The new NEW Mass - Proper Translation

[cathguy]

Good grief, I was not aware that Karl Keating was one of those. The things he says in his “appeal” would get a member suspended here if the same were said against the notion of “Traditionalism.”

It certainly makes things a little more clear.

This is a confusing post. Karl Keating is a good Catholic, not one of “those.” (whatever that means!)

Not very charitable Tim! Yes, Mr. Keating has a preference for orthodox presentations of the faith and Traditional Catholic praxis. So too do most thinking Catholics who stand with the Holy Father. What gives with this hostility to traditional Catholicism… in the traditional Catholic forum no less?

 

[cathguy]

My wife is attending mandatory classes at our church for anyone who has children that will make their first Holy Communion. In this class the Nun who is teaching it is asking people to sign a petition to stop the translation from going forward. She has successfully talked about half of the parents into signing it.
On a better note. Our choir director has brought this up in a more positive light. “This is what is coming be prepared, ask questions but it is happening”.

You need to tell the parish priest this immediately, and if the nun is fired or asked to issue an apology, you need to write the Bishop, and if the nun is not fired or asked to issue an apology you need to write the superior of her order and the Vatican with copies sent to all relevant authorities.

Be RESPECTFUL always when contacting everybody, but do so in writing, and clearly and calmly state that you expect a written reply.

This is AWFUL!

 

[Letchitsa1]

there’s something wrong with that nun. I cant understand why oppose the new translation?

First thing I would wonder about the nun is her age and whether she wears a habit. The reason why I ask this is because, based on my experience, if she is of the Baby Boomer generation/tail end of the “greatest generation” (i.e. born in late 1930s/early 1940s just before the baby boom) and from one of the orders running around in secular clothes, she may well be a part of the “Spirit of Vatican II” crowd. That bunch is still in full teenaged rebellion mode, and they are going to naturally rebel against anything they see as being close to or similar to what they were raised with - which, sadly, they have been in rebellion against since the 1960s. The problem: This isn’t the 1960s and hasn’t been for about 40-50 years now!

 

[Letchitsa1]

Regarding the new translations, I look forward to them. They seem to be a more accurate translation from the Latin than what we have now, and I think that is a good thing. We do not have the luxury of the EF mass in this area. Surrounded by raging and aging liberals - I’m happy first of all to even have mass when we’re supposed to (they always have Sunday mass, but the holy days are more of a tossup) and second of all for a mass that is relatively free of the liturgical abuses so many of them have embraced over the years - gender inclusive language, liturgical dance, and ignoring the revocation of the indult that allowed the lay EMHCs to perform the initial purification the communion vessels being the most blatant here.

I never have understood the whole “Pro multis” thing and how they managed to get “all” out of “many”. Our bishop is of the opinion it was likely done in haste when the Latin was originally translated into English because it was done so quickly. Personally - I’m not sure I agree with him, simply because anybody with a lick of sense and a decent grasp of English roots will be able to figure out the difference between anything with multi in it and anything with omni in it, and supposedly the men who provided the translations which gave us “for all men” out of pro multis were learned Latin scholars. I dunno - I wish I could be as charitable as my bishop in this regard, but I can’t see any other possible reason for it than the translators having an agenda.

One area where I do agree with my bishop, however, is in how the new translation will be received. Generally, I think it is going to come down to the bishops and priests. If they present it in a positive light and take the time necessary to provide the proper instruction on the changes, why they are occurring, etc. - it will be well accepted eventually - the biggest problem will be the generality that people just really don’t like change. If they just allow it to be dumped on people, or they outright fight it, though, there is going to be rebellion.

 

[JReducation]

First thing I would wonder about the nun is her age and whether she wears a habit. The reason why I ask this is because, based on my experience, if she is of the Baby Boomer generation/tail end of the “greatest generation” (i.e. born in late 1930s/early 1940s just before the baby boom) and from one of the orders running around in secular clothes, she may well be a part of the “Spirit of Vatican II” crowd. That bunch is still in full teenaged rebellion mode, and they are going to naturally rebel against anything they see as being close to or similar to what they were raised with - which, sadly, they have been in rebellion against since the 1960s. The problem: This isn’t the 1960s and hasn’t been for about 40-50 years now!

The habit has nothing to do with it. There are religious communities that never had a habit. The issue is that a petition to stop the use of the translation is childish and unreasonable. The translation has to be corrected so that it conforms to the way it was written in Latin. There is not if or buts about that. Obviously the good sister does not understand that there is nothing new being done here. This is not a change, but a correction in a translation. No matter how many signatories she gets, it doesn’t change the fact that the translation has mistakes in it and they must be corrected.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Letchitsa1]

The habit has nothing to do with it. There are religious communities that never had a habit. The issue is that a petition to stop the use of the translation is childish and unreasonable. The translation has to be corrected so that it conforms to the way it was written in Latin. There is not if or buts about that. Obviously the good sister does not understand that there is nothing new being done here. This is not a change, but a correction in a translation. No matter how many signatories she gets, it doesn’t change the fact that the translation has mistakes in it and they must be corrected.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

On the issue of the habit - I would respectfully disagree with you to an extent. Some orders have never had a habit, but I would be willing to bet this is not the case for the average habitless order in North America today. Discarding the habit may not be the cause of the problem, but I believe it is definitely a symptom when the motive behind it is the same foolish human pride that drives the rebellious behavior of this woman and others like her who are still in full teenaged rebellion mode even now that they are in their 60s and well past their teen years. If you doubt me on that - confront one of them with something they would clearly be at odds with and watch how they react. Is their disapproval expressed as a mature adult would express it, or is it expressed in the words/actions of a rebellious, petulant child?

 

[Vir_Iucundus]

I have a good solution for those catholic fellows uneasy with the new translation. If you think the new one do not reflect the original Novus Ordo Missae with fidelity, then is better to have the New Mass in latin. In this way, you contribute to the implementation of Vatican Ii reform, which, in the “Sacrosanctum Concilium” Act, recommends to have the New Mass in latin, or at least to keep those beautiful songs in latin.

 

[ProVobis]

In this way, you contribute to the implementation of Vatican Ii reform, which, in the “Sacrosanctum Concilium” Act, recommends to have the New Mass in latin, or at least to keep those beautiful songs in latin.

Amen to the latter. At the English OF I attended on (First) Friday, the organist played “O Salutaris Hostia” and I was pleasantly surprised that so many knew the Latin lyrics by heart. And this is probably one congregation where the new responses might be a tough sell. Now if they could have the Gloria, Nicene Creed, Sanctus, Consecration, etc. in the Latin, we’d be all set.

 

[cathguy]

No matter how many signatories she gets, it doesn’t change the fact that the translation has mistakes in it and they must be corrected.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

You know what “translation” would be free of errors?

THE LATIN!!

(sorry… couldn’t resist)

You make excellent points. Thank you!

Peace!