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Reformed1
Guest
I venture you won’t get an answer that doesn’t either attack sola scriptura or bring up the canon.
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estesbob
Guest
I am at a loss as to what you mean? iI am not in the least bit interested in coming up with personal inteperations of Scripture. Everything i need to know about my Faith is laid out in the Catechism. Why would Christ have left it for each individual to figure things out on their own?Your church has only interpreted, at least officially, a few scriptures. What do you do with the rest of the scriptures?
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YADA
Guest
No I disagree, they do thisbased upon the context from which they learn. The protestant learns to rely upon the ‘self’ as that is the teaching they received from the persons or church in which they are formed… I have to say persons and church beecause protestant christianity is so fractures and an individual can establish their own church with their own theology rather willy-nilly.
The fact remains that the protestant allowed to interpret scripture is not [by and large] deciding for themselves what constitutes ‘scripture’, they accept [from some source] a ‘scripture’ that they are told they can read and interpret on their own. This is a teaching of man. This is the training they receive.
The catholic, is introduced to his christian beleifs God Jesus, and Scripture through the Church, and freely acknowledges it. The scriptures are made available for worship study and reflection. Yes the catholic freely decides to practice his faith, worship and study but they also submit to the teaching office of the church.
The protestant freely decides to practice his faith, worship and study, he just fails to ackowledge a teaching authority [even though] at some point their initiation requires one defacto. ALso a primary teaching [of protestantism] is self determination of ‘truth’ which of course is not true and has led as I noted in another post, a cafeteria of Christian belief that is contradictory of any Truth;
Just to reiterate few examples:
The fact remains that the protestant allowed to interpret scripture is not [by and large] deciding for themselves what constitutes ‘scripture’, they accept [from some source] a ‘scripture’ that they are told they can read and interpret on their own. This is a teaching of man. This is the training they receive.
The catholic, is introduced to his christian beleifs God Jesus, and Scripture through the Church, and freely acknowledges it. The scriptures are made available for worship study and reflection. Yes the catholic freely decides to practice his faith, worship and study but they also submit to the teaching office of the church.
The protestant freely decides to practice his faith, worship and study, he just fails to ackowledge a teaching authority [even though] at some point their initiation requires one defacto. ALso a primary teaching [of protestantism] is self determination of ‘truth’ which of course is not true and has led as I noted in another post, a cafeteria of Christian belief that is contradictory of any Truth;
Just to reiterate few examples:
- Jesus rose fromm the dead
- The apostles hallucinated the resurrection event
- Jesus was born of a virgin
- Jesus was probably the result of a rape by ary buy a Roman soldier.
- Baptism cleanses a person from sin
- Baptism is symbolic and un-necessary
All of the above are beleived by protestant christians depending upon their ‘interpretations’
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estesbob
Guest
Probably because Protestants never seem to able to jusfiy Sola Scripture nor answer the question as to why they use the canon created by the ChurchI venture you won’t get an answer that doesn’t either attack sola scriptura or bring up the canon.
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Reformed1
Guest
I doubt you are a loss at to what I mean.I am at a loss as to what you mean? iI am not in the least bit interested in coming up with personal inteperations of Scripture. Everything i need to know about my Faith is laid out in the Catechism. Why would Christ have left it for each individual to figure things out on their own?
Do you agree or disagree that your church has only “officially” or “infallibly” interpreted a few scriptures?
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runandsew
Guest
We as Catholics can interpret scripture, but if our interpretation goes against Church teaching then we are in error in our interpretation.What do they do with the vast majority of scriptures which haven’t been interpreted by the church?
The Church doesn’t have to interpret every single passage in the bible.
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Reformed1
Guest
What happens when their is some wiggle room in what your church teaches?We as Catholics can interpret scripture, but if our interpretation goes against Church teaching then we are in error in our interpretation.
The Church doesn’t have to interpret every single passage in the bible.
For example, your church has not ruled one way or the other on whether the creation story is describing 6 literal, 24 hour days or using alleogry.
There are Catholics on this board that take both sides of the issue.
The church has not ruled one way or the other, good Catholics are free to believe one way or the other on this issue.
Since they aren’t guided by the church in this area are they not engaging in private interpretation?
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noma
Guest
We as Protestants can interpret Scripture. But if our interpretation comes into conflict with another Scripture (or with that same Scripture), then we are in error in our interpretation.We as Catholics can interpret scripture, but if our interpretation goes against Church teaching then we are in error in our interpretation.
The Church doesn’t have to interpret every single passage in the bible.
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estesbob
Guest
Disagree. There are only a few verses they have specifically commented in but the Cathecism contains the interperation of Scriptire and traditions in its entiretyI doubt you are a loss at to what I mean.
Do you agree or disagree that your church has only “officially” or “infallibly” interpreted a few scriptures?
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estesbob
Guest
Which is why there are 10s of thousands of different Proestant interperations of Scripture. From the Protestant perspective Jesus did not found a Church-he founded ChaosWe as Protestants can interpret Scripture. But if our interpretation comes into conflict with another Scripture (or with that same Scripture), then we are in error in our interpretation.
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noma
Guest
Who gets to interpret the Catechism?Disagree. There are only a few verses they have specifically commented in but the Cathecism contains the interperation of Scriptire and traditions in its entirety
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noma
Guest
Sticks and stones… and floury words. Still it doesn’t address the point.Which is why there are 10s of thousands of different Proestant interperations of Scripture. From the Protestant perspective Jesus did not found a Church-he founded Chaos
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Reformed1
Guest
Interesting, in debates I have heard Sungenis, Pacwa, and Madrid all admit that the church has only interpreted a few verses. None of them mentioned the catechsim.Disagree. There are only a few verses they have specifically commented in but the Cathecism contains the interperation of Scriptire and traditions in its entirety
Regardless, what do you do where there is wiggle room in a church teaching? For example, your church has not ruled one way or the other on the whether the creation story is using allegory, or whether the creation story is describing six, literal 24 hour days.
If you or another Catholic takes one side or the other, they aren’t putting themselves in opposition to any church teaching. So, what are they relying on in this case?
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ricmat
Guest
The catechism was written recently, in a modern historical context, and is less liable to misinterpretation than the ancient scriptures which it is in part the Catechism is actually interpreting. However it could be misinterpreted. Obviously anyone reading the catechism is interpreting it themselves at some level.Who gets to interpret the Catechism?
But as I mentioned previously (maybe in another thread), if I go public with Ricmat’s interpretation, and then the Pope were to come to me and say “Ricmat, you’re interpreting that all wrong, here is what it really means…” I’d say “Yes sir Pope. I’ll follow your interpretation.”
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noma
Guest
But how do you know how to interpret the Pope’s interpretation, so you can go with it?But as I mentioned previously (maybe in another thread), if I go public with Ricmat’s interpretation, and then the Pope were to come to me and say “Ricmat, you’re interpreting that all wrong, here is what it really means…” I’d say “Yes sir Pope. I’ll follow your interpretation.”
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ricmat
Guest
Where there is wiggle room, it is there for a purpose. Usually this boils down to “It’s not important for your salvation, therefore you can believe either way.”Regardless, what do you do where there is wiggle room in a church teaching? For example, your church has not ruled one way or the other on the whether the creation story is using allegory, or whether the creation story is describing six, literal 24 hour days.
If you or another Catholic takes one side or the other, they aren’t putting themselves in opposition to any church teaching. So, what are they relying on in this case?
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Reformed1
Guest
Okay, but when engaging in debate about various topice such as predestination, creation, etc. what do Catholics do when there is no offical church teaching?Where there is wiggle room, it is there for a purpose. Usually this boils down to “It’s not important for your salvation, therefore you can believe either way.”
Do they not engage in private interpretation?
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Randy_Carson
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But what I have written is an accurate assessment.You have completely missed the point of the OP’s lament.
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DeFide
Guest
They merely do not present their personal fallible opinions as Church teaching. They present it as just their opinion (if they even have one).Okay, but when engaging in debate about various topice such as predestination, creation, etc. what do Catholics do when there is no offical church teaching?
Do they not engage in private interpretation?
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Reformed1
Guest
Okay, but the are still interpreting scripture on their own, are they not and if they are, aren’t they engaging in private interpretation?They merely do not present their personal fallible opinions as Church teaching. They present it as just their opinion (if they even have one).
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