The ugly truth of Canada's First Nations teen suicide

[fcgv]

Oh don’t be reactionary. I am one who does not buy into this PC view of native cultures. They are what they are-their traditional ways are barbaric. They should not be on reserves receiving what amounts to welfare from taxpaying citizens. As one Canadian, I resent every free penny they get. they should enter the mainstream of our culture and have to work for what they have like all the rest of us.Their ways should be regulated to history. Biggest mistake we made was closing the Catholic schools we had for them.

Without passing judgement on their traditional cultures, I agree with what you wrote in essence. I don’t agree with any system that sees any minority receiving special treatment and financial compensation from the federal government. The Reserves are a travesty in a country that prides itself on being multi-cultural and equal. There is no reason what-so-ever why we should not end the Reservation system and introduce the Native Canadians into the mainstream of our society.

 

[curlycool89]

A folk hero??? Not exactly how I’d refer to him. I am French-Canadian and Catholic, and do not consider a man who lead a violent rebellion against the newly formed Canadian government a “folk hero”.

Oh right, we shouldn’t dare to drag Canada’s first Drunkard-in-Chief through the mud. The rights of the Metis were about to be completely taken away. The land they lived on for a hundred years was being surveyed so that it could be given to loyal English Protestants. The new lieutenant governor was anti-French, which didn’t sit well for the french-descendent Metis.

Riel did what people had done for a thousand generations before him when they felt their rights were being abused: they fought back. There was no equal rights or protections back then; the Metis themselves were considered half-breeds by the so-called civil people. Especially by the Orange Order, if we want to throw Thomas Scott into this. Scott was an anti-Catholic who called the Metis “half-breeds”; he was no saint, that’s for sure.

As a westerner I call Riel a hero and a Father of Confederation. He’s worth at least 10 of that drunkard we called our first PM. Riel at least had the guts to stand up for what he believed in, unlike today where being passionate about something is considered un-Canadian.

Nice try, but he did not scuttle Meech Lake. You can fool the Americans if you wish, but history, and the rest of the country knows who killed Meech–Pierre Trudeau. It was Trudeau speaking out publically against Meech Lake that effectively ended the idea.

Actually you’re the one that needs the civics lesson. Elijah Harper did scuttle the Meech Lake Accord because to pass the Accord needed the unanimous consent of the legislature of every province to fast track approval and meet the deadline, and Manitoba was the first to say no after most of the provinces said yes. By voting no, Harper did not allow the bill to be fast tracked. Later Newfoundland would scrap their vote, and without the consent of Newfoundland and Manitoba the Accord was dead. Elijah Harper was the first legislator to say no.

Without passing judgement on their traditional cultures, I agree with what you wrote in essence. I don’t agree with any system that sees any minority receiving special treatment and financial compensation from the federal government. The Reserves are a travesty in a country that prides itself on being multi-cultural and equal. There is no reason what-so-ever why we should not end the Reservation system and introduce the Native Canadians into the mainstream of our society.

Yes, let’s just end all the special rights. I say that we start by ending all the special rights the Quebecois get, starting with ending the favoritism in the equalization formula, the special number of judges they get on the Supreme Court, the mandatory bilingualism, and the constitutional veto. Heck, they should all be required to speak English and we should disown the history of Canada before the Battle on the Plains of Abraham as just barbaric times. After all, the French are a minority here.

Now unless you didn’t get that, I don’t believe any of that (well, maybe except for the equalization formula, it does seem to favour Quebec). I love Canada’s multiculturalism. Also, some of that would violate the Constitution and the Charter. Taking away the Native’s rights would also violate the Constitution because the Treaties are part of our Constitution.

 

[fcgv]

Riel did what people had done for a thousand generations before him when they felt their rights were being abused: they fought back. There was no equal rights or protections back then; the Metis themselves were considered half-breeds by the so-called civil people. Especially by the Orange Order, if we want to throw Thomas Scott into this. Scott was an anti-Catholic who called the Metis “half-breeds”; he was no saint, that’s for sure.

As a westerner I call Riel a hero and a Father of Confederation. He’s worth at least 10 of that drunkard we called our first PM. Riel at least had the guts to stand up for what he believed in, unlike today where being passionate about something is considered un-Canadian.

Well, we’ll have to disagree. I consider Riel a self-seeking moron who rebelled against the legitimate government.Because others have done so does not make it a good excuse

Actually you’re the one that needs the civics lesson. Elijah Harper did scuttle the Meech Lake Accord because to pass the Accord needed the unanimous consent of the legislature of every province to fast track approval and meet the deadline, and Manitoba was the first to say no after most of the provinces said yes. By voting no, Harper did not allow the bill to be fast tracked. Later Newfoundland would scrap their vote, and without the consent of Newfoundland and Manitoba the Accord was dead. Elijah Harper was the first legislator to say no.

Well, imagine that. The Canadian parliamentary site, the Canadian Polysci courses I’ve taken and even Wiki seems to regard the most instrumental player in the downfall of the Accord as Trudeau. Yes, Harper played a role, but it was without a doubt Mr Trudeau who polarized and gained the support of the nation in leading the Accord to defeat. But of course, you would know better

Yes, let’s just end all the special rights. I say that we start by ending all the special rights the Quebecois get, starting with ending the favoritism in the equalization formula, the special number of judges they get on the Supreme Court, the mandatory bilingualism, and the constitutional veto. Heck, they should all be required to speak English and we should disown the history of Canada before the Battle on the Plains of Abraham as just barbaric times. After all, the French are a minority here.

Now unless you didn’t get that, I don’t believe any of that (well, maybe except for the equalization formula, it does seem to favour Quebec). I love Canada’s multiculturalism. Also, some of that would violate the Constitution and the Charter. Taking away the Native’s rights would also violate the Constitution because the Treaties are part of our Constitution.

Let’s get past the PC ********. The Natives are a conquered people. Nobody is talking about taking away their rights. Instead, I am suggesting they leave the Reserves and take their places as Canadian citizens. Enough pandering to them. The French-Canadians are one half of the founding peoples of this country, and deserve and should be accorded special status.

 

[curlycool89]

Well, we’ll have to disagree. I consider Riel a self-seeking moron who rebelled against the legitimate government.Because others have done so does not make it a good excuse

Of course! Because when you have the support of the whole Metis community for what you’re doing it must be for self-serving purposes. And when he gets asked to come back by Gabriel Dumont and lead the second one in 1885 on behalf of the Metis and Natives then he’s probably only doing it for himself, right?

The Canadian government just happens to be the government du jour, and all they did was replace the former government du jour the Hudson’s Bay Company. Don’t elevate rebelling against a government into some kind of mortal sin because it’s not. As I’ve said before they’re just another political entity with arbitrary defined borders among other political entities with similarly arbitrarily defined borders.

We live in such a cushy age here where if we don’t like something then we can call some ambulance chaser to fix it for us. Back then when the Metis were not even recognized as people they only had 2 options: move or fight, and by 1885 they had already moved from Manitoba to what’s now Saskatchewan. Their only other option was to let their land be confiscated and be absorbed into Canada like the American melting pot system. Their entire culture and heritage would have been lost just because the big wigs in the 1880s didn’t consider them to be equal, and I find that to be totalitarian and imperialistic. Everything Canada isn’t.

Well, imagine that. The Canadian parliamentary site, the Canadian Polysci courses I’ve taken and even Wiki seems to regard the most instrumental player in the downfall of the Accord as Trudeau. Yes, Harper played a role, but it was without a doubt Mr Trudeau who polarized and gained the support of the nation in leading the Accord to defeat. But of course, you would know better

I won’t deny that Trudeau played a very large part, but as an unelected person he didn’t have much actual power at the time. The final voice rested in the legislatures of the provinces and with the premiers. It seems that most of them were willing to pass it anyways.

Let’s get past the PC ********. The Natives are a conquered people. Nobody is talking about taking away their rights. Instead, I am suggesting they leave the Reserves and take their places as Canadian citizens. Enough pandering to them. The French-Canadians are one half of the founding peoples of this country, and deserve and should be accorded special status.

And the Natives provided, I don’t know, Canada for us. The French are as conquered as the Natives are, except because of the times (1867) they were considered sub-human and therefore not worthy to participate in the talks. We signed Treaties with them which form part of our Constitution, and because of that they get the special treatment. Actually, one of the best recent developments have been the introduction of urban reserves (when they put a gas station on one, it’s somehow 2 cents cheaper a liter. I’ll support that business ).

If Quebec ever does separate then I hope the Natives assert their Constitutional rights to keep their land (ie all of norther Quebec) as part of Canada, if only just to be a big middle finger to the separatists. Especially since all the hydroelectric power stations and all the natural resources are in norther Quebec.

I guess as a western Canadian I would be more compassionate though, seeing as we’re living on all their traditional land out here.

 

[kimmielittle]

The Natives are a conquered people.

If that is what you think - then you know little.

Nobody is talking about taking away their rights.

Oh , but it is our rights you will be violating - you are suggesting forced assimilation

Instead, I am suggesting they leave the Reserves and take their places as Canadian citizens. Enough pandering to them. The French-Canadians are one half of the founding peoples of this country, and deserve and should be accorded special status.

Evidently, you are listening to our Moslum friends. They believe much the same way about Christians.

You may end up needing us

 

[fcgv]

And the Natives provided, I don’t know, Canada for us. The French are as conquered as the Natives are, except because of the times (1867) they were considered sub-human and therefore not worthy to participate in the talks. We signed Treaties with them which form part of our Constitution, and because of that they get the special treatment. Actually, one of the best recent developments have been the introduction of urban reserves (when they put a gas station on one, it’s somehow 2 cents cheaper a liter. I’ll support that business ).

If Quebec ever does separate then I hope the Natives assert their Constitutional rights to keep their land (ie all of norther Quebec) as part of Canada, if only just to be a big middle finger to the separatists. Especially since all the hydroelectric power stations and all the natural resources are in norther Quebec.

I guess as a western Canadian I would be more compassionate though, seeing as we’re living on all their traditional land out here.

We’ll have to do the old “agree to disagree” routine. I have little to no respect for native culture or their perceived “rights”. They should have the same rights as any other citizen, and I deeply resent our tax dollars going to them as what amounts to de facto welfare

 

[kimmielittle]

They are what they are-their traditional ways are barbaric.

Yeah, barbaric.

And the culture of death, isn’t barbaric ?
Abort now, for convenience
Eugenics now, for convenience
Euthanize now, for convenience

.Their ways should be regulated to history. Biggest mistake we made was closing the Catholic schools we had for them.

Clean your own house - and then maybe you can talk

 

[curlycool89]

We’ll have to do the old “agree to disagree” routine. I have little to no respect for native culture or their perceived “rights”. They should have the same rights as any other citizen, and I deeply resent our tax dollars going to them as what amounts to de facto welfare

Again, they do get extra rights because we have a Treaty with them (many treaties). They agreed to give us the land, the Crown agreed to special rights and exemptions for them. It is a binding agreement and forms part of Canada’s Constitution.

Could the Crown have just taken the land? Probably, but they decided to be diplomatic about it (probably after seeing what America did, which wasn’t as nice). It is an agreement and we must honour that agreement.