The need to keep the Sabbath holy

[johnnyjones]

Hey, I am not arguing here! This thread has turned contentious when it was apparent to me that the OP was speaking of the Lord’s day, (perhaps due to English being a second language) calling it the Sabbath, and rightly suggesting that we keep it holy, in accord with Church teaching.

Can everyone take a deep breath?

With all due respect you jumped all over me with capital letters telling me I was wrong when I wasn’t. I think I was entitled to a forthright rebutal which was quite tame. Call for civility when you display it on your end.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

I think just for fun, we could spend this next Sunday abstaining from finding fault in the logic or statements of others. Total surrender being the only way to go. Turn the logical other cheek. CAF is good practice grounds: they can’t physically slap you over the Internet, and there is always someone we can disagree with, to test and purify our own answers. Maybe now would be a fun time to practice?

Hint: the code phrase, “you may be right,” can be substituted in for any other possible response, whether positive or negative.

Note what you didn’t say: if you MAY be right, then maybe you’re wrong. Bwahaha.

Alan

 

[po18guy]

With all due respect you jumped all over me with capital letters telling me I was wrong when I wasn’t. I think I was entitled to a forthright rebutal which was quite tame. Call for civility when you display it on your end.

What caps? What jumping?

 

[po18guy]

The OP merely mentioned that many Catholics do not keep Sunday as a holy day - set apart from the others. This is hard to argue against, is it not? Why don’t we cease fire and let the OP explain more fully, since he/she is from Indonesia and may not speak English as a primary language?

 

[johnnyjones]

What caps? What jumping?

I had the wrong person, my comments were not meant for you. My deepest apologies.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Gal 5:22:

In contrast, the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.

 

[thistle]

The “Lords Day” IS the christian sabbath. Your current post changes nothing. The church teaches that Sunday is a replacement of the OT sabbath to be kept holy. Yes, “obey” the church.

Sunday is not the Christian Sabbath. Sunday replaced the Sabbath.

 

[johnnyjones]

Sunday is not the Christian Sabbath. Sunday replaced the Sabbath.

Wrong. Sabbath means rest day. The day has been changed from the seventh day to the first day and is a fulfillment of the OT sabbath in which we still rest (in Jesus). Therefore a Christian sabbath.

Roman Catholicism

In 1998 Pope John Paul II wrote an apostolic letter Dies Domini,[33] “on keeping the Lord’s day holy”. He encourages Catholics to remember the importance of keeping Sunday holy, urging that it not lose its meaning by being blended with a frivolous “weekend” mentality.

In the Western Catholic Church, “Sabbath” is a synonym of “Lord’s Day” (Sunday), which is kept in commemoration of the resurrection of Christ, and celebrated with the Eucharist (Catholic Catechism 2177).[34] It is also the day of rest. Lord’s Day is considered both the first day and “the eighth day” of the seven-day week, symbolizing both first creation and new creation (2174).[34] Roman Catholics view the first day as a day for assembly for worship (2178, Heb. 10:25),[34] but consider a day of rigorous rest not obligatory on Christians (Rom. 14:5, Col. 2:16).[35] Catholics count the prohibition of servile work as transferred from seventh-day Sabbath to Sunday (2175-6),[34][36] but do not hinder participation in “ordinary and innocent occupations”.[37]

Cardinal Gibbons affirmed Sunday Sabbath as a sign of the Roman Catholic Church’s sufficiency as guide:

Now the Scriptures alone do not contain all the truths which a Christian is bound to believe, nor do they explicitly enjoin all the duties which he is obliged to practice. Not to mention other examples, is not every Christian obliged to sanctify Sunday and to abstain on that day from unnecessary servile work? Is not the observance of this law among the most prominent of our sacred duties? But you may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify.
—Faith of Our Fathers, Cardinal Gibbons, p. 72 [38]

 

[thistle]

Wrong. Sabbath means rest day. The day has been changed from the seventh day to the first day and is a fulfillment of the OT sabbath in which we still rest (in Jesus). Therefore a Christian sabbath.

Roman Catholicism

In 1998 Pope John Paul II wrote an apostolic letter Dies Domini,[33] “on keeping the Lord’s day holy”. He encourages Catholics to remember the importance of keeping Sunday holy, urging that it not lose its meaning by being blended with a frivolous “weekend” mentality.

In the Western Catholic Church, “Sabbath” is a synonym of “Lord’s Day” (Sunday), which is kept in commemoration of the resurrection of Christ, and celebrated with the Eucharist (Catholic Catechism 2177).[34] It is also the day of rest. Lord’s Day is considered both the first day and “the eighth day” of the seven-day week, symbolizing both first creation and new creation (2174).[34] Roman Catholics view the first day as a day for assembly for worship (2178, Heb. 10:25),[34] but consider a day of rigorous rest not obligatory on Christians (Rom. 14:5, Col. 2:16).[35] Catholics count the prohibition of servile work as transferred from seventh-day Sabbath to Sunday (2175-6),[34][36] but do not hinder participation in “ordinary and innocent occupations”.[37]

Cardinal Gibbons affirmed Sunday Sabbath as a sign of the Roman Catholic Church’s sufficiency as guide:

Now the Scriptures alone do not contain all the truths which a Christian is bound to believe, nor do they explicitly enjoin all the duties which he is obliged to practice. Not to mention other examples, is not every Christian obliged to sanctify Sunday and to abstain on that day from unnecessary servile work? Is not the observance of this law among the most prominent of our sacred duties? But you may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify.
—Faith of Our Fathers, Cardinal Gibbons, p. 72 [38]

We must keep Sunday Holy.
We do not have to keep the Sabbath Holy.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

The first precept of the Church:

“To attend Mass on Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation, and resting from servile works.”

EVERYTHING else amounts to a word game, and is not worth fighting over.

Let me call to mind the comparison between knowledge and love. If you go to almost any wedding you’ll hear it:
1 Cor 13:2:

And if I have the gift of prophecy and comprehend all mysteries and all knowledge; if I have all faith so as to move mountains but do not have love, I am nothing.

So if we argue tit for tat about words that have no bearing on our actual behavior and certainly not for salvation, then we are placing knowledge above love. Would you rather be right, or kind?

There actually is a way to be both.

Alan

 

[johnnyjones]

We must keep Sunday Holy.
We do not have to keep the Sabbath Holy.

Sunday is the Sabbath that you should keep holy. Rewriting it different ways does not force the change you oddly desire.

 

[fred_conty]

I’ve noticed that some are saying that the word Sabboth means the 7th day.

While others are saying the the word Sabboth means the day of rest.

Does anyone know?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

I’ve noticed that some are saying that the word Sabboth means the 7th day.

While others are saying the the word Sabboth means the day of rest.

Does anyone know?

fred, this is why I suggested that anything beyond what we are supposed to do Sunday is basically a word game. Somebody has to argue about words without first agreeing on their meaning, but I don’t want it to be me.

Alan

 

[porthos11]

fred, this is why I suggested that anything beyond what we are supposed to do Sunday is basically a word game. Somebody has to argue about words without first agreeing on their meaning, but I don’t want it to be me.

Alan

Shabbat does mean “cease” or “desist” so from a linguistic perspective, it’s quite all right to call Sunday the “Christian Sabbath” where we cease/stop work. We honour the Sabbath by keeping the eighth/first day holy, not the seventh day of the calendar week (i.e. what we call Saturday in English; Romance languages still call the seventh day by a variant of its original Hebrew name, such as sabbatto, sabado, etc.)

 

[johnnyjones]

I’ve noticed that some are saying that the word Sabboth means the 7th day.

While others are saying the the word Sabboth means the day of rest.

Does anyone know?

(Hebrew shabbath, cessation, rest; Greek Sabbaton; Latin Sabbatum).In addition the church keeps the Sabbath synonymous with rest. 2184 Just as God "rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had done,"121 human life has a rhythm of work and rest. The institution of the Lord’s Day helps everyone enjoy adequate rest and leisure to cultivate their familial, cultural, social, and religious lives.122

The Lords Day ( Sunday) replaced the OT Sabbath because Jesus fulfiled the Sabbath by becoming our true rest and we are encouraged to keep it holy all through the catechism. We are to still to keep holy the Sabbath (sabbatical) day. We don’t often use the word Sabbath as Catholics because of it Jewish connotations but we keep it in the spirit of the OT Sabbath. The Sabbath remains and should be kept holy. The meaning poured into the actual day has changed because of the resurrection.

 

[fred_conty]

Thank you for your answers.

So I take this to mean that Sabboth does not equate with Saturday.
Sabboth means rest day. And since Christians do not observe Jewish law, the Day of rest(Sabboth) is now Sunday. So most Christians observe Sunday as Sabboth except for Seventh Day Adventists, and the Jews. And the reason is that Christians have this as part of their tradition handed down to them from the early Church.

But there are many differences and requirements to keep it holy. And this is where disagreements take place, namely how to observe it.

Before Vatican II, we were taught that to do manual work for more than 15 minutes was more serious. This did not include necessary manual work. However office work didn’t seem to matter tho it would not be keeping the spirit of Sunday.

Mass was required and shopping was forbidden except for necessities of that day.

Otherwise it was your day, although it was the Lord’s day too.

I didn’t notice a lot of drinking on Sunday, tho now I do, it was more of a family day…

Sunday in those days was very peaceful.

Just a few thoughts.

 

[thomasf]

I have a long time friend from high school that is involved in some kind of pseudo-jewish/christian sect that still tries to live by the old food laws and jewish laws, and is fanatical about the sabbath thing. To her, the sabbath is saturday and it’s because of a roman/constantine conspiracy to get christians to worship the sun-god that we worship on sunday instead. And it’s sinful that we don’t worship on saturday, we don’t speak hebrew and don’t follow the old jewish customs, etc. She’s pretty adamant about it and no amount of discussion can change her mind. I get very tired of hearing about how horrible we all are for changing things from the old jewish laws etc.

Something that I have found in response to her nonsense is Romans Chapter 14, which talks about the old food laws and the change of worship days, etc. I find what Paul says to be very reassuring and enlightening.

Me, personally, I have to work some sundays. It sucks, but I always try to get to mass on those days and worship and give thanks. But I read what Jesus said about the sabbath laws, and that God set them down because the jews were so hard hearted, and that we as Christians shouldn’t be so restricted by the law because we have died to the law and are new creatures in Christ. The old laws aren’t meant to handcuff us, they were meant to get the stiff necked jews to obey God. As long as we do what we do for Christ, what day we worship does not matter, and as long as we obey God and His church, we shouldn’t have to be handcuffed to these old laws meant for disobedient people.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Me, personally, I have to work some sundays. It sucks, but I always try to get to mass on those days and worship and give thanks. But I read what Jesus said about the sabbath laws, and that God set them down because the jews were so hard hearted, and that we as Christians shouldn’t be so restricted by the law because we have died to the law and are new creatures in Christ. The old laws aren’t meant to handcuff us, they were meant to get the stiff necked jews to obey God. As long as we do what we do for Christ, what day we worship does not matter, and as long as we obey God and His church, we shouldn’t have to be handcuffed to these old laws meant for disobedient people.

It all gets back to the sabbath being made for man, not man for the sabbath.

We are not to be slaves to it.

Alan

 

[johnnyjones]

It all gets back to the sabbath being made for man, not man for the sabbath.

We are not to be slaves to it.

Alan

That is very true, but the idea that some have put forth that the Sabbath has been eliminated or that we don’t keep the Sabbath holy as Catholics is wrong. We keep the Lords day which IS a Sabbath. I admit that using the word Sabbath with some Catholics might be confusing because the word itself is typically connected to Judaism and old customs.

We still have ten commandments. “Remember to keep holy the rest day” is a simple way to say it today.

 

[johnnyjones]

Heres an old thread from 09 about keeping the Sabbath holy. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=322736