This is really troubling me - help please

[T.Knight]

I’m an 8 year revert to the Catholic Church. I’m so distressed by the closure of the Church to the laity. I don’t understand why the Bishops are doing this to us. I live in Georgia and our Bishops went above and beyond the secular restrictions which made allowances for worship.
My question is this:
The Third Commandment states, “Remember that thou keep holy the sabbath day.“ Exodus 20:8.
The Catholic Church has historically interpreted this to mean “go to Mass on Sunday.” I’m aware of the specific exceptions (traveling, illness…). Personally, I’ve fallen into mortal sin 3 times in the last 8 years because I failed my Sunday obligation.
So, 5 weeks ago if I skipped Mass on Sunday I was in mortal sin. 4 weeks ago it’s okay not to go to Mass. Why? Because a Bishop said so, based on a perceived threat. I don’t want to argue the danger posed by the covid-19 pandemic, but how can a man just arbitrarily cancel the Third Commandment?
If a Bishop can tell me it’s okay to not keep the Sabbath holy can be just arbitrarily change other grave matters? Can he pronounce a blanket allowance to murder? Or can he tell me it’s okay to look at porn? Why have I struggled so much with that when he can apparently just declare it not a sin?
I’m incredibly confused about this…

 

[SPBlitz]

If a Bishop can tell me it’s okay to not keep the Sabbath holy can be just arbitrarily change other grave matters? Can he pronounce a blanket allowance to murder? Or can he tell me it’s okay to look at porn? Why have I struggled so much with that when he can apparently just declare it not a sin?
I’m incredibly confused about this…

The Sabbath was made for man not man for the Sabbath. Mass can be temporarily postponed for a legitimate reason - preventing the spread of pandemic is one of those.

 

[Gorgias]

So, 5 weeks ago if I skipped Mass on Sunday I was in mortal sin. 4 weeks ago it’s okay not to go to Mass. Why? Because a Bishop said so, based on a perceived threat.

Yep. Exactly!

Or are you saying that bishops do not have the authority to regulate the discipline and sacraments of the Church?

If a Bishop can tell me it’s okay to not keep the Sabbath holy can be just arbitrarily change other grave matters?

Depends on the matter. Doctrine and dogma? Nope. Discipline and practice? Yep.

So, 5 weeks ago if I skipped Mass on Sunday I was in mortal sin. 4 weeks ago it’s okay not to go to Mass. Why? Because a Bishop said so

One last thought: 55 years ago, if you ate meat on any Friday, you’d have been in a state of grave (and possibly mortal) sin. Today, generally speaking, that’s not the case. Why? Because the sin wasn’t the meat or the day of the week… it was the refusal to follow the legitimate disciplines of the Church.

 

[Beryllos]

@T.Knight, Welcome to Catholic Answers Forums, and please do not be troubled. Christ is still with us. Mass is still being celebrated. Closed doors do not prevent you from keeping holy the Lord’s day. How can you best love and worship God on Sunday, wherever you happen to be?

 

[phil19034]

1. We STILL have to keep the Sabbath day holy. Just because we can’t go to mass doesn’t mean we don’t have to keep the Sabbath day holy. We still do. The Third Commandment was NOT canceled. The only thing that changed is that we have been dispensed from a normative way of recognizing it.

• Keep in mind, the Bible doesn’t say that the only way to keep the Third Commandment is by attending worship services (aka Mass) that day. However, it’s is OBVIOUS that if you can attend, you should.

1. There are a number of reasons why we can be dispensed from our Sunday obligation: sick, taking care of a sick person, travel, taking care of young children (yes, a parents is excused if they they need to stay home because of a cranky baby), not living near a Church, etc.

Right now, we simply don’t have the ability of attend a mass. This is no different from the Catholics in Japan who didn’t have access to priests/churches because they were outlawed.

Finally, I HIGHLY recommend that you listen to this 20 minute homily from a FSSP priest. I found it to be very insightful and helpful

“https://mcusercontent.com/cc5370170...4d691ae/Spiritual_Communion_and_Gods_Will.mp3”

God Bless

 

[po18guy]

Welcome! Let not your heart be troubled.

A parable, if you will: The sheep were in the pasture and never wanted to leave - but the shepherd knew that a wolf was prowling around. This was no ordinary wolf - but one which could not be seen or even felt in many cases. This was a wolf, literally in sheep’s clothing. It was looking for souls to devour. It was looking to spread disease, misery and death - and was doing so at an alarming rate. The shepherd heard of this and was called to take action.

The shepherd worked for his Master and knew that he must answer for the well-being of his sheep. The sheep were very well fed in the pasture and greatly desired to remain there, but the shepherd had greater knowledge than the sheep, and loved them dearly, so he quarantined them in the sheepfold until the danger of the wolf was past.

At this dangerous time, we are called to be sheep and not goats, to be longing for our lord, but with enough charity to know that we might might be one of those wolves in sheep’s clothing, i.e. a carrier of the virus.

I am elderly, immune suppressed and have diabetes - a perfect target for the virus. I will probably die if I contract the corona virus. It is being spread by parishioners (and many others) who have no symptoms.

Is it prudent to allow close-quarters gatherings knowing this?

The mass is still being celebrated daily and we are spiritually fed via spiritual communion and the fervent prayers of every Deacon, Priest and Bishop, including the Holy Father.

They are asking that we demonstrate the virtues of patience and obedience.

 

[Inbonum]

The Catholic Church has historically interpreted this to mean “go to Mass on Sunday.” I’m aware of the specific exceptions (traveling, illness…). Personally, I’ve fallen into mortal sin 3 times in the last 8 years because I failed my Sunday obligation.
So, 5 weeks ago if I skipped Mass on Sunday I was in mortal sin. 4 weeks ago it’s okay not to go to Mass. Why? Because a Bishop said so, based on a perceived threat. I don’t want to argue the danger posed by the covid-19 pandemic, but how can a man just arbitrarily cancel the Third Commandment?

I think that your main problem here isn’t bishop but is fact that you have to obey the rules by someone who you don’t agree with.
The bishop can make the decision on Masses as he did in these times for the greater good and he has right to do that. Didn’t Jeus said that law is here because of man not man because of law???
You cannot be wrong with obedience to bishop but you can fall into sin mumbling and disobedience in your heart so be careful with this.
It is not hard time only for you, there is many pople who are ill and in danger because of others who violate law and orders by authorities in these times. Every catholic whose faith is alive miss Masses, communion and confession but obedience is over our feelings in these things.

Can he pronounce a blanket allowance to murder? Or can he tell me it’s okay to look at porn? Why have I struggled so much with that when he can apparently just declare it not a sin?

He cannot pronounce it, you are comparing this covid19 situation’s order for Masses with murder and porn. Porn is sinn in every circumstances as is murder, there is no Catholic Bishop who would ever say it is okay to look at porn.
You take things out of context here.
I suggest you to read about obedience and authority.

By “authority” one means the quality by virtue of which persons or institutions make laws and give orders to men and expect obedience from them.
1898 Every human community needs an authority to govern it.16 The foundation of such authority lies in human nature. It is necessary for the unity of the state. Its role is to ensure as far as possible the common good of the society.

1899The authority required by the moral order derives from God: "Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore he who resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment."17

1900 The duty of obedience requires all to give due honor to authority and to treat those who are charged to exercise it with respect, and, insofar as it is deserved, with gratitude and good-will.
https://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c2a2.htm

This one is also good example

Obedience Is A Virtue: Follow Your Bishop’s Rules! | Matthew Schneider

 

[1ke]

but how can a man just arbitrarily cancel the Third Commandment?

It was neither arbitrary NOR was it “canceling the 3rd Commandment”. It was dispensing the obligation to attend mass, which is PART of keeping the Lord’s Day.

The obligation to attend mass on Sundays and Holy Days is an ecclesial discipline, meaning required because the bishops say so. It’s not a divine law requirement. Therefore they can dispense it.

If a Bishop can tell me it’s okay to not keep the Sabbath holy can be just arbitrarily change other grave matters?

No one told you not to keep the Lord’s Day holy. We do that outside the mass as well as by attending mass. The bishopS dispensed the obligation to attend mass. That’s all.

change other grave matters? Can he pronounce a blanket allowance to murder? Or can he tell me it’s okay to look at porn?

I think you don’t understand the difference between a church discipline and divine law.

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

how can a man just arbitrarily cancel the Third Commandment?

What makes you think it was arbitrary?

 

[Gab123]

The Church has authority to grant dispensations for attending mass. This does not mean that you are exempt of keeping the day of the Lord. You are still obligated to keep the day holy.

 

[Beryllos]

Many good points have been made in the replies. One more thing to remember is that the reason for closing churches is not just to keep Catholics healthy. The main reason is actually to keep Catholics from spreading the disease to other people. By staying home, we are saving the lives of non-Catholics and even strangers. In so doing, we follow the commandment to love our neighbor.

 

[Angel_Bradford]

There are situations that dispense with the obligation to attend Mass such as illness (yours or someone you are caring for), traveling and there is no Mass, having to work, extreme weather, and matters of public safety are some examples. The decision to cancel public Masses was not something that was taken lightly or made easily, but after much prayerful consideration… Please try not to struggle with it…

 

[veritatisstella]

As other answers have stated, going to Mass on Sunday is a matter of Church discipline, not a matter of doctrine, so it can change according to different circumstances. We are still obliged to keep the Lord’s day holy in some way even when we can’t get to Mass.

That said, you have a very sound point when you say:

I’m so distressed by the closure of the Church to the laity. I don’t understand why the Bishops are doing this to us. I live in Georgia and our Bishops went above and beyond the secular restrictions which made allowances for worship.

Bishops can (and should) at this time dispense from the Sunday obligation so people may know it’s okay to remain home, and especially so that those who are most vulnerable to this virus will not have to put themselves at risk. However, I think many bishops are shamefully treating physical lives as more important than spiritual lives over a possible threat from a virus we as yet know little about, and it is very right and natural for you to feel distressed by this. It’s especially shameful when they’re going above and beyond a secular allowance for worship with social distancing measures in place! A far better response is that of bishops in Poland who granted dispensation to the elderly and anyone who fears contracting the virus, but called for more Masses so people can go to Mass and keep distance according to secular guidelines. Makes little sense to me why no bishops in the US have called for something similar.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

So, 5 weeks ago if I skipped Mass on Sunday I was in mortal sin. 4 weeks ago it’s okay not to go to Mass. Why? Because a Bishop said so, based on a perceived threat. I don’t want to argue the danger posed by the covid-19 pandemic, but how can a man just arbitrarily cancel the Third Commandment?

He didn’t “arbitrarily” cancel it. He cancelled it in his prudential judgment “based on a perceived threat”. “Arbitrarily” would be that he just cancelled it because he felt like it, or for no good reason. That’s obviously not what happened if there’s a “perceived threat” involved.

At my work, if I just decided not to show up at the office one day when I was required to be there, I could expect to be disciplined - get a lecture from my boss, get a bad mark on my performance review, and maybe even lose my job.
But if the managers were aware of “a perceived threat” from COVID or something else, they could close the office and tell everyone not to show up. (Which indeed they have done. They disabled all our access cards so we can’t even get in the building.)
What the bishops have done is no different.

Obedience and humility are important virtues for a Catholic. I myself don’t find it easy to go without Mass or the Eucharist either. The bishop does allow us to pray at Church, to have Adoration, and to go to confession, so at least there’s that and I’m grateful, but it doesn’t take the place of receiving Jesus in sacramental form. I know there have been a few rogue churches that kept distributing Eucharist anyway and I could go around and look for one of those, at the risk of my health, or I could be obedient and humble and remember that some canonized saints were not able to receive the Eucharist for literally years. I decided to try to be like the saints. It’s not easy some days but neither are a lot of other things in life and God gives us these challenges for a reason.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

If a Bishop can tell me it’s okay to not keep the Sabbath holy can be just arbitrarily change other grave matters? Can he pronounce a blanket allowance to murder? Or can he tell me it’s okay to look at porn? Why have I struggled so much with that when he can apparently just declare it not a sin?

Do you not see the difference between the Bishop’s authority to dispense people from Mass attendance, and his lack of authority to decide that porn is okay to look at?

I would suggest you study this issue. There are areas where Bishops are specifically given authority by the Church. Dispensing their flock from Mass attendance requirements is one of them. Looking at porn is not one of them.

 

[_jesus_is_god]

The Sabbath was made for man not man for the Sabbath.

Is not the Lord’s day different than the Sabbath?

 

[SPBlitz]

Yes, but much of Catholic teaching on the Lords day is derived from the ancient teachings on the Sabbath.

 

[Fauken]

if you notice, the church has removed part of the first commandment. Thou shalt not have any other Gods before me. Thou shalt not have any graven images.

Idolatry is rolled under the first commandment. Worshipping idols is holding another god before God. Yet another old, anti-Catholic, slanderous lie that gets passed around and treated seriously. Have you never read a Catholic Examination of Conscience?

https://www.usccb.org/resources/Examination-of-Conscience.pdf

I’m an ex Catholic and I loved Jesus and my church

You sadly knew little about it then and still know little about it now if you’re pushing these anti-Catholic lies as truth. Your belief is based off of misrepresentations of Catholic teaching. It is sadly not a unique story, there are many like you who were raised Catholic with non-existent catechesis. I beg you to please learn about what your faith actually teaches instead of what people who promote lies about it say about it. At least you can then make a decision based on what it is instead of what it isn’t.

 

[Thom18]

Sunday is not the sabbath. Look up what sabbath means or even seven. We are to rest from work and worship the Lord on the sabbath. Actually weve been taught, “oh that doesnt apply to us today,” but it does. God is the same today and yesterday. His laws never changes. Man has changed Gods word to their benefit. If you want to attend service during the week be it Monday, Wednesday, Friday or even Sunday, you may. The more you hear God’s word the better but, we must keep the Sabbath Holy. That means the seventh day. It is one of the commandments. We must keep it Holy into Him with good intentions. God knows why we do anything so let it be your true intentions to follow Christ not because we are cattle, following the person in front of us.

You’ll be delighted to know that the Church has not changed the Sabbath. Saturday is Saturday. The Church has, however, with the authority of Christ, established Sunday as the Lord’s day, the day on which He rose from the dead. It is the fulfillment of the Sabbath, and as such is of greater importance for us under the New Covenant.

Also if you notice, the church has removed part of the first commandment. Thou shalt not have any other Gods before me. Thou shalt not have any graven images. There are graven images that people think will heal them and thats blasphemy.

The Church changed nothing, as the Church is the entity which numbered the Commandments in the first place, and, in her wisdom, grouped that command under the first Commandment. It is the Protestant revolutionaries who changed the Commandments.

Also, We don’t pray to anyone else but Jesus. There is only one mediator between us and God and thats Jesus Christ. Not Mary Joseph or Issac. I’m an ex Catholic and I loved Jesus and my church but over time I felt something empty inside. I saw people not being sincere about their faith so I started to read my bible and visit other Christian churches and found Jesus through my first sermon. The betrayal of Judas. I knew it was truth. God said his word would not return void. And it never will if your truly searching truth. Many changes have happened in the church in the first century and ithe church continues to change more and more to the world and not change the world to God. Just read your bible and see what Gid has to say to you God bless my catholics.

A careful reading of that passage will inform you that Paul does not contradict himself. In this same letter (in the same CHAPTER), he praises intercessory prayer. Yet you claim that he here says that we ought not to ask others for prayers? Saint Paul (yes, Saint) says in that passage you mention that Jesus is true God and true Man. Christ is our “one mediator”, the God-man, who was pierced for our transgressions. But here you make Paul a fool for contradicting himself.

You are agenda posting, not to mention acting fallaciously. Read the forum rules.

 

[phil19034]

However, I think many bishops are shamefully treating physical lives as more important than spiritual lives over a possible threat from a virus we as yet know little about, and it is very right and natural for you to feel distressed by this. It’s especially shameful when they’re going above and beyond a secular allowance for worship with social distancing measures in place! A far better response is that of bishops in Poland who granted dispensation to the elderly and anyone who fears contracting the virus, but called for more Masses so people can go to Mass and keep distance according to secular guidelines.

We can’t really compare ourselves to Poland. My educated GUESS is that in the United States the following happened:

1. First and foremost, the entire USCCB most likely spoke with one another, perhaps even on a conference call, and surely each of the smaller state conference of bishops each spoke to one another too.
2. I’m sure that SOME bishops feared what would happen to the Church in America if a large number of older priests came down with the virus.
3. During the Spanish Flu in the United States (esp in the Archdiocese of Philadelphia), mass was canceled for approx 1 month. So it’s not unheard of.
4. Finally, you can’t really compare the United States to Poland.

• 1st, Poland is a Catholic nation ~87% Catholic
• Several of their conservative political parties are dedicated to preserving the Catholic faith.
• 2nd, if you look at the Catholics per Priest number in Poland (2nd link below), you will see the most (if not all) of the Dioceses have a very healthy & improving number of priests per Catholic in Poland.
  ---- the Archdiocese of Przemyśl, for example (as of 2016), is 93.7 % Catholic & has 1049 priests for a ratio of 710 Catholics per Priest
  ---- there is not a single diocese in Poland (as of 2016) with 2000 or more Catholics per Priest and only 5 dioceses have a Catholics per Priest ratio larger than 1500:1
  ---- and many dioceses in Poland have a Catholics per Priest ratio well under 1000
• While the US on of the largest nations in regards to number of Catholics, Catholics in the US only make 20.8% of the population.
  ---- The Archdiocese of Atlanta alone has a Catholics per Priest ratio of 4166:1 as of 2018
  ---- The Diocese of Dallas alone has a Catholics per Priest ratio of 6229:1 as of 2016
  ---- The Diocese of Phoenix alone has 4117 Catholics per Priest as of 2016
• Finally, America has a pretty anti-Catholic history. And while many think things are better now, the anti-Catholic sentiment in the US is still very much alive, esp when it comes to orthodox Catholicism. America is OK with Cafeteria Catholics, but America still has issues with devout Catholic views.

http://www.gcatholic.org/dioceses/country/PL.htm
http://www.catholic-hierarchy.org/country/dpl2.html
http://www.catholic-hierarchy.org/diocese/qview1.html#us

For better or worse, the US bishops don’t want to voluntarily go back to the time when every day Catholics were being persecuted.

FINALLY- I REALLY RECOMMEND EVERYONE LISTEN TO THE HOMILY I PROVED ABOVE, IN POST 6

God Bless