The position of those who don’t vaccinate because of aborted fetal tissue

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Can someone explain to me the moral principle behind the objections to vaccinations for this reason. The way I see it is that it was done long ago and what’s done is done.
 
To gain materially and without spiritual gain from a life murdered is disgusting.
 
What’s done is done but it will continue to be done that way(new cell lines from the tissues of aborted fetuses) because eventually the cell lines from several decades ago deteriorate. There was an abortion in 2015 that a new cell line was made from. It’s supply and demand. People keep buying vaccines using human fetal cell lines, they will keep being made that way because it’s the cheapest, easiest way of vaccine manufacturing.
 
redcatholic said:
Can someone explain to me the moral principle behind the objections to vaccinations for this reason. The way I see it is that it was done long ago and what’s done is done.
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First of all, I note that some of the controversy over covid-19 vaccines is based on misinformation or misunderstandings, so the following remarks may not apply.

While the deed was done a long time ago, and what’s done is done, there is still an issue of human dignity and treating human remains with respect. The ongoing use of cell lines from aborted babies amounts to treating them as useful products rather than beloved persons created in the image and likeness of God.
 
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The Moderna and Pfizer COVID vaccine candidates are morally licit according the the US Catholic Bishops.

In a Nov. 21 statement, the president and CEO of the Catholic Health Association, Mercy Sister Mary Haddad said CHA ethicists, “in collaboration with other Catholic bioethicists,” used the guidelines released by the Vatican’s Pontifical Academy for Life in 2005 and 2017 on the origin of vaccines and “find nothing morally prohibitive with the vaccines developed by Pfizer and BioNTech (Pfizer’s German partner) and Moderna.”

 
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Beryllos said:
While the deed was done a long time ago, and what’s done is done, there is still an issue of human dignity and treating human remains with respect. The ongoing use of cell lines from aborted babies amounts to treating them as useful products rather than beloved persons created in the image and likeness of God.
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Would the same argument apply if the cell line was from a born murder victim?
 
Yeah this is what I don’t understand. Anyone I’ve met who doesn’t vaccinate and cites the moral opposition usually is inconsistent in the application of this principle. It seems so remote to me. I don’t like the method but I’m unsure of the purpose of not vaccinating because of this. I’m thinking of many many companies who advanced using immoral means. I say this as I type on my iPhone as an example.
 
Yeah, but numerous pro-life groups have signed off on the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines (and those seem to be the two most likely to be approved for emergency use in the coming months)

The Pontifical Academy for Life, in a Nov. 22 statement posted to Twitter, said based on its own 2005 and 2017 guidance on the origin of vaccines, the academy has found “nothing morally prohibitive with the vaccines developed” by Moderna or Pfizer.

The Charlotte Lozier Institute, research arm of the pro-life Susan B. Anthony List, has listed the Moderna vaccine among the “ethically uncontroversial CoV-19 vaccine programs.”
 
Canvas said:
Yeah, but numerous pro-life groups have signed off on the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines (and those seem to be the two most likely to be approved for emergency use in the coming months)

The Pontifical Academy for Life, in a Nov. 22 statement posted to Twitter, said based on its own 2005 and 2017 guidance on the origin of vaccines, the academy has found “nothing morally prohibitive with the vaccines developed” by Moderna or Pfizer.
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That may actually be an argument in favor of getting vaccinated sooner. I think the next in line (Astra Zeneca - if they resolve whatever went wrong) is definitely unethical. However, given that it is likely to be cheaper (can be stored at higher temps than the others) I suspect that when it is ready it will become the most widely available vaccine.
redcatholic said:
Yeah this is what I don’t understand.
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My reservation is that in the case of the unborn the consent came from someone involved in the murder, but that does not seem to be the argument I was responding to.
 
This thread isn’t really about the Covid vaccine in particular, just vaccinations that do use those methods.
 
it took effort, but my daughter found ethical versions of all of the childhood vaccines other than chickenpox.
 
Is the issue that the child did not donate his/her body to science? If so, I wonder why they’re using aborted individuals and not people who donate themselves to science intentionally. Also, can a parent donate their child’s body to science? Or is this a case where the mother of the aborted baby knew nothing about it & the body was “harvested”?
 
Looking for the moral reasoning of those who specifically don’t vaccinate due to this moral issue. This isn’t a vaccinate or don’t vaccinate thread, nor is it a thread on the covid vaccine.
 
So, would you hold the same position if a vaccine is developed using cell lines from murder victim whose body was donated to science?
 
redcatholic said:
This thread isn’t really about the Covid vaccine in particular, just vaccinations that do use those methods.
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Except that, in this case, we’re talking about a global pandemic and the ways in which we want to shut it down ASAP.
leosfeetq said:
Instead of hating what her cells have become, celebrate her brief life by accepting what she gives to us.
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I would buy this argument, except for the fact that she didn’t “give” anything. Rather, it was taken from her. So, it’s a bit of a stretch to celebrate it.
leosfeetq said:
Get vaccinated and celebrate her life.
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I think that the retort you might hear is “get vaccinated and celebrate her murder”… 🤔
stormer83 said:
So, would you hold the same position if a vaccine is developed using cell lines from murder victim whose body was donated to science?
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I think there’s an additional dynamic that’s in play which must be part of this thought experiment: the reality that the medical community participated not only in the creation of the vaccine, but in the murder of the victim. So, the proper hypothetical might run more like this: “would you hold the same position if a vaccine were developed using cell lines from a victim whom the medical community murdered and then used her body for the vaccine?”
 
No, since neither of the two Covid vaccines use this method we are not talking about that. This thread is about those who don’t vaccinate on moral or religious principles because of fetal tissue. And why that is the deciding factor. More to the point, we all agree it’s wrong to use aborted tissue but why would it be wrong To use vaccines specifically because of that one issue. And does that logic apply to other aspects of their lives.
 
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That’s like a person saying "Thank God I had that abortion a couple months ago so that my perfect baby could be conceived. " It’s just excusing the use the bodies of murdered people against their will. I am vaccinated as I was in the Army. Still, I completely understand why people oppose fetal cell line vaccines and the use of new aborted fetal tissue in current disease research. Living off the bodies of the murdered and unwilling isn’t what I want to have on my soul.
 
Gorgias said:
I think there’s an additional dynamic that’s in play which must be part of this thought experiment: the reality that the medical community participated not only in the creation of the vaccine, but in the murder of the victim. So, the proper hypothetical might run more like this: “would you hold the same position if a vaccine were developed using cell lines from a victim whom the medical community murdered and then used her body for the vaccine?”
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Except that’s not the case since the abortions were not carried out to create the vaccine. They were donated fetuses from abortions unrelated to the vaccine research. And we’ll all know the sad truth that there are no shortages of abortions in the world…
 
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