TLM to be reintroduced into EVERY PARISH in England and Wales

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I can barely believe it :D. From Fr. Z:

"Damian Thompson covers and comments on the Pontifical Mass celebrated by His Eminence Dario Card. Castrillon Hoyos in Westminster Cathedral.

My **emphases **and comments.

Latin Mass to return to England and Wales
By Damian Thompson

The traditional Latin Mass – effectively banned by Rome for 40 years – is to be reintroduced into every Roman Catholic parish in England and Wales, [Get that?] the senior Vatican cardinal in charge of Latin liturgy said at a press conference in London today. [This was stated by someone who knows what he is talking about. He wouldn’t have said it if it was according to the Holy Father’s will. how can we knwo this? He made a similar statement before. Review http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/05/pceds-card-castrillon-hoyos-celebrate-tlm-in-parishes-even-when-it-isnt-requested/”]this. If the Secretariate of State or the Holy Father had a problem with what Card. Castrillon said back then, he wouldn’t be saying it in public now.]

In addition, all seminaries will be required to teach trainee priests how to say the old Mass so that they can celebrate it in all parishes. [Get that? Will… be… required…. ]

Catholic congregations throughout the world will receive special instruction on how to appreciate the old services, formerly known as the Tridentine Rite."

Full Story:

http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/06/uk-card-castrillon-hoyos-tlm-in-“not-many-parishes-–-all-parishes/

This is magnificent news! What fantastic things our Pope is doing for Tradition!
 
Our God is an awesome God! :bowdown2:

Bless the LORD, o my soul! :highprayer:

ALLELUIA :extrahappy:
 
do you have a link that discusses this?

I went to the only link on the post but couldn’t find anything about this topic.
 

And what if there are not enough priests to say it ? The vestments & other wherewithal for offering it are not free (unfortunately), & the extra expenditure for a form of the Mass which is not even particularly well-attended may be hard to justify when dioceses & parishes are already short of cash. (Maybe that is a good reason for ordaining married men - so that they can offer the EF of the RR.)​

What is the point of bothering with an extra-ordinary form of the Roman Rite, when most Catholics in England & Wales don’t even go to the ordinary form ? It’s possible that the 70 % of Catholics who don’t attend Mass are all to a man crypto-Tridentinists, but it’s not exactly likely.

The revised Missal is perfectly adequate for the purpose of worshipping Almighty God - unless Rome has given us, or has tolerated, a Missal that is not adequate for that purpose: in which case one has wonder what justification there is for a Papacy in the first place 😦 That is a weak point in the disparaging of the revised Missal: if it so dreadful, then the Popes must have asleep, dead, or othewise absent of mind to have approved & allowed it for so long. And if they can be so wrong once, they can be as wrong any number of times. The logic of denying the adequacy of the revised Missal, leads to undermining the Papacy & the Church.
 
It makes sense to reintroduce the old Mass to those who have stopped going to Church because of all the changes that were made to the liturgy. I don’t understand your fears, geers.
 
Gottle_of_Geer said:
…The revised Missal is perfectly adequate for the purpose of worshipping Almighty God - unless Rome has given us, or has tolerated, a Missal that is not adequate for that purpose: in which case one has wonder what justification there is for a Papacy in the first place 😦 That is a weak point in the disparaging of the revised Missal: if it so dreadful, then the Popes must have asleep, dead, or othewise absent of mind to have approved & allowed it for so long. And if they can be so wrong once, they can be as wrong any number of times. The logic of denying the adequacy of the revised Missal, leads to undermining the Papacy & the Church.
Click to expand...
As has been stated numerous times, prudential decisions of the Pope are not infallible. The adequacy (I am not discussing the validity) of the New Mass for worship has been discussed by Cardinals. I repost this from Fr. John Parsons (emphases in bold mine):

Sacrosanctum Concilium No. 54:

“A suitable place may be allotted to the vernacular in Masses which are celebrated with the people, especially in the readings and the “common prayer”, and also, as local conditions may warrant, in those parts which pertain to the people… Nevertheless care must be taken to ensure that the faithful may also be able to say or sing together in Latin those parts of the Ordinary of the Mass which pertain to them. Wherever a more extended use of the vernacular in the Mass seems desirable, the regulation laid down in article 40 of this Constitution is to be observed”.

Fallibility of Prudential Judgments

This is the paragraph that sank a thousand missals, and more than a thousand years of unity in the Roman Rite, which had been one of the principal factors in the emergence of a unified western civilization.

There is the famous story of how the Dominican Cardinal Browne urged the Council Fathers to beware of allowing the vernacular, lest Latin vanish from the liturgy within ten years or so. He was laughed at by the assembly, but as so often, the pessimistic reactionary proved to be more in touch with the flow of events than the optimistic progressives.

The Council Fathers’ incredulous laughter at Cardinal Browne helps to remind us that a general council, like a Pope, is only infallible in its definitions of faith and morals, and not in its prudential judgements, or in matters of pastoral discipline, or in acts of state, or in supposed liturgical improvements. It is thus false to assert that a Catholic is logically bound to agree with the prudential judgments a council may make on any subject. It is still more illegitimate to extrapolate from the negative immunity from error which a general council enjoys in definitions of faith and morals, to belief in a positive inspiration of councils, as if the bishops were organs of revelation like the Apostles, and their prudential decrees inerrant like the Scriptures. It is only a false ecclesiology and a false pneumatology that can lead to the exorbitant assertion that a council is “the voice of the Holy Spirit for our age”. Are we really obliged to believe that the Holy Spirit demanded the launching of a Crusade at the Fourth Lateran Council in 1215? And must we hold that in 1311 the Holy Spirit dictated the Council of Vienne’s rules regulating the use of torture by the Inquisition? And is it *de fide *that when Alexander IV ordered those suspect of heresy to be tortured to confess their guilt, this was what “the Spirit was saying to the churches” on 15 May 1252? If so, are we to condemn the Catechism of the Catholic Church of 15 August 1997, which comes to us on the same papal and episcopal authority and which condemns the use of torture to extract confessions of guilt, and openly says that “the pastors of the Church” erred on the matter?

…No, this doctrine of the Infallibility of the Party Line simply will not do. It is not Catholic teaching that the Church is infallible in pastoral or prudential judgements. We are therefore logically free to hold that any council can be ill-advised when making these kinds of decisions, and thus ill-advised in allowing the conversion of the liturgy into the vernacular, even if that had taken the form of a direct translation of the 1962 Missal.

http://www.christianorder.com/features/features_2001/features_bonus_dec01.html
 
Dauphin said:
I can barely believe it :D. From Fr. Z:

"Damian Thompson covers and comments on the Pontifical Mass celebrated by His Eminence Dario Card. Castrillon Hoyos in Westminster Cathedral.

My **emphases **and comments.

Latin Mass to return to England and Wales
By Damian Thompson

The traditional Latin Mass – effectively banned by Rome for 40 years – is to be reintroduced into every Roman Catholic parish in England and Wales, [Get that?] the senior Vatican cardinal in charge of Latin liturgy said at a press conference in London today. [This was stated by someone who knows what he is talking about. He wouldn’t have said it if it was according to the Holy Father’s will. how can we knwo this? He made a similar statement before. Review http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/05/pceds-card-castrillon-hoyos-celebrate-tlm-in-parishes-even-when-it-isnt-requested/”]this. If the Secretariate of State or the Holy Father had a problem with what Card. Castrillon said back then, he wouldn’t be saying it in public now.]
Click to expand...
In addition, all seminaries will be required to teach trainee priests how to say the old Mass so that they can celebrate it in all parishes. [Get that? Will… be… required…. ]

Catholic congregations throughout the world will receive special instruction on how to appreciate the old services, formerly known as the Tridentine Rite."

Full Story:

http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/06/uk-card-castrillon-hoyos-tlm-in-“not-many-parishes-–-all-parishes/

This is magnificent news! What fantastic things our Pope is doing for Tradition!

Fantastic news! When can I move to England? God bless our Pope and Cardinal Hoyos. Certainly above and beyond my own expectations.
 
Hang on, I seriously doubt this is going to happen over night or anything like. Church authorities tend to move as fast as snails.

I imagine at the very earliest all the crop of students currently beginning in seminary will be compulsorily trained in it and those parishes that get these new priests when they finish will be the first to have extra TLMs, and gradually after that they or others will train the older priests to say it.
 
ProVobis said:
It makes sense to reintroduce the old Mass to those who have stopped going to Church because of all the changes that were made to the liturgy. I don’t understand your fears, geers.
Click to expand...
I think a miniscule percentage of the people who have left the church over the last 40 years who have done so did so for reason of the TLM. Most would’ve stayed with the NO even if they didn’t like it. So you’ll see a shift from NO attendees to TLM, but not a huge increase in churchgoers overall.

I’d say many times more people left for other reasons - not liking Humanae Vitae, or church law regarding annulment and divorce, or just not being properly catechised about the importance of weekly Mass attendance and so on. Education is the answer, and I doubt any of those who left for these reasons will come back for the TLM :nope:
 
Just the fact that it annoys Gottle of Geer so much means it is a wonderful thing. May God grant the Holy Father long life in which to annoy Gottle many more times and in many creative ways.
 
Gottle_of_Geer said:
The revised Missal is perfectly adequate for the purpose of worshipping Almighty God - unless Rome has given us, or has tolerated, a Missal that is not adequate for that purpose: in which case one has wonder what justification there is for a Papacy in the first place 😦 That is a weak point in the disparaging of the revised Missal: if it so dreadful, then the Popes must have asleep, dead, or othewise absent of mind to have approved & allowed it for so long. And if they can be so wrong once, they can be as wrong any number of times. The logic of denying the adequacy of the revised Missal, leads to undermining the Papacy & the Church.
Click to expand...
So, why do we have the new Mass? Was the old one inadequate for worshipping Almighty God? Didn’t the Popes tolerate that Mass for something like 1500 years? Were they asleep, dead or otherwise absent of mind throughout that period? And the really amazing thing about all this outrage is that the OF Mass is not even being abandoned, but will continue to be offered everywhere just as it is now. That is something that can’t be said about the TLM when the Novus Ordo was instituted, and so if any liturgy would appear to have been declared inadequate, it would have to have been that one, not the OF.
 
Okay, I now officially want to visit England !!!

🙂 👍 :cool:

Besides which, I have ancestors that come from there. :o

~~ the phoenix
 
I agree that this is a long-term plan, but at least we now know the intentions of the Holy Father in liberating the Traditional Latin Mass; he wants to make it a central part of Catholic life in average parishes.

It’s clear now what the ultimate goal is concerning this Mass.
 
Deo gratias.

Oremus pro pontifice nostro Benedicto.😃

The Cardinal was not speaking of just England but the whole Roman Church. That’s the impression I got at least.👍
 
I hate to be a wet blanket, but I feel that the title is greatly exaggerated. I seriously doubt that EVERY PARISH will have a TLM.
 
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