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FK04US
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WarriorAngel
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erigby27;4824086:
Nevetheless, you are unable to refute my views.
You can’t prove that Bethany was not the home of Mary Magdalene and you cannot prove that Mary Magdalene was not Martha’s sister. And regarding sex between Jesus and Mary Magdalene, what’s the big deal if they were married? Why it would have to be sexless? Is sex a sin between a man and a woman within the marriage context?.
The text does not say that Jesus was not married. So, your argument is equally fallacious.
How:blush: ever, the truth is much closer to me than to you.
You are digging one more contradiction in the NT
when you say that Jesus did not need to obey the Law, and the opposite is exactly what Jesus said in Matthew 5:17-19.
That’s not what Jesus said about the Law of Moses. Read Luke 16:29-31. The only way to be saved from Hell is to listen to Moses. He meant the Law.
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You are right. Jews cannot be idolaters as to think of a man as if he were God. Therefore, Jesus was under the same Law that we all are. And there is no mystery about this.
Nothing to do with Paull. There are more evidences in the gospels that Jesus was married than that he was not.
I don’t seem to think anything that’s not down in your Bible. Read Acts 11:26. It was with Paul that his disciples started being called Christians for the first time because Paul was preaching that Jesus was Christ. What’s so hard to understand here?
Ben:
I want some answers to posts #231 and 232.
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S_J_Thaikattil
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Ben, it is your take that Paul alone is responsible for the creation of Christianity. Jesus created it and His disciples and followers followed His command to spread it. Matthias, who had been with Jesus all through His three year ministry was chosen to replace Judas Iscariot. There were several others who had been followers of Jesus in those three years even if they were not chosen as special disciples by Jesus.Listen Thaikattil, I do not deny that the disciples of Jesus promoted his cause almost everywhere. In fact, there was never in the History of Israel a people more zelous in the business of proselytizing than the Nazarenes. Only the Chritianity
of the 4th Century overshadowed that missionary fervor. But I tell
you, their teaching was not Christian. It became Christian later as
almost all of Asia Minor had become with the work of Paul.
You ask what was wrong with Paul that I seem just not to give him a break. He was responsible for the rise of Christianity, which
has killed more of the Jewish People than any other institution from before and after it’s rising. Besides, Christianity promotes Replacement Theology and we Jews must rise to defend our place
under the sun.
Ben:
You must know that Christianity is about a Jewish religion. Christians paid with their life for centuries for merely being Christians. The early history of Christianity in Europe bears that out. Christianity in Europe was built on the blood of martyrs.
Christianity is meanwhile a respectable 2000 years old. It is a world religion and almost one third of the world population is at least nominally Christian. Thanks to the zeal of ALL the disciples and followers who were filled with the Holy Spirit and a missionary zeal.
It is materialism and ego centered New Age religions that is fast replacing Christianity. Hardly any Jew gets converted to Christianity. So you should not worry on that account.
Nazism by the way was about German nationalism as propagated by an insane dictator who killed not only Jews but also German disabled, Germans who opposed Hitler, gypsies, homosexuals, lots and lots of Christians in Europe. The first country Hitler invaded was Poland which had 95% Catholics.
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paarsurrey
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Hi
You mean when Judas Iscariot betrayed Jesus; Matthias was inducted to make the 12. But my question is who inducted Matthias? Jesus could not have inducted him; as there was no time for that, Jesus had been arrested and the event of Crucifixion had started.
I don’t think Jesus inducted Matthias. Did he?
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oneGODoneCHURCH
Guest
you ar right i do forget about those that would just be reading and not posting/ we do have to respond to such utter non since, I just warn against continued argument/debate with such.
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paarsurrey
Guest
S J Thaikattil; 4826433:
I agree with Ben; Paul played cleverly and used Jesus and others only as a human shield. Paul stood in the name of Jesus, and thought and acted 100% reverse of what Jesus thought and acted, I am sorry to state. Peace; we are only discussing things to find out the truth; others could stick to their own beliefs, no compulsion.
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.
Thanks
Hi
I agree with Ben; Paul played cleverly and used Jesus and others only as a human shield. Paul stood in the name of Jesus, and thought and acted 100% reverse of what Jesus thought and acted, I am sorry to state. Peace; we are only discussing things to find out the truth; others could stick to their own beliefs, no compulsion.
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.
Thanks
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paarsurrey
Guest
HiNo, you are mistaken about my purpose to be here. I am here to claim Jesus as our own. Jesus was Jewish and not Christian. He never had anything to do with Christianity. If Jesus could know what the Christianity of Paul has done to Jesus’ own People, he would turn in his grave.
Ben:
That would be in line with what Quran says; and I quote here:
**The Holy Quran : Chapter 5: Al-Ma’idah المَائدة **
[5:115] قَالَ عِيْسَى ابْنُ مَرْيَمَ اللّٰهُمَّ رَبَّنَاۤ اَنْزِلْ عَلَيْنَا مَآٮِٕدَةً مِّنَ السَّمَآءِ تَكُوْنُ لَـنَا عِيْدًا لِّاَوَّلِنَا وَاٰخِرِنَا وَاٰيَةً مِّنْكَۚ وَارْزُقْنَا وَاَنْتَ خَيْرُ الرّٰزِقِيْنَ
[5:115] Said Jesus, son of Mary, ‘O Allah, our Lord, send down to us a table from heaven spread with food that it may be to us a festival, to the first of us and to the last of us, and a Sign from Thee; and provide sustenance for us, for Thou art the Best of sustainers.’
[5:116] قَالَ اللّٰهُ اِنِّىْ مُنَزِّلُهَا عَلَيْكُمْۚ فَمَنْ يَّكْفُرْ بَعْدُ مِنْكُمْ فَاِنِّىْۤ اُعَذِّبُهٗ عَذَابًا لَّاۤ اُعَذِّبُهٗۤ اَحَدًا مِّنَ الْعٰلَمِيْنَ
[5:116] Allah said, ‘Surely, I will send it down to you, but whosoever of you disbelieves afterwards — I will surely punish them with a punishment wherewith I will not punish any other of the peoples.’
**[5:117] وَاِذْ قَالَ اللّٰهُ يٰعِيْسَى ابْنَ مَرْيَمَ ءَاَنْتَ قُلْتَ لِلنَّاسِ اتَّخِذُوْنِىْ وَاُمِّىَ اِلٰهَيْنِ مِنْ دُوْنِ اللّٰهِؕ قَالَ سُبْحٰنَكَ مَا يَكُوْنُ لِىْۤ اَنْ اَقُوْلَ مَا لَـيْسَ لِىْ بِحَقٍّؕ اِنْ كُنْتُ قُلْتُهٗ فَقَدْ عَلِمْتَهٗؕ تَعْلَمُ مَا فِىْ نَفْسِىْ وَلَاۤ اَعْلَمُ مَا فِىْ نَفْسِكَؕ اِنَّكَ اَنْتَ عَلّٰمُ الْغُيُوْبِ
[5:117] And when Allah will say, “O Jesus, son of Mary, didst thou say to men, ‘Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah?’”, he will answer, “Holy art Thou. I could never say that to which I had no right. If I had said it, Thou wouldst have surely known it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy mind. It is only Thou Who art the Knower of hidden things.
[5:118] مَا قُلْتُ لَهُمْ اِلَّا مَاۤ اَمَرْتَنِىْ بِهٖۤ اَنِ اعْبُدُوا اللّٰهَ رَبِّىْ وَرَبَّكُمْۚ وَكُنْتُ عَلَيْهِمْ شَهِيْدًا مَّا دُمْتُ فِيْهِمْۚ فَلَمَّا تَوَفَّيْتَنِىْ كُنْتَ اَنْتَ الرَّقِيْبَ عَلَيْهِمْؕ وَاَنْتَ عَلٰى كُلِّ شَىْءٍ شَهِيْدٌ
[5:118] “I said nothing to them except that which Thou didst command me — ‘Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord.’ And I was a witness over them as long as I remained among them, but since Thou didst cause me to die, Thou hast been the Watcher over them; and Thou art Witness over all things. **
[5:119] اِنْ تُعَذِّبْهُمْ فَاِنَّهُمْ عِبَادُكَۚ وَاِنْ تَغْفِرْ لَهُمْ فَاِنَّكَ اَنْتَ الْعَزِيْزُ الْحَكِيْمُ
[5:119] “If Thou punish them, they are Thy servants; and if Thou forgive them, Thou surely art the Mighty, the Wise.”
alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?submitCh=Read+from+verse%3A&ch=5&verse=114
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran
Thanks
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paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
There is also a liklihood that Jesus married in the Afghans
and also in Kashmir. Well David married many, so if Jesus did marry, of course, I see no harm. Jesus was a holy person; if he had sons and daughters, they should also be holy, I think.
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.
Thanks
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WarriorAngel
Guest
Thanks for showing the fallacious opinion on what Jesus would have said according to some man 600 years later who never met Him.
Apparently Muhammad changed what Jesus said. After all - HE NEVER MET HIM.
But this is not much different than all the other gnostic tales about Him.
Paul didn’t create Christianity - who makes these things up? Seriously?
Apparently Muhammad changed what Jesus said. After all - HE NEVER MET HIM.
But this is not much different than all the other gnostic tales about Him.
Paul didn’t create Christianity - who makes these things up? Seriously?
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paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
Matthew does not register the presence of John when Jesus was put on the Cross. There is every likelihood that he was with the fleeing party.
Such is the case of those who are supposed to be the first hand witnesses of Crucifixion of Jesus. I don’t see any proper witnessing which could withstand the scrutiny of the Cross-examination in any court of law presently.
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.
Thanks
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benedictgal
Guest
Matthais was chosen to replace Judas after lots were cast. St. Peter prayed to the Holy Spirit to guide the decision. When the lot was cast, it fell to Matthias. So, the decision came from the Holy Spirit, who is God, Himself (the Third Person of the Holy Trinity).
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benedictgal
Guest
Just because Matthew did not mention the fact that John was at the crucifixion that doesn’t mean that the beloved Apostle was not there. John was there. He was the beloved disciple to whom Jesus entrusted His Mother.
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S_J_Thaikattil
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Paarsurrey, but I thought you read the Bible inside out! Jesus did not “induct” Matthias; the disciples chose him to replace Judas Iscariot. They wanted to choose one who had been with Jesus from the beginning of His ministry just like Jesus’ chosen disciples. Two names were proposed, and in order to choose one, they cast lots after praying specifically about it.
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paarsurrey
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S_J_Thaikattil
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Paarsurrey, you are a Muslim. Stick to your Quran. Believe whatever you want about Jesus and Christianity. But please don’t ask Christians to accept what is written about Jesus in the Quran, or your fantasies about who created Christianity.
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S_J_Thaikattil
Guest
Paarsurrey, you are getting mixed up. It is Mohammad who followed in the footsteps of King David and fought wars, ruled his people and married many women. Ben, the Jew from Israel would be the best to comment on the difference between King David and Mohammad.
Jesus was celibate. He didn’t make any imaginary trips anywhere. He lived and was crucified in Israel. Once again you are getting mixed up with Mohammad who traveled to Jerusalem in his dreams.
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benedictgal
Guest
Ask and you shall receive. This is from the first chapter of the Acts of the Apostles:
15 In those days Peter rising up in the midst of the brethren, said: (now the number of persons together was about an hundred and twenty
I hope this helps you.
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paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
What authority could the deserting and fleeing disciples have from Jesus? They were doing a think which Jesus had not preferred himself; which he could have done to start with, if he had wanted. It was a mistake of the deserting disciples, in my opinion. or Did they want to find fault with Jesus? Did they want to make amends for the mistake done by Jesus?
In my opinion, it was a mistake of the disciples to convene a meeting in the absence of Jesus. Jesus had gone to India with Mary and other faithful followers.
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quan.
Thanks
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S_J_Thaikattil
Guest
PaarSurrey, your Muslim imagination and fiction about Christianity is wasted on a Catholic blog.
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