This verse disproves purgatory

  • Thread starter Thread starter Link0126
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
L

Link0126

Guest
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
 
No, the verse speaks of our mortal bodies being raised incorruptible in an instant. Our souls will still need to go through purgation.
 
Link0126 said:
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
Click to expand...
Time as we know it doesn’t exist in the afterlife.

Given that then, at one moment we are corrupted sinners, the next, perfect saints. Even Between these two events, a change had to take place. This can be accurately called Purgatory. Time, in the, um, temporal sense of the world, is no factor here; the perceived duration is up to God.
 
It speaks about the end times. Not all will sleep means that some will still be living when this occurs, but others will have died. Then at the last moment, the end times, the bodies of the dead will rise to join the living, and the bodies of both the living and the dead will be transformed into our heavenly bodies.

One wonders, however, what the souls of those who already died are doing in the mean time. This verse actually points precisely to the Catholic view of judgement and the life to come.

This is also why reading little snippets of the Bible on your own to confirm preheld notions, without the interpretation of the Church which actually compiled the Bible, leads to no good.
 
This never speaks about the cleansing of souls in Purgatory as this states first that our bodies will be second, and that this will happen to all. But only few will find the narrow path and enter into Heaven as Christ told us showing this is nothing to do with purging the soul.
 
Link0126 said:
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
Click to expand...
Dear Link0:
That’s how we used to do things as individual interpreters. We would come across 1 verse, and build a theology around it. Salvation is MUCH deeper than 1 verse theology. You have to look at that verse and every other verse in the old testament and the new testament to come up with an adequate soteriology. Yes, for some, Jesus’ second coming will be in their lifetime, and the last trumpet will sound. We believe in the resurrection of the body and life everlasting. SOme will be raised to everlasting life. Those who died with sin on their souls will be purged. See all Revelation scriptures on purgatory.

www.scripturecatholic.com
 
I completely believe in purgatory b/c the Church teaches it. Just wondering what a response to this passage might be.
 
kmuestwin said:
I don’t understand why people are afraid of purgatory.
Click to expand...
I don’t think it’s Purgatory per se, but having been vehemently anti-catholic for a number of years, I’d say the fear is more like this: “Only Catholics believe in Purgatory, so if it’s real; they’re right.”
One major chasm between Catholicism and Protestantism is the composition of the canon. If Catholics are right, it shows protestants are wrong. In my arrogance I was blind

the edit Conversely, if Catholics are wrong it makes Protestants right. That’s the arrogance I fell to for years. .
 
Link0126 said:
I completely believe in purgatory b/c the Church teaches it. Just wondering what a response to this passage might be.
Click to expand...
Did you read the posts above yours? The passage has nothing at all to do with purgatory, and certainly doesn’t disprove it.
 
Layman_F said:
I don’t think it’s Purgatory per se, but having been vehemently anti-catholic for a number of years, I’d say the fear is more like this: “Only Catholics believe in Purgatory, so if it’s real; they’re right.”
One major chasm between Catholicism and Protestantism is the composition of the canon. If Catholics are right, it shows protestants are wrong. In my arrogance I was blind

the edit Conversely, if Catholics are wrong it makes Protestants right. That’s the arrogance I fell to for years. .
Click to expand...
😃 Right on!

At the end of the fourth century, the Catholic Church selected 27 of her own writings, canonized them, and named them the New Testament. At the same time, in the same Councils, she canonized the 46 writings of the Septuagint that she inherited from Jesus and the Apostles and named them the Old Testament. Her entire collection of sacred Scripture she named tá Biblia – the Bible – the Books.

The Jews (and therefore Jesus and the Apostles) believed in purification of the soul after death (see 2 Maccabees 12:38-45, missing from Protestant Bibles). Consequently, this was a belief of the early Church (as can be seen in 1 Corinthians 3:12-45). The Catholic Church eventually named this process “purgatory,” from the Latin purgare, to purify, to cleanse. Orthodox Jews still retain this ancient belief and pray the kaddish for their beloved dead for eleven months after their passing.

The Catholic Church is not based on the New Testment; rather, the NT is based on the living, dynamic, teaching Church who wrote it.

Jim Dandy
Ex-Southern Baptist, ex-agnostic, ex-atheist, ecstatic to be Catholic!
 
Link0126 said:
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
Click to expand...
You are mistaken…or whoever told you that is. It refers to the final resurrection of the dead and our bodies being changed.

That verse applies in the same context as John 6:55 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day.

You might take some time to carefully read the following article from my blog, called Biblical and Jewish Traditional Beliefs About Purgatory
 
The people alive when Christ returns could indeed undergo purgatory if they needed it in the time period of the twinkling of an eye–it would seem to us as only a second on Earth–to them as they are being change it might FEEL like a long time or a medium time or no time at all–we simply don’t know what purgatory time and purging feels like in this world.
 
Link0126 said:
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
Click to expand...
when Jesus comes again there will be no Purgatory. At that time our bodies will be raised from the dead and be changed in a “twinkling of an eye.”

But, prior to the second coming we still need Purgatory. Purgatory is an act of mercy on God’s part. How could we go to a perfect being if we are stained with venial sin? We have to be cleaned up first.
 
Link0126 said:
I completely believe in purgatory b/c the Church teaches it. Just wondering what a response to this passage might be.
Click to expand...
Ask anyone who does not believe in purgatory to explain this passage.

If anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, or straw, the work of each will come to light, for the Day will disclose it. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire (itself) will test the quality of each one’s work. If the work stands that someone built upon the foundation, that person will receive a wage. But if someone’s work is burned up, that one will suffer loss; the person will be saved, but only as through fire. (1 Corinthians 3:12-15)

Where can one suffer loss and yet be saved? You don’t suffer loss in Heaven and you can’t be saved in Hell.

This passage is incomprehensible in a Heaven and Hell only theology.

-Tim-
 
TimothyH said:
Ask anyone who does not believe in purgatory to explain this passage.

If anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, or straw, the work of each will come to light, for the Day will disclose it. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire (itself) will test the quality of each one’s work. If the work stands that someone built upon the foundation, that person will receive a wage. But if someone’s work is burned up, that one will suffer loss; the person will be saved, but only as through fire. (1 Corinthians 3:12-15)

Where can one suffer loss and yet be saved? You don’t suffer loss in Heaven and you can’t be saved in Hell.

This passage is incomprehensible in a Heaven and Hell only theology.

-Tim-
Click to expand...
Yes, I have read some protestant commentaries on this verse back in the day. When I was into their faith alone theology. They are quite lacking, and they claim that this person will suffer loss IN heaven. Either that or they are so brief with the commentary that it isn’t helpful. They twist “any man’s work” to mean doctrine’s of faith, and sometimes claim this verse is only for preacher’s of the Gospel. I have heard that as well.
 
Link0126 said:
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
Click to expand...
I agree ! The term, ‘purgatory’ itself is never found in scripture, nor any reference is given in scripture. If you miss heaven, you won’t be going to purgatory or any other place, you will be going to hell !
 
The OP has a point, in that those who live until the end of this Earth will not go to purgatory. They either be ready for heaven, having very likely been purified by suffering in this life or go to hell. People who die before the end of time can and do still go to purgatory though.

Pax Christi
 
kmuestwin said:
I don’t understand why people are afraid of purgatory.
Click to expand...
I don’t either, it seems to me that the contrast between an ordinary human being and an Almighty & Holy God demands purgatory. How else could we ever stand in His Presence with joy & peace??:confused::confused:
 
Link0126 said:
1 Corinthians 15:51-52:

“Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”

In a moment we will change from corrupted sinners to perfect saints in heaven. No time for a stop in purgatory it seems…
Click to expand...
That quote talks about the last day and the resurrection of the body.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top