Tired of debating? Let's agree on Jesus :)

[whatisthetruth]

Hi all,

I believe ii is human nature to want to debate, which is apparent aon all these threads, and to illustrate on who is right and who is wrong rather than agree and say, yeah I can see why you would believe that.

We can read the same verse from the same bible and we will get different meaning from that verse.

That said, I believe there is common ground that we Christians, whether we are Catholic, Baptist, Protestant, Methodist, etc., do believe and can agree on that I hope can be addressed in this thread.

Let me start out by saying that I believe that we can agree on the following about God and Jesus. Correct me if I am wrong…

There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

He lived a **sinless life and then when He was in His early 30’s the core of Christianity became horribly real,

continued…**

 

[whatisthetruth]

Matthew 26

64"Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”
65Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy.
66What do you think?”
"He is worthy of death," they answered.
67Then they spit in his face and struck him with their fists. Others slapped him
68and said, “Prophesy to us, Christ. Who hit you?”

and before Pontius Pilate when it came time to decide whether or not to punish Him or a criminal,

Matthew 27

11Meanwhile Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor asked him,
“Are you the king of the Jews?”
“Yes, it is as you say,” Jesus replied.
12When he was accused by the chief priests and the elders, he gave no answer. 13Then Pilate asked him,
“Don’t you hear the testimony they are bringing against you?” 14But Jesus made no reply,
17So when the crowd had gathered, Pilate asked them,
"Which one do you want me to release to you:

Barabbas,
or
Jesus who is called Christ?"

18For he knew it was out of envy that they had handed Jesus over to him.

“Barabbas,” they answered.

22"What shall I do, then, with Jesus who is called Christ?" Pilate asked. They all answered,

**“Crucify him!” **

23"Why? What crime has he committed?" asked Pilate.
But they shouted all the louder,

**“Crucify him!” **

24When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd.

The Soldiers Mock Jesus

28They stripped him and put a scarlet robe on him,
29and then twisted together a crown of thorns and set it on his head.
30They spit on him, and
took the staff and struck him on the head again and again. 31After they had mocked him, they took off the robe and put his own clothes on him.
Then they led him away to crucify him.

The crucifixion, being layed on a cross, by the way it amazes me Jesus is still alive at this point, and having three nails driven right through His flesh. one through each hand and one through both feet. I can not imagine the pain our saviour endured that day leading to His death.

I believe we can also agree in His dying breath, Jesus thought about each and every one of us (who had passed on prior too, existed at the time and for all generations to come) when He said,

Luke 23:34
Jesus said, “Father,** forgive them**, for they do not know what they are doing.”

I believe we all are in agreement so far with all the above, are we?

I hope we are all in agreement,

I challenge anyone to open their heart and feel the love and the passion as to why Jesus, as innocent as innocent can be, endured all that bloody torture, pain, suffering, and eventual death for.

From your heart, why did Jesus endure that pain and eventual death?

Now after answering that, without letting anything else get in the way of the love you are feeling right now from Jesus, answer this question,

I believe when Jesus in His last breaths He would take said “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” He was telling us the way to forgiveness is through Himself and through no one else especially when he said "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. John 14:6?

A prime example of Jesus directly forgiving sins is one of the thieves on the cross. two others are the paralzed man on the mat and the adultress woman.

I believe** we all can agree on ** that the way to forgiveness is on of the dividing lines between Catholics and other bible believing Christian religions.

I believe that God loves us so much that He sacrificed His son to endure all the above to illustrate how much he loved all of us.

I believe all God asks is to show our appreciation of Him for giving us a very valuable treasure, salvation through the blood of Jesus, and to show our love to him by honoring Him and living our lives in honor of the life Jesus lived.

When we get to :heaven: I do not believe we will see separate rooms, one for catholics, one for baptists, one for protestants, etc.

We will be all in massive number before the throne of God, worshipping and rejoicing…Alleluia

:extrahappy: :clapping: :grouphug: :bowdown:

God bless all of you,

 

[suupah]

Hi all,

I believe ii is human nature to want to debate, which is apparent aon all these threads, and to illustrate on who is right and who is wrong rather than agree and say, yeah I can see why you would believe that.

We can read the same verse from the same bible and we will get different meaning from that verse.

That said, I believe there is common ground that we Christians, whether we are Catholic, Baptist, Protestant, Methodist, etc., do believe and can agree on that I hope can be addressed in this thread.

Let me start out by saying that I believe that we can agree on the following about God and Jesus. Correct me if I am wrong…

There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

He lived a **sinless life and then when He was in His early 30’s the core of Christianity became horribly real,

continued…**

Lets not reinvent the wheel. here is what we can all agree on

The Apostles Creed

 

[mark_a]

Hi all,

I believe ii is human nature to want to debate, which is apparent aon all these threads, and to illustrate on who is right and who is wrong rather than agree and say, yeah I can see why you would believe that.

We can read the same verse from the same bible and we will get different meaning from that verse.

That said, I believe there is common ground that we Christians, whether we are Catholic, Baptist, Protestant, Methodist, etc., do believe and can agree on that I hope can be addressed in this thread.

Let me start out by saying that I believe that we can agree on the following about God and Jesus. Correct me if I am wrong…

There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

He lived a **sinless life and then when He was in His early 30’s the core of Christianity became horribly real,

continued…**

You’re right, and all us Trinitarians know it. Jesus asked for us to be united.

But it must be part of my fallen nature, because I know as soon as I open another anti-Catholic thread, I’m going to . . . . . . .

But you are right. Please pray for me.

 

[whatisthetruth]

You’re right, and all us Trinitarians know it. Jesus asked for us to be united.

But it must be part of my fallen nature, because I know as soon as I open another anti-Catholic thread, I’m going to . . . . . . .

But you are right. Please pray for me.

I am glad we agree Mark

"I know as soon as I open another anti-Catholic thread, I’m going to ". . . . . . .

Mark, I have no idea how you were going to continue, can you tell me here or PM?

I will be happy to pray for you Mark, but what is your prayer need for? again here or in PM

God bless

 

[mark_a]

I am glad we agree Mark

"I know as soon as I open another anti-Catholic thread, I’m going to ". . . . . . .

Mark, I have no idea how you were going to continue, can you tell me here or PM?

I will be happy to pray for you Mark, but what is your prayer need for? again here or in PM

God bless

Patience in the face of intolerance and mostly for help with my own.

And to follow the 2 great commandments.

 

[whatisthetruth]

bump

Wow, 55 viewers and only 2 replies, I am surprised. I guess we rather debate our differences than try to find common ground… mainly our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ

That my friends is one of the reasons why I believe there is a separation between religions.

Is that how Jesus wants us to be?

Having an “I am right… you are wrong” attitude and lets debate.
You have to agree. it will be difficult for people to feel welcomed “in your house” with that attitude.

suupah, when you replied back to me,

you quoted me and then you made one comment,

Let’s not reinvent the wheel. here is what we can all agree on

I can understand why you said that, I will explain in a little bit. Unfortunately, your statement “here is what we can all agree on” is not true of how all people believe today. That belief only applies to RC’s belief.

Then suupah, you quoted the The Apostles Creed with your very subtle “I am right… you are wrong attitude” (which I am just as guilty as the next guy) when you inserted an asterisk in the line…
“I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy *catholic church”

Friends, I am just as guilty as the next guy. it is our human nature to find it difficult to say these words…“I am wrong” or “I see your point” those are phrases with sincerity that will win friendships.

suupah, as a former RC I was told by many of people in the RC church that if one did not have our beliefs, they were doomed. And every time we had a family gathering and my Catholic cousin would be with her Jewish boyfriend, I would feel sorry for Him cause I knew he was doomed if he did not change his beliefs.

But then I started to realize, Jesus was Jewish too.

It is great that you believe in what the Apostles Creed says as I do. I believe everything it says except what is implied in the the one line I quoted.
“I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy (Jesus Christ) catholic (universal) church”
not
“I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy (Roman) catholic church”

Saying the creed and other prayers over the years I always felt there was something missing. It wasn’t until I left the RC church I found out what it was…the raw emotion of who Jesus is and His love for us and WHAT he went through to illustrate that love.

Maybe that is why, the bible says do not pray in repetition…

Matthew 6:7 KJV
But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions…

From this point on, I can promise you one thing, even though I disagree with you, I realize that we have probably read the same verse from the same text and we got different meaning from that verse

I believe there is truth in everyone of us. Let’s put our minds together, not just here but in the outside world of the people we meet every day

I want to thank Mark for being an example that we all should take note. Not only did he acknowledge our similiar beliefs…

Jesus asked for us to be united.

but also our weakness

You’re right, and all us Trinitarians know it.
But it must be part of my fallen nature

not your fallen nature Mark…ours

But then Mark did something I did not expect, He trusted me that I believe in the same God, the same Jesus as he does and he
asked me

Please pray for me

.

Let us all follow a true leader of Jesus Christ’s church which Mark has illustrated, God bless you Mark

God bless you all

truth

 

[water]

That my friends is one of the reasons why I believe there is a separation between religions.

Is that how Jesus wants us to be?

People read your thread but they don’t reply. Don’t be surprised by that. Not everybody who agrees replies to your post. They probably do more praying than writing – which is as important. Besides, there might be more posts which are more interested to people. I have written posts which no one replied.

Jesus prayed for us to be one. It looks like we are not.

 

[CTA1967]

Hi all,
There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

What about the presentation in the temple in Luke? Simeon and Anna seemed to believe very much.

 

[DebChris]

Dialogue is conversation against differences. It begins by acknowledging what we have in common.
When conversing with a Jew or Muslim, for instance, I begin by accepting that we worship the same God and that we are all children of Abraham.
When I lived in WI, after Mass, I worshipped with my Christian brothers and sisters of different denominations. I would be asked if I was going to a particular function with the church and I would have to ask," which one?" . My willingness to pray with others opened the door to many conversations about my own faith.
I now live in the Bible Belt where this still happens with conversations at work or on the bus. Typically, on Ash Wednesday, I would hear, “Did you know you have dirt on your forehead?”

 

[whatisthetruth]

People read your thread but they don’t reply. Don’t be surprised by that. Not everybody who agrees replies to your post.

I am not surprised. I wanted to make a point about us humans. experience tells me if someone hears or sees something they will state what they disagree with faster than stating that they are in agreement.

I have fun with my kids in Sunday school. I will purposely make a mistake to see who is paying attention and without fail someone will raise their hand and say “oh no that is not right”.

They probably do more praying than writing – which is as important.

Absolutely agree. the benefits of prayer can never be overstated

Besides, there might be more posts which are more interested to people.

I have no doubt

I have written posts which no one replied.

I am sure we all have

Jesus prayed for us to be one. It looks like we are not.

We as a world are not one But at least you and I and the people with similiar beliefs as you and I believe in Jesus, His birth, death on the cross and resurrection into :extrahappy: heaven.:heaven:

God bless,

Truth

 

[whatisthetruth]

Dialogue is conversation against differences. It begins by acknowledging what we have in common.
When conversing with a Jew or Muslim, for instance, I begin by **accepting that we worship the same God **and that we are all children of Abraham. When I lived in WI, after Mass, I worshipped with my Christian brothers and sisters of different denominations. I would be asked if I was going to a particular function with the church and I would have to ask," which one?" . My willingness to pray with others opened the door to many conversations about my own faith.
I now live in the Bible Belt where this still happens with conversations at work or on the bus. Typically, on Ash Wednesday, I would hear, “Did you know you have dirt on your forehead?”

Thank you for sharing Deb, you made wonderful points we all can learn from.

God

truth

 

[whatisthetruth]

What about the presentation in the temple in Luke? Simeon and Anna seemed to believe very much.

My ears and heart are open…please share

 

[john_ennis]

You’re speaking, of course, of pride. It can make us want to be right not only for the sake of truth, but for the sake of ourselves.

Our conversations and debates are part about pride, part about love of the truth. Whether on this forum it tends to be 90% pride and ten percent love of truth, or the other way around, I can’t say. I know I’ve been driven by both on different occasions.

Peace.
John

BTW, I hope you eventually recognized that whoever told you non-catholics go to Hell wasn’t being true to Catholic teaching. I wouldn’t want you thinking that all of us believing Catholics believe that, or need to be straightened out on that point.
It’s one more thing we can agree on!

 

[water]

Our conversations and debates are part about pride, part about love of the truth. Whether on this forum it tends to be 90% pride and ten percent love of truth, or the other way around, I can’t say. I know I’ve been driven by both on different occasions.

Thanks for bringing this up - a good reminder.

 

[whatisthetruth]

You’re speaking, of course, of pride. It can make us want to be right not only for the sake of truth, but for the sake of ourselves.
Our conversations and debates are part about pride, part about love of the truth. Whether on this forum it tends to be 90% pride and ten percent love of truth, or the other way around, I can’t say. I know I’ve been driven by both on different occasions.

Wow, God John, and water for agreeing The realness of people is shining on this thread. we are all guilty of pride as I say with both arms raised.

Pride by the love of truth that we all believe we have. However at the same time we realize someone has to be wrong somewhere. We all cant be right, can we?

If only God had a loud speaker. Nah that would be too easy

BTW, I hope you eventually recognized that whoever told you non-catholics go to Hell wasn’t being true to Catholic teaching. I wouldn’t want you thinking that all of us believing Catholics believe that, or need to be straightened out on that point.

I understand and may I make an apology to you. I hear a lot of non catholis say that ALL RC’s are going to hell. I for one do not believe that, I apologize for anyone that tells you so

 

[suupah]

suupah, when you replied back to me,

you quoted me and then you made one comment,

Then suupah, you quoted the The Apostles Creed with your very subtle “I am right… you are wrong attitude” (which I am just as guilty as the next guy) when you inserted an asterisk in the line…
“I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy *catholic church”

Friends, I am just as guilty as the next guy. it is our human nature to find it difficult to say these words…“I am wrong” or “I see your point” those are phrases with sincerity that will win friendships.

Actually i just cut and pasted that apostles creed from a protestant website. the asterisk was connected to a note that the “catholic” in this creed meant the universal christian churcn and was in no way connected to the apostate religion of the church of rome.

In this site it said that this creed was a very ancient creed probably dating to the late first century. I am pretty sure it is a universal creed and not a Roman Catholic one.

 

[planter654]

Matthew 26

64"Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”
65Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy.
66What do you think?”
"He is worthy of death," they answered.
67Then they spit in his face and struck him with their fists. Others slapped him
68and said, “Prophesy to us, Christ. Who hit you?”

and before Pontius Pilate when it came time to decide whether or not to punish Him or a criminal,

Matthew 27

11Meanwhile Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor asked him,
“Are you the king of the Jews?”
“Yes, it is as you say,” Jesus replied.
12When he was accused by the chief priests and the elders, he gave no answer. 13Then Pilate asked him,
“Don’t you hear the testimony they are bringing against you?” 14But Jesus made no reply,
17So when the crowd had gathered, Pilate asked them,
"Which one do you want me to release to you:

Barabbas,
or
Jesus who is called Christ?"

18For he knew it was out of envy that they had handed Jesus over to him.

“Barabbas,” they answered.

22"What shall I do, then, with Jesus who is called Christ?" Pilate asked. They all answered,

**“Crucify him!” **

23"Why? What crime has he committed?" asked Pilate.
But they shouted all the louder,

**“Crucify him!” **

24When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd.

The Soldiers Mock Jesus

28They stripped him and put a scarlet robe on him,
29and then twisted together a crown of thorns and set it on his head.
30They spit on him, and
took the staff and struck him on the head again and again. 31After they had mocked him, they took off the robe and put his own clothes on him.
Then they led him away to crucify him.

The crucifixion, being layed on a cross, by the way it amazes me Jesus is still alive at this point, and having three nails driven right through His flesh. one through each hand and one through both feet. I can not imagine the pain our saviour endured that day leading to His death.

I believe we can also agree in His dying breath, Jesus thought about each and every one of us (who had passed on prior too, existed at the time and for all generations to come) when He said,

Luke 23:34
Jesus said, “Father,** forgive them**, for they do not know what they are doing.”

I believe we all are in agreement so far with all the above, are we?

I hope we are all in agreement,

I challenge anyone to open their heart and feel the love and the passion as to why Jesus, as innocent as innocent can be, endured all that bloody torture, pain, suffering, and eventual death for.

From your heart, why did Jesus endure that pain and eventual death?

Now after answering that, without letting anything else get in the way of the love you are feeling right now from Jesus, answer this question,

I believe when Jesus in His last breaths He would take said “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” He was telling us the way to forgiveness is through Himself and through no one else especially when he said "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. John 14:6?

A prime example of Jesus directly forgiving sins is one of the thieves on the cross. two others are the paralzed man on the mat and the adultress woman.

I believe** we all can agree on ** that the way to forgiveness is on of the dividing lines between Catholics and other bible believing Christian religions.

I believe that God loves us so much that He sacrificed His son to endure all the above to illustrate how much he loved all of us.

I believe all God asks is to show our appreciation of Him for giving us a very valuable treasure, salvation through the blood of Jesus, and to show our love to him by honoring Him and living our lives in honor of the life Jesus lived.

When we get to :heaven: I do not believe we will see separate rooms, one for catholics, one for baptists, one for protestants, etc.

We will be all in massive number before the throne of God, worshipping and rejoicing…Alleluia

:extrahappy: :clapping: :grouphug: :bowdown:

God bless all of you,



I agree ONE God, ONE Kingdom, ONE Church…all God’s children. Thank you for this thread…a little child of God.

 

[CTA1967]

There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

What about the presentation in the temple in Luke? Simeon and Anna seemed to believe very much.

My ears and heart are open…please share

Not trying to start any arguments, just pointing out a statement of yours that I disagree with: Luke 2: 21-39

21 And after eight days were accomplished, that the child should be circumcised, his name was called JESUS, which was called by the angel before he was conceived in the womb. 22 And after the days of her purification, according to the law of Moses, were accomplished, they carried him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord: 23 As it is written in the law of the Lord: Every male opening the womb shall be called holy to the Lord: 24 And to offer a sacrifice, according as it is written in the law of the Lord, a pair of turtledoves or two young pigeons: 25 And behold there was a man in Jerusalem named Simeon: and this man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel. And the Holy Ghost was in him. 26 And he had received an answer from the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death before he had seen the Christ of the Lord. 27 And he came by the Spirit into the temple. And when his parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the law, 28 He also took him into his arms and blessed God and said

29 Now thou dost dismiss thy servant, O Lord, according to thy word in peace:
30 Because my eyes have seen thy salvation,
31 Which thou hast prepared before the face of all peoples:
32 A light to the revelation of the Gentiles and the glory of thy people Israel.

33 And his father and mother were wondering at those things which were spoken concerning him. 34 And Simeon blessed them and said to Mary his mother: Behold this child is set for the fall and for the resurrection of many in Israel and for a sign which shall be contradicted. 35 And thy own soul a sword shall pierce, that, out of many hearts thoughts may be revealed. 36 And there was one Anna, a prophetess, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Aser. She was far advanced in years and had lived with her husband seven years from her virginity. 37 And she was a widow until fourscore and four years: who departed not from the temple, by fastings and prayers serving night and day. 38 Now she, at the same hour, coming in, confessed to the Lord: and spoke of him to all that looked for the redemption of Israel. 39 And after they had performed all things according to the law of the Lord, they returned into Galilee, to their city Nazareth.

 

[planter654]

My ears and heart are open…please share

Yes, Simeon and Anna believed very much and they waited upon the Lord. Their faith, trust in God was very strong. They obedyed God and gave God’s message to Mary. They accepted God’s will and desire for them and did what he asked them to do.

a little child of God.