TLC's "All American Muslims"

[Crdl2Grv]

So what does his being Catholic add to the story that wouldn’t be there had he been, say, an atheist instead?

Probably nothing. In my experience, atheists are far, far more intolerant of anyone who doesn’t think exactly like they do than Catholics are. I can very easily see a situation where an atheist mother, especially one who is as committed to atheism as the groom’s mother is to Catholicism, flips out when her son converts to Islam.

The most interesting part of that episode, to me at least, is watching how converting to Islam works*. Apparently you just have to say, “I attest that there is no god but Allah, and Muhammed is his Prophet” a few times in Arabic. Boom - now you’re muslim. You also apparently get a celebratory dinner thrown at your future bride’s uncle’s house.

That’s kinda my point. The episode is not a detailed examination of the theological differences between Catholicism and Islam. It’s a slightly new variation on “my fiancee’s family and my family don’t get along.” That’s not groundbreaking storytelling, nor is it “Let’s show America that Christianity is wrong and Islam is right.”

(* - Yes, yes, standard caveats about how there is no single, standard version of Islam throughout the world. So the hordes of urbane, self-congratulatory sophisticates who love nothing more than “enlightening” their more provincial brethren through tedious, cliche-ridden finger-wagging can just relax.)

 

[Contarini]

(* - Yes, yes, standard caveats about how there is no single, standard version of Islam throughout the world. So the hordes of urbane, self-congratulatory sophisticates who love nothing more than “enlightening” their more provincial brethren through tedious, cliche-ridden finger-wagging can just relax.)

Do you have any justification for this sarcasm, or are you just being pointlessly rude?

Pointing out truth is necessary, even if it gets one labeled an “urbane, self-congratulatory sophisticate.”

In fact, as far as I can tell, the process of conversion is pretty uniform. So maybe I’m not an urbane, self-congratulatory sophisticate after all?

Edwin

 

[Crdl2Grv]

Do you have any justification for this sarcasm, or are you just being pointlessly rude?

1. Um… what part of that quote is sarcastic? I think it’s pretty clear that meant every word.
2. I didn’t name any names. But the fact that you immediately took offense and started protesting waaaaaaaay too much provides more than enough justification.

 

[John_Paul_Jones]

In case you have not seen the coming attractions or the show itself TLC now has a show documenting the life of Muslims living in America. In one episode though it shows the fiance of a muslim woman converting from Catholicism to Islam. I was sick to my stomach seeing this, I do not know why TLC would show this. It was just so upsetting for me to see this. I am now personally boycotting TLC and advocating all my friends do the same. I am also going to send letters telling them how this was completely inappropriate. To show anyone changing their religion on regular television, I feel, is too sensitive of a subject to show, any religion. How do all of you feel about this show?

Right on, boycott TLC and turn on EWTN.
Don’t worry about any negative comments or opposition to how you feel on this. I just see it as the same ol’ same ol’ where the media either totally ignores the Catholic Church or shows it in a bad light. I watch most of cable channel like History, Science, etc and none of them are really about the subject they channel claims to be, you are more likely to find a show on paranormal activity than something about real science on the Science Channel - and is Punkin Chunkin really a science? The History Channel is either about Nazi’s and UFOs or both so the credibility and the expectation of these channels are not very high. So don’t worry too much what you see on cable.

I think the “subtext” for this episode is that islam is so great a force that even those in the Catholic Church can not resist conversion. “You must assimilate.” “Resistance is futile.” http://www.woodwindforum.com/forums/images/smilies/icon_borg-smiley.gif

 

[Contarini]

1. Um… what part of that quote is sarcastic? I think it’s pretty clear that meant every word.
2. I didn’t name any names. But the fact that you immediately took offense and started protesting waaaaaaaay too much provides more than enough justification.

I see. You describe a perfectly legitimate point (that Islam is not monolithic), and without making a single argument against it, describe anyone who makes the point in clearly insulting terms. And when someone calls you on it, you say that my objection to your substance-less insults somehow gives them substance?

So suppose I were to say, “This is the cue for the raving hordes of mindless fanatics to point out that yes, Muslims do often commit violence.”

Would your objection to that objectionable sentence justify it? Would the fact that I “named no names” absolve me from the guilt of having pointlessly insulted a number of people who have made a legitimate argument?

Surely not.

Refuting other people’s positions is somewhat more difficult than you seem to think. You attempted an illegitimate short-cut. I called you on it. The decent thing is for you to apologize and get back to making whatever substantive point you were trying to make when you unwisely distracted yourself by a snide and empty sneer.

Edwin

 

[Crdl2Grv]

I see. You describe a perfectly legitimate point (that Islam is not monolithic), and without making a single argument against it, describe anyone who makes the point in clearly insulting terms.

I didn’t insult anyone who makes that argument. I only insulted people who make that argument in a pedantic, self-important manner. It is, after all, quite possible to make that argument w/o being condescending.

So suppose I were to say, “This is the cue for the raving hordes of mindless fanatics to point out that yes, Muslims do often commit violence.”

Since I’m neither mindless nor a fanatic I’d probably assume you weren’t talking about me. And I’d move on.

 

[Kristin234]

I saw that episode and I really do not see what the big deal was .

The main reason why the man did it was to marry that woman. He admits it and if you see the preview for the next episode his wife actually says he didn’t do it because he believes in it, but he did it because he wanted to marry her.

It is sad when you see people converting, but it is a TV show about Muslims living in America, and this woman was marrying a man that was a different religion as her and they show how they resolved it. That’s like me boycotting HBO because they show people having pre marital sex and I am against it. Or watching Sister Wives and saying that they should not show a show about a Mormon man marrying 4 women so you are going to boycott it. Anything and everything is being played on TV now a days. No one is forcing you to watch it. There is no need to make a fuss and boycott things when you can do something as easy as change the channel.

 

[Lampuntomyfeet]

My thought about the shows on TLC are this:

They show a Mormon man’s family with multiple wives, they show little people trying to have a baby with surrogate, they have a show of people having multiples with fertility treatments and now a show about another religion that some American citizens consider to be a threat. What does TLC do they, in lack of a better term, play the devil’s advocate. They do things to stir up an argument they put all the shows they have on for entertainment that people take too seriously. Understand that it is entertainment, these are not peoples’ real lives. It would be like saying that real house wives shows are so real! I am not saying anything about the religion part I am sure they are Muslim, but if a camera was put in your family home would your life really unfold and show the truth? It is entertainment, besides the guy who converted did so because he doesn’t even know what he wants in his life, I watched his interviews, he is a big pushover, if that who he is in real life. I just think take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Crdl2Grv]

Having seen the first two episodes of “All-American Muslims” I am joining the call for a boycott of this show. Not because it’s “anti-Catholic” (it’s not) but because it’s just not a very good show, even by reality tv standards.

The attempts to create conflict are so ham-fisted you can almost see the producers just off-camera desperately mouthing words for people on the show. I’m not talking the main families they’re following - they all seem nice enough. But a lot of the “incidents” featured in the show are clearly staged. For instance, the football coach who’s team is 99% Muslim holds a series of practices at night during ramadan. Clearly, everyone on the team and in the community is fine with it. But the producers identify one of the few kids on the team who is not Muslim and get his parents to sit down with the coach to address their “concerns.”

CUT TO: The coaches office. Two parents sitting awkwardly. Coach: “I understand you have concerns about the practice schedule.” Parents (furtive looks to the camera): “Um… yeah… is that (practicing at night) due to… um… your religion?” Coach: “Yes. It’s called ramadan…” CUT TO: Outside school. Parent: “We had some concerns, but the coach addressed them. Now we feel good.”

It’s a lot of that. Awkwardly staged moments in hopes of creating conflict that just come off as really forced or artificial. It’s off my list.

 

[LinuxUser]

Having seen the first two episodes of “All-American Muslims” I am joining the call for a boycott of this show. Not because it’s “anti-Catholic” (it’s not) but because it’s just not a very good show, even by reality tv standards.

The attempts to create conflict are so ham-fisted you can almost see the producers just off-camera desperately mouthing words for people on the show. I’m not talking the main families they’re following - they all seem nice enough. But a lot of the “incidents” featured in the show are clearly staged. For instance, the football coach who’s team is 99% Muslim holds a series of practices at night during ramadan. Clearly, everyone on the team and in the community is fine with it. But the producers identify one of the few kids on the team who is not Muslim and get his parents to sit down with the coach to address their “concerns.”

CUT TO: The coaches office. Two parents sitting awkwardly. Coach: “I understand you have concerns about the practice schedule.” Parents (furtive looks to the camera): “Um… yeah… is that (practicing at night) due to… um… your religion?” Coach: “Yes. It’s called ramadan…” CUT TO: Outside school. Parent: “We had some concerns, but the coach addressed them. Now we feel good.”

It’s a lot of that. Awkwardly staged moments in hopes of creating conflict that just come off as really forced or artificial. It’s off my list.

Most “reality” shows are like that. As far as the new show I would rather watch 10 hours of non stop sister wives over 1 sec of the muslim thing

 

[Crdl2Grv]

I don’t begrudge reality shows manipulating as much as they possibly can in order to create something interesting. Entertainment is a pretty risky business, so of course the people paying the bills are going to want the people shooting the footage to have as much control over their environment as possible.

What I do take issue with is poorly executed manipulation, and All-American Muslims has that in spades. Maybe they got better as they shot more stuff. But two episodes in, it’s kind of a snooze fest.

 

[domandcarols]

I find this show offensive to both Muslims and Christians.

 

[pswords]

I have just heard about this show. I think they can show whatever they want. However, it only makes me want to declare my faith more openly, and to stand up for my faith more.

 

[adstrinity]

Didn’t read past the first few posts.

Let’s put this in perspective, the apostate is leaving GOD. Does that make things easier for people? He is leaving Christ’s Bride to join up with NOT God, or Satan. This is breaking God’s Heart, but, He did impugn His creature with free will, so, if this probably poorly catechized person wants to not learn about God and instead choose his own will over God’s, that is his choice, BUT, he chose something over God. In Hell, the first pain will be the loss of the Beatific vision, and, all in Hell only have themselves to blame.

We should pray that this man not only converts back to Catholicism, but, also brings his wife to life with him.

Again, this is breaking God’s Heart that he is doing this. He is leaving the Truth for a lie…freely. True, other people flit between religions and go to and fro with them, but, there is only one true religion that is the Kingdom of Heaven, and this person willfully chooses to leave.

And nobody can see what the big deal is?

Other than that, I do not believe one can be American and Muslim, either one’s nationality and patriotism or faith will suffer.

And people wonder why there are threads here concerning people and getting rid of their televisions altogether…

 

[Crdl2Grv]

, BUT, he chose something over God. In Hell, the first pain will be the loss of the Beatific vision, and, all in Hell only have themselves to blame.

Pretty weird that you’re sure this guy’s going to Hell despite the fact that you haven’t seen a single episode. Must be nice to personally have the kind certainty about an individual’s salvation that the Church itself doesn’t even claim.

 

[schaick]

I was happy to see this:

wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=370461

Advertisers fleeing ‘All-American Muslim’ 'propaganda’
Sears, Wal-Mart, Home Depot, others drop support for program

“All-American Muslim,” a new program on The Learning Channel that is being touted as a “powerful series” that carries viewers “inside the rarely seen world of American Muslims,” is being dropped by advertisers.

 

[schaick]

At the university I attended, we had a good size group of Malaysian Muslim students. No one gave them a hard time at all but this was before 9/11. They were good students, and some of them brought their young families with them while they attended school. I did get a chance to have a meal with a few of the female students at an apartment they had off campus. They lived simply with not much furniture etc. When we had dinner, we sat on the floor, and they helped me fill my plate as I normally sit at a table with a chair to eat. They were very kind and welcoming, and respected the fact about my way of life & religion as I treated them nicely in return.

There are good and bad people of all faiths and all walks of life in every nation. I presume that most people try to live a good life, and treat their neighbors & those they don’t know with respect, plus not harm them. I’ve been to Belfast Ireland, and some areas of the city still will not welcome Catholics to live in them and vice versa regarding Protestants (or even those who are not Christians). I just don’t openly say I am Catholic when going down the Shankill Road as an example (Protestant area) as you never know who may take offense.

Yes there are good and bad people in all faiths.

The issue - Jesus and the Gospel do not condone the violence and immorality that Mohammad and the Quran did/do.

 

[Crdl2Grv]

I was happy to see this:

wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=370461

Advertisers fleeing ‘All-American Muslim’ 'propaganda’
Sears, Wal-Mart, Home Depot, others drop support for program

Shiack,

I have mixed feelings about that wnd article. On one specific point, they’re right on. They show the Wayne county deputy sheriff talking about keeping peace between Christian protesters and people attending at the Arab American Fesitval. And I’m sure he and the other officers were totally professional when they were on duty. (That sounds like I’m being sarcastic, but I’m really not.) However, they don’t give any context at all about what happened the previous year, when people were arrested at the festival for simply handing out literature.

Granted, the cameras weren’t there the previous year because the show wasn’t even in production. But they make no reference to the arrests the previous year. That’s just bad.

On the other hand, the article you posted doesn’t seem to have any beef about what’s actually in the show; almost all of their criticisms are about what’s not in the show. It is, after all, a show called “All-American Muslims.” So the idea that it’s trying to be some kind of sly whitewashing of Islam is kinda ridiculous. Again, it’s called, “All-America Muslims,” not “Dangerous Muslims” or “Individual Muslims Who Represent The Real Affects Of The Koran’s Violent Language.”

My point is that every TV show cannot be all things to all people all the time. It can’t show every single angle of every single issue every single time. You have to make some choices. And while the producers clearly made the choice to show only “All-American Muslims,” they didn’t exactly try to trick anyone into thinking they were showing anything but the most “red, white and blue” of American Muslims.

I guess I just don’t understand calls for boycotts or criticism because a show isn’t what you wish it would be. Why not just turn the channel and be done with it? That’s what I did after two episodes, mostly because the show is terribly contrived and not that exciting. But it seems a little excessive to be like, “I’m boycotting your entire channel because you’re not producing one of your shows exactly like I want you to produce it!”

 

[schaick]

Shiack,

I have mixed feelings about that wnd article. On one specific point, they’re right on. They show the Wayne county deputy sheriff talking about keeping peace between Christian protesters and people attending at the Arab American Fesitval. And I’m sure he and the other officers were totally professional when they were on duty. (That sounds like I’m being sarcastic, but I’m really not.) However, they don’t give any context at all about what happened the previous year, when people were arrested at the festival for simply handing out literature.

Granted, the cameras weren’t there the previous year because the show wasn’t even in production. But they make no reference to the arrests the previous year. That’s just bad.

On the other hand, the article you posted doesn’t seem to have any beef about what’s actually in the show; almost all of their criticisms are about what’s not in the show. It is, after all, a show called “All-American Muslims.” So the idea that it’s trying to be some kind of sly whitewashing of Islam is kinda ridiculous. Again, it’s called, “All-America Muslims,” not “Dangerous Muslims” or “Individual Muslims Who Represent The Real Affects Of The Koran’s Violent Language.”

My point is that every TV show cannot be all things to all people all the time. It can’t show every single angle of every single issue every single time. You have to make some choices. And while the producers clearly made the choice to show only “All-American Muslims,” they didn’t exactly try to trick anyone into thinking they were showing anything but the most “red, white and blue” of American Muslims.

I guess I just don’t understand calls for boycotts or criticism because a show isn’t what you wish it would be. Why not just turn the channel and be done with it? That’s what I did after two episodes, mostly because the show is terribly contrived and not that exciting. But it seems a little excessive to be like, “I’m boycotting your entire channel because you’re not producing one of your shows exactly like I want you to produce it!”

It is difficult for us that believe in multiculturalism to question another’s religionm culture, motives. In the case of Islam we need to wake up. We are allowing a dangerous and violent religion, cult, idealogy to get a foothold that is totally against multiculturalism.

Allah says that Isalm must rule above all other religions.

A true Muslim will follow the ways of Mohammad and want sharia law to be in place. Sharia law and democracy, equality don’t mix.

Women are treated with inequality-they are the property of their men, need permission to leave the house and must be escorted by a male and are worth half a man. Jews are worth 1/4 of man, etc.

 

[Contarini]

Yes there are good and bad people in all faiths.

The issue - Jesus and the Gospel do not condone the violence and immorality that Mohammad and the Quran did/do.

Is there nothing more to Christianity than Jesus and “the Gospel”" Don’t we have an Old Testament? Don’t we have centuries of tradition? Don’t we have epistles in our New Testament? Don’t we have an extremely violent apocalyptic book closing our New Testament? For that matter, as conservatives like to point out, Jesus talks about Hell in the Gospels quite a bit, and any violence in this world that Muslims or anyone else may commit pales before everlasting fire.

The contrast you make is certainly significant, but it’s not the end of the story.

Edwin