The Third Secret

[Albizzi]

Thankyou Shoshana!

That’s what i was referring to! god bless!

I am new on this forum and I am much interested on the third secret’s issue since years.
I didn’t know the quote from St Maximilian Kolbe, but you can have a first hand testimony regarding the freemasons entering the Vatican in googling these words “Paul VI beatified?”
The Fr. Luigi Villa, an Italian priest, has devoted his life in fighting the freemasonry in the church. His book is very convincing.
You may download the book’s 195 pages on: sheddinglight.info/archives_paul_vi.beatified.pdf
On p. 191 there is a very strange and disturbing story regarding a masonic emblem (a pentagram or “pentacle”) carved on the pope Paul VI’ wrist in a bronze sculpture that was inaugurated by himself in 1977.
If you want to be fully informed, there are pictures available of the initial bronze panel on this italian link:
chiesaviva.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65&Itemid=84,

That’s hair rising.

 

[pnewton]

On p. 191 there is a very strange and disturbing story regarding a masonic emblem (a pentagram or “pentacle”) carved on the pope Paul VI’ wrist in a bronze sculpture that was inaugurated by himself in 1977.
If you want to be fully informed, there are pictures available of the initial bronze panel on this italian link:
chiesaviva.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=65&Itemid=84,

That’s hair rising.

Your link is not intelligible to me. Are you, or this blog suggesting that Pope Paul VI was a mason?

 

[Roy5]

I haven’t taken time to read all these postings, so forgive me if I cover old territory. A couple quick thoughts.

(1) It's my impression that the third secret was never revealed because it likely was something quite ridiculous and would embarrass the church, perhaps undermining the whole Fatima story.

 (2) These apparations of Mary are one of the major barriers that keep people from admiring Catholicism. So much good has been done by the Catholic Church, such as feeding the poor, providing fine hospitals, beginning great universities, and much more. However, most non-Catholics regard such alleged miracles as Fatima and Lourdes as infested by superstition. No, not lies, as the faithful likely were convinced of the miracles. But good people of great faith can be credulous. All religions, whether Judaism or Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism, have miraculous traditions. Pentecostal ministers, for example, announce healing miracles regularly - one reason they are making such a headway in the 3rd world (Africa and Latin America in particular). Good-hearted, gullible people have been impressed by such miracles throughout history.

 (3) Religion is losing its appeal to millions around the world because it continues to insist upon believing the unbelievable. I'm one of those Christians (we are many, among both Catholics and Protestants) who focus on loving God and one another, as Christ commanded, and not fretting over fine points of theology which divide us and which no one fully understands. "God's ways are not our ways" we read in scripture, and those who claim that they alone embrace the full truth are deluded. They should be forgiven if they

are not scholars, but those who have had the benefit of a well-rounded education should be tolerant of a variety of views rather than insisting that their church is the one true church. There is no true church, just true followers of Christ, and I try my best to be among this number.
May God bless all, of every race and creed and tongue and nation. I include Christians of whatever label but also Jews, Muslims, Buddhists and those of goodwill regardless of their faith community. Religion should be a bridge and not a barrier, and much pain it must cause our one God that we battle over such incidentals when humanity still is plagued by war, injustice, crime, bigotry, hunger, and other sadnesses.

 

[Albizzi]

Your link is not intelligible to me. Are you, or this blog suggesting that Pope Paul VI was a mason?

Pnewton,
I don’t suggest anything.
The pictures speak by themselves. Pls take your time reading the Fr Villa’s book.
If you find it too long, go immediately on p. 191
The story is very strange and shocking. Possibly this was a trap that nobody (the Pope included) actually didn’t notice. The fact is that Fr Villa noticed it immediately, went to complain a friend Cardinal and the full bronze panel was soon removed and replaced by a new one without that infamous pentacle.
Anyway you are free to draw the conclusions you want.
This story was a good introduction for me to begin to read the book.

 

[jam070406]

Religion is losing its appeal to millions around the world because it continues to insist upon believing the unbelievable.

Like the incarnation, resurrection, the ascension, the virgin birth, real presence in the Eucharist, etc. etc.
Jesus demanded belief. People were healed because of their belief.
It’s because people are steeped in their own passions and sin that there is a falling away. Not because of the vision of Fatima.

 

[Albizzi]

I haven’t taken time to read all these postings, so forgive me if I cover old territory. A couple quick thoughts.

(1) It's my impression that the third secret was never revealed because it likely was something quite ridiculous and would embarrass the church, perhaps undermining the whole Fatima story.

 (2) These apparations of Mary are one of the major barriers that keep people from admiring Catholicism. So much good has been done by the Catholic Church, such as feeding the poor, providing fine hospitals, beginning great universities, and much more. However, most non-Catholics regard such alleged miracles as Fatima and Lourdes as infested by superstition. No, not lies, as the faithful likely were convinced of the miracles. But good people of great faith can be credulous. All religions, whether Judaism or Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism, have miraculous traditions. Pentecostal ministers, for example, announce healing miracles regularly - one reason they are making such a headway in the 3rd world (Africa and Latin America in particular). Good-hearted, gullible people have been impressed by such miracles throughout history.

 (3) Religion is losing its appeal to millions around the world because it continues to insist upon believing the unbelievable. I'm one of those Christians (we are many, among both Catholics and Protestants) who focus on loving God and one another, as Christ commanded, and not fretting over fine points of theology which divide us and which no one fully understands. "God's ways are not our ways" we read in scripture, and those who claim that they alone embrace the full truth are deluded. They should be forgiven if they

are not scholars, but those who have had the benefit of a well-rounded education should be tolerant of a variety of views rather than insisting that their church is the one true church. There is no true church, just true followers of Christ, and I try my best to be among this number.

  May God bless all, of every race and creed and tongue and nation. I include Christians of whatever label but also Jews, Muslims, Buddhists and those of goodwill regardless of their faith community. Religion should be a bridge and not a barrier, and much pain it must cause our one God that we battle over such incidentals when humanity still is plagued by war, injustice, crime, bigotry, hunger, and other sadnesses.

Roy5,
Pls remember that God performed an astronomical miracle of the sun spinning in the sky before 70000 scared pilgrims who where here only because the kids foretold there would be a huge miracle (“so that everybody may believe”, said the Virgin) at this exact moment, months before.
Do you truly believe that God made this only to prepare the people for a “ridiculous” message that would puzzle the Church? That’s a bit injurious to God and the Mother of God, don’t you think so?
The purported “miracles” you say that happen in other religions never are documented like are those that are registered (I personnally witnessed one) in Lourdes or elsewhere in catholic shrines and they cannot resist a good scientific investigation. The Miracle of the Sun has no equivalent in the human history even in Jesus time.
Being of “good will” is necessary of course, but that’s not enough because you are forgetting that Jesus didn’t come as a prophet but as a redeemer and as such, sorry to say you, he founded the one and unique true Church, the one that leads to salvation.
To say that all religions are equal and lead to salvation too is same as saying that we have no use of Jesus and that His sacrifice was useless since the other religions deny Him. That God forbid
He said “I am the Way, I am the Life. Nobody can go to the Father but through Me” is that clear enough?

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

I suspect the secret either is predicts something that didn’t happen (thus debunking all of Fatima) or the secret says some pretty nasty things about the Vatican. Both scenarios provide a motive for the cover-up.

No, it doesn’t say any pretty nasty things about the Vatican. The blessed Mother had told one of her visionaries that she loved the Holy Father. Remember that.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

I haven’t taken time to read all these postings, so forgive me if I cover old territory. A couple quick thoughts.

(1) It's my impression that the third secret was never revealed because it likely was something quite ridiculous and would embarrass the church, perhaps undermining the whole Fatima story.

 (2) These apparations of Mary are one of the major barriers that keep people from admiring Catholicism. So much good has been done by the Catholic Church, such as feeding the poor, providing fine hospitals, beginning great universities, and much more. However, most non-Catholics regard such alleged miracles as Fatima and Lourdes as infested by superstition. No, not lies, as the faithful likely were convinced of the miracles. But good people of great faith can be credulous. All religions, whether Judaism or Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism, have miraculous traditions. Pentecostal ministers, for example, announce healing miracles regularly - one reason they are making such a headway in the 3rd world (Africa and Latin America in particular). Good-hearted, gullible people have been impressed by such miracles throughout history.

 (3) Religion is losing its appeal to millions around the world because it continues to insist upon believing the unbelievable. I'm one of those Christians (we are many, among both Catholics and Protestants) who focus on loving God and one another, as Christ commanded, and not fretting over fine points of theology which divide us and which no one fully understands. "God's ways are not our ways" we read in scripture, and those who claim that they alone embrace the full truth are deluded. They should be forgiven if they

are not scholars, but those who have had the benefit of a well-rounded education should be tolerant of a variety of views rather than insisting that their church is the one true church. There is no true church, just true followers of Christ, and I try my best to be among this number.

  May God bless all, of every race and creed and tongue and nation. I include Christians of whatever label but also Jews, Muslims, Buddhists and those of goodwill regardless of their faith community. Religion should be a bridge and not a barrier, and much pain it must cause our one God that we battle over such incidentals when humanity still is plagued by war, injustice, crime, bigotry, hunger, and other sadnesses.

There is nothing in the third Secret to embarrass the Catholic church, since the blessed Mother approves of it. Not only that, but she predicted ALL will convert to the faith. And I resent you saying that these Apparitions of the Blessed Mother are barriers to people learning about Catholicism. Well, the Blessed Mother IS part of the Catholic faith and should be included in ALL other faiths as well. Take a lesson from this apparition. Heed what she has said.

 

[Victorious]

I haven’t taken time to read all these postings, so forgive me if I cover old territory. A couple quick thoughts.

(1) It's my impression that the third secret was never revealed because it likely was something quite ridiculous and would embarrass the church, perhaps undermining the whole Fatima story.

 (2) These apparations of Mary are one of the major barriers that keep people from admiring Catholicism. So much good has been done by the Catholic Church, such as feeding the poor, providing fine hospitals, beginning great universities, and much more. However, most non-Catholics regard such alleged miracles as Fatima and Lourdes as infested by superstition. No, not lies, as the faithful likely were convinced of the miracles. But good people of great faith can be credulous. All religions, whether Judaism or Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism, have miraculous traditions. Pentecostal ministers, for example, announce healing miracles regularly - one reason they are making such a headway in the 3rd world (Africa and Latin America in particular). Good-hearted, gullible people have been impressed by such miracles throughout history.

 (3) Religion is losing its appeal to millions around the world because it continues to insist upon believing the unbelievable. I'm one of those Christians (we are many, among both Catholics and Protestants) who focus on loving God and one another, as Christ commanded, and not fretting over fine points of theology which divide us and which no one fully understands. "God's ways are not our ways" we read in scripture, and those who claim that they alone embrace the full truth are deluded. They should be forgiven if they

are not scholars, but those who have had the benefit of a well-rounded education should be tolerant of a variety of views rather than insisting that their church is the one true church. There is no true church, just true followers of Christ, and I try my best to be among this number.

  May God bless all, of every race and creed and tongue and nation. I include Christians of whatever label but also Jews, Muslims, Buddhists and those of goodwill regardless of their faith community. Religion should be a bridge and not a barrier, and much pain it must cause our one God that we battle over such incidentals when humanity still is plagued by war, injustice, crime, bigotry, hunger, and other sadnesses.

Hmm. Good to know the Church isn’t conformed enough to the world for the world’s tastes!

 

[Shoshana]

No, it doesn’t say any pretty nasty things about the Vatican. The blessed Mother had told one of her visionaries that she loved the Holy Father. Remember that.

The Pope is not the Vatican…and vice versa.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

The Pope is not the Vatican…and vice versa.

The pope IS the Vatican and the Vatican the pope. Without one and not the other, we wouldn’t exist. The pope IS the Vicar of Christ and he IS the Vatican. That is what it is all about. The Vatican has Saint Peter buried underneath it. 2,000 years of an unbroken link from Peter until now.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

The pope IS the Vatican and the Vatican the pope. Without one and not the other, we wouldn’t exist. The pope IS the Vicar of Christ and he IS the Vatican. That is what it is all about. The Vatican has Saint Peter buried underneath it. 2,000 years of an unbroken link from Peter until now.

Except for about 70 years when the cry would have been The pope IS Avignon and Avignon IS the pope.

 

[VARC]

Except for about 70 years when the cry would have been The pope IS Avignon and Avignon IS the pope.

Zing

 

[Hesychios]

The pope IS the Vatican and the Vatican the pope.

I never expected to agree with you, but on this point you are correct.

The Vatican apparatus (ie the Curia) has no authority of it’s own. It’s entire authority is based upon the jurisdiction of the bishop of Rome. The Vatican apparatus acts as the secretarial staff of the Pope, and has no authority separate from that of the Pope. It always acts in his name, and with his permission. It is through this collection of offices that the Pope exerts his authority of universal ordinary jurisdiction.

It wouldn’t matter if the Papacy moved away to Miami, or Avignon. The apparatus we know as the Vatican would be called something else but it’s function would be the same: secretaries of the Pope. He could not do that job without a big staff of assistants.

 

[pnewton]

Pnewton,
I don’t suggest anything.
The pictures speak by themselves. Pls take your time reading the Fr Villa’s book.
If you find it too long, go immediately on p. 191 .

I read the section you mention and more. I quit because none of it has the ring of truth. I tried to find this priest’s qualitfications and can’t really find anything on him. In fact, this whole story has the feel of Jack Chick’s Fr. Rivera, ex-Jesuit priest’s writings, right down to all the little text shifts, bolding and scare quotes.

 

[Shoshana]

The pope IS the Vatican and the Vatican the pope. Without one and not the other, we wouldn’t exist. The pope IS the Vicar of Christ and he IS the Vatican. That is what it is all about. The Vatican has Saint Peter buried underneath it. 2,000 years of an unbroken link from Peter until now.

True as this is, what I was trying to say is that Our Lady said she loved the pope. Someone posted saying that Our Lady loved the Vatican. So, hence my contradiction. As for as this afffection from Our Lady, she stated she loved THE Pope, the Vicar of Christ. SHe did not say that she loved the vatican…and she would know the difference.

 

[Albizzi]

I read the section you mention and more. I quit because none of it has the ring of truth. I tried to find this priest’s qualitfications and can’t really find anything on him. In fact, this whole story has the feel of Jack Chick’s Fr. Rivera, ex-Jesuit priest’s writings, right down to all the little text shifts, bolding and scare quotes.

Yes, of course, I had the same reaction the first time I read it. But I doubted that the pictures would be forgeries.
The truth sometimes may be scary.
I changed my mind when I heard that this Fr Villa had close connections with the late Card. Gagnon, with the widow of the well known theologian Dietrich Von Hildebrand and Padre Pio.
I recommend that you read the interview that Dr Alice Von Hildebrand gave to the Latin Mass Magazine in 2001: latinmassmagazine.com/articles/articles_2001_SU_Hildebran.html
I hope this will enlighten you

 

[Shoshana]

Yes, of course, I had the same reaction the first time I read it. But I doubted that the pictures would be forgeries.
The truth sometimes may be scary.
I changed my mind when I heard that this Fr Villa had close connections with the late Card. Gagnon, with the widow of the well known theologian Dietrich Von Hildebrand and Padre Pio.
I recommend that you read the interview that Dr Alice Von Hildebrand gave to the Latin Mass Magazine in 2001: latinmassmagazine.com/articles/articles_2001_SU_Hildebran.html
I hope this will enlighten you

This echoes enough of Socci’s book. Our Lady did have much to cry about!

 

[Earnest_Bunbury]

Yes, of course, I had the same reaction the first time I read it. But I doubted that the pictures would be forgeries.
The truth sometimes may be scary.
I changed my mind when I heard that this Fr Villa had close connections with the late Card. Gagnon, with the widow of the well known theologian Dietrich Von Hildebrand and Padre Pio.
I recommend that you read the interview that Dr Alice Von Hildebrand gave to the Latin Mass Magazine in 2001: latinmassmagazine.com/articles/articles_2001_SU_Hildebran.html
I hope this will enlighten you

It is very apparent the loss of the supernatural is in the Church because it is everywhere. Technology and scientific explanations of the world around us permeate human understanding to the exclusion of the spiritual. It is a true test of faith to desire what is denied even though it is seen in even a cursory read of the Bible and the Catechism, that is, reading without a bias or preconceived notion. Liberation theology, feminist theology, or social justice theology that makes Jesus just a man wanting political change, and other novelties that are not in Magisterial teaching, are in every parish because people of dubious faith are in every parish. They separate themselves from the Church by not listening to the Magisterial teaching about the spiritual and supernatural. No secret needed there.

 

[Shoshana]

No secret needed there.

Could it be this that terrified Sr Lucia? When the statement by our Lady that:
The dogma of the faith will never change in portugal, ETC…

While all of this relativism, secularism and every other ‘isms’ that exist which we are accustomed to…it might be a great shock for Sr Lucia to hear!