The Stoning of Soraya (movie)

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planten said:
** Yes, there is no stoning in Quran. The bibleOT has the stoning and even Jesus prescribed the punishment of stoning. He could not deny that. But he could not have it carried out for fear of the Roman Rulers.

Now Josie is taking special interest in films. I had a film by the title Da Vinci Code which proved that Jesus was married to Mary Magd and he had a child from that marriage too.

Using the films for malafide purposes could be interesting hobby. I as a muslim do not believe in stoning because there is no punishment of stoning in my religious book. I do not want that any one be stoned to death.

But what about the Catholics. Why they do not stone the adulterers when it is the punishment according to both bibleOT and bibleNT. They are disobeying the law of God. It is because of that disobedience that there is too much illegal sex in christian dominated countries. The reason is that the catholics have no punishment for adultery. If there is no stoning in christianity then there is no flogging too. So there is no punishment for adultery for the Catholics and they are in fact permitted to commit adultery.

Is that not so? We Muslims have flogging as real punishment and stoning as illegal punishment. But we have some punishment. I ask the Catholics what punishment they have for adulterers. Please tell. Leave the films alone.**
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Planten I am very happy that you don’t believe in stoning anyone (Thank God), but where does it say in the NT that Christians are supposed to stone people for adultery? You do realize that Christians are under a new covenant with God and as such do not prescribe to the Mosaic laws. Also, Planten for like the umpteenth time the DAVINCI CODE is a fictional book. Fiction means it is not real. God bless Planten, may you soon become a Christian. I will pray for your conversion.
 
planten said:
** Yes, there is no stoning in Quran. The bibleOT has the stoning and even Jesus prescribed the punishment of stoning. He could not deny that. But he could not have it carried out for fear of the Roman Rulers.**

Now Josie is taking special interest in films. I had a film by the title Da Vinci Code which proved that Jesus was married to Mary Magd and he had a child from that marriage too.

Using the films for malafide purposes could be interesting hobby. I as a muslim do not believe in stoning because there is no punishment of stoning in my religious book. I do not want that any one be stoned to death.

But what about the Catholics. Why they do not stone the adulterers when it is the punishment according to both bibleOT and bibleNT. They are disobeying the law of God. It is because of that disobedience that there is too much illegal sex in christian dominated countries. The reason is that the catholics have no punishment for adultery. If there is no stoning in christianity then there is no flogging too. So there is no punishment for adultery for the Catholics and they are in fact permitted to commit adultery.

Is that not so? We Muslims have flogging as real punishment and stoning as illegal punishment. But we have some punishment. I ask the Catholics what punishment they have for adulterers. Please tell. Leave the films alone.
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Hello Planten:

My Christian friends have certainly voiced our collective disdain for stoning and with great validity. However, my real concern is the injustice done toward women under Islamic law. There seems to be a total disregard for their rights as humans to be able to function in society with the same freedoms and basic rights that males have in Islamic societies. To put it bluntly, women seem to get the short end of the stick, as evidenced the the movie referenced in the title of this thread.

There is no question that there were harsher punishments in the Old Testament of our Scriptures for certain sins and crimes. However, as josie L has stated, Christians are under a New Covenant with God whereby the laws of the Old Testament have been set aside along with their harsh punishments. You’ll probably know the story of Jesus asking the person who was innocent of sin to cast the first stone.

We in America left our barbaric ways behind many years ago. We have more humane ways of punishing a person for crimes. Oh and by the way, as Americans living in a democratic society, we only punish crimes against society, not sins. We have had a separation of church and state. God punishes us for sin, not man. That is not to say these don’t in some ways overlap, they do. But not all sin is a crime punishable by civil law.

A statement was made, and I think by josie L., that it is a curious matter that stoning is not mentioned in your holy book and is in our Scriptures and yet Islam is the only one between the two still using this barbaric practice.

Can you tell us why that is?

HC
 
josie_L said:
I am convinced that they know it is intellectually wrong, however, they (our happy in denial Muslim posters) have too much at stake emotionally, to admit the reality of wrong-doing committed by Mohammed. That is my take.

P.S. :takethat: This was the best I could do under the circumstances.
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**Josie, you are again attacking our prophet with wrong doings. Why is that. You are using films too. But when I am thankful to dan Brown for his excellent work on Da Vinci Code, you get upset. That was also a film and may be a fiction after the fact about secret life of Jesus.

That is a revealed fact about the three years secret life of Jesus. The other early thirty (30) years is still kept in secret. God knows how many affairs are hidden in those 30 years.

If you attack Muhammad on the basis of some man made, written material then please be ready to face the similar attacks from non-Catholics on Jesus about his private life. Do not have one way traffic. If you depend on films (videos) to malign Muhammad then face the Da Vinci Code facts too. That is also a film, and a great book, and a great work. We Muslims are not worried if Jesus is married many times and enjoys a good happy married life.

You deny the married life of Jesus. We will confirm and support the good married life of Jesus. Marriage is not a sin as you people might be preaching. The best for you would be to leave off all attacks on Muhammad and also attack on child marriage in some Muslim countries. Because that is not the fault of Islam. It may only be a cultural thing like you have NO MARRIAGE in your christian countries. You people have abolished the marriage and people there do not marry until they have produced an illegal child before marriage.

What do you say about those things.? So do not show us what the Saudis are doing. Let them do what they like, just as you are letting the christians do what they like in western countries. WE do not bring that up to you for discussion here. So why are you so much interested in bringing up the works of the Saudis here??**
 
Hadi said:
so God in the OT was cruel and barbaric…
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Would anyone like to comment on the REAL problem here which is the total disregard for human rights for females in these stonings and other punishments carried out in the name of Islam? Would any Muslim care to comment on why Soraya was treated the way she was in this clip? She was obviously “railroaded” and denied any due process whatsoever. Two witnesses = guilt?! Come on.

I am not aware of any Scripture in which God orders stoning as punishment. Christ stopped the stoning of the prostitute in John and told her to go and sin no more. Just because stoning is mentioned in Scripture does not mean God/Jesus perscribed it.

HC
 
planten said:
Josie, you are again attacking our prophet with wrong doings. Why is that. You are using films too. But when I am thankful to dan Brown for his excellent work on Da Vinci Code, you get upset. That was also a film and may be a fiction after the fact about secret life of Jesus.

That is a revealed fact about the three years secret life of Jesus. The other early thirty (30) years is still kept in secret. God knows how many affairs are hidden in those 30 years.

If you attack Muhammad on the basis of some man made, written material then please be ready to face the similar attacks from non-Catholics on Jesus about his private life. Do not have one way traffic. If you depend on films (videos) to malign Muhammad then face the Da Vinci Code facts too. That is also a film, and a great book, and a great work. We Muslims are not worried if Jesus is married many times and enjoys a good happy married life.

You deny the married life of Jesus. We will confirm and support the good married life of Jesus. Marriage is not a sin as you people might be preaching. The best for you would be to leave off all attacks on Muhammad and also attack on child marriage in some Muslim countries. Because that is not the fault of Islam. It may only be a cultural thing like you have NO MARRIAGE in your christian countries. You people have abolished the marriage and people there do not marry until they have produced an illegal child before marriage.

What do you say about those things.? So do not show us what the Saudis are doing. Let them do what they like, just as you are letting the christians do what they like in western countries. WE do not bring that up to you for discussion here. So why are you so much interested in bringing up the works of the Saudis here??
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Sorry for butting in. I just wanted to get back on topic and let you in on what we want to know so you can properly respond.

We want to know why women do not have the same basic rights as men in Islam. We want to know why, according to Islam, a woman can be stoned to death if she is alone with a man outside her family with no explaination. What if she is raped? She has no recourse if she is raped and the rapist does not admit it. The woman has no defense whatsoever and is tried and punished with no defense. In other words, why are women considered property? Why are women considered less than pure if they speak to a man they do not know for no other reason than conversation? And why these harsh punishments for such things?

I had an American friend once who met a man who was from Iraq and went to his country to marry him with his parents’ blessing. She was unaware of the “rules” and spoke to a man right outside her door. Her “husband” beat her senseless. He broke her jaw and would not let her seek medical treatment because he didn’t want to be disgraced, not because he beat her, but because she disgraced him and he didn’t want anyone to know. Her mother called and of course she couldn’t speak so that alarmed her family. They called the embassy and spent the next 3 months trying to get her back to the U.S. Well, by the grace of God the man released her from the marriage (her father knew people in our government that helped get her out)

She’s back here now and it’s been almost 20 years but her face is still scarred she’s had many surgeries to correct her jaw. I’ve spoken to her at length about it and she has told me that this is almost the norm. She says that not all men treat their wives in this manner, but for the ones that do, there is no recourse for the woman and no punishment for the man because it is seen as acceptable according to Islam. It all depends on the family and the man you’re married to. Some are strict and some are not. Islam allows this type of treatment of women and some are inclined to take advantage of it and be abusers.

Can you tell me why these things are happening? If it weren’t for her parents checking up on her and having connections, she’d probably be dead. Any poor Iraq woman would be dead because it could have been kept hidden without too much effort.
HC
 
josie_L said:
Hey guys, I just needed some cheering up so I posted this for your amusement and mine, it has nothing to do with religion but rather the precociousness of children. Get ready to laugh:

youtube.com/watch?v=Y5zlf2cxj98

I found another one, you’re gonna bust a gut watching this (please note ending):

youtube.com/watch?v=Pn9mE-VvOwo&NR=1
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HA! Those kids are going to need therapy for all the damage their parents are going to do with those videos! 😃

My dad drags out the videos every single time more than two people gather at their house. I think it’s in the parenting manual: Embarass your kids whenever possible, videos are especially helpful in accomplishing this task.

Thanks for the laugh Josie!

HC
 
**Iran regime’s judiciary: A man stoned to death in Northern Iran **

Tuesday, 05 May 2009

NCRI - On Tuesday, Ali Reza Jamshidi, mullahs’ judiciary spokesman in response to a question regarding a man who had been stoned to death recently in the city of Rasht (northern Iran) said, “Stoning was carried out during the Iranian month of Esfand,” which ended on March 20.

Iranian Resistance had previously reported, “On March 5, a 30-year-old man from Pars-Abad of Moghan, northern Iran, was stoned to death in the Lakan prison in the northern city of Rasht. He was identified as Vali Azad, an employee of the Commerce Department. The mullahs’ local judiciary refused to release the body to his family and buried him in an unknown location.”

The state-run daily Aftab-e Yazd reported on Tuesday that a 30-year-old government employee identified only as “V”, was stoned to death in Rasht prison on March 5, further confirming the report.

In another case, on January 13, the mullahs’ judiciary spokesman confirmed reports first exposed by the Iranian Resistance about the secret and brutal stoning on December 26, 2008 of three people in the Behesht-e Reza cemetery in the holy city of Mashhad.

Prior to this, in a deceptive move, Mahmoud Hashemi Shahroudi, head of the mullahs’ judiciary, had announced a ban on implementing stoning sentences. The regime’s judiciary spokesman explained about this clear inconsistency as well as the rationale for implementing the cruel punishment by stoning, and said, “Considering the independence of judges, it is possible that as long as the ban on stoning has not become law, the recommendations of the head of the judiciary would not be acted upon.”

The National Council of Resistance of Iran (NCRI)

ncr-iran.org/content/view/6307/1/
 
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