The Price of Priestly Pederasty

[swampfox]

U.S. Church Sex Abuse Costs Top $1B
Thursday, June 09, 2005
foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C159076%2C00.html

The cost to the U.S. Roman Catholic Church (search) of sexual predators in the priesthood has climbed past $1 billion, according to tallies by American bishops and an Associated Press review of known settlements.

And the figure is guaranteed to rise, probably by tens of millions of dollars, because hundreds more claims are pending.

Dioceses around the country have spent at least $1.06 billion on settlements with victims, verdicts, legal fees, counseling and other expenses since 1950, the AP found. A $120 million compensation fund announced last week by the Diocese of Covington, Ky., pushed the figure past the billion-dollar mark.

A large share of the costs — at least $378 million — have been incurred in just the past three years, when the crisis erupted in the Boston Archdiocese (search) and spread nationwide.

The Rev. Thomas Doyle (search), who left a promising career with the church to help represent victims, had warned the bishops in 1985 that abuse costs could eventually exceed $1 billion.

“Nobody believed us,” said Doyle, a canon lawyer. “I remember one archbishop telling me, `My feeling about this, Tom, is no one’s ever going to sue the Catholic Church.”

 

[Lisa_N]

“It’s because of the media coverage,” said Schiltz, a professor at the University of St. Thomas School of Law in Minneapolis. “The thumb is heavily on the scale against the church.Schiltz said he disagreed with Catholics who contend that many of the newer claims are fake. But he said weaker cases that once would have been thrown out of court are probably succeeding.”

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This is the real issue. The Catholic church has been adjudicated as guilty so any subsequent claims will not be scrutinized or viewed with skepticism. It’s become easy money. That the smaller Kentucky diocese settled for MORE than the huge Boston diocese indicates that the longer this goes, the higher the awards.

Lisa N

 

[swampfox]

“It’s because of the media coverage,” said Schiltz, a professor at the University of St. Thomas School of Law in Minneapolis. “The thumb is heavily on the scale against the church.Schiltz said he disagreed with Catholics who contend that many of the newer claims are fake. But he said weaker cases that once would have been thrown out of court are probably succeeding.”

---

This is the real issue. The Catholic church has been adjudicated as guilty so any subsequent claims will not be scrutinized or viewed with skepticism. It’s become easy money. That the smaller Kentucky diocese settled for MORE than the huge Boston diocese indicates that the longer this goes, the higher the awards.

Lisa N

The lavendar mafia within the AmChurch priesthood has ruined lives and squandered the fruits of the labor of countless immigrants who built a strong Catholic Church in the US. What a tragedy.

 

[Lisa_N]

swampfox:

The lavendar mafia within the AmChurch priesthood has ruined lives and squandered the fruits of the labor of countless immigrants who built a strong Catholic Church in the US. What a tragedy.

Yes and the Rainbow Sashayers are surprised we aren’t welcoming more overt homosexuals with open arms and open Communion?

Lisa N

 

[Anna_Elizabeth]

swampfox:

The lavendar mafia within the AmChurch priesthood has ruined lives and squandered the fruits of the labor of countless immigrants who built a strong Catholic Church in the US. What a tragedy.

Yes, it is a tragedy. And it is why I am sorry that you gave in to the allure of alliteration in your thread title! This has been only minimally pederasty, but is very much the result of the infestation of the Church by homosexuals.

Let’s see how the bishops can once again avoid facing the truth at their meeting this month. If the laity in this country does nothing else, it should watch with close and steadfast attention the supposed audit of the seminaries that we have been waiting for now these three years. Moreover, we need to see that the results of those reviews are made sufficiently public so as to determine which seminaries should receive our support and which should be, if not closed down, at least sent no men for formation from our dioceses.

At the risk of sounding like Pollyanna, or someone about to make lemonade from the proverbial lemon, I do think maybe all this will bear good fruit down the line. Sad to say, the more it costs now, the more confident I am that steps will be taken to see that there’s no repetition. (And that is “sad” to say. )

God bless,

Anna

 

[st_felicity]

I’m sorry, but I think the real price–the one that matters–is the credibility we’ve lost. People have a LEGITIMATE reason to be angry about what happened–and some legitimate reason to be angry about how it has been handled.

Some people will NEVER be able to forgive the Church–but I’d like to know what we say to people who raise it as a reason to dismiss all of Catholicism without coming off sounding bitter, defensive, excusing…What does one say to that valid charge?

(Sorry–I know it’s off topic and in the wrong forum for apologetic questions–ignore me if you’d like )

 

[st_felicity]

Edit to previous post: Or HOMOPHOBIC!

 

[stumbler]

A thought occurs . . .this is in some ways similar to the “Reformation.” That is, valid complaints about corruption throughout much of the hierarchy, bishops asleep at the wheel (or worse), church wealth being stripped away by the opportunistic, the poorly catechized are driven away … you get the idea.

Hopefully, B16 represents the Counter-Reformation.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

stumbler:

A thought occurs . . .this is in some ways similar to the “Reformation.” That is, valid complaints about corruption throughout much of the hierarchy, bishops asleep at the wheel (or worse), church wealth being stripped away by the opportunistic, the poorly catechized are driven away … you get the idea.

Hopefully, B16 represents the Counter-Reformation.

Me too stumbler,with our prayers and maybe a “smackdown” from ROME THings may get better

 

[Anna_Elizabeth]

st_felicity:

I’m sorry, but I think the real price–the one that matters–is the credibility we’ve lost.

I, too, am sorry, felicity, but unlike you, I don’t feel that I’ve lost any credibilty.

People have a LEGITIMATE reason to be angry about what happened–and some legitimate reason to be angry about how it has been handled.

And some people (read: homosexuals), have a legitimate reason to be delighted, since the plans they formulated decades ago are coming to fruition.

Some people will NEVER be able to forgive the Church–

Hey! I’m part of that Church. If they won’t forgive me for something, tuf. They’ll have to deal with that not only now, but in the hereafter. Failure to forgive is Big Time Wrong! Besides, it also hurts the non-forgiver’s health.

but I’d like to know what we say to people who raise it as a reason to dismiss all of Catholicism without coming off sounding bitter, defensive, excusing.

We say, “I think you have other issues, don’t you? When you are ready to discuss them, call me.”

…What does one say to that valid charge?

To ourselves we say, “That’s not a valid charge.”
To others we say the little speech I just gave you!

This also may be of some value when the Da Vinci thing comes out.

God bless,

Anna

 

[swampfox]

st_felicity:

I’m sorry, but I think the real price–the one that matters–is the credibility we’ve lost. People have a LEGITIMATE reason to be angry about what happened–and some legitimate reason to be angry about how it has been handled.

Some people will NEVER be able to forgive the Church–but I’d like to know what we say to people who raise it as a reason to dismiss all of Catholicism without coming off sounding bitter, defensive, excusing…What does one say to that valid charge?

(Sorry–I know it’s off topic and in the wrong forum for apologetic questions–ignore me if you’d like )

Not much you can say to someone with a predisposition against the Church or someone who finds its teachings to be an obstacle to the fulfillment of his or her own desires, except that Christ and the one true Church that He established recognize the fallibility of human beings and the reality of sin and the need for true contrition, penance and forgiveness. They can exercise their free will and use this tragedy to reject the Truth if they wish or to embrace it with an informed and mature conscience.

 

[snoopy]

swampfox:

The lavendar mafia within the AmChurch priesthood has ruined lives and squandered the fruits of the labor of countless immigrants who built a strong Catholic Church in the US. What a tragedy.

Perhaps you could put the blame where it really lies, on the predator priests who molested children and the cowardly bishops who covered it up. What a tangled web we weave!

 

[snoopy]

Anna Elizabeth:

I, too, am sorry, felicity, but unlike you, I don’t feel that I’ve lost any credibilty.

And some people (read: homosexuals), have a legitimate reason to be delighted, since the plans they formulated decades ago are coming to fruition.

Hey! I’m part of that Church. If they won’t forgive me for something, tuf. They’ll have to deal with that not only now, but in the hereafter. Failure to forgive is Big Time Wrong! Besides, it also hurts the non-forgiver’s health.

We say, “I think you have other issues, don’t you? When you are ready to discuss them, call me.”

To ourselves we say, “That’s not a valid charge.”
To others we say the little speech I just gave you!

This also may be of some value when the Da Vinci thing comes out.

God bless,

Anna

All this is great, but what about the true victims. Not one word about them. Why is that?

 

[st_felicity]

Quote:
Originally Posted by st_felicity
I’m sorry, but I think the real price–the one that matters–is the credibility we’ve lost.

I, too, am sorry, felicity, but unlike you, I don’t feel that I’ve lost any credibilty.

When I said "credibility’–I meant our position of compromised believability to people who look at the abuses and the way some of it was handled and see THAT FACT before they can open their heart to much else about the Catholic faith.

The Church is still objectively credible–because it is TRUTH–but a lot of people can’t see past the fact of abuse to see the Truth of the Church.

Quote:
People have a LEGITIMATE reason to be angry about what happened–and some legitimate reason to be angry about how it has been handled.

And some people (read: homosexuals), have a legitimate reason to be delighted, since the plans they formulated decades ago are coming to fruition.

I’m sure you are aware it is not a sin to be homosexual. It is the acting upon and/or indulging in disordered desires in thought or deed. “They” too are created in the image and likeness of God, and I think setting up an us against them camp isn’t helpful.

However, I do agree that some individuals who are homosexuals are organized in their warped desire to change the social fabric–and that they are pleased the Church is wounded.

Also, many things in society support those organized against the Church to further distort the truth and make her message all that much harder to untangle in minds wrapped up in all this strangling yarn of pseudo-reasoning so rampant these days. When there is a legitimate beef with the behaviors of some in authority of that Body–the authority will undoubtedly be questioned by doubters.

How does one combat that in an actual discussion while maintaining the evangelistic spirit and demonstrating the love of Christ?

Quote:
Some people will NEVER be able to forgive the Church–
Hey! I’m part of that Church. If they won’t forgive me for something, tuf. They’ll have to deal with that not only now, but in the hereafter. Failure to forgive is Big Time Wrong! Besides, it also hurts the non-forgiver’s health.

Does that mean don’t try to help them see through their error?

Quote:
but I’d like to know what we say to people who raise it as a reason to dismiss all of Catholicism without coming off sounding bitter, defensive, excusing.

We say, “I think you have other issues, don’t you? When you are ready to discuss them, call me.”

That could work…but I think it’s a bit abrupt and dismissive…

Quote:
…What does one say to that valid charge?
To ourselves we say, “That’s not a valid charge.”
To others we say the little speech I just gave you!

Disgust at some of what happened IS a valid charge. Abuse is WRONG and that much more wrong when done by a person in a priest’s position–sot only for the individual victim–but also for the scandal and specifically the difficulty I see in trying to get people to see through that sin to see the face of Christ in the Catholic Church.

This also may be of some value when the Da Vinci thing comes out.

That is different–that book is NONSENSE–completely and wholly. I have no problem defending the faith against lies. The scandal is a fact though some of the facts are distorted.

 

[Sarah_Jane]

We must pray for our bishops and our priests, and also for the victims.

 

[Anna_Elizabeth]

snoopy:

All this is great, but what about the true victims. Not one word about them. Why is that?

My post was in response to felicity’s. It was item for item. The fact that you chose to not quote the items, and then complain that another subject was ignored is unfair.

Anna

 

[st_felicity]

I believe the problem is primarily homosexually deviant priests–I believe they are people with warped sexuality who have become priests in an attempt to hide their deviance. Rather than confronting it and offering the burden of same-sex attraction up to God as a sacrifice, they give in to their warped natures and prey on boys because they have fallen into sin. I blame the discernment process of these priests and their spiritual directors who thought of the Priesthood as a career rather than a vocation. And I blame the abusing individuals themselves for succumbing to the lure of satan.

I suppose I could explain it that way to someone–but if they don’t want to see the light of the Catholic Faith through the darkness of some men’s sins–what more can be said?

 

[Anna_Elizabeth]

st_felicity:

I believe the problem is primarily homosexually deviant priests–I believe they are people with warped sexuality who have become priests in an attempt to hide their deviance. Rather than confronting it and offering the burden of same-sex attraction up to God as a sacrifice, they give in to their warped natures and prey on boys because they have fallen into sin. I blame the discernment process of these priests and their spiritual directors who thought of the Priesthood as a career rather than a vocation. And I blame the abusing individuals themselves for succumbing to the lure of satan.

I suppose I could explain it that way to someone–but if they don’t want to see the light of the Catholic Faith through the darkness of some men’s sins–what more can be said?

Yes, felicity. That’s exactly it, and at first I thought you either didn’t see this or were in denial. As to what to say? When in such a situation I say, “Oh, it’s terrible, just terrible how the homosexuals have infested the churches, but it’s even worse for us than for you all, because so much more is expected of Catholics!”

That may take care of it on it’s own. If the implication that all others have such problems gets a response, I am prepared with a list of over 100 Protestant and Orthodox abusers, as well as a reference for data from Christianity Today showing an average of – are you ready?—70 Protestant church accusations of abuse in the 1990s each week!.

As I recall, 24% of the accusations were against pastors!

Incidentally, I used to carry copies of the list of 100+ in the trunk of my car. You’d be surprised how seldom anyone ever accepted for a copy when offered!!!.

And remember, anyone who knows or cares so little about the faith, definitely has other problems with it, ignorance if nothing else. Do your part and leave the rest to the HS.

God bless,

Anna

 

[st_felicity]

Anna Elizabeth:

Yes, felicity. That’s exactly it, and at first I thought you either didn’t see this or were in denial. As to what to say? When in such a situation I say, “Oh, it’s terrible, just terrible how the homosexuals have infested the churches, but it’s even worse for us than for you all, because so much more is expected of Catholics!”

Yes…I do “get it”. I just find it hard to strike that balance between defending and defensiveness–and acknowledging with regret over the scandal and perhaps not coming off in support of the Truth of the Church enough because of my zealousness for the Faith, I overcompensate so not to offend–that balance is difficult.

We don’t aim to “get rid” of people with homosexul attraction. We should aim to be a light toward right reason and the Holy Spirit for them.

 

[snoopy]

snoopy:

All this is great, but what about the true victims. Not one word about them. Why is that?

In response to my own quote, I repeat, what about the true victims. Why does no one want to focus on them? It seems all we want to do is debate whether the predators were homosexual or heterosexual. I believe it is important when speaking of this crime, that we never forget the victims. It really is all about the victims. My friend committed suicide while being sexually molested by a priest. I often wonder, will God give him a free pass into heaven because of being molested by a man representing God and the Catholic Church? It seems to me like he should have a non-stop ticket into heaven. He suffered so much on this earth. I for one never speak about the evil scandals without mentioning the word “victims.” I always incorporate them into the discussions.