This is terrifying - Could this be the end of the Church in America?

[mangy_dog]

View the story here

I don’t think taking this lightly is a good idea. What is the Church going to do about this? What are WE going to do about this?

I think this is terrifying - think of the timing of this event. Right before a major election season when every liberal politician in the country is going to be loving this up and jumping on the band wagon. We already know what that sort of response did to the presidential election. Make no mistake, if the liberal media and politicians get behind this event and this organization, they could be unstoppable.

americancatholiccouncil.org/

This looks very much to me like a call for schism in the Church.

~Liza

This is terrifying but,

The gates of hell will not prevail against the One, True, Catholic and Apostolic church.

I read thru their site and I didn’t see the Crucifix, the Rosary, the Sacraments. Not one Saint or Angel in the building of this “strange church”.

There was nothing holy about it…on the contrary, there was something boastful about and defiant in it.

 

[lizaanne]

This is terrifying but,

The gates of hell will not prevail against the One, True, Catholic and Apostolic church.

I totally agree - and I have full faith that the gates of hell will NOT prevail against the Church. HOWEVER - my original intent, and the title of this thread is “Could this be the end of the Church in America?” I could see groups like this causing a schism in the Church in this country. Sure, Holy Mother Church will survive, but if we have a massive break over these issues here in the States, what does that mean for Faithful Catholic Americans?

~Liza

 

[Jerry_Parker]

Liza,

**You wrote: ** I totally agree - and I have full faith that the gates of hell will NOT prevail against the Church. HOWEVER - my original intent, and the title of this thread is “Could this be the end of the Church in America?” I could see groups like this causing a schism in the Church in this country. Sure, Holy Mother Church will survive, but if we have a massive break over these issues here in the States, what does that mean for Faithful Catholic Americans?​

Good and important distinction to make, Liza! In addition to all the attacks by liberals and radicals within the Catholic Church, there are other insidious movements, such as that of capitulation to “civic religion” by Catholics, especially those who fall for Neo-Con political American Catholicism (e.g. that of recently deceased Richard Neuhaus). This kind of thing, making the Catholic faith to be rolled up in the American flag (or, here, north of your border, rolled up in Canadian gentility) so idolatrously, is as grave a danger as any!

Jerry Parker

 

[PadraigPearce]

Liza,

**You wrote: ** I totally agree - and I have full faith that the gates of hell will NOT prevail against the Church. HOWEVER - my original intent, and the title of this thread is “Could this be the end of the Church in America?” I could see groups like this causing a schism in the Church in this country. Sure, Holy Mother Church will survive, but if we have a massive break over these issues here in the States, what does that mean for Faithful Catholic Americans?​

Good and important distinction to make, Liza! In addition to all the attacks by liberals and radicals within the Catholic Church, there are other insidious movements, such as that of capitulation to “civic religion” by Catholics, especially those who fall for Neo-Con political American Catholicism (e.g. that of recently deceased Richard Neuhaus). This kind of thing, making the Catholic faith to be rolled up in the American flag (or, here, north of your border, rolled up in Canadian gentility) so idolatrously, is as grave a danger as any!

Jerry Parker

That’s an interesting point. I think the Church is sufficiently universal in scope that she would survive any attempt at nationalization. Lot’s of people have tried that in the past, when the popes were basically in the pockets of emperors. Look at all those Borgias who bought the papacy back in the 1500’s. Those were situations when the universal Church was threatened, not just the Church in one nation. That said, I can see any attempt to form an “American Catholic Church” doomed to suffer the same fate as the evangelical “religious right” in the United States, which tried to wrap their movement in the flag, or in the Republican party. In the case of the group that’s currently pushing for schism, they might be the left wing version of that. They marry the spirit of the age, and end up as widowers, to quote someone much better than I.

 

[Jerry_Parker]

Padraig,

**You wrote: ** *I can see any attempt to form an “American Catholic Church” doomed to suffer the same fate as the evangelical “religious right” in the United States, which tried to wrap their movement in the flag, or in the Republican party. In the case of the group that’s currently pushing for schism, they might be the left wing version of that. They marry the spirit of the age, and end up as widowers, to quote someone much better than I. *​

Yes, you seize a lot of what I meant. What seems to some Catholics or any other Christians as a secular ideal at a moment may have its “clay feet” exposed at another, as is the case with the exposed, discredited, and corrupt Neo-Con movement and its leaders, former Pres. Dubya Bush not excepted soever! Richard Neuhaus and Catholics of like mind, who alligned themselves with those corrupt and war-crazed folks, even in the face of the Pope’s warning about what constitutes “just war” theory and how American zealots were breaching it, and who set themselves against Catholic social teaching, too, now appear to have had their entire programme reavealed as deplorably tawdry.

One of the worst results of the Dubya Bush years, however explicitly unintended, was the near destruction of the Catholic, Orthodox, and Oriental Churches in Iraq, a disaster which many, the Pope included, foresaw when American Crypto-Zionists sullied the reputation of Christianity and the Church with their crusader-like pretensions. Richard Neuhaus died too soon to suffer the humiliation of having his compromise of faith and politics revealed as the sort of baggage that neo-con, pro-zionist “Evangelicals” accepted so readily and who despised and/or ignored the indigenous Christians of the Middle East and who continue to do so.

This is not to say that Catholics can give an uncritical endorsement of Obama or of any politician or party. All political parties have their failings and blindness. However, a Catholic should try to live his life and to train his mind to be in accord with Christian principles, real ones like those of Catholic teaching. Let’s not let another debacle like that of Neuhausian, Bucklyite delusion arrise again and flourish among Catholics. (I would note that at least William Buckley, the illustrious Catholic thinker and activist whom I mentioned, eventually had the integrity to express publicly his regret at having been so grievously mistaken.) Let such foolishness be that of the Evangelicals, Pentecostalists, and all of their silly and faddish ilk, who fall into one error and delusion after another as the centuries take the toll of their folly!

Jerry Parker

 

[Layman]

There will always be attempts to co-opt our religion to political ends. They will fail 1) Given that our religion is directed towards saving souls for Heaven, not worldly ends and 2) Given Who is ultimately in charge of it.

The dogs bark, the caravan moves on.

 

[wisdomseeker]

Padraig,

**You wrote: ** *I can see any attempt to form an “American Catholic Church” doomed to suffer the same fate as the evangelical “religious right” in the United States, which tried to wrap their movement in the flag, or in the Republican party. In the case of the group that’s currently pushing for schism, they might be the left wing version of that. They marry the spirit of the age, and end up as widowers, to quote someone much better than I. *​

Yes, you seize a lot of what I meant. What seems to some Catholics or any other Christians as a secular ideal at a moment may have its “clay feet” exposed at another, as is the case with the exposed, discredited, and corrupt Neo-Con movement and its leaders, former Pres. Dubya Bush not excepted soever! Richard Neuhaus and Catholics of like mind, who alligned themselves with those corrupt and war-crazed folks, even in the face of the Pope’s warning about what constitutes “just war” theory and how American zealots were breaching it, and who set themselves against Catholic social teaching, too, now appear to have had their entire programme reavealed as deplorably tawdry.

One of the worst results of the Dubya Bush years, however explicitly unintended, was the near destruction of the Catholic, Orthodox, and Oriental Churches in Iraq, a disaster which many, the Pope included, foresaw when American Crypto-Zionists sullied the reputation of Christianity and the Church with their crusader-like pretensions. Richard Neuhaus died too soon to suffer the humiliation of having his compromise of faith and politics revealed as the sort of baggage that neo-con, pro-zionist “Evangelicals” accepted so readily and who despised and/or ignored the indigenous Christians of the Middle East and who continue to do so.

This is not to say that Catholics can give an uncritical endorsement of Obama or of any politician or party. All political parties have their failings and blindness. However, a Catholic should try to live his life and to train his mind to be in accord with Christian principles, real ones like those of Catholic teaching. Let’s not let another debacle like that of Neuhausian, Bucklyite delusion arrise again and flourish among Catholics. (I would note that at least William Buckley, the illustrious Catholic thinker and activist whom I mentioned, eventually had the integrity to express publicly his regret at having been so grievously mistaken.) Let such foolishness be that of the Evangelicals, Pentecostalists, and all of their silly and faddish ilk, who fall into one error and delusion after another as the centuries take the toll of their folly!

Jerry Parker

well said.

 

[John_Grudzien]

For those asking what we can do:
First and foremost: watch and pray
Second, make sure your bishop (particularly those in Detroit or the home diocese of any of these organizations) is aware that this is happening.

As this event approaches encourage your bishop to make a statement on it.

Now you know what mindset I’ve been up against here in the archdiocese of Detroit(it’s got to re-earn its capital A). Please pray for all of us Traditional Catholics, as well as any others who can still be saved here!
I’ve been waiting to see what our new Archbishop Vigneron will do to correct the current scene, but since he is a native of the area and went through the liberal-run seminary here, I’m not expecting much.
This poor town and region has been so devastated by liberal politicians, unionists, and modernists in our Church and now to be at the epicenter of a damnable scismatic scheme like this. It is so darn discouraging, but since discouragement and despair are but two of the Evil One’s major weapons against us, I WILL NOT SUCCUMB!!!

 

[CradleCath]

whatever happened to excommunication action?

these groups are bringing confusion into the Church and are allowed to still be in the Church? they are just deceiving and misleading many good Catholics who dont know what to believe. where are the shepards, the protector of the people of God? i just wonder what are they doing about this.

Actually, many of the members of our hierarchy are also deceiving & misleading many good Catholics. About 10 years ago, Bishop Bruskewitz in Ne. excommunicated a similar group who call themselves Call To Action. Not ONE other Catholic Bishop has followed suit & the Vatican has continually backed him up on it. When CAT. appealed to Rome re Bishop Bruskewitz’s actions, they were told:

Vatican affirms excommunication of Call to Action members in Lincoln.
"The Vatican’s highest court said it has no jurisdiction over a** decision by Bishop Fabian W. Bruskewitz of Lincoln that Catholics in his diocese who are members of a dozen organizations were automatically excommunicated.**

The movement toward liberal modernism, which I call “Secret Schism” started, at least, 40 years ago…during & immediately after Vatican II… & it started at the top with our USCCB officials of that time. As the number of “gay” priests grew (homosexuals make up 3% of our general population & 30% of our priesthood), so did the homosexual numbers in our episcopacy. As a result, the USCCB became more & more liberal, not only concerning gay “rights”, but their views concerning the indissolubility of Catholic marriage, abortion, artificial contraception, the Sacrament of Confession, etc., etc.

I do believe that the worst in over. When the sexual abuse of young boys became known to all, I believe that several of our Bishops, who had tried to stay neutral…walking a tenuous line between the Vatican & the USCCB… said to themselves “Enough is enough”.

My conclusion:
If our California hierarchy couldn’t throw us into Schism, I don’t think that VOTF has a chance.

An old article about VOTF:
archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/8/11/172152.shtml

What Is VOTF’s Real Agenda?
Fred Martinez

Monday, Aug. 12,** 2002 **Recently, Voice of the Faithful (VOTF) became the news media’s favorite “Catholic” lay organization to cure the Catholic Church of its sex-abuse scandal.
The New York Times and Boston Globe wrote glowing articles about this new “mainstream” Catholic organization. Even in Ireland and on the European landmass, newspapers were covering this “grassroots” group that started from a humble church basement…
Voice of the Faithful and Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against DefamatioN
"The only information I had about this group was that a member of VOTF’s steering committee was working closely with the homosexual spin group Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD). I, too, am against defamation of ANY group, including Gays & Lesbians. However, I am also against pederasty & I have never known a gay priest that was able to relate really well to my husband & 3 sons. I know that homosexuals have a place in our Church, but it’s not in the priesthood. There are many other ways to serve.

Catholic leaders have consistently taught that homosexual men should not be ordained to the priesthood. Pope John XXIII approved a formal policy to that effect, which still remains in effect. However, during the 1970s and 1980s, that policy was widely ignored, particularly in North America.
freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1487583/posts

 

[wisdomseeker]

Actually, many of the members of our hierarchy are also deceiving & misleading many good Catholics. About 10 years ago, Bishop Bruskewitz in Ne. excommunicated a similar group who call themselves Call To Action. Not ONE other Catholic Bishop has followed suit & the Vatican has continually backed him up on it. When CAT. appealed to Rome re Bishop Bruskewitz’s actions, they were told:

The movement toward liberal modernism, which I call “Secret Schism” started, at least, 40 years ago…during & immediately after Vatican II… & it started at the top with our USCCB officials of that time. As the number of “gay” priests grew (homosexuals make up 3% of our general population & 30% of our priesthood), so did the homosexual numbers in our episcopacy. As a result, the USCCB became more & more liberal, not only concerning gay “rights”, but their views concerning the indissolubility of Catholic marriage, abortion, artificial contraception, the Sacrament of Confession, etc., etc.

I do believe that the worst in over. When the sexual abuse of young boys became known to all, I believe that several of our Bishops, who had tried to stay neutral…walking a tenuous line between the Vatican & the USCCB… said to themselves “Enough is enough”.

My conclusion:
If our California hierarchy couldn’t throw us into Schism, I don’t think that VOTF has a chance.

An old article about VOTF:
archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/8/11/172152.shtml

What Is VOTF’s Real Agenda?
Fred Martinez

Monday, Aug. 12,** 2002 **Recently, Voice of the Faithful (VOTF) became the news media’s favorite “Catholic” lay organization to cure the Catholic Church of its sex-abuse scandal.
The New York Times and Boston Globe wrote glowing articles about this new “mainstream” Catholic organization. Even in Ireland and on the European landmass, newspapers were covering this “grassroots” group that started from a humble church basement…
Voice of the Faithful and Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against DefamatioN
"The only information I had about this group was that a member of VOTF’s steering committee was working closely with the homosexual spin group Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD). I, too, am against defamation of ANY group, including Gays & Lesbians. However, I am also against pederasty & I have never known a gay priest that was able to relate really well to my husband & 3 sons. I know that homosexuals have a place in our Church, but it’s not in the priesthood. There are many other ways to serve.

Catholic leaders have consistently taught that homosexual men should not be ordained to the priesthood. Pope John XXIII approved a formal policy to that effect, which still remains in effect. However, during the 1970s and 1980s, that policy was widely ignored, particularly in North America.
freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1487583/posts

thank you for the info. i didnt know all that.

 

[ljubim]

This is actually good in a way… Catholics who aren’t REAL Catholics (such as ones who support abortion, gay marriage, etc) will leave the Church and all remaining will be truly devout Catholics, so then the Church might stop putting up with so-called Catholics who don’t believe anything the Church teaches!

 

[human_being]

I’m sorry. Maybe I have a bit of an attitude lately. But,what I see is not a group who is any threat to the Church. If they would even become some group of priests that joined it. If it was wrong they wouldn’t be allowed to participate. They wouldn’t be allowed to preach against Church teachings. I’m sorry. I think the Church is much stronger than worryinbg about this.

But what did bother me about this thread was that it seems like the same type of stuff that goes on in protestant churches. I’m not talking about the group that the guy on the link is talking about. I’m talking about the link,itself. It’s like money making at God’s at the church’s expense. It’s like tacky protestant preachers spreading fear of hellfire and damnation. And that stuff bugs me about protestantism. It’s like Catholicism is in the market. Like maybe the idea that " there’s a market for catholicism" Let’s see what we can sell to them. And I’m sorry if I offend the threadstarter but it is also in large advertising stuff under the person’s posts. I really dislike the idea of trying to sell hyped up catholicism. It’s like who’s gonna be the next catholic superpreacher or newsstation which is not the church but hype and a moneymaking machine. I almost even get that feal from this CA stuff… I don’t know,but it’s bugging me. I listened to a protestant radio show on my way home from work yesterday and one of the things that really bugs me about their type of station is that everything leads to selling a book or donating so you get this “great preachers book about his opinion of biblical references on everything under the sun.” Everything leads to the exchange of money,and it bothers me…And I get the same feeling from the link:“Catholicism for sale here!”…The Church doesn’t need to be sold.

 

[Jerry_Parker]

ljubim,

**You wrote: ** *Catholics who aren’t REAL Catholics (such as ones who support abortion, gay marriage, etc) will leave the Church and all remaining will be truly devout Catholics, so then the Church might stop putting up with so-called Catholics who don’t believe anything the Church teaches! *​

Well, this could come about, through attrition, as you say. I think that if bishops neglect the powers of discipline, including excomunication, that are theirs, these will atrophy until they cannot exercise them anymore. Let’s hope that the Church wakes up to such a danger of what is anything but “benign neglect”!

Jerry Parker

 

[human_being]

I’m sorry. Maybe I have a bit of an attitude lately. But,what I see is not a group who is any threat to the Church. If they would even become some group of priests that joined it. If it was wrong they wouldn’t be allowed to participate. They wouldn’t be allowed to preach against Church teachings. I’m sorry. I think the Church is much stronger than worryinbg about this.

But what did bother me about this thread was that it seems like the same type of stuff that goes on in protestant churches. I’m not talking about the group that the guy on the link is talking about. I’m talking about the link,itself. It’s like money making at God’s at the church’s expense. It’s like tacky protestant preachers spreading fear of hellfire and damnation. And that stuff bugs me about protestantism. It’s like Catholicism is in the market. Like maybe the idea that " there’s a market for catholicism" Let’s see what we can sell to them. And I’m sorry if I offend the threadstarter but it is also in large advertising stuff under the person’s posts. I really dislike the idea of trying to sell hyped up catholicism. It’s like who’s gonna be the next catholic superpreacher or newsstation which is not the church but hype and a moneymaking machine. I almost even get that feal from this CA stuff… I don’t know,but it’s bugging me. I listened to a protestant radio show on my way home from work yesterday and one of the things that really bugs me about their type of station is that everything leads to selling a book or donating so you get this “great preachers book about his opinion of biblical references on everything under the sun.” Everything leads to the exchange of money,and it bothers me…And I get the same feeling from the link:“Catholicism for sale here!”…The Church doesn’t need to be sold.

I might add that I do not support abortion. Nor do I support homosexual marriage.
I like EWTN,but I believe that Mother Angelica is an authority there. And being a nun she is subject to discipline through the bishops if her programing becomes too far off base. Is the type of programing on the REal Catholic channel or webpage subject to the same type of discipline? Or are they allowed to continue to operate picking and choosing what political agenda they want even though it may or may not be wholeheartedly supported by the church. It almost seems as if a marketplace with the same kind of money changers working at the same kind of tables that Jesus overturned, to me.
IMO,if the people really want to put there whole life into “selling the Church” maybe they should join a third order or something instead of making it a business for profit. It is distasteful to me. In a third order they would be under the church’s authority more and I’d trust that their opinions aren’t just for politics or money making. They’d be doing what their doing for charity and love of church,not for profit.

 

[Jason_1977]

I’m sorry. Maybe I have a bit of an attitude lately. But,what I see is not a group who is any threat to the Church. If they would even become some group of priests that joined it. If it was wrong they wouldn’t be allowed to participate. They wouldn’t be allowed to preach against Church teachings. I’m sorry. I think the Church is much stronger than worryinbg about this.

But what did bother me about this thread was that it seems like the same type of stuff that goes on in protestant churches. I’m not talking about the group that the guy on the link is talking about. I’m talking about the link,itself. It’s like money making at God’s at the church’s expense. It’s like tacky protestant preachers spreading fear of hellfire and damnation. And that stuff bugs me about protestantism. It’s like Catholicism is in the market. Like maybe the idea that " there’s a market for catholicism" Let’s see what we can sell to them. And I’m sorry if I offend the threadstarter but it is also in large advertising stuff under the person’s posts. I really dislike the idea of trying to sell hyped up catholicism. It’s like who’s gonna be the next catholic superpreacher or newsstation which is not the church but hype and a moneymaking machine. I almost even get that feal from this CA stuff… I don’t know,but it’s bugging me. I listened to a protestant radio show on my way home from work yesterday and one of the things that really bugs me about their type of station is that everything leads to selling a book or donating so you get this “great preachers book about his opinion of biblical references on everything under the sun.” Everything leads to the exchange of money,and it bothers me…And I get the same feeling from the link:“Catholicism for sale here!”…The Church doesn’t need to be sold.

I don’t see that happening anytime soon. If it does, it wont be recognized, let alone sanctioned by Rome. If they do begin doing those things that the video discussed, they cease to be catholic. That is the beauty in our faith. That which ceases to be catholic, is no longer catholic. period. I’m not worried about it. There are liberals in the church, one pet peeve of mine is watching some priests & monks DIPPING their host into the wine during communion. That drives me INSANE!!! The Body is pure. The Blood is pure. If you MIX one with the other, they are no longer pure, & they are no longer the body & blood. THIS I saw at Mepkin Abbey during my retreat this week. A few monks & a few priests DIPPED their bread into the wine!!! I almost went BONKERS!!! It put a kink in my retreat, but I didnt let it bother me.

 

[CDNowak]

…one pet peeve of mine is watching some priests & monks DIPPING their host into the wine during communion. That drives me INSANE!!! The Body is pure. The Blood is pure. If you MIX one with the other, they are no longer pure, & they are no longer the body & blood. THIS I saw at Mepkin Abbey during my retreat this week. A few monks & a few priests DIPPED their bread into the wine!!! I almost went BONKERS!!! It put a kink in my retreat, but I didnt let it bother me.

Where to begin?

Either Species contains the whole of Christ, apart or together. Intinction is the standard mode of communion in the Eastern Rites, and an accepted form in the Latin Rite.

Yes the monks (and non-concelebrating priests) should not self-intinct, but if it drives you insane then you need to actually learn what is the accepted discipline.

 

[Hesychios]

I think the Church is sufficiently universal in scope that she would survive any attempt at nationalization. Lot’s of people have tried that in the past, when the popes were basically in the pockets of emperors.

Look at all those Borgias who bought the papacy back in the 1500’s. Those were situations when the universal Church was threatened, not just the Church in one nation.

These are good points.

The church will always survive. Even when it’s institutions are compromised (and it has happened many times before) the church survives. If necessary (and when possible), it gives rise to new institutions. There are many examples of this.

Oftentimes the church has shed it’s skin ‘like a snake’ and emerged stronger and healthier than before.

It doesn’t last… there are always new crises… but the church lives on and saves souls.

 

[John92]

Liberal Catholics are scary and the hierarchy should do more about them but remember . . . these people’s consciences ALWAYS “inform” them that the Church is wrong on birth-control (funny how that works).

We will outbreed them.

 

[Jerry_Parker]

Hesychios,

**You wrote: ** *The Church always will survive. Even when it’s institutions are compromised (and it has happened many times before) the Church survives. If necessary (and when possible), it gives rise to new institutions. There are many examples of this. Oftentimes the Church has shed it’s skin ‘like a snake’ and emerged stronger and healthier than before. It doesn’t last… there are always new crises… but the Church lives on and saves souls. *​

You are partly right, partly wrong. Indeed, the Church will survive, despite persecutions from without and dissension and apostasy from within. Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself assured us of that, i.e. that not even the very Gates of Hell can annihilate His Church. However, the same Lord who gave that assurance ("… the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it" – St. Matt. 16:18-b, Douay-Rheims-Challoner Version) posed also the question “But yet the Son of Man, when He cometh, shall He find, think you, faith on earth?” (St. Luke 18:8, Douay-Rheims-Challoner Version). Both of these statements are true, but how do they work themselves ou in history?

I recently finished reading a very interesting historical study of global Christianity, especially Christianity in antiquity and in “mediaeval” times (as they are called in the West) on up to the present in Northern Africa, the Middle East, Central Asia, and the Far East, which addresses this very issue. I refer to Philip Jenkins’ The Lost History of Christianity: the Thousand-Year Golden Age of the Church in the Middle East, Africa, and Asia, and How It Died (San Francisco, Calif.: Harper-Collins, 2008, in the series, “Harper-One”). Jenkins ackowledges the truth of what Jesus prophesied in both of those Bible passages that I cite. He shows how the Churches of Antiquity in entire regions of the world have flourished and spread to amazing geographical and demographic extent, yet then entirely disappeared in some of those areas (e.g., in Northern Africa and also in China before the 19th Century) or have been reduced to piteous levels in other regions. He also analyses why this has happened. He also takes some time and space to apply his reflections to our own current situation.

The proper question does not concern whether or not the Church will disappear, but whether it will continue to flourish, or even to continue to exist, in some areas where it has been strong until recent decades. Will the Church survive in the U. S. of A. and in the Dominion of Canada? Or will the Church flourish and expand elsewhere, e.g. continental Europe, while it atrophies or it is forcibly extinguished in English- and French-speaking North America? There are no grounds for apathy! It is not only persecution and inner dissension and rank heresy that can destroy the North American Anglophone and Francophone Church, but also a tendency in that Church to sacrifice the interests of Christian and Catholic truth to other agendas. This applies even (indeed, especially!) to the easy “civil religion” that so thoughtlessly plagues American Christianity and saps it of its strength and genuine witness and which can reduce the Church, especially when the onslaught on the Church is a combination of both of these factors (persecution and inner decline) as they ccur. So many young folk turn from the Church, recognising how toothless it has become, how irrelevant it is in dealing with current realities from a standpoint that takes what the Church and its Holy Scriptures truly say into account. Yes, the Church will survive the Gates of Hell – but will it do so only or mostly in what are “missionary areas” today, like Africa and the Far East? Will Our Lord find faith in the U. S. of A. and in the Dominion of Canada when, at last, He returns in glory?

Read Jenkins’ book and think about what he writes in it. Read the Holy Scriptures in the light of Faith, not with the blinders on of American complacency. Think, ponder, and pray about the consequences of creeping religious decline where Christianity and Catholicism itself are losing ground and relevancy. Do you want the Catholic Church to survive in your own nation and culture? The statistical indicators (those honestly calculated) are slipping. How far will they plunge? (I know that statistics are not “the whole story”, but over a long term they do tend to tell the tale.) Let’s attempt to turn things around, in our own lives and minds as well as in the Church itself in our North American nations.

Jerry Parker

 

[Gregory_I]

“I hear there are schisms among you, and yet, this doesn’t surprise me; for there must always be schisms that the truth may be made manifest.”

-St. Paul.-

Look on the Bright Side: THe Roman Catholic Church will be rid of those corrupting influences known as heretics and schismatics: If they draw a hard line, they will only clarify the truth. Our church may shrink in America, but it will be a more faithful Church, and right now, I can live with that.

…Besides, the only way I see myself being canonized is through Martyrdom, So…

BRING IT!!!

Jesus Christ is the Same yesterday today and Forever, and NO heretical, Neo-Masonic, protestant, false Charity “Christian” will ever change that.

There are tight small communities of those dedicated to maintaining the church’s tradition, I know, I am a part of one. We will endure, because we adhere to the Pillar, the Rock, the Bulwark, We have the ark. SO what if it’s raining out??? We were expecting this, THAT IS WHY WE ARE HERE! To save our souls!

DOn’t let your hearts be troubled by these shallow and pedantic fools. If they ruin your peace, Satan is winning against you.

The Truth is eternal: The Eternal Word incarnate. We are not called to success in our lives, but to faithfulness as Mother Theresa would say…

Let my life be a “failure” and end in burning out for the ROman Catholic Church.

IS there a better way to die?

Come Nero, Come Beast, Come Antichrist, The more you mow us down, the more we populate!!!

I do not fear to be a candle to light the colliseum!!!

Christ is Risen!