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benidict
Guest
well how bout it hisalone. any more questions about snakes on poles and such? 
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eucharisteo
Guest
This thread just made me think about the book of Revelations. Talk about imagery. How does that make you feel? If symbols are so awful, then why is there so much of it contained in this book. If you know your history youāll remember that Martin Luther also wanted to remove it from sacred scripture along with the book of James. He found it to strange I guess.
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KathleenGee
Guest
Berean,
Where do we worship serpents???
Where do we worship serpents???
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Loboto-Me
Guest
This is a question for MY sake more than the sake of the OP, but this is the second time today that Iāve seen mentioned āThe bible being God-Breathedā by a non-catholic.
Now please correct me if Iām wrong but I was under the impression that the Scripture isnāt God breathed but inspired. The Catholic Church though IS God-Breathed.
Do I have this all wrong?
Now please correct me if Iām wrong but I was under the impression that the Scripture isnāt God breathed but inspired. The Catholic Church though IS God-Breathed.
Do I have this all wrong?
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benidict
Guest
well i know one thing kathleen. it is not the serpent being crushed under Marys feet! lol! that one is kindaā¦well crushed
peace 
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eucharisteo
Guest
I do believe you have that correct. I heard a good exerpt about it by Tim Staples I believe it was on CA Radio some time back, months.
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
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Loboto-Me
Guest
The breath of God was breathed only twice in the bible, once to give life to man and once again when Jesus breathed on the Apostles as He gives them the authority to forgive sins.
That says a lot for the importance of the Church
That says a lot for the importance of the Church
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KathleenGee
Guest
I realize Hisalone wonāt understand this, but I think Catholicism is the most humane of all religions. We maintain our humanity. And i say that in recognition of the Churchās past sins and excesses. It is self-reforming. If it wasnāt, we would be gone.
There is such a thing as catechizing through art and environment. But you have to know the Scripture readings to understand that art work. So it is critical that the environment and art forms within a church building catechize correct theology.
My parish has a statue in our church of Christ, but its message is not correct in its placement. The pastor is moving it and replacing it with a crucifix above the altar as we can only come to the Father by picking up on our own cross and following the Crucified Lord, the only Bridge to the Father. When those opposing the move saw the model of the work, then they realized it was about theologyā¦and the pastor was simply doing his job.
I am so thankful that we can express our beliefs beyond book form. And yes, because of Scriptureās propensity to misinterpretation to the point of abuse of disputes, fractures and killing wars among believers, I do see its removal from our humanity and every day life end up as a book, and even an idol in itselfā¦again, considering the bad fruits that can come from the misinterpretation of Scripture.
It is critical we have a consecrated office the Holy Spirit works through in the Church to oversee Scripture. Because the Holy Spirit is working in the Church, that also means He is working through us and our assent and subsequent unity.
The more I study other forms of Christianity, the more I can see we are blessed by allowing authority to discern and guide us, because most want to be left alone and follow their own inclinations and ethnicity, not the oneness we are called to, and a discipline of self denial. Pride comes with the fallā¦
As far as Hisalone goes, I can see he is dear in his own wayā¦
There is such a thing as catechizing through art and environment. But you have to know the Scripture readings to understand that art work. So it is critical that the environment and art forms within a church building catechize correct theology.
My parish has a statue in our church of Christ, but its message is not correct in its placement. The pastor is moving it and replacing it with a crucifix above the altar as we can only come to the Father by picking up on our own cross and following the Crucified Lord, the only Bridge to the Father. When those opposing the move saw the model of the work, then they realized it was about theologyā¦and the pastor was simply doing his job.
I am so thankful that we can express our beliefs beyond book form. And yes, because of Scriptureās propensity to misinterpretation to the point of abuse of disputes, fractures and killing wars among believers, I do see its removal from our humanity and every day life end up as a book, and even an idol in itselfā¦again, considering the bad fruits that can come from the misinterpretation of Scripture.
It is critical we have a consecrated office the Holy Spirit works through in the Church to oversee Scripture. Because the Holy Spirit is working in the Church, that also means He is working through us and our assent and subsequent unity.
The more I study other forms of Christianity, the more I can see we are blessed by allowing authority to discern and guide us, because most want to be left alone and follow their own inclinations and ethnicity, not the oneness we are called to, and a discipline of self denial. Pride comes with the fallā¦
As far as Hisalone goes, I can see he is dear in his own wayā¦
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benidict
Guest
i whole heartedly agree kathleen. if it were not for people like his alone, we probably would not have the chance to examine our own faith like we are able to do. i thank him for that. peace
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KathleenGee
Guest
I think he was a good sport with me and my use of imagery and āthe environmentāā¦sometimes things get exasperating and I have to go into a weird kind of humorā¦like the Jewish mother, āIf you donāt be good, I will stick my head in the ovenā.
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losh14
Guest
If I could see His Face, I would kiss it.
If I could see His Feet, I would kiss them.
I cannot in this life, so I kiss the physical container of what has been reduced to the human form of His Word.
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KathleenGee
Guest
Losh,
That is beautiful sentimentā¦Jesus is The Word.
That is beautiful sentimentā¦Jesus is The Word.
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guanophore
Guest
Both are God breathed, as has been pointed out, God breathed upon the Church when He created it, just as He breathed the breath of Life into man when He created humans.
The Gk. word is ātheopneustosā, the same word where we get the root for pneuma (pneumonia) the process of breathing. The Holly Scriptures are said to be inspired (theopneustos) by God.
This word is never applied to the Church in the NT, and it is only applied to the Septuagint (OT) as the NT had not yet been formed.
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KathleenGee
Guest
What I see lacking in some protestant church buildings is again the void of humanity, the work of human handsā¦
The normal response to truth is the intent to live out the message, and to express beauty.
The Mexican Aztecs communicated through pictographsā¦subsequently the image of Our Lady of Guadalupe ā who stands on a serpent to wipe him out ā is also a manner of communicating a message.
The NW bishops drew from the communication tool of the totem pole to catechize the Indian natives, that are kept now in museums. It is said the Catholic missionaries were very effective in communicating faith to otherwise disinterested natives.
The work of evangelizing does first involve the means of communication, understanding meanings and symbols in deep level. My priest I worked with developed and made the first grammar book for the natives we worked with, formed several emerging faith communities with the natives, and began with Genesisā¦worked through the Old Testament teaching the people the stories, and then proclaiming Christ beginning with Mary, Joseph, the infant narratives.
Doing so also reflects on the Catholicsā relationship to the Scriptures as a people of God, not individual interpretation that fracture.
I used to go into the barrios surrounding my house, and personally came to evangelize the women discarded by their male partners. They had children. For some time, I visited, joked, shared storiesā¦and most of the time I listened and prayed that the Lord would work through me to reach them by my listening. They told me of the Adventists that came through that were maledicting Catholics and the priests. The priest and his partner, were considered the best team in the country. The community of priests were the most people oriented of all congregations in the country. So those who were speaking against us were telling the natives we were idolizing statues.
One day a man came by the hut and insulted them. It was raining outside. I told them right there they were children of God and no one had any right speaking to them like that. They also told me they didnāt like some of the women who were prostitutes, had nice clothes and purses. When I had to go out of town, they would not come to visit the mission. When I came back, people would come to see me. Finally, the women didnāt need me any more, and I saw them going through practices outside to be baptized.
I heard some one say the Protestantsā way of relating to God is looking up to Him and seeking His will. The Jews and Catholics are more as a community of believers, revolving and centering our lives on God. We seek His will every day, but we see also a day in the life, a cycle, and this is also why we have the liturgical yearā¦the rhythms of life incarnating the Lordās Word and Body into every day life.
The normal response to truth is the intent to live out the message, and to express beauty.
The Mexican Aztecs communicated through pictographsā¦subsequently the image of Our Lady of Guadalupe ā who stands on a serpent to wipe him out ā is also a manner of communicating a message.
The NW bishops drew from the communication tool of the totem pole to catechize the Indian natives, that are kept now in museums. It is said the Catholic missionaries were very effective in communicating faith to otherwise disinterested natives.
The work of evangelizing does first involve the means of communication, understanding meanings and symbols in deep level. My priest I worked with developed and made the first grammar book for the natives we worked with, formed several emerging faith communities with the natives, and began with Genesisā¦worked through the Old Testament teaching the people the stories, and then proclaiming Christ beginning with Mary, Joseph, the infant narratives.
Doing so also reflects on the Catholicsā relationship to the Scriptures as a people of God, not individual interpretation that fracture.
I used to go into the barrios surrounding my house, and personally came to evangelize the women discarded by their male partners. They had children. For some time, I visited, joked, shared storiesā¦and most of the time I listened and prayed that the Lord would work through me to reach them by my listening. They told me of the Adventists that came through that were maledicting Catholics and the priests. The priest and his partner, were considered the best team in the country. The community of priests were the most people oriented of all congregations in the country. So those who were speaking against us were telling the natives we were idolizing statues.
One day a man came by the hut and insulted them. It was raining outside. I told them right there they were children of God and no one had any right speaking to them like that. They also told me they didnāt like some of the women who were prostitutes, had nice clothes and purses. When I had to go out of town, they would not come to visit the mission. When I came back, people would come to see me. Finally, the women didnāt need me any more, and I saw them going through practices outside to be baptized.
I heard some one say the Protestantsā way of relating to God is looking up to Him and seeking His will. The Jews and Catholics are more as a community of believers, revolving and centering our lives on God. We seek His will every day, but we see also a day in the life, a cycle, and this is also why we have the liturgical yearā¦the rhythms of life incarnating the Lordās Word and Body into every day life.
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