The New Catholic Church? Have the Rules Really Changed?

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TruthSkr

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The story I am about to tell is the absolute truth. I am not making this up.

About two years ago I went to confession and told the priest that my wife and I had sex without intercourse due to certain physical disabilities. The priest suggested I call his office and schedule a private meeting to discuss this in detail. A few weeks later I scheduled the meeting. We met in his office and talked for about 45 minutes. At the end of the discussion he asked me where I had heard that it was a mortal sin for a married couple to have sex without intercourse. I told him I had read it here on this website. He said “but the people on the website are anonymous”. He told me that it was not a mortal sin and he was so sure about it that he was putting his soul on the line by telling me this. I left the meeting feeling elated, that my problem had finally been resolved. This priest has been my pastor for many years. He is a highly respected and trusted man who has never acted in any way that would question his honesty or integrity. So for the next year and a half my wife and I had sex without intercourse.

After some time had passed I came across something that caused to to question what the priest told me so I brought it up again with another priest in the confessional. This priest told me that having sex without intercourse was a mortal sin because it was not procreative. So we stopped having sex again.

Some months later I told yet a third priest that my wife was very upset about being forbidden to have sex as a married couple. This priest said that my wife absolutely had to right to have sex with her husband and that to deny her would be very harmful to our marriage.

And now fast forward to last month. My parish was having its annual Easter confession. Numerous priests from around the area were invited to come and hear confessions. The priest I got was an older gentleman from a parish a few miles across the county. He had obviously been around long enough to know the rules. Because there were not enough confessionals for so many priests my confession was face to face. I told this priest that I had been told by other priests that having sex with my wife without intercourse was not a mortal sin. He said that it certainly was not a sin. He said it was a sin under “the old Catholic Church”. He said it is not a sin under the new Church. I sat there incredulous! I then said “what about sex having to be unitive and procreative?” He said “it is unitive; it can’t be procreative.” He told me that what my wife and I do in our bedroom is our business and not to worry about all this.

I have been raised in the Catholic faith to believe that what a priest tells you in the confessional is what you are to believe. Three out of four priests told me it’s not a mortal sin. Am I to believer there is some kind of “deep state” trying to alter the Church? Is this just a coincidence that 3 of 4 priests told me the same thing? Or have the rules really changed? And if they did, how would I even know? Where can anyone go to confirm the current truth? This whole issue has challenged my faith in an enormous way. I really don’t know who or what to believe anymore.
 
Haven’t finished reading your post yet, but what does sex without intercourse even mean?

Sex is intercourse.
 
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Sex without intercourse is touching each other as would normally occur during sex and reaching climax without penetration.
 
Well, to answer your post, there is no such thing as a “New Catholic Church”. And sex without intent of procreation, if that’s what you mean by sex without intercourse, is a sin and still is one. Does the aforementioned padre, by any chance, have beef with Vatican 2?
 
This is not just one padre. This is three, and from different parishes.
 
They told you right. Your old priest for some reason got that wrong.

Why do you think this is reason to believe there is a new and old Church?
 
When you say “they told me right”, who are you referring to? Three out of four said it’s not a sin. New and old Catholic church is not my terminology. It’s what I was told in the confessional.
 
This sounds more like a case of confusion among the clergy, perhaps as a result of poor formation, than a case of old Church - new Church. I’ve seen a lot of clerical confusion during the process of my conversion and during the 14 years since then.

(Not touching the subject of sex without penetration; it’s not the subject of this thread.)

D
 
Wait wait. I’ve misunderstood you.

Bottom line: Sex, even marital sex, without intent of procreation is a big fat sin. That’s what we teach.

Not sure what to make of what you were told in the confessional. I would have reminded anyone saying otherwise that there is only one Catholic Church.
 
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Well, this amount of clerical confusion is very troubling to me. Three out of four is a serious issue if they are wrong.
 
Wait wait. I’ve misunderstood you.

Bottom line: Sex, even marital sex, without intent of procreation is a big fat sin. That’s what we teach.
No, we don’t have to intend to procreate every time we have sex.
 
Sex, even marital sex, without intent of procreation is a big fat sin.
I’m not sure this is accurate. I think it’s that sex without openness to procreation is sinful, not that sex with the intent of procreation is sinful. After all, a couple in their sixties probably aren’t intending to procreate when they have sex.
 
Well, this amount of clerical confusion is very troubling to me.
I totally agree. The amount of confusion that I’ve seen over the past 16 years hasn’t kept me out of the Church, but it is, as you said, very troubling.

D
 
Dang, apologies for the faulty info. Thats why we shouldn’t rely on the internet, OP.

I would tell you to ask a priest, like I am going to do about all this, but I’m no longer sure about the priests you frequent.
 
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The really awful part is that most Catholics probably do not visit this website. They get their information from their parish priest.
 
Exactly.

I’ve had surgery. No baby making parts left in me. If I got pregnant, the Vatican would be at my doorstep.

But it isn’t a sin to have sex with my husband. As long as that act is “ordered toward procreation.”
 
Hey TruthSkr

First off, I’m sorry that you had to deal with this. No matter what, this priest is wrong. The truth remains the truth even if ten thousand priests say contrary. Remember the words of Saint Paul in Galatians; "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema. "

I obviously don’t know the ins and outs of your situation. What I can say is that non unitive, non procreative, sex is always sinful. The particulars of your situation might change the circumstances though and you need a good orthodox priest, who has a really good grasp of moral theology. I happen to know one and I would be able to give you his email if you’d like it. PM me if you are interested.

Praying for you and your wife.
 
If I didn’t rely on the internet and just listened to my priests I would believe that non procreative sex was not a sin. And yes, I’m not so sure about my priests either, but where do I go? How do I know who is telling the truth?
 
If I didn’t rely on the internet and just listened to my priests I would believe that non procreative sex was not a sin. And yes, I’m not so sure about my priests either, but where do I go? How do I know who is telling the truth?
Well, you could read the source material. Vatican documents are readily available for free online. You could read up on the theology of the body. You could do your own reading of official sources.
 
OP, do you have an FSSP parish near you? I would suggest going to see a priest there and asking him. There is no old church or new church. There is, however, an issue lately with some clergy being more liberal minded.
 
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