Thought process of non Christians who use the New Testament

[openmind77]

You did not choose to read obviously…so it will not become apparent as to what we are saying.

Regards Tony

It is quite apparently that when the Bahai talk about Bahaullah being Jesus, and the Father and born of the Holy Spirit, that they are just making things up. Please just stop saying these things, they just don’t make any sense.

Anyway, the Second Coming of Jesus is definitely not going to be with Jesus being in prison and executed like Bahaullah. Jesus will return ‘with power and glory’

 

[MartinJordan]

You did not choose to read obviously…so it will not become apparent as to what we are saying.

Regards Tony

Tony, when are you going to give your answer to my questions? Return courtesy please.

MJ

 

[TonyBS]

Jesus will return ‘with power and glory’

As he did the First time, a mission that lasted 3 years, Baha’u’llah mission lasted 40 years as per biblical prophesy.

God Bless always - Regards Tony

 

[MartinJordan]

As he did the First time, a mission that lasted 3 years, Baha’u’llah mission lasted 40 years as per biblical prophesy.

God Bless always - Regards Tony

Your green light is on. Tony please make an effort.

MJ

 

[openmind77]

As he did the First time, a mission that lasted 3 years, Baha’u’llah mission lasted 40 years as per biblical prophesy.

God Bless always - Regards Tony

What does the length of mission have to do with anything? Anyway, I am talking about the prophesy of the Second Coming, nothing to do with First time.

Matthew 24:30 says: “they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory”

What power is there in spending 40 years in jail and what great glory? Bahaullah just does not fit the prophesy.

Anyway, he still can’t be the Son (Jesus) as well as the Father!

 

[TonyBS]

What does the length of mission have to do with anything? Anyway, I am talking about the prophesy of the Second Coming, nothing to do with First time.

Matthew 24:30 says: “they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory”

What power is there in spending 40 years in jail and what great glory? Bahaullah just does not fit the prophesy.

Anyway, he still can’t be the Son (Jesus) as well as the Father!

What power was there in Dying on a Cross?

There is a lot in what is being said, but one must want to consider what is offered. I see no one wishing to actually look at what is being offered.

God doeth as He willeth contains the answer to all these many and varied questions. Sorry not much time at the moment, life is busy

Regards Tony

 

[openmind77]

What power was there in Dying on a Cross?
…
Regards Tony

Why do you keep comparing the First Coming of Jesus with the Second Coming? They are completely different stories.

The Second Coming is predicted to be “on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory” (not the First) and Bahaullah in no way fulfills this ‘power and glory’. He is not even close.

Anyway, nobody including Bahaullah can be both the Son (Jesus) and the Father - that is impossible - they are two separate persons.

 

[TonyBS]

Why do you keep comparing the First Coming of Jesus with the Second Coming? They are completely different stories.

The Second Coming is predicted to be “on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory” (not the First) and Bahaullah in no way fulfills this ‘power and glory’. He is not even close.

Anyway, nobody including Bahaullah can be both the Son (Jesus) and the Father - that is impossible - they are two separate persons.

Thus I leave you with you summary.

Regards Tony

 

[MartinJordan]

Thus I leave you with you summary.

Regards Tony

Thus ends my attempts to get a coutesy reply?

MJ

 

[Servant19]

So does that mean Islam is wrong when they expect the Mahdi and Jesus to Return separately as two different persons - first the Mahdi and then Jesus to follow (and both of them will be present on earth at the same time)?

In fact this Islamic prophesy does not seem to be fulfilled by Bab/Bahaullah, if you say Bahuallah was the Father.

Hi openmind,

Yes they are two Persons.

The Bab was the Mahdi ad Baha’u’llah was the Return of Jesus Christ in the glory of the Father.

The Allah of Islam is synonymous with the Father of Christianity and there are numerous Islamic Traditions that Allah will walk amongst us. There are similar Traditions in Judaism.

You can google “anthropomorphic Allah” or study a compilation of such Traditions on this Islamic website:
islam-watch.org/abulkasem/BismiAllah/1a.htm

Also if you look at Isaiah 9:6 “For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.”

Hope that helps

.

 

[Servant19]

Why do you keep comparing the First Coming of Jesus with the Second Coming? They are completely different stories.

The Second Coming is predicted to be “on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory” (not the First) and Bahaullah in no way fulfills this ‘power and glory’. He is not even close.

Anyway, nobody including Bahaullah can be both the Son (Jesus) and the Father - that is impossible - they are two separate persons.

Please read Isaiah 9:6 openmind, the Son is given and He will be known as “Everlasting Father”

.

 

[TonyBS]

Thus ends my attempts to get a coutesy reply?

MJ

MJ - These threads move quick, I am on a phone. I do not see all posts and do not always go back. At times two pages go by from log in to log in. Frustrating typing on a phone, most of the time auto spell and misplaced fingers just make it twice as long to post.

Thus sorry of we have missed a question or two.

In the Long run over the many threads Servant,.othenBaha’i and I have been involved in, all your questions have been answered.

In fact if the question was actually of interest, I know you would have researched it, you have been doing this for some time.

I am going to wind down a bit, as most of the conversation appears and seems to come from people not interested of how Christianity is perceived and why it is perceived that way by others.

Of course quite understandable

I will attempt to post only when it appears posted information needs clarification or correction.

See how I go!

Regards Tony

 

[openmind77]

Hi openmind,

Yes they are two Persons.

The Bab was the Mahdi ad Baha’u’llah was the Return of Jesus Christ in the glory of the Father.

The Allah of Islam is synonymous with the Father of Christianity and there are numerous Islamic Traditions that Allah will walk amongst us. There are similar Traditions in Judaism.

You can google “anthropomorphic Allah” or study a compilation of such Traditions on this Islamic website:
islam-watch.org/abulkasem/BismiAllah/1a.htm

Also if you look at Isaiah 9:6 “For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.”

Hope that helps

.

“anthropomorphic Allah” !!! I have never heard this expression before - this would be totally blasphemous to most Muslims. No wonder they are so angry with the Bahai.

But the explanation still does not work - how can Bahaullah be both Jesus(the Son) and the Father? - they are two separate persons and Bahaullah is one person. You Bahai really need to think this through.

As for Isaiah 9:6 - many religions talk of God as the Father, but they are not doing so in a Trinitarian sense, their Father (other than in Christianity) has no Son.

 

[Servant19]

“anthropomorphic Allah” !!! I have never heard this expression before - this would be totally blasphemous to most Muslims. No wonder they are so angry with the Bahai.

But the explanation still does not work - how can Bahaullah be both Jesus(the Son) and the Father? - they are two separate persons and Bahaullah is one person. You Bahai really need to think this through.

As for Isaiah 9:6 - many religions talk of God as the Father, but they are not doing so in a Trinitarian sense, their Father (other than in Christianity) has no Son.

Anthropormphic Allah is not a Baha’i phrase.

It is very well respected and believed in commonly among Shia Muslim circles

Also there is nothing for Baha’is to think through about the Father and the Son. It all relates to the station Baha’u’llah has within the Abrahamic religions and His commencing of a new religious cycle.

He has clarified the difference between the “essence of God” and the “attributes of God”
It is for those with a pure searching heart to do the necessary study

.

.

 

[MartinJordan]

MJ - These threads move quick, I am on a phone. I do not see all posts and do not always go back. At times two pages go by from log in to log in. Frustrating typing on a phone, most of the time auto spell and misplaced fingers just make it twice as long to post.

Thus sorry of we have missed a question or two.

In the Long run over the many threads Servant,.othenBaha’i and I have been involved in, all your questions have been answered.

In fact if the question was actually of interest, I know you would have researched it, you have been doing this for some time.

I am going to wind down a bit, as most of the conversation appears and seems to come from people not interested of how Christianity is perceived and why it is perceived that way by others.

Of course quite understandable

I will attempt to post only when it appears posted information needs clarification or correction.

See how I go!

Regards Tony

It’s very important to me as the OP to get it answered so I’ll ask again.

How many times did Jesus mention the New Testament? You answered 1 Corinthians but that not accurate enough.Are you able to figure out why it’s not accurate?

Second, which Bible do you use? The 66 book Bible, the 73 book Bible, 74 book Bible, the 81 book Bible. Which?

MJ

 

[TonyBS]

It’s very important to me as the OP to get it answered so I’ll ask again.

How many times did Jesus mention the New Testament? You answered 1 Corinthians but that not accurate enough.Are you able to figure out why it’s not accurate?

Second, which Bible do you use? The 66 book Bible, the 73 book Bible, 74 book Bible, the 81 book Bible. Which?

MJ

Hi Martin, again pressed for time, sorry busy life, thus short answers.

I answered the Bible question said NIV and King James, never looked how many books they had, still have not.

Also answer to original question will suffice. Yet, why is Jesus so important to them?

I can not believe in Baha’u’llah if I do not have the Love of Jesus. And vise versa I can not believe in Jesus if I do not have the Love of Baha’u’llah. To us, God is known through them.

Any more than is just debate on why that is so and we have found here that is unproductive.

It is the Love that matters. You Love God and Christ as do I. Now we do unto others as we would have then do unto us and Unity of Love will exist.

Regards Tony

 

[MartinJordan]

Hi Martin, again pressed for time, sorry busy life, thus short answers.

I answered the Bible question said NIV and King James, never looked how many books they had, still have not.

Also answer to original question will suffice. Yet, why is Jesus so important to them?

I can not believe in Baha’u’llah if I do not have the Love of Jesus. And vise versa I can not believe in Jesus if I do not have the Love of Baha’u’llah. To us, God is known through them.

Any more than is just debate on why that is so and we have found here that is unproductive.

It is the Love that matters. You Love God and Christ as do I. Now we do unto others as we would have then do unto us and Unity of Love will exist.

Regards Tony

I appreciate you now answered part of my question.

Now I recall you said you’ve read the Bible (back to front) so you would know how many books. So you haven’t?

So how many times did he mention the New Testament? And why?

If you loved Jesus then shouldn’t you have accepted his words that Sciripture spoke about him? That he’s the Messiah who takes away the Sins of the World? That he brought an end to death? You believe all this?

MJ

 

[Servant19]

I appreciate you now answered part of my question.

Now I recall you said you’ve read the Bible (back to front) so you would know how many books. So you haven’t?

So how many times did he mention the New Testament? And why?

If you loved Jesus then shouldn’t you have accepted his words that Sciripture spoke about him? That he’s the Messiah who takes away the Sins of the World? That he brought an end to death? You believe all this?

MJ

Come on Martin, be fair
How many times do you take note of how many chapters a book has when you read it.
I read my anatomy book at university at least 20 times, but I can’t tell you how many chapters it has…

Of course Tony believes in all the things Jesus brought to the world, except He brought an end to “spiritual” death not physical death .

.

 

[TonyBS]

Come on Martin, be fair
How many times do you take note of how many chapters a book has when you read it.
I read my anatomy book at university at least 20 times, but I can’t tell you how many chapters it has…

Of course Tony believes in all the things Jesus brought to the world, except He brought an end to “spiritual” death not physical death . .

3 Bibles behind me as I reply, funny still do not know and I am not even tempted to see how many books they do have. It was the NIV that I read,

One thing I have found if you want to think about adding or taking away from the Bible, is to how many pages are devoted to Interpreting or putting the passages in “CORRECT” context for you especially in the “Living Insights” Bible my Born Again mother gave me, Bless her Heart!

Sorry I got wore out with the rest

Regards Tony

 

[MartinJordan]

Come on Martin, be fair
How many times do you take note of how many chapters a book has when you read it.
I read my anatomy book at university at least 20 times, but I can’t tell you how many chapters it has…

.

Maybe there is a unusual amount of fear to answer this very basic, elementary question. This is quite odd to talk about an anatomy book which is not used for prayer purposes like the Bible.

Of course Tony believes in all the things Jesus brought to the world, except He brought an end to “spiritual” death not physical death .

Then he should be able to tell me how books the Bible has? After all it is a Holy Book.

MJ