I
ialsop
Guest
Thanks for the warning!
Interesting. Isn’t there any good stretching books based on science not occult?
- Status
Interesting. Isn’t there any good stretching books based on science not occult?
S
soma
Guest
Jesus brought in New Age from the Old Testament. His main teaching is love and the Divinity is within. A Christian is making a lot of money as an expert on New Age, but I would say he is just a business person and he found a niche where people will pay to hear his judgements. My question is why aren’t they and the business person concentrating on love and the Divinity within. Christianity is reverent and alive if one listens to the call from inside. The dull habit of preaching, giving sermons, patronizing, condemning or judging others as insufficient is the ego talking about Christ, not the religion of Christ. Descriptions about Jesus are not the spiritual ideas Jesus described. The experience of joy and the supernatural realization of Christ are not about sins, hell or Satan, but the glorious energy of the soul. A healer doesn’t rifle through the lives of others, but brings one from the outer personality to the inner-self arousing one from immaturity and prejudice to wholeness.
This solo Christian mystical journey evolves from location to position, from view to vision onward towards total understanding. It is passed from mind to mind, a flame passed from candle to candle. There is nothing to buy, join or donate. A Christian vision beyond personality opens the eye to a new awareness, cultivating good qualities, internal clarity and introspection. It encourages one to believe the truth that is experienced and not necessarily to join. When one is tired of reading the menu, it is time for the inner spiritual meal to be experienced, a deeper reality beyond the normal worldly existence of guilt, pain and pleasure. Looking from the inside out the veil of ideological and religious conflict is parted giving clues to unity and wholeness.
This solo Christian mystical journey evolves from location to position, from view to vision onward towards total understanding. It is passed from mind to mind, a flame passed from candle to candle. There is nothing to buy, join or donate. A Christian vision beyond personality opens the eye to a new awareness, cultivating good qualities, internal clarity and introspection. It encourages one to believe the truth that is experienced and not necessarily to join. When one is tired of reading the menu, it is time for the inner spiritual meal to be experienced, a deeper reality beyond the normal worldly existence of guilt, pain and pleasure. Looking from the inside out the veil of ideological and religious conflict is parted giving clues to unity and wholeness.
I
ialsop
Guest
NONONONONO. There is ONLY divinity within Christ. Jesus NEVER said their is divinity elsewhere. ONLY in him, not you, not me.
Second, NO! The mission of christ was to defeat sin, satan, death, and die on the Cross form our salvation from HELL. Deal with it, thats what Christ himself showed us.
Third, christianity is not solo mysticism, he built a CHURCH to administer the SACRAMENTS, tat are authentic christian life.
Jesus had nothing to do with the backwards theology you just expressed. U mean seriously, where do you hear Jesus saying stuff like that? WHERE?
P
Path_Finder
Guest
There is nothing wrong with doing something like that, even Push-ups, Press-ups, Hindu Push-ups could be called a form of Yoga.This is a yoga pose.
http://www.a2zyoga.com/img/poses/tadasana.jpg
By your definition, I summon a hindu god every time I stretch my back. So far, the only thing I’ve ever conjured is the need for a coffee break.
And I don’t even do yoga.
Different stretches from different disciplines have different benefits to the body.
We have to be careful not to bear false witness as well.
S
simple_soul
Guest
Oh wow. I just had a thought or maybe more like question so maybe more like a wondering questioning kind of thought.
If Jesus is dwelling in us don’t we then have His Divinity in us? So in reality we do have divinity in us but it is only because we have Him in us. He is our Divinity. I don’t know the exact quotes but I have been told that the Church Fathers taught us that Jesus became man so that man might become god. We also know we are made in God’s image and likeness. We know His image and likeness is Divine how can we be made in His Divine likeness if we do not have some element of the Divine in us?
I thought it was we abide in Him and He abides in us. I also thought the Church is called the. Mystical Body of Christ so maybe it is all about the Mystical.
Hhhmmmm I’m wondering now…
I
ialsop
Guest
Yes. he abides in us. but it is still HIM, even in us. Not our OWN divinity. Elements of the divine? Yes, Intellect. Free will. Immortal souls. Total godpower and divinity? NO.
You have to be careful with this. Yes we share elements of the divine and yes God dwells in us and we are in his likeness. But to say we are thus gods is false. It is still God’s divinity reflected by us. Because without God we would be nothing. And if it were truly our “inner divinity” we could be without God. Without help. Without others. We cant though. Because we are dependent.
P
Path_Finder
Guest
I don’t agree with this, however, I’d say Christian Concepts such as Life is a journey of continual conversion is proper.
We would not know without the Church what Christianity is so to those who have the “loner” approach, I can’t buy it, we would not have the Bible and so on.
However, just by the facts that we have Monks, Hermits, there definitely is the way to seek a personal relationship with God.
I
ialsop
Guest
Exactly. And key thing there is relationship with God, not relationship and devotion to ourselves as God.
S
simple_soul
Guest
Cool! I believe I understand this and get it and for some reason I believe Soma does also. I did not get anything out of what was posted that you and pathfinder seemed to have found.
But any way what do I know. Soma sorry if I miss understood your post.
I
ialsop
Guest
Ok. Well sorry I misunderstood your posts then, or came across as uncharitable n my rebuttal. I guess we agree them!
Same apologies to you, Soma. Perhaps we agree too if simple soul interpreted your post correctly! If he did, sorry about that!
S
simple_soul
Guest
No worries. No offense taken. I did not take it as being uncharitable if it was.
.
R
Rosarydevotion
Guest
Your right about pilates, I just recently discerned this to be true. Pilates is just a fusion of yoga and other things and needs to be avoided.
S
soma
Guest
I think we are here to read, discuss and go deeper in our faith. I appreciate everyone being honest. I feel the Divinity is within us and we don’t have to fear other beliefs, but need to concentrate on our Christianity and go deeper in our personal relationship with Our Lord so we don’t have to be afraid of every shadow. I am a Christian not to be against other beliefs.
L
Lost_Wanderer
Guest
Thank you for giving me more proof that there’s really no pleasing the spiritual warfare camp.Your right about pilates, I just recently discerned this to be true. Pilates is just a fusion of yoga and other things and needs to be avoided.
B
Bruised_Reed
Guest
Oh, please.
I imagine mat Pilates looks similar to yoga but anyone who has started from the most basic Pilates knows they are two different disciplines. I would love to hear how the reformer or Cadillac is connected to yoga. Medieval torture device maybe.So, this ex-New Age converted evangelist now makes his living
telling people to avoid things he’s no longer profiting from. How convenient./church lady
Does this " ex New Age converted evangelist" have a name? I would appreciate the chance to discuss the origins and benefits of Pilates with him or her.
S
soma
Guest
Where there is love, fear does not exist. Jesus started a new age movement and he is not satanic at his core. In my love for Jesus I can accept simple exercises to relax, I don’t have to go around with hellish thoughts judging others.
O
OurLadysServant
Guest
EXACT quotes from the Vatican’s document about New Age and Eastern meditation that was realised under pope John Paul II and Cardinal Ratzinger:
Some of the traditions which flow into ‘’‘NEW AGE’’’ are: ancient Egyptian ‘’‘OCCULT’’’ practices, Cabbalism, early Christian gnosticism, Sufism, the lore of the Druids, Celtic Christianity, mediaeval alchemy, Renaissance hermeticism, Zen Buddhism, ‘’’ YOGA ‘’’’ and so on
Psychology is used to explain mind expansion as “mystical” experiences. ‘’‘YOGA’’’, zen, transcendental meditation and tantric exercises lead to an experience of self-fulfilment or enlightenment. Peak-experiences (reliving one’s birth, travelling to the gates of death, biofeedback, dance and even drugs – anything which can provoke an altered state of consciousness) are believed to lead to unity and enlightenment. Since there is only one Mind, some people can be channels for higher beings.
These ‘’‘SPIRITUAL ENTITIES’’’ are often invoked ‘’‘NON-RELIGIOUSLY’’’ to help in ‘’‘RELAXATION’’’ aimed at better decision-making and control of one’s life and career.
It would be UNWISE and UNTRUE to say that everything connected with the New Age movement is good, it is on the whole difficult to reconcile it with Christian doctrine and spirituality
Some of the traditions which flow into ‘’‘NEW AGE’’’ are: ancient Egyptian ‘’‘OCCULT’’’ practices, Cabbalism, early Christian gnosticism, Sufism, the lore of the Druids, Celtic Christianity, mediaeval alchemy, Renaissance hermeticism, Zen Buddhism, ‘’’ YOGA ‘’’’ and so on
Psychology is used to explain mind expansion as “mystical” experiences. ‘’‘YOGA’’’, zen, transcendental meditation and tantric exercises lead to an experience of self-fulfilment or enlightenment. Peak-experiences (reliving one’s birth, travelling to the gates of death, biofeedback, dance and even drugs – anything which can provoke an altered state of consciousness) are believed to lead to unity and enlightenment. Since there is only one Mind, some people can be channels for higher beings.
These ‘’‘SPIRITUAL ENTITIES’’’ are often invoked ‘’‘NON-RELIGIOUSLY’’’ to help in ‘’‘RELAXATION’’’ aimed at better decision-making and control of one’s life and career.
It would be UNWISE and UNTRUE to say that everything connected with the New Age movement is good, it is on the whole difficult to reconcile it with Christian doctrine and spirituality
O
OurLadysServant
Guest
More EXACT quotes from the Vatican’s document about New Age and Eastern meditation that was realised under pope John Paul II and Cardinal Ratzinger:
But the more one looks within, the smaller the political arena becomes.
Even though it would hardly be correct to suggest that quietism is universal in New Age attitudes, one of the chief criticisms of the New Age Movement is that its privatistic quest for self-fulfilment may actually work against the possibility of a sound religious culture
New Age imports Eastern religious practices piecemeal and re- interprets them to suit Westerners; this involves a rejection of the language of sin and salvation, replacing it with the morally neutral language of addiction and recovery.
once again, it is clear that what is implied when people opt for New Age alternatives is a complete break with the tradition that formed them. Is this as mature and liberated as it is often thought or presumed to be?
New Age is often referred to by those who promote it as a “new spirituality”. It seems ironic to call it “new” when so many of its ideas have been taken from ancient religions and cultures. But what really is new is that New Age is a conscious search for an alternative to Western culture and its Judaeo-Christian religious roots.
In this sense, while it is not Christian, New Age spirituality is not Buddhist either, inasmuch as it does not involve self-denial. The dream of mystical union seems to lead, in practice, to a merely virtual union, which, in the end, leaves people more alone and unsatisfied.
For Christians, the spiritual life is a relationship with God which gradually through his grace becomes deeper, and in the process also sheds light on our relationship with our fellow men and women, and with the universe. Spirituality in New Age terms means experiencing states of consciousness dominated by a sense of harmony and fusion with the Whole.
A Christian’s “method of getting closer to God is not based on any technique in the strict sense of the word.
Christian prayer is not an exercise in self-contemplation, stillness and self-emptying,
NEW AGE AND CHRISTIAN FAITH IN CONTRAST
Since the New Age movement makes much of a communication with nature, of cosmic knowledge of a universal good – thereby negating the revealed contents of Christian faith – it cannot be viewed as positive
it is necessary to signal a warning against the attempt to place New Age religiosity on the same level as Christian faith
cannot be accepted by those who are faithful to Christ and his Church
These practices all create an atmosphere of psychic weakness (and vulnerability)
The achievement of silence can confront us with emptiness
The Church’s one foundation is Jesus Christ
New Age offers an alternative to the Judaeo-Christian heritage
No servant can be the slave of two masters: he will either hate the first and love the second, or treat the first with respect and the second with scorn” (Lk 16.13).
It must never be forgotten that many of the movements which have fed the New Age are explicitly anti-Christian.
Christians must be taught about the true object and content of prayer – in the Holy Spirit, through Jesus Christ, to the Father
Many people are convinced that there is no harm in ‘borrowing’ from the wisdom of the East, but the example of Transcendental Meditation ™ should make Christians cautious about the prospect of committing themselves unknowingly to another religion (in this case, Hinduism)
content of the exercise clearly determines whether it relates to the God revealed by Jesus Christ, to some other revelation, or simply to the hidden depths of the self.
But the more one looks within, the smaller the political arena becomes.
Even though it would hardly be correct to suggest that quietism is universal in New Age attitudes, one of the chief criticisms of the New Age Movement is that its privatistic quest for self-fulfilment may actually work against the possibility of a sound religious culture
New Age imports Eastern religious practices piecemeal and re- interprets them to suit Westerners; this involves a rejection of the language of sin and salvation, replacing it with the morally neutral language of addiction and recovery.
once again, it is clear that what is implied when people opt for New Age alternatives is a complete break with the tradition that formed them. Is this as mature and liberated as it is often thought or presumed to be?
New Age is often referred to by those who promote it as a “new spirituality”. It seems ironic to call it “new” when so many of its ideas have been taken from ancient religions and cultures. But what really is new is that New Age is a conscious search for an alternative to Western culture and its Judaeo-Christian religious roots.
In this sense, while it is not Christian, New Age spirituality is not Buddhist either, inasmuch as it does not involve self-denial. The dream of mystical union seems to lead, in practice, to a merely virtual union, which, in the end, leaves people more alone and unsatisfied.
For Christians, the spiritual life is a relationship with God which gradually through his grace becomes deeper, and in the process also sheds light on our relationship with our fellow men and women, and with the universe. Spirituality in New Age terms means experiencing states of consciousness dominated by a sense of harmony and fusion with the Whole.
A Christian’s “method of getting closer to God is not based on any technique in the strict sense of the word.
Christian prayer is not an exercise in self-contemplation, stillness and self-emptying,
NEW AGE AND CHRISTIAN FAITH IN CONTRAST
Since the New Age movement makes much of a communication with nature, of cosmic knowledge of a universal good – thereby negating the revealed contents of Christian faith – it cannot be viewed as positive
it is necessary to signal a warning against the attempt to place New Age religiosity on the same level as Christian faith
cannot be accepted by those who are faithful to Christ and his Church
These practices all create an atmosphere of psychic weakness (and vulnerability)
The achievement of silence can confront us with emptiness
The Church’s one foundation is Jesus Christ
New Age offers an alternative to the Judaeo-Christian heritage
No servant can be the slave of two masters: he will either hate the first and love the second, or treat the first with respect and the second with scorn” (Lk 16.13).
It must never be forgotten that many of the movements which have fed the New Age are explicitly anti-Christian.
Christians must be taught about the true object and content of prayer – in the Holy Spirit, through Jesus Christ, to the Father
Many people are convinced that there is no harm in ‘borrowing’ from the wisdom of the East, but the example of Transcendental Meditation ™ should make Christians cautious about the prospect of committing themselves unknowingly to another religion (in this case, Hinduism)
content of the exercise clearly determines whether it relates to the God revealed by Jesus Christ, to some other revelation, or simply to the hidden depths of the self.
O
OurLadysServant
Guest
More EXACT quotes from the Vatican’s document about New Age and Eastern meditation that was realised under pope John Paul II and Cardinal Ratzinger:
The important thing to note is that God is reduced in certain New Age practices so as furthering the advancement of the individual.
It “does not demand any more faith or belief than going to the cinema”,(3) and yet it claims to satisfy people’s spiritual appetites. But here is a central question: just what is meant by spirituality in a New Age context? The answer is the key to unlocking some of the differences between the Christian tradition and much of what can be called New Age. Some versions of New Age harness the powers of nature and seek to communicate with another world to discover the fate of individuals, to help individuals tune in to the right frequency to make the most of themselves and their circumstances. In most cases, it is completely fatalistic. Christianity, on the other hand, is an invitation to look outwards and beyond, to the “new Advent”
But it is a volatile vehicle of misinformation on so many aspects of religion: not all that is labelled “Christian” or “Catholic” can be trusted to reflect the teachings of the Catholic Church and, at the same time, there is a remarkable expansion of New Age sources ranging from the serious to the ridiculous. People need, and have a right to, reliable information on the differences between Christianity and New Age
It has involved a progressive rejection of a personal God and a focus on other entities which would often figure as intermediaries between God and humanity in traditional Christianity, with more and more original adaptations of these or additional ones
Even if it can be admitted that New Age religiosity in some way responds to the legitimate spiritual longing of human nature, it must be acknowledged that its attempts to do so run counter to Christian revelation. In Western culture in particular, the appeal of “alternative” approaches to spirituality is very strong. On the one hand, new forms of psychological affirmation of the individual have be
An adequate Christian discernment of New Age thought and practice cannot fail to recognize that, like second and third century gnosticism, it represents something of a compendium of positions that the Church has identified as heterodox. John Paul II warns with regard to the “return of ancient gnostic ideas under the guise of the so-called New Age: We cannot delude ourselves that this will lead toward a renewal of religion. It is only a new way of practising gnosticism
more often assuming the characteristics of a religion or a para-religion in distinct, if not declared, conflict with all that is essentially Christian”
her members need to do two things: to root themselves ever more firmly in the fundamentals of their faith, and to understand the often-silent cry in people’s hearts, which leads them elsewhere if they are not satisfied by the Church.
It would be unwise and untrue to say that everything connected with the New Age movement is good, it is on the whole difficult to reconcile it with Christian doctrine and spirituality.
Furthermore, at the heart of New Age is the belief that the time for particular religions is over,
. Some of the traditions which flow into New Age are: ancient Egyptian occult practices, Cabbalism, early Christian gnosticism, Sufism, the lore of the Druids, Celtic Christianity, mediaeval alchemy, Renaissance hermeticism, Zen Buddhism, Yoga and so on
The rejection of modernity underlying this desire for change is not new, but can be described as “a modern revival of pagan religions with a mixture of influences from both eastern religions and also from modern psychology, philosophy, science, and the counterculture that developed in the 1950s and 1960s”
Perhaps the clearest example of this, in terms of the relationship between New Age and Christianity, is the total recasting of the life and significance of Jesus Christ. It is impossible to reconcile these two visions.(1
It may well be one of the signs of a “return to religion”, but it is most certainly not a return to orthodox Christian doctrines and creeds
These spiritual entities are often invoked ‘non-religiously’ to help in relaxation aimed at better decision-making and control of one’s life and career.
It is clear that, in theory at least, the New Age often recognizes no spiritual authority higher than personal inner experience
This is a fundamental point which pervades all New Age thought and practice, and conditions in advance any otherwise positive assessment where we might be in favor of one or another aspect of its spirituality. As Christians, we believe on the contrary that “man is essentially a creature and remains so for all eternity, so that an absorption of the human I in the divine I will never be possible
It was particularly strong in freemasonry, spiritualism, occultism and theosophy, which shared a kind of esoteric culture
People can contact the upper or lower worlds by means of their imagination (an organ of the soul or spirit), or by using mediators (angels, spirits, devils) or rituals.
within New Age, there are some common points:
– the cosmos is seen as an organic whole
– it is animated by an Energy, which is also identified as the divine Soul or Spirit
– much credence is given to the mediation of various spiritual entities
– humans are capable of ascending to invisible higher spheres, and of controlling their own lives beyond death
– there is held to be a “perennial knowledge” which pre-dates and is superior to all religions and cultures
– people follow enlightened masters…
The important thing to note is that God is reduced in certain New Age practices so as furthering the advancement of the individual.
It “does not demand any more faith or belief than going to the cinema”,(3) and yet it claims to satisfy people’s spiritual appetites. But here is a central question: just what is meant by spirituality in a New Age context? The answer is the key to unlocking some of the differences between the Christian tradition and much of what can be called New Age. Some versions of New Age harness the powers of nature and seek to communicate with another world to discover the fate of individuals, to help individuals tune in to the right frequency to make the most of themselves and their circumstances. In most cases, it is completely fatalistic. Christianity, on the other hand, is an invitation to look outwards and beyond, to the “new Advent”
But it is a volatile vehicle of misinformation on so many aspects of religion: not all that is labelled “Christian” or “Catholic” can be trusted to reflect the teachings of the Catholic Church and, at the same time, there is a remarkable expansion of New Age sources ranging from the serious to the ridiculous. People need, and have a right to, reliable information on the differences between Christianity and New Age
It has involved a progressive rejection of a personal God and a focus on other entities which would often figure as intermediaries between God and humanity in traditional Christianity, with more and more original adaptations of these or additional ones
Even if it can be admitted that New Age religiosity in some way responds to the legitimate spiritual longing of human nature, it must be acknowledged that its attempts to do so run counter to Christian revelation. In Western culture in particular, the appeal of “alternative” approaches to spirituality is very strong. On the one hand, new forms of psychological affirmation of the individual have be
An adequate Christian discernment of New Age thought and practice cannot fail to recognize that, like second and third century gnosticism, it represents something of a compendium of positions that the Church has identified as heterodox. John Paul II warns with regard to the “return of ancient gnostic ideas under the guise of the so-called New Age: We cannot delude ourselves that this will lead toward a renewal of religion. It is only a new way of practising gnosticism
more often assuming the characteristics of a religion or a para-religion in distinct, if not declared, conflict with all that is essentially Christian”
her members need to do two things: to root themselves ever more firmly in the fundamentals of their faith, and to understand the often-silent cry in people’s hearts, which leads them elsewhere if they are not satisfied by the Church.
It would be unwise and untrue to say that everything connected with the New Age movement is good, it is on the whole difficult to reconcile it with Christian doctrine and spirituality.
Furthermore, at the heart of New Age is the belief that the time for particular religions is over,
. Some of the traditions which flow into New Age are: ancient Egyptian occult practices, Cabbalism, early Christian gnosticism, Sufism, the lore of the Druids, Celtic Christianity, mediaeval alchemy, Renaissance hermeticism, Zen Buddhism, Yoga and so on
The rejection of modernity underlying this desire for change is not new, but can be described as “a modern revival of pagan religions with a mixture of influences from both eastern religions and also from modern psychology, philosophy, science, and the counterculture that developed in the 1950s and 1960s”
Perhaps the clearest example of this, in terms of the relationship between New Age and Christianity, is the total recasting of the life and significance of Jesus Christ. It is impossible to reconcile these two visions.(1
It may well be one of the signs of a “return to religion”, but it is most certainly not a return to orthodox Christian doctrines and creeds
These spiritual entities are often invoked ‘non-religiously’ to help in relaxation aimed at better decision-making and control of one’s life and career.
It is clear that, in theory at least, the New Age often recognizes no spiritual authority higher than personal inner experience
This is a fundamental point which pervades all New Age thought and practice, and conditions in advance any otherwise positive assessment where we might be in favor of one or another aspect of its spirituality. As Christians, we believe on the contrary that “man is essentially a creature and remains so for all eternity, so that an absorption of the human I in the divine I will never be possible
It was particularly strong in freemasonry, spiritualism, occultism and theosophy, which shared a kind of esoteric culture
People can contact the upper or lower worlds by means of their imagination (an organ of the soul or spirit), or by using mediators (angels, spirits, devils) or rituals.
within New Age, there are some common points:
– the cosmos is seen as an organic whole
– it is animated by an Energy, which is also identified as the divine Soul or Spirit
– much credence is given to the mediation of various spiritual entities
– humans are capable of ascending to invisible higher spheres, and of controlling their own lives beyond death
– there is held to be a “perennial knowledge” which pre-dates and is superior to all religions and cultures
– people follow enlightened masters…
- Status