The Nature of Sex and the Effects of Religion on Sexuality

[blacktiger057]

Have you all noticed a simple fact? If you have a picture of a beautiful female dog and bring it to a dog, he will not be interested at all. Dogs are not playboys. Not that they don’t love female dogs, they love them tremendously, but they will not be interested in the picture, in pornography. To create pornography you need saints and religion. First repress the sexual instinct, the natural instinct, and tell people that it is wrong and evil. When they repress their sexual instinct, the repressed instinct finds an outlet.

Now it is difficult to go and enjoy watching beautiful women passing down the road. SO what to do? Lock yourself in your room and look at Playboy magazine. That is safer; nobody comes to know about it. You can hide your Playboy magazine inside the Bible and pretend you are reading the Bible.

Only man is pornogrpahic. No other animal is pornographic. These are simple facts.

And who has made man pornographic? Primitives are not interested in pornography-still are not. Women are naked and move about naked without any fear. So what type of civilazation do you say you are living in? A woman cannot walk down the street without being pinched on the bottom, without being treated inhumanely. A woman cannot walk in the night alone-and this is civilazation? People are just obssessed with sex 24/7.

Who has given this obsession to man? Animals are sexual but not obsessed; they are natural. When sex becomes an obsession it takes perverted forms, and these perverted forms are rooted in the moralizers and their teachings.

The so-called religious people have never trusted human nature. They talk about trust, but they have never trusted life. They trust rules, laws; they never trust love. They talk about God, but that is just empty talk. They trust in the police, in the courts. They trust in hellfire. They trust in creating fear and in creating greed. If you are saintly and good and moral, you will have heaven and all the pleasures of paradise. Or, if you are not moral, then you will suffer hellfire- eternally, remember, forever and ever. These things are rooted in greed and fear. These people have been manipulating the human mind through fear and greed.

I trust you and I trust your nature. I trust animal nature. If nature is allowed its own course, yes, there will be a little anger sometimes and there will be a little flaring up, too, but nothing is wrong in it. It is human and beautiful. But there will be no war.

You have lived with rules and norms, and what has happened? Look at the state of humanity today. It is a neurotic earth, a great madhouse. This is what happened out of your norms, your idealism, perfectionism, morality. Out of all your commandments this has happened- the whole earth has turned into a neurotic campground, a big madhouse. And still you are afraid of hellfire, and still you go on. This a a vicious circle.

I’ll stop here for now…

 

[blacktiger057]

Are you going to start debating or do you agree with me now?

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Speaking for myself, I disagree with you completely. You have it all wrong, so much so that I would have to write an entire book (and I’d give you references, footnotes, evidence etc.) to refute your erroneous assumptions and conclusions. I’m sorry, but I am sure there is already plenty of material that addresses you variously, point to point–I’d suggest you check out G. K. Chesteron at least, and C.S. Lewis most certainly especially Mere Christianity. But I think that you need a good spiritual director and (this is only a suggestion) take a training course and then work in a hospice center, because right now you are being tried by ‘life’ issues and you need to balance yourself out by seeing, and helping, people deal with ‘end of life’ issues. It has a way of putting all one’s ‘sensual’ and ‘argumentative’ questions into perspective. May God open your eyes to His truth and your heart to His teachings. Do not despair and do not be troubled.

 

[JimG]

I trust you and I trust your nature. I trust animal nature. If nature is allowed its own course, yes, there will be a little anger sometimes and there will be a little flaring up, too, but nothing is wrong in it. It is human and beautiful. But there will be no war.

I’m trying to think of any particular time in recorded history when war has been entirely avoided by the simple expedient of letting nature take its own course. Could you formulate this into a national policy? Or even a personal policy for avoiding war?

 

[blacktiger057]

I’m trying to think of any particular time in recorded history when war has been entirely avoided by the simple expedient of letting nature take its own course. Could you formulate this into a national policy? Or even a personal policy for avoiding war?

Look at wild life…do you see any war there? The animals prove my point. History as we know it has always been repressed and organized societies, which is why most of history is war. In the past 3,000 years we have had 5,000 wars.

 

[blacktiger057]

Speaking for myself, I disagree with you completely. You have it all wrong, so much so that I would have to write an entire book (and I’d give you references, footnotes, evidence etc.) to refute your erroneous assumptions and conclusions. I’m sorry, but I am sure there is already plenty of material that addresses you variously, point to point–I’d suggest you check out G. K. Chesteron at least, and C.S. Lewis most certainly especially Mere Christianity. But I think that you need a good spiritual director and (this is only a suggestion) take a training course and then work in a hospice center, because right now you are being tried by ‘life’ issues and you need to balance yourself out by seeing, and helping, people deal with ‘end of life’ issues. It has a way of putting all one’s ‘sensual’ and ‘argumentative’ questions into perspective. May God open your eyes to His truth and your heart to His teachings. Do not despair and do not be troubled.

Yes, you say I’m wrong…so back up what you have to say like I did and I’ll actually consider your thoughts.

 

[TOP]

Look at wild life…do you see any war there? The animals prove my point. History as we know it has always been repressed and organized societies, which is why most of history is war. In the past 3,000 years we have had 5,000 wars.

Yes I have seen chimps use tools to kill in an organized fashion. They also get drunk . monkeys have a week long party eating the firmented fruit of a certain tree in the wild. Crazy monkeys! Tim

 

[JimG]

Look at wild life…do you see any war there? The animals prove my point. History as we know it has always been repressed and organized societies, which is why most of history is war. In the past 3,000 years we have had 5,000 wars.

Humans are not solely animals. Even chimps hardly ever participate in internet discussion forums. I still don’t see what your recommendation would be. We should all abandon civilization and live like animals?

 

[blacktiger057]

Yes I have seen chimps use tools to kill in an organized fashion. They also get drunk . monkeys have a week long party eating the firmented fruit of a certain tree in the wild. Crazy monkeys! Tim

Yes, I said there is some individual fighting…but those aren’t wars. They are used as an absolute means for survival and are only natural.

 

[blacktiger057]

Humans are not solely animals. Even chimps hardly ever participate in internet discussion forums. I still don’t see what your recommendation would be. We should all abandon civilization and live like animals?

No, that would also be impossible now a days. But what I’m saying is think of how much peace there would be if we never repressed anything. And if we lived more naturally, without all the technology…it would be almost utopian. But having nothing repressed would cause alot of fighting to stop as it is. That is what we should do about it instead of letting this vicious circle continue.

 

[az_4_faith]

Everyone - please know that Blacktiger057 has listed my user name in the title of this thread without my permission.

 

[TOP]

Yes, I said there is some individual fighting…but those aren’t wars. They are used as an absolute means for survival and are only natural.

No , these are organized bands going after rival bands. The top people in the study of chimps agree. Do I have to get drunk monkey pictures too? Tim

janegoodall.org/chimp_central/default.asp

 

[blacktiger057]

Everyone - please know that Blacktiger057 has listed my user name in the title of this thread without my permission.

What are you talking about? You are the one who said go make another thread so that you could support your opinion without disrupting the previous thread we were in…so yeah, you are the one who told me to make this a thread. But still, no one has stated why they disagree with me…

 

[blacktiger057]

No , these are organized bands going after rival bands. The top people in the study of chimps agree. Do I have to get drunk monkey pictures too? Tim

janegoodall.org/chimp_central/default.asp

What does drunk monkeys have to do with anything? No, they aren’t world monkey wars. They don’t have bombs. They are in a fight for survival, and when the conflict is settled they let it be. Sometimes when animals fight neither sides have fatalities. It is never like that when people fight. And people hold grudges, too.

 

[TOP]

Drunk monkeys are copied in an early form of Kung Fu. Which was generated by buddist monks for human warfare. Can’t get more related then that.. And in these wars between chimp bands, there is fatalities. If I can follow your logic, you can follow mine.Tim

 

[SemperFidelis]

What does drunk monkeys have to do with anything? No, they aren’t world monkey wars. They don’t have bombs. They are in a fight for survival, and when the conflict is settled they let it be. Sometimes when animals fight neither sides have fatalities. It is never like that when people fight. And people hold grudges, too.

There aren’t “world monkey wars” because monkeys don’t have the technological means to able to participate in one. Monkeys fight and sometimes kill each other, just on a smaller scale then we do because they don’t have the means otherwise. When monkeys fight it is over a disagreement or resources, just like human wars. Their resources are food, etc. Because we are more advanced our resources are other things. Monkeys don’t have bombs because they are aren’t smart enought to be able to build them or employ them if they had them. Their fight for survival is the same fight for survival humans face, just on a different scale and in different ways because we are you guessed it - different. Comparing humans to monkeys or any other animal is ridiculous because humans are DIFFERENT than any other animal on the planet. God placed Adam and Eve in a dominion over animals for a reason. Give up on this utopian ideal because it is neither possible or achievable, history proves that. People are imperfect so it could never work. Communism was supposed to be a utopian society of sorts and ask Marx, Lenin, or Stalin how that worked out.

 

[TOP]

You see the world as a “nuerotic campground”. As a person who has seen a tender and caring side of some people, esp. one who saved my life, I know they uphold the world. Most of which started with a strict form of discipline, ie Dr.'s, nurses, Priests… Everything isn’t bad in the world. Tim

 

[duskyjewel]

So what type of civilazation do you say you are living in? A woman cannot walk down the street without being pinched on the bottom, without being treated inhumanely. A woman cannot walk in the night alone-and this is civilazation? People are just obssessed with sex 24/7.

Okay, seriously…where do you live? I have lived in a medium-sized coastal city in California, a huge metropolitan city on the Great Lakes, a tiny rural Texas town, a midsize city in North Carolina, a smallish city in Montana, and a huge suburb of a major metro area in Arizona. I have visited many other places in my life, and never have I been treated as you state in your post, much less constantly. I have rarely ever been in situations where I felt real fear or insecurity, even when I literally lived across the street from federal housing projects…the real ghetto. I deliver newspapers, so I am regularly out at night during the hours when most people sleep (and when most crimes are committed) and still, I have rarely ever felt threatened. And I have NEVER had my butt pinched while walking down a street (except by my husband). The times I have been treated inhumanely, it has had nothing to do with my being a woman, and everything to do with the flaws of the person treating me badly. Your assertion is that all women are threatened in these ways at all times, and after 32 years of walking the Earth, I can tell you that just isn’t true.

Why are we different from animals? Because we are created in God’s image. Of course a higher standard of behavior would be expected of us. We have the capacity to make sex holy, life-giving, and spirit-building. Animals do not. Your philosophy makes us NO BETTER than animals, and frankly, I consider myself way above monkeys or my dog or whatever other animal both in capacity and in value. And I believe that because God told me it is true, through his Word.

Even in the most primitive human civilizations, when there were no sexual regulations, there were battles over choice pieces of land rich in resources. The battle for survival is always there. Your thinking is so flawed, I can’t even scratch the surface, though I have tried.

 

[ltbpoe43]

I’m not sure I really understand your post but here are my observations:

You can’t possibly compare animal behavior to human behavior. Humans have the capacity to be intellectual, respectful, and control their behavior by the very nature of their God given intellect and free will. Animals do not have that capacity.

The norms and rules of a civilized society are meant to be adhered to in order for justice and well being of all to be preserved. It is the abscence of adhering to these norms that causes all the strife you mention - disrespect, perversions, and pain.

The secular decay of our culture does indeed warrant our attention, but the media portrays it day in and day out as the norms. Not so, there is much more good in the world but it just doesn’t catch anyone’s attention - it doesn’t sell or make headlines so no words or air time is devoted to it.

Do not despair my friend, seek out the good news, stay true to the norms and rules, these keep all mankind in a fair and equitable state. We are higher beings of intellect and can and must control ourselves respectfully - to not do so - causes the pain you mention and leads us to despair.

 

[bankerdavid]

Have you all noticed a simple fact? If you have a picture of a beautiful female dog and bring it to a dog, he will not be interested at all. Dogs are not playboys. Not that they don’t love female dogs, they love them tremendously, but they will not be interested in the picture, in pornography. To create pornography you need saints and religion. First repress the sexual instinct, the natural instinct, and tell people that it is wrong and evil. When they repress their sexual instinct, the repressed instinct finds an outlet.

Now it is difficult to go and enjoy watching beautiful women passing down the road. SO what to do? Lock yourself in your room and look at Playboy magazine. That is safer; nobody comes to know about it. You can hide your Playboy magazine inside the Bible and pretend you are reading the Bible.

Only man is pornogrpahic. No other animal is pornographic. These are simple facts.

And who has made man pornographic? Primitives are not interested in pornography-still are not. Women are naked and move about naked without any fear. So what type of civilazation do you say you are living in? A woman cannot walk down the street without being pinched on the bottom, without being treated inhumanely. A woman cannot walk in the night alone-and this is civilazation? People are just obssessed with sex 24/7.

Who has given this obsession to man? Animals are sexual but not obsessed; they are natural. When sex becomes an obsession it takes perverted forms, and these perverted forms are rooted in the moralizers and their teachings.

The so-called religious people have never trusted human nature. They talk about trust, but they have never trusted life. They trust rules, laws; they never trust love. They talk about God, but that is just empty talk. They trust in the police, in the courts. They trust in hellfire. They trust in creating fear and in creating greed. If you are saintly and good and moral, you will have heaven and all the pleasures of paradise. Or, if you are not moral, then you will suffer hellfire- eternally, remember, forever and ever. These things are rooted in greed and fear. These people have been manipulating the human mind through fear and greed.

I trust you and I trust your nature. I trust animal nature. If nature is allowed its own course, yes, there will be a little anger sometimes and there will be a little flaring up, too, but nothing is wrong in it. It is human and beautiful. But there will be no war.

You have lived with rules and norms, and what has happened? Look at the state of humanity today. It is a neurotic earth, a great madhouse. This is what happened out of your norms, your idealism, perfectionism, morality. Out of all your commandments this has happened- the whole earth has turned into a neurotic campground, a big madhouse. And still you are afraid of hellfire, and still you go on. This a a vicious circle.

I’ll stop here for now…

I don’t know where to begin…First, to have pornography, you have to take something normal and turn it abnormal. You have to make a spectical of something, turn it around. Christ is the Word made flesh, pornography is the flesh made word. Pornographic sex is nothing of what real, natural sex is. It’s blown up body parts, bleached, removing what’s natural, adding what’s not natural. Breast implants, tattoos, body piercings. I don’t know if you have access to a high definition television, but if you watch the Discovery Channel in high def, you see pure beauty. Watch pornography on the same equipment, all you see is ugliness. I used to be caught up in that stuff, but when I discovered what true beauty is, it was sooooo easy for me to give it up. True beauty is gazing on my Lord, reading about my Lord, praying to my Lord. Man-made things are not beautiful-they can show you beauty, but are not themselves beautiful. Beauty is not of this world. Beauty is of God.

Now, on to war. There are not real wars in nature, not the scale of man, but did you ever notice that war is not of man, war is of governments, which are man-made. War is of mankind. True, men fight wars, but usually at the behest of their respective governments. And governments usually fight wars over worldly things, not Godly things. We want this territory, or we don’t like how you look. Much of this is because governments deal with the earthly. Men who keep their eyes on the Lord do not war against other men. The problem is that there hasn’t been born a man who can keep his eyes on the Lord 100% of the time.