The sufficiency of Christ

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So, if these things are required, and also granted…then it is a cooperation between man and God, is it not? For how can something be “required” if we do nothing as a result of this “requirement”? I agree with everything you say here…except for your conclusion that the “requirement” is nullified by the “granting”…else why call it a “requirement” at all? Better word might be “predestined”?

At this point, I truly believe you have no idea how to explain this relationship between man and God “sufficiently”.
Okay, so within Reformed theology, we see regeneration and a forensic justification to be an act of God (monergism). But in the life of transformation, we see sanctification to be synergistic. I think we get blurred in our theologies since we see justification differently.

What Is Monergism?
Monergism: In regeneration, the Holy Spirit unites us to Christ independent of any cooperation from our unregenerated human nature. He quickens us through the outward call cast forth by the preaching of His Word, disarms our innate hostility, removes our blindness, illumines our mind, creates understanding, turns our heart of stone to a heart of flesh – giving rise to a delight in His Word – all that we might, with our renewed affections, willingly & gladly embrace Christ. The Prophet Ezekiel inspired by the Holy Spirit asserted “I will give them an undivided heart and put a new spirit in them; I will remove from them their heart of stone and give them a heart of flesh. Then they will follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. They will be my people, and I will be their God.” (Eze 11:19, also 36:26) The Apostle Paul said, “For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction.” (1 Thess 1, 4, 5). I.e. In regeneration the word does not work alone but must be accompanied by the “germination” of the Holy Spirit. And again “…you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God.” (1 Pet 1:23)

The Century Dictionary defines it as follows:

“In theology, the doctrine that the Holy Spirit is the only efficient agent in regeneration - that the human will possesses no inclination to holiness until regenerated, and therefore cannot cooperate in regeneration.”

It means that the very desire for faith, by which we believe in Him who justifies the ungodly comes to us through regeneration – and if anyone says that this belongs to us by nature and not by a gift of grace, that is, by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit amending our will and turning it from unbelief to faith and from godlessness to godliness, he/she ignores the teaching of the Apostles, for Paul says, “…Even when we were dead in sins, [God] hath quickened us together with Christ, by grace ye are saved.” and “…he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit.” (Titus 3:5) And again, “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God” (Eph. 2:8). or if anyone makes the assistance of grace depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, “What have you that you did not receive?” (1 Cor. 4:7), and, “But by the grace of God I am what I am” (1 Cor. 15:10).

It is in contrast to synergism which the Century Dictionary defines as

“…the doctrine that there are two efficient agents in regeneration, namely the human will and the divine Spirit, which, in the strict sense of the term, cooperate. This theory accordingly holds that the soul has not lost in the fall all inclination toward holiness, nor all power to seek for it under the influence of ordinary motives.”

For more in-depth treatment of this topic click here… monergism.com/what_is_monergism.php
 
Okay, so within Reformed theology, we see regeneration and a forensic justification to be an act of God (monergism). But in the life of transformation, we see sanctification to be synergistic. I think we get blurred in our theologies since we see justification differently.

What Is Monergism?
Monergism: In regeneration, the Holy Spirit unites us to Christ independent of any cooperation from our unregenerated human nature. He quickens us through the outward call cast forth by the preaching of His Word, disarms our innate hostility, removes our blindness, illumines our mind, creates understanding, turns our heart of stone to a heart of flesh – giving rise to a delight in His Word – all that we might, with our renewed affections, willingly & gladly embrace Christ. The Prophet Ezekiel inspired by the Holy Spirit asserted “I will give them an undivided heart and put a new spirit in them; I will remove from them their heart of stone and give them a heart of flesh. Then they will follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. They will be my people, and I will be their God.” (Eze 11:19, also 36:26) The Apostle Paul said, “For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction.” (1 Thess 1, 4, 5). I.e. In regeneration the word does not work alone but must be accompanied by the “germination” of the Holy Spirit. And again “…you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God.” (1 Pet 1:23)

The Century Dictionary defines it as follows:

“In theology, the doctrine that the Holy Spirit is the only efficient agent in regeneration - that the human will possesses no inclination to holiness until regenerated, and therefore cannot cooperate in regeneration.”

It means that the very desire for faith, by which we believe in Him who justifies the ungodly comes to us through regeneration – and if anyone says that this belongs to us by nature and not by a gift of grace, that is, by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit amending our will and turning it from unbelief to faith and from godlessness to godliness, he/she ignores the teaching of the Apostles, for Paul says, “…Even when we were dead in sins, [God] hath quickened us together with Christ, by grace ye are saved.” and “…he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit.” (Titus 3:5) And again, “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God” (Eph. 2:8). or if anyone makes the assistance of grace depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, “What have you that you did not receive?” (1 Cor. 4:7), and, “But by the grace of God I am what I am” (1 Cor. 15:10).

It is in contrast to synergism which the Century Dictionary defines as

“…the doctrine that there are two efficient agents in regeneration, namely the human will and the divine Spirit, which, in the strict sense of the term, cooperate. This theory accordingly holds that the soul has not lost in the fall all inclination toward holiness, nor all power to seek for it under the influence of ordinary motives.”

For more in-depth treatment of this topic click here… monergism.com/what_is_monergism.php
If we have no free will pre-justification but suddenly do have it to cooperate with God for sanctification? Not too mention the human will has been violated previously and is now cooperating…

So if free will and predestination can be mixed as we see in Adam and Eve and in sanctification, why not at all the times? According to your theology, it is possible for God’s sovereignty to remain but still have free will…
 
I honestly think it’s a lower view of* both *God and man. In Catholicism, man is great because, while he’s fallen he still retains the image of God in part -short of His glory but still with dignity and not so completely depraved- and from there he has the potential to contribute to his own future greatness that God desires to elevate him to. God really loves mankind.
Okay, play these thoughts out in Scripture for me if you can. I have a head start to refute your position.

Genesis 6

Increasing Corruption on Earth

6:1 When man began to multiply on the face of the land and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive. And they took as their wives any they chose. 3 Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not abide in [1] man forever, for he is flesh: his days shall be 120 years.” 4 The Nephilim [2] were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown.

5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him to his heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, man and animals and creeping things and birds of the heavens, for I am sorry that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.

Jeremiah 17:9

The heart is deceitful above all things,
and desperately sick;
who can understand it?

No One Is Righteous

9 What then? Are we Jews [1] any better off? [2] No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, 10 as it is written:

“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”
13 “Their throat is an open grave;
they use their tongues to deceive.”
“The venom of asps is under their lips.”
14 “Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.”
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 in their paths are ruin and misery,
17 and the way of peace they have not known.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”

19 Now we know that whatever the law says it speaks to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be held accountable to God. 20 For by works of the law no human being [3] will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin. - Rom 3
 
Okay, play these thoughts out in Scripture for me if you can. I have a head start to refute your position.

Genesis 6

Increasing Corruption on Earth

6:1 When man began to multiply on the face of the land and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive. And they took as their wives any they chose. 3 Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not abide in [1] man forever, for he is flesh: his days shall be 120 years.” 4 The Nephilim [2] were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown.

5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him to his heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, man and animals and creeping things and birds of the heavens, for I am sorry that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.
“God so loved THE WORLD, that he gave His only begotten Son…” -St. John
 
If we have no free will pre-justification but suddenly do have it to cooperate with God for sanctification? Not too mention the human will has been violated previously and is now cooperating…

So if free will and predestination can be mixed as we see in Adam and Eve and in sanctification, why not at all the times? According to your theology, it is possible for God’s sovereignty to remain but still have free will…
John 3, and the new heart! To make sure we are on the same page, what is my view on free will, and man’s ability to choose Christ for life?
 
John 3, and the new heart!
If you’re quoting that, then you believe in infused grace not imputed. A heart cannot be declared new, it must be new…or else God is lying by saying it is new when it’s not.
 
If you’re quoting that, then you believe in infused grace not imputed. A heart cannot be declared new, it must be new…or else God is lying by saying it is new when it’s not.
Help me out with your thoughts. I believe in both imputation and infused grace.
 
Please finish the verse, and what is the requirment for eternal life?
“…that those believe in Him MIGHT have eternal life…” -John 3:16.

But what about James here?

“Demons believe and tremble…” St. James 2: 20

Oh, and I still want my Adam and Eve–free and sovereignty questioned answered.
 
Okay, so within Reformed theology, we see regeneration and a forensic justification to be an act of God (monergism). But in the life of transformation, we see sanctification to be synergistic. I think we get blurred in our theologies since we see justification differently.

What Is Monergism?
Monergism: In regeneration, the Holy Spirit unites us to Christ independent of any cooperation from our unregenerated human nature. He quickens us through the outward call cast forth by the preaching of His Word, disarms our innate hostility, removes our blindness, illumines our mind, creates understanding, turns our heart of stone to a heart of flesh – giving rise to a delight in His Word – all that we might, with our renewed affections, willingly & gladly embrace Christ. The Prophet Ezekiel inspired by the Holy Spirit asserted “I will give them an undivided heart and put a new spirit in them; I will remove from them their heart of stone and give them a heart of flesh. Then they will follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. They will be my people, and I will be their God.” (Eze 11:19, also 36:26) The Apostle Paul said, “For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction.” (1 Thess 1, 4, 5). I.e. In regeneration the word does not work alone but must be accompanied by the “germination” of the Holy Spirit. And again “…you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God.” (1 Pet 1:23)

The Century Dictionary defines it as follows:

“In theology, the doctrine that the Holy Spirit is the only efficient agent in regeneration - that the human will possesses no inclination to holiness until regenerated, and therefore cannot cooperate in regeneration.”

It means that the very desire for faith, by which we believe in Him who justifies the ungodly comes to us through regeneration – and if anyone says that this belongs to us by nature and not by a gift of grace, that is, by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit amending our will and turning it from unbelief to faith and from godlessness to godliness, he/she ignores the teaching of the Apostles, for Paul says, “…Even when we were dead in sins, [God] hath quickened us together with Christ, by grace ye are saved.” and “…he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit.” (Titus 3:5) And again, “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God” (Eph. 2:8). or if anyone makes the assistance of grace depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, “What have you that you did not receive?” (1 Cor. 4:7), and, “But by the grace of God I am what I am” (1 Cor. 15:10).

It is in contrast to synergism which the Century Dictionary defines as

“…the doctrine that there are two efficient agents in regeneration, namely the human will and the divine Spirit, which, in the strict sense of the term, cooperate. This theory accordingly holds that the soul has not lost in the fall all inclination toward holiness, nor all power to seek for it under the influence of ordinary motives.”

For more in-depth treatment of this topic click here… monergism.com/what_is_monergism.php
Can you articulate your own beliefs instead of cutting and pasting from other sources 😊 like you did from here: monergism.com/what_is_monergism.php
 
Okay, play these thoughts out in Scripture for me if you can. I have a head start to refute your position.

Genesis 6

Increasing Corruption on Earth

6:1 When man began to multiply on the face of the land and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive. And they took as their wives any they chose. 3 Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not abide in [1] man forever, for he is flesh: his days shall be 120 years.” 4 The Nephilim [2] were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown.

5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him to his heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, man and animals and creeping things and birds of the heavens, for I am sorry that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.

Jeremiah 17:9

The heart is deceitful above all things,
and desperately sick;
who can understand it?

No One Is Righteous

9 What then? Are we Jews [1] any better off? [2] No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, 10 as it is written:

“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”
13 “Their throat is an open grave;
they use their tongues to deceive.”
“The venom of asps is under their lips.”
14 “Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.”
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 in their paths are ruin and misery,
17 and the way of peace they have not known.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”
God really hates sin
Originally Posted by Dancelittleewok View Post
“God so loved THE WORLD, that he gave His only begotten Son…” -St. John
Please finish the verse, and what is the requirment for eternal life?

God really loves mankind, as we’re all called to, rather than recede into exclusivism.
…that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
God won’t force any to believe in and come to love Him.
 
Can you articulate your own beliefs instead of cutting and pasting from other sources like you did from here: monergism.com/what_is_monergism.php

I’m not in the dog house. 😃 Like it or not, your personal preference towards another poster doesn’t exclude him from posting on the forums.
 
Can you articulate your own beliefs instead of cutting and pasting from other sources like you did from here: monergism.com/what_is_monergism.php

I’m not in the dog house. 😃 Like it or not, your personal preference towards another poster doesn’t exclude him from posting on the forums.
Of course Zee and Izoid can post all day long. It’s not my Forum site. However, I won’t be answering them for awhile. I’m exercising my free will to choose whomever I want to answer. 😃
 
See, you ARE responding to me! I knew that deep down you loved me. I am moving up in the world of doghouses. I am a much tougher looking dog than I was in your earlier post :D. Just don’t make me a Chihuahua.
I own two purebred dogs. If you are able to guess what kind of dogs that I own within 10 tries, I will let you out of the doghouse. You only need to get one right answer. If you miss, then you are predestined to remain in the doghouse for a long time. BTW… is Zee the Mormon your brother in Christ?
 
Cocker Spaniel
German Shepherd
Doberman
Poodle
Maltese

Am I close?
Your close since they are all dogs. You are down to five guesses. My dog breeds start with a B and a C. I live next to the forest and the B dog get’s no respect.
 
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