to be treated as such. I think God steps aside when we try to make too many demands from Him. We need to step aside and allow Him to make these demands on us. This silence or darkness teaches us to go to Him as a child would. We need to allow Him to be the parent and not treat Him as a child.

 

[fisherman_carl]

Yes, there are tons of them living in heaven.

But none on earth.

I wanted to talk to someone who had a connection with God so I could ask questions to God through them. God won’t talk to me, but maybe I could talk to God through them.

There are no living mystics on earth.

This is depressing.

This means there is no way for me to ever have a two-way conversation with God.

You don’t need a mystic to hear from God. Everyone can hear from God through prayer and meditation on the scriptures. I know people who pray for others and get words for them. Try going to a prayer meeting or to a life in the Spirit seminar.

 

[CaptainPicard]

Hey Bob. Try googling a guy named “Brendon Case”. He’s a charismatic Catholic who does retreats at parishes here in the US. He does many things, but one thing he does it prays over you and gives “words of wisdom”. He did it to me and told me something that I am pretty sure was from God which helped me. Anyway, even if you can’t see him (which is, I’m sure his normal routine) maybe you could try emailing him.

 

[BobCatholic]

My Bible is in English. Isn’t yours?

The only way for God to talk to me is through the Bible? Sounds too much like sola scriptura to me.

You’re praying for do-overs? Time travel?

I said a second chance. I failed in the past in a secular realm, I want a second chance in those areas.

That’s very good, may I suggest adding the following:
Each morning pray to God and ask him to bless you with the graces you need to grow in faith, hope, charity and humility and then ask Our Lady to dispense these graces to you (as she is the Mediatrix of all Graces).

I’ll give that a try.

And pray the rosary daily.

I can’t do that. I’m horrible at that, my mind wanders and I wind up doing a horrible job.

I mean, just doing the five first saturdays took me almost 2 years because I kept screwing it up. I’d miss one and have to start over again, with despair on my ability to persevere (if I can’t even do this simple thing, I’m doomed if I have to do more)

And finally, don’t forget to thank God periodically throughout the day for your blessings. Not only is this important for your faith journey, but also it is important psychologically because it forces you to think about what you do have, what blessings you have received, what graces you have received help with. Otherwise it’s all too easy to only focus on the things that are going wrong.

I am grateful to God for a lot of things and I do thank him.

God bless you. I am adding you to my intentions when I say the Rosary at night.

Thanks! I appreciate it.

In fact, I appreciate everyone’s prayers.