The question of miracles - Are there convincing miracle cases?

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Sometime in 1986, There was in Milan a Charismatic type of gathering. There was a little girl who was there with her grandfather. She said to her grandfather, “I hear Jesus, he is calling me. He is telling me to come to him.”
Her grandfather replied, “If Jesus is calling you then you must go to him.”
She got out of her wheelchair and ran accross the sanctuary toward the tabernacle.
 
The Catholic Church’s standard for saying something is a miracle is very high: scientists, including atheists, examine instances and it is on their findings that the instance is declared, or not declared, miraculous.

Here is a quick article about 4 Eucharistic miracles. The writer points out something that still gives me goosebumps: these and other phenomena such as the Shroud of Turin all test as the same blood type: AB.

This may be a video I watched some years ago about Dr Ricardo Castañón Gómez’s investigation into a Eucharistic miracle mentioned 3rd in the article above. There used to be a version with English subtitles, but I can’t find it now. These videos were uploaded back when YouTube videos had to be 10 minutes or less long.

Anyway, if you or a friend know Spanish, you can watch them. He speaks quite slowly and with a lot of cognates (since it is about science) so one does not have to be super-good in Spanish to understand.

It is long, but fascinating 🙂

ETA: Dr Castañón was an atheist at the beginning of this set of investigations 🙂
 
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There are billions of miracles which happen daily, from little things like miraculous cures to the biggest ever thing which happens every day in every church a piece of bread turns into the body of God…but if you don’t want to see them, you won’t. But if you open your eyes and see, they can happen to you. Many catholics (not necessarily saints) have had miracles happen to them but dont brag about it because of humility and non believers. Life in God is full of miracles.
 
Could someone explain to me the major point of miracles? Is it to strengthen the faith of those that already believe or is it to convince non believers or those of other faiths of the truth of God? Or, something else?

Why do you think miracles were so plentiful back in the more superstitious past and so seldom declared today? If there are Eucharist miracles of turning into actual blood or no decay should the church allow it to be scientifically tested today with our much more accurate DNA analysis, etc?

I’ve looked into many miracles and, for me, every single one has either a natural explanation, fraud, or just a statistical likelihood of happening anyway. Not a one has convinced me. Yes, I’m a skeptic but I like to think that a truly unexplainable event by experts would be accepted by me. I’m not adamant that miracles can not occur. I’ve had some very strange experiences in my life but nothing that I could classify as miraculous.
 
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MasterHaster said:
For example, can you choose to believe Muhammed is a prophet of Yahweh?
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yes

to believe is an act, so yes an act is a choice, otherwise it wouldn’t be an act.

to believe with 100% evidence is no longer belief, but knowledge. If the evidence is 99% then it’s still belief.
 
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Pattylt said:
Could someone explain to me the major point of miracles? Is it to strengthen the faith of those that already believe or is it to convince non believers or those of other faiths of the truth of God? Or, something else?

Why do you think miracles were so plentiful back in the more superstitious past and so seldom declared today? If there are Eucharist miracles of turning into actual blood or no decay should the church allow it to be scientifically tested today with our much more accurate DNA analysis, etc?

I’ve looked into many miracles and, for me, every single one has either a natural explanation, fraud, or just a statistical likelihood of happening anyway. Not a one has convinced me. Yes, I’m a skeptic but I like to think that a truly unexplainable event by experts would be accepted by me. I’m not adamant that miracles can not occur. I’ve had some very strange experiences in my life but nothing that I could classify as miraculous.
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That’s pretty much my position.
 
Can you please reiterate the definition of ‘miracle’ you refer to in this thread. You have replied in a somewhat random manner that leaves me questioning where the original poster has asked for, or given a formal definition of 'miracle. The poster I replied to gave one google definition. I have not commented on that definition.
Various posters have given definitions, therefore please specify which one you refer to.
 
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jan10000 said:
Shroud of Turin has been proven a fraud numerous times.
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No. I don’t think so.
jan10000 said:
Fatima is not a “miracle” because no one else saw the sun ‘dancing’. If the sun truly was dancing, it would have been recorded worldwide. Subjective perception by definition is not a miracle.
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That’s interesting logic. Logic I don’t follow. I mean I understand the logic just don’t come to the same conclusion. I don’t know how the event described by multiple people at Fatima happened. I don’t believe the Sun or the earth ever deviated from their natural orbit. But I do believe hundreds of people saw the same thing.
 
jan10000 said:
The problem is that if miracles are necessary to prove Christianity, why are they so rare, if at all?
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Like I said, my faith precedes ever hearing of any of the miracles I mentioned.
jan10000 said:
Why won’t God just exhibit a miracle every day or so?
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Because God is not miracles. God is love. Love is in you & around you all day, every day. Instead of researching miracles, spend as much energy studying love & see where that gets you.
jan10000 said:
Apparently, miracles occurred all the time in ancient times, even by those that were not Christian.
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“All the time” is a figure of speech that is far from accurate. Most of the Bible is void of Miracles. From Genesis to Moses not really any “miracles.” From Moses to Maccabees, not a lot of Miracles.
 
MasterHaster said:
You agreed with tomo-pomo’s post which listed those examples as miracles. Defining “miracle” will be a semantic disagreement. Again, I am pointing out that in my opinion the examples you agreed with encompass a definition of miracle that is too broad. Do you agree that a person converting to Islam is also a “miracle”?
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Miracle has a definition according to the Catholic Church. It is not open to semantic disagreement.
LateranBasilica said:
Such an excellent response.
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That is what I said to tomo pomo.

Your opinion is not necessarily the opinion of the Catholic Church.

Perhaps you care to explain why you are sending this thread down the garden path by asking me if I consider conversion to Islam a miracle.
 
PattyIt, there is no one major point of miracles, other than God sharing His love. He doesn’t have to prove Himself, as most skeptics think is a requirement for miracles to be true.

I’ve been the recipient of many miracles, all had different effects and purposes. I would say no one knows me better than God, so that’s why the reasons for the miracles vary so much in my life. I began to document the miracles, not to prove anything to others or brag, but more for a reminder of God’s love and how it has impacted my life. And if I do share them with others it’s because I feel I am sharing God’s love and it gives Him glory.

The most recent miracles involve the loss of our daughter due to a miscarriage earlier this year. Here are some of them; An unplugged lamp lighting up bright pink twice, picked flowers that were days dead on her grave coming back to life, a lamp in her would be nursery lighting up pink at moments of meaning, having a dream about Scripture and a particular number only to have it happen the next morning (impossible odds that included the place it happened, her nickname, the number on the rock, and the reason and location of the rock.) These are some of the major miracles, there have been several minor miracles as well. I’m very blessed and so thankful to our Lord, He doesn’t have to prove a thing to me, I love Him and believe even without the miracles.
 
Pattylt said:
Why do you think miracles were so plentiful back in the more superstitious past and so seldom declared today?
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Because in the past, we could not scientifically study phenomena, so events which could have had a scientific explanation were thought to be miracles
Pattylt said:
If there are Eucharist miracles of turning into actual blood or no decay should the church allow it to be scientifically tested today with our much more accurate DNA analysis, etc?
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Not only does the Church allow such testing, it requires extensive testing before deeming an event as miraculous, as was pointed out in the article I linked above about Eucharistic miracles which have been tested for DNA, etc.
 
po18guy said:
Rather: I am wondering what proof atheists or other non-believer’s demand in order to hold their beliefs
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I try not to have beliefs. I try to draw conclusions from observations. Sometimes it hard to do this. I think our brains are hard-wired to accept arguments put by people in authority and to fall in with the views of others. I think this must have had an evolutionary advantage in the past. I do think the achievements of science which have even in the past few decades saved more people from painful and early death than all claimed miracles of all time are extremely impressive.
 
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