The Sinner's Prayer in the Bible

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Long story short: I’m at Bass Pro Shop buying a Father’s Day Present. The young man behind the counter is very helpful and polite and a non-denominational preacher. Finds out we are Catholic. The young man says to my husband that he and his wife go to a Bible believing church and in the Bible it says that to be saved is to believe that Jesus is your Lord and Savior.

I’m assuming he’s talking about the Sinner’s Prayer…I looked at my 12yr old daughter whom is standing there and she knows this “sinner’s prayer” is NOT in the Bible, I’ve taught her that in case she is ever asked that question & to respond with “show me that specific prayer in the Bible & yes, I’m saved the Bible way Jesus taught…of water and spirit”… luckily she was zoned out so I didn’t feel the need to get into a long discussion especially since we had been there for almost 2hrs.

If the sinner’s prayer is not explicitly in the Bible, why do they say it is? What scripture could he be thinking about that he thinks says the sinner’s prayer?

Thank you,

Thanks be to God
 
I don’t recall the citation, but I thought this prayer is referring to Jesus’ story of the publican and the sinner, in the gospels. The sinner prays something like “Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner”
displaying the gospel attitude of humility and contrition.
 
An early version of the Sinners’ Prayer is found in Pilgrim’s Progress by John Bunyan, published in 1678.

Ninth Stage. (Chapter 18)
 
The only one you’ll find is in Luke 18.

[13] And the publican, standing afar off, would not so much as lift up his eyes towards heaven; but struck his breast, saying:** O God, be merciful to me a sinner.** [14] I say to you, this man went down into his house justified rather than the other: because every one that exalteth himself, shall be humbled: and he that humbleth himself, shall be exalted.

This is really not much different from the verse that we quote during the Mass when we say,

Matthew 8:8
And the centurion making answer, said:** Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldst enter under my roof: but only say the word, and my [soul]** servant** shall be healed.**
 
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?

Thank you
 
journey00 said:
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?

Thank you
Click to expand...
journey00 said:
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?

Thank you
Click to expand...
Do you need to refute that? There is also a verse that says something about confessing to one another (sacrament of reconcillation), while Christ gave authority to his apostles to forgive sins ‘’…whoever sins you forgive on earth it is forgiven…’’. Why did Jesus recognise that there are sins,and that they are to be confessed and forgiven, if the only way to be saved is by just believing in him? Basically, there would have been no need for him to have shed His blood, the blood cleanses you and makes you pure, ‘’…for nothing unclean shall enter heaven…’’.
It is by believing that you acknowledge your sins,confess and are washed by the blood,therefore saved!!

The other day I saw a poster announcing a christian (though not catholic) seminar…’‘His Blood must not be in vain’’.
 
journey00 said:
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?

Thank you
Click to expand...
That’s not really all that difficult. Remember that that is not the only passage to deal with salvation.

The passage is Romans 10:9-10 and reads…
[9] because, if you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. [10] For man believes with his heart and so is justified, and he confesses with his lips and so is saved.

However, there are many other verses and passages all through the New Testament that pertain to what is need for salvation and this article from my blog may help you see the topic in context.

Who REALLY Preaches “A Different Gospel”?
 
Ok…Yes that all makes sense…it is true that there are more verses in the Bible regarding salvation…No blood shed needed if all that was necessary was confess with your lips that He is Lord.

If he had quoted to you the Romans verse as the sinner’s prayer, how would you have responded?

I’m going to pull out my apologetics books and do some reading.

Thank you everyone.

Peace be with you.
 
journey00 said:
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?

Thank you
Click to expand...
You don’t refute it. You say, “Amen!” because it is God’s revealed truth. And non-Catholics will look at you like. :eek:

As people who do not take a literalist approach to scripture, we realize that in a land under Roman occupation in the first century, to confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord was to deny the authority of the emperor and would likely get you killed. It wasn’t just two people talking over the water cooler at work. It had very real consequences.

We also take the Bible in its entirety, not just that passage alone.

for, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. (Romans 9:10)

To this we say, AMEN!

Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. (Matthew 7:21)

And to this we say, AMEN!

They are both true. If we confess with our mouth that Jesus is lord, we will be saved, and if we don’t do the will of God then we will not get into heaven. They are both true.

We don’t refute the words of the Bible. We say Amen! But we have to undersand the Bible correctly.

-Tim-
 
Of course I wouldn’t refute what’s in the Bible, that’s not what I meant lol! It came out wrong lol. Thank you for the great replies.

Peace be with you.
 
I would like to add, that that is a great prayer extoling the mercy of Jesus.
It is very similiar to “Jesus I trust in you.” For his mercy is what we trust in.

Just a thought.
 
I think that this is the fruit of the mind-set of the 16th century rebels, who rejected the Church and her Sacraments. Instead of “work out your salvation with fear and trembling”, which indicates an on-going reception of the sacraments (and obedience), it has essentially been dumbed down to a single-point-in-time catch phrase. Romans is the center of their scriptural universe and Paul has been referred to as the protestant pope. Little attention may be paid to non-Pauline books, unless they can be twisted to back their twisting of Romans.

Yet, almost 2,000 years ago, the individual twisting of scripture and private interpretation was such a problem that it was condemned in the selfsame bible. Not many “Roman’s Road” believers seem to read and heed the letters of Peter - too confining. Worse than that, they point you back to the Church that Christ founded.

Combine the above with the spirit of individualism that settled upon the early US, and you have the recipe for the “personal Lord and Savior” and the invisible Church. Jesus of Nazareth is most certainly their Savior, but if He were truly their Lord, wouldn’t they cling to the Church He founded for their salvation?
 
journey00 said:
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?
Click to expand...
That’s Romans 10:9, but to take it as meaning that one MUST do this particular WORK of confessing/believing to be saved, or else one goes to hell, is a serious misinterpretation.

Let’s start with that Scripture itself:
[BIBLEDRB]Romans 10:9[/BIBLEDRB]

However, elsewhere Jesus indicates that confessing with one’s mouth that He is Lord is not sufficient for salvation:
[BIBLEDRB]Matthew 7:21[/BIBLEDRB]

So what is the difference between those being addressed in Romans 10:9 and the “Lord, Lord” folks who aren’t saved? The Evangelicals answer that it is the faith of the person in question; in other words, that the “Lord, Lord” group did not sincerely believe that Jesus is Lord and was raised from the dead. But we have to remember that faith is not something that humans come up with on their own. We are not capable of “making” a saving faith or earning that faith by doing anything for it. Rather, faith is a grace, that is, a gift of God.

[BIBLEDRB]Eph 2:8-9[/BIBLEDRB]

So, what the Evangelical is claiming is that God gives a saving faith to one group, and a non-saving faith to another group. That is essentially Calvinistic double-predestination, in which it is claimed that God wills some people to be saved and others not to be saved. Of course, such a notion is ridiculous, and is directly contradicted by the Bible, which clearly states that God wills EVERYONE to be saved.

[BIBLEDRB]1 Timothy 2:3-4[/BIBLEDRB]

Now, EVERYONE includes babies, the mentally infirm, and others who are incapable of professing the Lordship of Christ or believing that God raised Him from the dead. How are they to be saved if they cannot do what Evangelicals demand of them? There’s no good answer to that question, so the Evangelicals read an into the Bible that babies supposedly lose their salvation at a certain age and have to say the Sinner’s Prayer OR ELSE they go to hell. Neither the Sinner’s Prayer nor such a concept of auto-damnation is found anywhere in the Bible and preaching this as if it were the Gospel is spiritual abuse.

So the difference between the Romans 10:9 group and the “Lord, Lord” group is not the quality of their faith; God does not ship junk or suddenly turn around and take away salvation on someone’s seventh birthday. The clue to deciphering it all is that:

[BIBLEDRB]1 Corinthians 12:3[/BIBLEDRB]

What Evangelicals interpret this to mean is that one can receive the Holy Spirit by simply saying “Jesus is Lord.” However, the “Lord, Lord” group is doing exactly that, and they obviously don’t have the Holy Spirit. So what Paul means is that only those who have the Holy Spirit first can legitimately proclaim Jesus to be Lord, that is, to have a saving faith. And this makes sense, given the fact that faith is a gift of God that the Bible elsewhere directly attributes to the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 12:9). It is through the Holy Spirit that one receives a saving faith as a gift. The “Lord, Lord” folks don’t have the Holy Spirit and that is why they don’t have a saving faith.

So now, the big question: how does one receive the Holy Spirit?

We already know the answer to that question is not by saying “Lord, Lord.” That excludes altar calls and born-again experiences of the Evangelical type, in which someone has to do something (like say the Sinner’s Prayer) to earn their salvation. Nowhere in the Bible does the Holy Spirit come upon a person as a result of their making a personal faith commitment to Christ or saying a sinner’s prayer. Rather, the Bible clearly states that the Holy Spirit is received as follows:

[BIBLEDRB]Acts 2:38-39[/BIBLEDRB]
[BIBLEDRB]Acts 8:17[/BIBLEDRB]

These are, respectively, the Sacraments of Baptism and Confirmation as taught and administered by the Catholic Church. Babies are baptized precisely because faith is a grace, a free unmerited gift that doesn’t require any action on the baby’s part–and that gift is given by the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is received by Baptism. To require the baby to grow up first and make a “personal commitment” to Christ is to say that does not receive the Holy Spirit as a gift but rather that one earns Baptism (and thus the Holy Spirit) by having a correct belief system based on one’s human faculties, which is unbiblical and spiritually abusive and ultimately makes men the saviors of themselves rather than the recipients of the gift of the Holy Spirit won once and for all by Christ on the cross.
 
journey00 said:
Isn’t there a scripture in Romans that says if we confess with our mouth that If we believe that Jesus is Lord then we will be saved? How do I refute that?
Click to expand...
That’s Romans 10:9, but to take it as meaning that one MUST do this particular WORK of confessing/believing to be saved, or else one goes to hell, is a serious misinterpretation.

Let’s start with that Scripture itself:
[BIBLEDRB]Romans 10:9[/BIBLEDRB]

However, elsewhere Jesus indicates that confessing with one’s mouth that He is Lord is not sufficient for salvation:
[BIBLEDRB]Matthew 7:21[/BIBLEDRB]

So what is the difference between those being addressed in Romans 10:9 and the “Lord, Lord” folks who aren’t saved? The Evangelicals answer that it is the faith of the person in question; in other words, that the “Lord, Lord” group did not sincerely believe that Jesus is Lord and was raised from the dead. But we have to remember that faith is not something that humans come up with on their own. We are not capable of “making” a saving faith or earning that faith by doing anything for it. Rather, faith is a grace, that is, a gift of God.

[BIBLEDRB]Eph 2:8-9[/BIBLEDRB]

So, what the Evangelical is claiming is that God gives a saving faith to one group, and a non-saving faith to another group. That is essentially Calvinistic double-predestination, in which it is claimed that God wills some people to be saved and others not to be saved. Of course, such a notion is ridiculous, and is directly contradicted by the Bible, which clearly states that God wills EVERYONE to be saved.

[BIBLEDRB]1 Timothy 2:3-4[/BIBLEDRB]

Now, EVERYONE includes babies, the mentally infirm, and others who are incapable of professing the Lordship of Christ or believing that God raised Him from the dead. How are they to be saved if they cannot do what Evangelicals demand of them? There’s no good answer to that question, so the Evangelicals read into the Bible that babies supposedly lose their salvation at a certain age and have to say the Sinner’s Prayer OR ELSE they go to hell. Neither the Sinner’s Prayer nor such a concept of auto-damnation is found anywhere in the Bible and preaching this as if it were the Gospel is spiritual abuse. The only people who go to hell are the ones who choose to do so by intentionally and knowingly committing a grave sin (Heb. 10:26-29).

So the difference between the Romans 10:9 group and the “Lord, Lord” group is not the quality of their faith; God does not ship junk or suddenly turn around and take away salvation on someone’s seventh birthday. The clue to deciphering it all is that:

[BIBLEDRB]1 Corinthians 12:3[/BIBLEDRB]

What Evangelicals interpret this to mean is that one can receive the Holy Spirit by simply saying “Jesus is Lord.” However, the “Lord, Lord” group is doing exactly that, and they obviously don’t have the Holy Spirit. So what Paul means is that only those who have the Holy Spirit first can legitimately proclaim Jesus to be Lord, that is, to have a saving faith. And this makes sense, given the fact that faith is a gift of God that the Bible elsewhere directly attributes to the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 12:9). It is through the Holy Spirit that one receives a saving faith as a gift. The “Lord, Lord” folks don’t have the Holy Spirit and that is why they don’t have a saving faith.

So now, the big question: how does one receive the Holy Spirit?

We already know the answer to that question is not by saying “Lord, Lord.” That excludes altar calls and born-again experiences of the Evangelical type, in which someone has to do something (like say the Sinner’s Prayer) to earn their salvation. Nowhere in the Bible does the Holy Spirit come upon a person as a result of their making a personal faith commitment to Christ or saying a sinner’s prayer. Rather, the Bible clearly states that the Holy Spirit is received as follows:

[BIBLEDRB]Acts 2:38-39[/BIBLEDRB]
[BIBLEDRB]Acts 8:17[/BIBLEDRB]

These are, respectively, the Sacraments of Baptism and Confirmation as taught and administered by the Catholic Church. Babies are baptized precisely because faith is a grace, a free unmerited gift that doesn’t require any action on the baby’s part–and that gift is given by the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is received by Baptism. To require the baby to grow up first and make a “personal commitment” to Christ is to say that does not receive the Holy Spirit as a gift but rather that one earns Baptism (and thus the Holy Spirit) by having a correct belief system based on one’s human faculties, which is unbiblical and spiritually abusive and ultimately makes men the saviors of themselves rather than the recipients of the gift of the Holy Spirit won once and for all by Christ on the cross.
 
Just point out that the sinners prayer has (imperfectly) derived from the Catholic Practice of an Act of Contrition, Penance, and prayer to be united with Christ. It may spark an interest in some Truth seeking Evangelicals, on the other hand it may push the Catholic bashing Evangelicals away 😦

I got this from ourcatholicprayers.com/spiritual-communion.html

Do you feel too busy to make time for our Lord? An Act of Spiritual Communion can help! No matter what your day is like, Jesus can help make it better, or at least more bearable, if you ask him for His help and guidance in prayers such as this one, composed by St. Alphonsus Liguori in the 18th century:

My Jesus, I believe that you are present in the most Blessed Sacrament. I love You above all things and I desire to receive You into my soul. Since I cannot now receive You sacramentally, come at least spiritually into my heart. I embrace You as if You have already come, and unite myself wholly to You. Never permit me to be separated from You. Amen.

The best way to receive Christ is in Holy Communion at Mass. (The picture above from a 19th century holy card commemorates the first Communion given out by our Lord Himself at the Last Supper.)

Yet for those times you can’t make Mass, or can’t take Communion because of an unconfessed mortal sin (for which you can ask for and receive God’s forgiveness in the Sacrament of Penance), you can still reach out to Him by making a Spiritual Communion in prayer!

It is an important part of Church teaching that the consecrated bread (in the form of wafers we call hosts) becomes what is known as the Blessed Sacrament, referred to in St. Alphonsus’s prayer above.

Those hosts not used in Holy Communion at Mass are placed in a special box known as the Tabernacle to be given out later to the sick or the dying who cannot attend Mass, and to be exposed otherwise for adoration in what is known as the Rite of Eucharistic Exposition and Benediction.

You can make a Spiritual Communion such as this one below during Mass, or before our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament, or anywhere else where the Spirit moves you.
**
Oh Jesus, I turn toward the holy tabernacle where You live hidden for love of me. I love you, O my God. I cannot receive you in Holy Communion. Come, nevertheless, and visit me with Your grace. Come spiritually into my heart. Purify it. Sanctify it. Render it like unto Your own. Amen.

Lord, I am not worthy that Thou shouldst enter under my roof, but only say the word and my soul shall be healed.**

You can have your own private “audience” with Christ at Mass in Holy Communion or in Spiritual Communion in front of the Blessed Sacrament! Countless Saints and theologians throughout the centuries have extolled the virtues and great spiritual benefits we can receive from this time spent with our Lord.

Remember, however, that you can “turn toward the holy tabernacle” and receive Jesus in your heart from anywhere you might happen to be, at any time, day or night!

You just need to approach Him with sincerity, humility and a desire to follow in His footsteps in acts of faith and charity. And He’s delighted when we do so! The Baltimore Catechism notes that a Spiritual Communion “is an act of devotion, and one very pleasing to God.”
 
Another thing about Romans 10:9 – the verb tense used for “confess” and “believe” denote an ongoing thing – in other words, if you confess and continue to confess with your mouth and believe and continue to believe in your heart . . . . So Paul isn’t simply referring to a one-time event where you pray a prayer, and presto, you’re saved. You have to persevere in believing and confessing too!
 
So, if a one-time prayer is all we need, shouldn’t it be limited to the exact words of Christ as recorded in Luke 18:13 (“O God, be merciful to me, a sinner”) rather than carry the man-made additions? My impression is that the short act of contrition in Luke is not as satisfying to a non-Apostolic Christian as, say, sacramental confession is to Catholics and Orthodox. So, man added to our Lord’s words and morphed it into a form of public confession, all the while decrying private confession. The only things missing are our Lord’s words of absolution. No one who has ever uttered the sinner’s prayer has ever heard those comforting words. And, even though scripture indicates that we should do penance, no such thing is attached to the sinner’s prayer. I would opine that what man has been appended is a short form of the Catholic examination of conscience. We see from this Wiki example that it begins with the Words which Christ spoke, but man has appended much onto it:
God be merciful to me a sinner, and make me to know and believe in Jesus Christ; for I see, that if his righteousness had not been, or I have not faith in that righteousness, I am utterly cast away. Lord, I have heard that thou art a merciful God, and hast ordained that thy Son Jesus Christ should be the Saviour of the world; and moreover, that thou art willing to bestow him upon such a poor sinner as I am-and I am a sinner indeed. Lord, take therefore this opportunity, and magnify thy grace in the salvation of my soul, through thy Son Jesus Christ. Amen.
Click to expand...
As well, from the second example in the Wiki, we see a remarkable similarity to the Catholic Act of Contrition. I wonder where that came from… :ehh:
Heavenly Father, I know that I have sinned against you and that my sins separate me from you. I am truly sorry. I now want to turn away from my sinful past and turn to you for forgiveness. Please forgive me, and help me avoid sinning again. I believe that your Son, Jesus Christ, died for my sins, that He was raised from the dead, is alive, and hears my prayer. I invite Jesus to become my Savior and the Lord of my life, to rule and reign in my heart from this day forward. Please send your Holy Spirit to help me obey You and to convict me when I sin. I pledge to grow in grace and knowledge of you. My greatest purpose in life is to follow your example and do Your will for the rest of my life. In Jesus’ name I pray, Amen.
Click to expand...
It seems rather clear that with the 16th century trashing of five of the seven Sacraments, that some of the later transformers felt a little flat-footed with the content of their doctrines. Since nature abhors a void, well…
 
journey00 said:
Long story short: I’m at Bass Pro Shop buying a Father’s Day Present. The young man behind the counter is very helpful and polite and a non-denominational preacher. Finds out we are Catholic. The young man says to my husband that he and his wife go to a Bible believing church and in the Bible it says that to be saved is to believe that Jesus is your Lord and Savior.

I’m assuming he’s talking about the Sinner’s Prayer…I looked at my 12yr old daughter whom is standing there and she knows this “sinner’s prayer” is NOT in the Bible, I’ve taught her that in case she is ever asked that question & to respond with “show me that specific prayer in the Bible & yes, I’m saved the Bible way Jesus taught…of water and spirit”… luckily she was zoned out so I didn’t feel the need to get into a long discussion especially since we had been there for almost 2hrs.

If the sinner’s prayer is not explicitly in the Bible, why do they say it is? What scripture could he be thinking about that he thinks says the sinner’s prayer?

Thank you,

Thanks be to God
Click to expand...
I have a New American Standard Bible that is popular with evangelicals. In the back of this bible is a guided tour through the New Testament–it takes you through a series of verses, one after the other, mostly through the writings of Paul, with a dip into John, and then ends by taking you again to the back of the bible with the sinner’s prayer. Here, then, you see how the sinner’s prayer is founded upon selected verses, very narrowly selected, from the NT.

You then say the sinner’s prayer, and magically, you are saved. And that’s it, one more thing crossed off on the list of things to do. “Hmm…well, my eternal salvation is taken care of…what’s next on my list? Oh yes, golf…”

There is nothing wrong with the sinner’s prayer itself; I’ve said it. But it’s not magical.
 
mackbrislawn said:
I have a New American Standard Bible that is popular with evangelicals. In the back of this bible is a guided tour through the New Testament–it takes you through a series of verses, one after the other, mostly through the writings of Paul, with a dip into John, and then ends by taking you again to the back of the bible with the sinner’s prayer. Here, then, you see how the sinner’s prayer is founded upon selected verses, very narrowly selected, from the NT.

You then say the sinner’s prayer, and magically, you are saved. And that’s it, one more thing crossed off on the list of things to do. “Hmm…well, my eternal salvation is taken care of…what’s next on my list? Oh yes, golf…”

There is nothing wrong with the sinner’s prayer itself; I’ve said it. But it’s not magical.
Click to expand...
I see it as akin to changing the oil in your car one time and declaring it to be “once changed always changed.” Like the man says, you can pay me now or you can pay me later…

Truthfully, the Sacrament of Reconciliation is your soul’s oil change.
 
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