Things I learned from feminism I wish I'd learned from Christianity

[NonTimendum]

Feminism created a monster, released it into the streets, and then wants to be hailed as the hero for pretending to slay the monster.

 

[DarkLight]

I don’t know what Catholic teaching has to say about it, but the gist of it is this:

Women want to have a feminist world of hyper-sexualized, no-boundaries, “free-love” and then they get mad when the wrong type of man plays that game. They like dangerous boys and then they expect men to save them when the dangerous boy does dangerous things. They complain about consent and pushy men, but then they drop a man like a rock because he’s not assertive. Women dress immodestly and act immodestly and then pretend like the way they are treated doesn’t have anything to do with it.

Women also want to be supported and respected, but they don’t do much to earn that support or respect. A man learns very early on that he stands on his own, falls on his own, and if he wants something he has to fight for it. A woman usually demands everyone carry her, but also treat her as if she’s standing on her own. When I challenge a man, I deal with that man. When I challenge a woman, I deal with her, every man in the area and every woman in the area. Women think it’s their God-given right and duty to cut me down, and men are worried if they don’t save women from every challenge then women won’t like them. And they’re right. Women won’t like them.

Honestly, I’ve learned one thing from feminism above all other things. Around women: keep your head down, smile and nod, never say anything they can take as a challenge, and stay as far away from all of them as you can unless you absolutely have to be around them. My mom and my sister-in-law are the only exceptions to that rule.

Absolutely none of this is what I said in the first post, or what any of the self-identified feminists in this thread have said.

I can’t fight against a straw man. This sounds less like “feminism” and more like you just have encountered women who don’t behave well. Entitled individuals are nothing new.

Although if every single woman (even Catholic women) that you encounter is like that…I’d take a good hard look at yourself and what you’re expecting, rather than blaming feminism for corrupting every single woman you deal with.

 

[NonTimendum]

Would you like to talk about Dark Light’s OP?

The stuff you wrote did not have a lot of points of contact with her post.

Consent: Feminism created the no-boundaries, hyper-sexualized culture. Feminism created the world where men who are respectful lose.

Modesty: Very, very, very few women are actually modest, yet every single one of them is convinced that their immodest dress and immodest behavior can’t possibly be the reason they are treated immodestly. I don’t buy it. Anyway, like I said: Feminism created the hyper-sexualized, “anything goes” culture.

Date Rape: Feminism didn’t create this problem, but it doesn’t help. It teaches women to play with fire but pretend like it’s not their fault when they get burned. If I hang out with thugs and pretend to be a thug, no one cries for me when I get beat down by thugs. But a woman goes out alone with a bad-boy and he treats her like a bad-girl and suddenly no one is responsible for their decisions anymore. Women made this bed, but they don’t want to sleep in it.

Women should be feminine. Men should be masculine. The loss of both is a tragedy unparalleled in our modern times. If women find it hard to be feminine, try harder. If men find it hard to be masculine, try harder.

No one deserves respect and attention, except for women apparently. They don’t have to earn respect, because it is automatically assumed that they are just as capable and just as intelligent, whether or not this is actually true. And any man who questions this is going to quickly find himself the target of both men and women, who for different reasons have the same burning drive to destroy any man who doesn’t bow down to the inherent supremacy of women in all things.

If there are two people telling me something, one is a man and the other is a woman, I’ll probably listen to the man. Why? Because chances are he earned it. Chances are the woman was given it, but wants me to pretend she earned it, and is perfectly willing to form a coalition of men to force me to play along. When I disagree with a man, it’s just me and him. When I disagree with a woman, it’s me and her and every man and woman within earshot.

 

[NonTimendum]

Absolutely none of this is what I said in the first post, or what any of the self-identified feminists in this thread have said.

I’ve heard that before, plenty of times. It’s all a crock. Feminists are never responsible for anything. They are always the victim. No woman has ever done anything wrong in her entire life except that one time when she doubted herself.

Although if every single woman (even Catholic women) that you encounter is like that…I’d take a good hard look at yourself and what you’re expecting, rather than blaming feminism for corrupting every single woman you deal with.

I’m a salty, mean, ugly, short-tempered, arrogant, prideful sinner with a heart as black as coal and a soul worth nothing but damnation. Doesn’t change a thing I said.

 

[DarkLight]

Consent: Feminism created the no-boundaries, hyper-sexualized culture. Feminism created the world where men who are respectful lose.

Modesty: Very, very, very few women are actually modest, yet every single one of them is convinced that their immodest dress and immodest behavior can’t possibly be the reason they are treated immodestly. I don’t buy it. Anyway, like I said: Feminism created the hyper-sexualized, “anything goes” culture.

Date Rape: Feminism didn’t create this problem, but it doesn’t help. It teaches women to play with fire but pretend like it’s not their fault when they get burned. If I hang out with thugs and pretend to be a thug, no one cries for me when I get beat down by thugs. But a woman goes out alone with a bad-boy and he treats her like a bad-girl and suddenly no one is responsible for their decisions anymore. Women made this bed, but they don’t want to sleep in it.

Women should be feminine. Men should be masculine. The loss of both is a tragedy unparalleled in our modern times. If women find it hard to be feminine, try harder. If men find it hard to be masculine, try harder.

No one deserves respect and attention, except for women apparently. They don’t have to earn respect, because it is automatically assumed that they are just as capable and just as intelligent, whether or not this is actually true. And any man who questions this is going to quickly find himself the target of both men and women, who for different reasons have the same burning drive to destroy any man who doesn’t bow down to the inherent supremacy of women in all things.

If there are two people telling me something, one is a man and the other is a woman, I’ll probably listen to the man. Why? Because chances are he earned it. Chances are the woman was given it, but wants me to pretend she earned it, and is perfectly willing to form a coalition of men to force me to play along. When I disagree with a man, it’s just me and him. When I disagree with a woman, it’s me and her and every man and woman within earshot.

Screeds about how awful women are aside…again, you’re responding to your own creation of what you think “feminism” says. Not what I actually said.

If nothing else…as far as modesty. I have been out in the winter up north. I was wearing a long trench coat, a hat, a scarf over my face, gloves, and boots. I still received crude, inappropriate advances. Muslim women in long skirts and tops covering their arms and scarves covering their hair are assaulted. Men who have decided to disrespect women will not be deterred by how modestly that woman is dressed.

I would also add that when I was assaulted, it was by a practicing Catholic man who claimed he believed in no sex outside of marriage. He was a star student and a model of faith to others. The danger here is precisely that many of these men don’t appear to be thugs to the outside world.

As far as assuming that a man earned something and a woman was given it - all I can do is say, how would you feel if someone said that to your mother?

 

[NonTimendum]

Screeds about how awful women are aside…again, you’re responding to your own creation of what you think “feminism” says. Not what I actually said.

What did you say? The usual fluff about “no one ever taught me to do X” that every single feminist I know has written about. Funny how no one ever taught any of you any of all this stuff that every single one of you knows about.

If nothing else…as far as modesty. I have been out in the winter up north. I was wearing a long trench coat, a hat, a scarf over my face, gloves, and boots. I still received crude, inappropriate advances. Muslim women in long skirts and tops covering their arms and scarves covering their hair are assaulted. Men who have decided to disrespect women will not be deterred by how modestly that woman is dressed.

Kinda weird how every single feminist is constantly being harassed and assaulted too, but I’ve never seen it, no guy I know has ever seen it, but I am constantly assured that it is always happening. And it is never the woman’s fault. Interesting that I never see all these modestly dressed women, but I am assured that every woman who is ever assaulted was practically wearing a burqa! And it was never by a bad-boy who she made a mistake in judging. Nope. It is always the nice boy, honor student, who no one ever could have known! There were NEVER any signs!

It stretches the credibility. But since doubting any woman’s story is the most horrible, mean, evil, heartless, cruel thing a man can do; I guess I have to bow my head and play along. So I am so terribly sorry to all women for ever thinking any woman was ever responsible for anything that ever happened to her. I don’t know what I was thinking, challenging a woman like that. I’ll go be alone forever now because I’m sure you’re going to tell me how lucky women are that I’m still single.

As far as assuming that a man earned something and a woman was given it - all I can do is say, how would you feel if someone said that to your mother?

If she didn’t earn it, then she shouldn’t pretend like she has. If she did earn it than she shouldn’t care what men say to her.

 

[Xantippe]

Consent:** Feminism created the no-boundaries, hyper-sexualized culture. **Feminism created the world where men who are respectful lose.

Modesty: Very, very, very few women are actually modest, yet every single one of them is convinced that their immodest dress and immodest behavior can’t possibly be the reason they are treated immodestly. I don’t buy it. Anyway, like I said: Feminism created the hyper-sexualized, “anything goes” culture.

Date Rape: Feminism didn’t create this problem, but it doesn’t help. It teaches women to play with fire but pretend like it’s not their fault when they get burned. If I hang out with thugs and pretend to be a thug, no one cries for me when I get beat down by thugs. But a woman goes out alone with a bad-boy and he treats her like a bad-girl and suddenly no one is responsible for their decisions anymore. Women made this bed, but they don’t want to sleep in it.

Women should be feminine. Men should be masculine. The loss of both is a tragedy unparalleled in our modern times. If women find it hard to be feminine, try harder. If men find it hard to be masculine, try harder.

No one deserves respect and attention, except for women apparently. They don’t have to earn respect, because it is automatically assumed that they are just as capable and just as intelligent, whether or not this is actually true. And any man who questions this is going to quickly find himself the target of both men and women, who for different reasons have the same burning drive to destroy any man who doesn’t bow down to the inherent supremacy of women in all things.

If there are two people telling me something, one is a man and the other is a woman, I’ll probably listen to the man. Why? Because chances are he earned it. Chances are the woman was given it, but wants me to pretend she earned it, and is perfectly willing to form a coalition of men to force me to play along. When I disagree with a man, it’s just me and him. When I disagree with a woman, it’s me and her and every man and woman within earshot.

Some points:

–Playboy Magazine (which is one of the early data-points for “hypersexualized” US culture) was launched in ultra-wholesome 1953. The Feminine Mystique was published in 1963. If we wanted to talk about causality, you could make a much better case that hypersexuality caused feminism, rather than the other way around.
–I have a lot of concerns about your belief that “Very, very, very few women are actually modest.” That suggests to me that you have weird ideas of modesty, unless you live on the beach in Rio de Janeiro. Would you like to give us some guidelines so we can understand what you understand by “modesty”? Are shorts out? Short sleeve shirts? Pants? Sleeveless swimsuits?
–People normally date among their socioeconomic peers.
–About these “bad boys” I keep hearing about–was Brock Turner the Stanford swimmer a “bad boy”? Was Bill Cosby a bad boy? If anything, Bill Cosby got a lot of mileage out of being a safe, fun, good guy that everybody could trust. Brock Turner is also not particularly scary looking.
–If femininity is natural, why does it require endless work?

 

[Xantippe]

Kinda weird how every single feminist is constantly being harassed and assaulted too, but I’ve never seen it, no guy I know has ever seen it, but I am constantly assured that it is always happening. And it is never the woman’s fault. Interesting that I never see all these modestly dressed women, but I am assured that every woman who is ever assaulted was practically wearing a burqa! And it was never by a bad-boy who she made a mistake in judging. Nope. It is always the nice boy, honor student, who no one ever could have known! There were NEVER any signs!

It stretches the credibility. But since doubting any woman’s story is the most horrible, mean, evil, heartless, cruel thing a man can do; I guess I have to bow my head and play along. So I am so terribly sorry to all women for ever thinking any woman was ever responsible for anything that ever happened to her. I don’t know what I was thinking, challenging a woman like that. I’ll go be alone forever now because I’m sure you’re going to tell me how lucky women are that I’m still single.

If she didn’t earn it, then she shouldn’t pretend like she has. If she did earn it than she shouldn’t care what men say to her.

You never see any modestly dressed women? Hmmm.

With regard to sexual assault, think about how often people who molest children are pillars of their communities–teachers, pediatricians, priests, Protestant pastors, coaches, beloved relatives, trusted friends, etc. Sexual assault often **depends **on trust. So yes, the perpetrators of sexual assault are going to be predominantly people who are trusted. (Related–about a third of the time, identity theft is commited by family and friends of the victim.)
cbsnews.com/news/when-identity-theft-is-a-family-affair/
We are much more vulnerable with people we trust and who are members of our circle.

 

[NonTimendum]

Feminism is the oldest cultural movement in human history. The first act of our human mother was to reject the rightful headship of her husband in an attempt to seize power which was improper to her station. The first act of our human father was to willingly cede his God appointed power over and duty to his wife so as to avoid the consequences of standing up to a woman.

My standards of modesty are very old-fashioned. I understand no one likes them or agrees with them. So be it. Do as you will. Mostly I am concerned with modest behavior, not dress, though I see the trend very clearly that immodest dress usually coincides with immodest behavior. As for what constitutes immodest behavior:

Speaking about inappropriate topics. (even among friends of the same sex)
Sexualizing yourself or others.
Profanity.
Consuming immodest entertainment (99% of all modern entertainment)
Any sexual behavior that is outside of marriage (including kissing, petting, etc.)
Consuming alcohol or drugs.
Any form of modern dancing.
Immodest dress (not as important as the others, but usually a sign)
Excessive piercings, or any tattoos.
Loud, boisterous behavior.

Brock Turner was completely railroaded. A girl got drunk at a party, decided to cheat on her boyfriend, made out with him, asked to be taken back to his room, and then panicked when it blew up and whistled rape because that made her the victim instead of the party-girl. I don’t believe her story for a second.

Bill Crosby was he said, she said. I’m not going to cast judgement on that case.

Natural man is damned. We need to stop doing what’s “natural” and start bearing our cross.

 

[Xantippe]

Feminism is the oldest cultural movement in human history. The first act of our human mother was to reject the rightful headship of her husband in favor of attempting to seize power which was improper to her station. The first act of our human father was to willingly cede his God appointed power and duty to his wife so as to avoid the consequences of standing up to a woman.

My standards of modesty are very old-fashioned. I understand no one likes them or agrees with them. So be it. Do as you will. Mostly I am concerned with modest behavior, not dress, though I see the trend very clearly that immodest dress usually coincides with immodest behavior. As for what constitutes immodest behavior:

Speaking about inappropriate topics. (even among friends of the same sex)
Sexualizing yourself or others.
Profanity.
Consuming immodest entertainment (99% of all modern entertainment)
Any sexual behavior that is outside of marriage (including kissing, petting, etc.)
Consuming alcohol or drugs.
Any form of modern dancing.
Immodest dress (not as important as the others, but usually a sign)
Excessive piercings, or any tattoos.
Loud, boisterous behavior.

Brock Turner was completely railroaded. A girl got drunk at a party, decided to cheat on her boyfriend, made out with him, asked to be taken back to his room, and then panicked when it blew up and whistled rape because that made her the victim instead of the party-girl. I don’t believe her story for a second.

Bill Crosby was he said, she said. I’m not going to cast judgement on that case.

Natural man is damned. We need to stop doing what’s “natural” and start bearing our cross.

–99% of modern entertainment is immodest. Man oh man! Finding Nemo? Finding Dory? Meet the Robinsons? Up? Zootopia? The Incredibles? My Little Pony? The Octonauts? Paw Patrol?
–Where is your catechism cite for kissing outside marriage being out of bounds for unmarried Catholics?
–Drinking a glass of wine is inappropriate? I’m a non-drinker, but WOW. That’s just not traditional for Catholics.
–You don’t appear to have read any news stories about the Brock Turner case. There was no room, she has no memories of the event, and the reason he got caught was that there were two eye witnesses who caught him in the act.
–Bill Cosby was he said-she said-she said-she-said-she said-etc., with about 50 accusers. Are you asserting that a woman’s word is worth 1/50th of a man’s word? That’s interesting.

 

[NonTimendum]

–99% of modern entertainment is immodest. Man oh man! Finding Nemo? Finding Dory? Meet the Robinsons? Up? Zootopia? The Incredibles? My Little Pony? The Octonauts? Paw Patrol?
–Where is your catechism cite for kissing outside marriage being out of bounds for unmarried Catholics?
–Drinking a glass of wine is inappropriate? I’m a non-drinker, but WOW. That’s just not traditional for Catholics.
–You don’t appear to have read any news stories about the Brock Turner case. There was no room, she has no memories of the event, and the reason he got caught was that there were two eye witnesses who caught him in the act.
–Bill Cosby was he said-she said-she said-she-said-she said-etc., with about 50 accusers. Are you asserting that a woman’s word is worth 1/50th of a man’s word? That’s interesting.

I haven’t seen Finding Nemo lately, but isn’t Finding Dory the one with the lesbian fish?

Because most young women are having just one glass of wine when they’re at the bar…

She claims to have no memories of the act, claims she didn’t ask to go to his room (her sister originally supported Brock’s counter-claim, but then changed her story), and two eye-witnesses (foreign exchange students) saw him with a girl and then tackled him, and then went along with the story that made them heroes instead of guilty of assault. Color me unconvinced.

A very rich man was accused and suddenly 50 women who have never said anything before this decided that a magazine cover, heroic treatment by the media, lots of money and fame, happened to remind them that they actually were raped. And I am instantly supposed to assume guilt because to do otherwise means I am a sexist, misogynist pig who hates women. Maybe he did, maybe he didn’t. It wasn’t enough to convince the (obviously sexist) jury, so I’ll reserve judgement on this one.

 

[Xantippe]

I haven’t seen Finding Nemo lately, but isn’t Finding Dory the one with the lesbian fish?

Because most young women are having just one glass of wine when they’re at the bar…

She claims to have no memories of the act, claims she didn’t ask to go to his room (her sister originally supported Brock’s counter-claim, but then changed her story), and two eye-witnesses (foreign exchange students) saw him with a girl and then tackled him, and then went along with the story that made them heroes instead of guilty of assault. Color me unconvinced.

A very rich man was accused and suddenly 50 women who have never said anything before this decided that a magazine cover, heroic treatment by the media, lots of money and fame, happened to remind them that they actually were raped. And I am instantly supposed to assume guilt because to do otherwise means I am a sexist, misogynist pig who hates women. Maybe he did, maybe he didn’t. It wasn’t enough to convince the (obviously sexist) jury, so I’ll reserve judgement on this one.

Here are the stats on alcohol consumption in the US:

“86.4 percent of people ages 18 or older reported that they drank alcohol at some point in their lifetime; 70.1 percent reported that they drank in the past year; 56.0 percent reported that they drank in the past month.”

niaaa.nih.gov/alcohol-health/overview-alcohol-consumption/alcohol-facts-and-statistics

“Americans drink an average of 2.3 gallons of pure alcohol a year compared to 7.1 gallons in 1830.”

bbc.com/news/magazine-31741615

That means that (compared to the early 19th century), Americans drink 2/3 less alcohol than they used to.

The US is not a heavy-drinking country:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_alcohol_consumption_per_capita

 

[SuperLuigi]

AdamPeter;14740714]I believe the words to describe these “red pill” men are selfish and individualistic.

Depends on how you define red pill. Every single red pill person I know of who would describe themselves as that has ZERO problems getting dates.

I mean, they essentially seem to view women as being solely there to satisfy their wants and needs. Their idea of a relationship is completely one-sided.

Most people do not think that way.

Most of the derogatory comments about “blue pill” men seem to be aimed at detracting from the marriages and success of these men. My guess is that the majority of red pill men are simply unsuccessful at romance and professionally and that’s why they spend all their time trying to find problems with other people’s relationships.

If all you can do is guess, you shouldn’t be posting about it. Most people who are red-pilled are traditional and reject 3rd-wave feminism.

How many would want to be in a relationship with a red pilled man?

Evidently a lot and considering that Laci Green is dating one of them, they seem to be doing well.

I happen to be married and consider myself a red-pilled person. Before that I would consistently get attention from Catholic women.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Feminism created a monster, released it into the streets, and then wants to be hailed as the hero for pretending to slay the monster.

:clapping:

 

[SuperLuigi]

I disagree with almost all of it. You won’t like my reasons though, so take a while to think about whether or not you actually want me to give them to you.

There’s reasons why I tell folks to avoid taking advice in this section like the plague.

The fact that practicing, married Catholics on here are arguing in favour of the blue-pill philosophy is exactly why so many young people do not take the Catholic Church seriously.

It’s also obvious that anytime I post links no one reads them. People are far too content to stay in their little box shouting ad hominems usually along lines about how us red-pillers can’t get women even though I’m married, have not problems getting dates once I got some practice in and figured out the game, and a lot of women who are married to or dating red-pilled men (hello Laci Green) are also red-pills.

In short:

If Milo tells a bad joke, they’re all over that. If Tommy Sotomayor makes a comment mocking Black women, why that’s also really bad…even though dates them and has kids with them. But 3rd wave feminists indoctrinating their kids in the Western education system they shell thousands and thousands each year to support? Why, that’s just fine and dandy!

Oh, and then when the culture changes “I’m surprised…didn’t think it could happen…but they promised they wouldn’t; really they did, I swear! :crying:”

 

[Xantippe]

OK, Red Pill guys–what is the difference between a wife and a slave?

I’ve never been able to make out the difference in what the roles are supposed to be in you guys’ book.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Xantippe;14748651]OK, Red Pill guys–what is the difference between a wife and a slave?

If you’re asking that question (which is a complex question fallacy, BTW), your either getting your information from postmodernists who want to destroy the nuclear family point blank and I’d be surprised that they’d even talk to you since they now regard even liberal atheists who don’t tow the SJW line as Nazis…OR you’re reading blogs about a sorry subset of people (who I really could not believe are red-pilled if all they do is whine and moan on-line) who just like the sad nice guys think pity and self-loathing and suicide black mail are the way to a woman’s heart, in which case it doesn’t matter what he thinks he is, he’s not getting a real date.

I’ve never been able to make out the difference in what the roles are supposed to be in you guys’ book.

That’s because people always talk over each on this. I’ll take the Catholic approach. But the red-pill notions are useful because they fundamentally reject radical feminism and postmodernism.

Really, to be a blue-pill by stretch of the imagination means not even talking to us because you’re feeding Nazi trolls by their standards.

I think anyone who thinks being a blue pill is a good idea needs to look into this deeper and understand who those folks really are and what their goals are. It’s not pretty and basically involves the destruction of the Catholic Church and the nuclear family. There’s no way they get what they want without that. :nope:

Red pill, on the other hand, is very broad and very much is in favour of women consenting. There is no endorsement of manipulating or hurting women. In fact if you’re really concerned about that, ask the blue-pillers about FGM or hijabs (not really against, just for their line of reasoning) or even other cultures. See what their priorities are------that is if they don’t call you a white supremacist first.

 

[NonTimendum]

I’ll take the Catholic approach.

Exactly. A wife and husband are one flesh, united in body and spirit. They should always work together and present a united face to the world. They should mutually support each other. The man should work to provide for his wife and his family, and should lead his wife with compassion and gentleness. The wife should work to provide for her husband, and should follow him with compassion and gentleness. They should sacrifice for each other willingly, and if not happily, at least without bitterness. A wife should submit to her husband, not because of some rule or because he owns her; she should do it because she loves him and wants to support him.

It is very popular to denigrate and demean the natural relationship between man and woman as one of slavery and inhumanity. This is a direct assault on the family and on God’s holy word.

 

[starshiptrooper]

OK, Red Pill guys–what is the difference between a wife and a slave?

I’ve never been able to make out the difference in what the roles are supposed to be in you guys’ book.

Slaves are less expensive and do not complain as much, obviously.

 

[Sophie_Lawrence]

Dory isn’t a lesbian fish. She’s voiced by an actress who happens to be a lesbian, but the film doesn’t have anything to do with homosexuality. (I thought I’d bring that up)