There are 2,942 Catholic Denominations, Maybe more

[kell0618]

Actually, I could take that definition and say there are as many Catholic denominations as there are dioceses.

The Bishop of each Diocese must answer directly to the Pope.

If we were speaking about a corporation, would you say that the CEO was boss but each individual branch of the company was a separate company? That doesn’t make any sense. ie: Kodak is headquartered in Rochester, NY., but in your analogy, the different locations throughout the world are actually not part of the whole but separate entities?

 

[itsjustdave1988]

And Protestant Churches are governed by Holy Scripture, which Webster won’t recognize as a “single legal and administrative body” but which, for the sake of this discussion is one.

Because a book, no matter how Holy, is not a denomination.

You said that if I was to use a definition, I should use the same for all. I did. Now you try it…

Using Webster’s definition, how many Protestant denomination do you suppose there are, given that each Baptist parish is a “law unto itself?”

Catholicism has ONE, since there exists a SINGLE Catholic organization uniting local congregations in a single legal and administrative body.

 

[eliasaph99]

By this definition, all Protestants would form a single denomination since all Protestants claim the Bible as their final authority. Yes, they differ as to how that authority is to be interpreted and applied but Catholic Bishops do EXACTLY the same thing with every magisterial pronouncement issuing from the Vatican.

Word twister.

The Bible is not a ruling authority, because it is a book. It is an authoritative source, but not a ruling authority. Clearly, the final authority referred to was a “legal and administrative body”, to quote itsjustdave.

As for what you have said about Catholic Bishops, they do have some latitude in interpretation and application. However, they are answerable to the Vatican. A Bishop who takes to much liberty can be reined in. A Baptist pastor whose church belongs to the SBA is not answerable to them in the same way. The church may be removed from the SBA, but the SBA has no authority to defrock the pastor or to silence him. For many Christian churches, there is no authority over them at all. The pastor teaches whatever he wants, and interprets scripture however he wants, and no one can correct or stop him.

 

[kell0618]

And Protestant Churches are governed by Holy Scripture

Which can be and is misinterpreted with great vigor. And then we come full circle and ask: “Where did your Bible come from?” and on and on and on.

 

[Steadfast]

The Bishop of each Diocese must answer directly to the Pope.

If we were speaking about a corporation, would you say that the CEO was boss but each individual branch of the company was a separate company? That doesn’t make any sense. ie: Kodak is headquartered in Rochester, NY., but in your analogy, the different locations throughout the world are actually not part of the whole but separate entities?

And the bishop of each Protestant congregation, or the leadership of each Protestant denomination must answer to Holy Scripture.

The point is that there is one church. Only one. not two or three or sixty-thousand.

A denomination is not analogous to a corporation since it entails a necessary doctrinal element; i.e. an interpretation of the authority on issues going far beyond marketing and organization.

I am Catholic, but not, evidently, for the same reasons as many of you.

For all your hand wringing about division, it’s quite clear that you glory in your difference. You like to talk about unity but you won’t accept that whatever unity there can ever be can only come at the call of Him in Whose Name we are bound together and never in the names we call ourselves.

 

[Steadfast]

I find it deliciously ironic that when it suits you you will trumpet the doctrinal and theological aspects of denominational taxonomy and then, when the discussion changes insist that it is merely a matter of ecclesial organization.



And you call me a twister!

 

[Syele]

Thanks to those here who “get it”.

Like I said in the OP, I am NOT disputing that we are divided. I didn’t post this thread to argue Sola Scriptura. If I was quoting an erroneous figure every other thread, I’d be glad someone pointed it out so I’d stop being wrong. I know I’m :banghead:.

For whoever pointed out that my numbers came from the 1985 printing, there was also a 2001 printing that was updated. In that one the total Denominations were around 33,000 and it also included Catholics, protestants and others in the list, not only protestants, so I’m not sure how your argument makes much difference to anything I said?

Joey warren is correct, I do not have my very own copy of the book. I *can *read excerpts of it from amazon.com you can search inside the book and read entire pages from the excerpt. Libraries have the book too, one dosen’t have to Own it to read it. I do have quite a bit of evidence that the online quotes from it are accurate. The only Catholic I could find refuting Svedenson retracted his refutation and posted the other link I put up! I find it almost amusing that there are Catholics here who are actually arguing that they can pick and choose what to believe from Barretts work “Because he is anti-Catholic”. You really mean to say you are accepting part of his findings because he is anticatholic???

Look, I’m not asking Catholics to stop arguing their points, I’m only asking you to use accurate info and stop throwing random numbers around.

 

[rr1213]

…the vast majority of Protestants in the USA can be found under the umbrella of less than 30 denominations.

Doings some research, I think I was pretty close.

For 2004, it was estimated by adherents.com that there were approximately 224,437,959 Christians in the United States.

adherents.com/rel_USA.html

For 2004, it was estimated that this included 71,796,719 Catholics.

So, subtracting one number from the other, there would have been about 152,641,240 non-Catholic Christians in 2004. Subtracting 1,200,000 Orthodox believers, (see source below), this would leave 151,441,240 “Protestant” believers (not sure if this would include folks I would not consider to be Protestants, such as the 3 million LDS and the JW believers).

hirr.hartsem.edu/research/orthodoxsummary.html

Also, for 2004, it was estimated by adherents.com that there were:

47,744,049 Baptists
19,969,799 Methodist/Wesleyans
13,520,189 Lutherans
7,897,597 Presbyterians
4,870,373 Episcopalian/Anglicans
3,659,483 Churches of Christ
1,944,762 United Churches of Christ
1,560,890 Assemblies of God

Using round numbers, this is approximately 103 million people or approximately 68% of the Protestants in America. (Much of the rest are in Pentacostal or Charismatic Churches). The Churches encompassing these 103 million people are divided into about 20 denominations.

 

[Steadfast]

If God the Holy Spirit speaks in Scripture as we all confess, and if He speaks in the living tradition of the Church as we Catholics confess, the message must be interpreted.

To say that the Bible can’t be an organizational unifier since it is just a book is a lot like saying that the documents of Vatican II can’t speak authoritatively to us because they are just words on a page.

 

[Mickey]

I am saying that the differences that exist between Catholic Bishops on whatever doctrine are of roughly the same gravity as those that exist between any two Protestant denominations on doctrines of similar gravity.

Well, I am on record as disagreeing with the 30,000+ figures for the protestant churches and now I must go on record to disagree with you in reference to the opinion of a single bishop as a representation of the Church teaching.

 

[Syele]

Which can be and is misinterpreted with great vigor. And then we come full circle and ask: “Where did your Bible come from?” and on and on and on.

I think we are straying from the topic quite a bit here.

 

[Stephen_C]

There is only one Christian Church, the Catholic Church. That’s it just one. All Christians are members or a part of this Church. Just that some Christians do not (through no fault of their own) know they are members or a part of this one Church. So there you have it just one Christian Church. With some groups teaching/preaching some Heresy and/or Sedevacantism.
As to Denominations, I don’t really care how many there are…Just want the Christian body whole again…That is what I pray for.

 

[Jean_Marie_1]

I didn’t read through all the posts, so I don’t know if this has been pointed out yet, but there are as many “Protestant” denominations are there are individuals that practice Sola Scriptura.

That means there are untold MILLIONS of Protestant denominations, as there is no one central authority to decide what their “god”, the Bible, means.

 

[Syele]

I didn’t read through all the posts, so I don’t know if this has been pointed out yet, but there are as many “Protestant” denominations are there are individuals that practice Sola Scriptura.

That means there are untold MILLIONS of Protestant denominations, as there is no one central authority to decide what their “god”, the Bible, means.

Interesting. So, you are a scholar and authority on what a denomination is?

 

[Jean_Marie_1]

Interesting. So, you are a scholar and authority on what a denomination is?

Yeah, I am an authority on it as much as needs be:

A religion has a certain set of dogma, and if that dogma is: figure it out for yourself, which is what Sola Scriptura is, then that means there are as many denominations as there are people that follow the dogma of Sola Scriptura, as no two people are going to be identical.

 

[jack_hawkins]

Yeah, I am an authority on it as much as needs be:

A religion has a certain set of dogma, and if that dogma is: figure it out for yourself, which is what Sola Scriptura is, then that means there are as many denominations as there are people that follow the dogma of Sola Scriptura, as no two people are going to be identical.

A post that more perfectly misses the point I can’t imagine:thumbsup:

 

[itsjustdave1988]

… a lot like saying that the documents of Vatican II can’t speak authoritatively to us because they are just words on a page.

It is a lot like saying that. In fact it is precisely like saying that. That is why we have a living magisterium, because Christianity has never been a self-study correspondence course. Christianity has always had and always will have a living teaching authority. It does not depend upon “sola-” document, whether that document is the Bible or whether that document is council decrees. No document or even a library of documents can be understood as a “religious organization uniting local congregations in a single legal and administrative body.” Only a living teaching authority can fulfill that role.

Which is why Jesus did just come bearing a better Bible, but instead established a living teaching authority which he called a “Church.”

 

[Jean_Marie_1]

A post that more perfectly misses the point I can’t imagine:thumbsup:

Whatever.

 

[Syele]

Yeah, I am an authority on it as much as needs be:

A religion has a certain set of dogma, and if that dogma is: figure it out for yourself, which is what Sola Scriptura is, then that means there are as many denominations as there are people that follow the dogma of Sola Scriptura, as no two people are going to be identical.

Not so, I know lots of people with identical beliefs on core issues. IF you want to split hairs on stuff like “should there be guitars during the singing in the church service” or “should women cover their heads in church”… well Catholics are just as divided when you go there.

You can’t just take English words and invent your own definition and declare yourself an authority. If that is allowed I can make up whatever I like when discussing things with you as well.

 

[lak611]

Not so, I know lots of people with identical beliefs on core issues. IF you want to split hairs on stuff like “should there be guitars during the singing in the church service” or “should women cover their heads in church”… well Catholics are just as divided when you go there.

That is exactly what criteria that author is using to define “denomination”.

You can’t just take English words and invent your own definition and declare yourself an authority. If that is allowed I can make up whatever I like when discussing things with you as well.

In all fairness, why should it matter to any of us, Catholic, Protestant or Orthodox how many denominations some author claims exist? What we need to do is pray for Christian unity and stop fighting over silly stuff like numbers.:grouphug: