To Protestants: Why aren't you Catholic?

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

Eden:

Has the Holy Spirit given you the charism of infallibility or are you capable of error on matters of faith and morals?

Just because im not Catholic you make it seem i am a bad person, do u really know what’s in my heart? I don’t think you do. Noone in this world would know my heart only GOD and JESUS would know the truth. Why do you keep trying to argue about this topic! Can’t you see all your doing is making a big mess. Instead of helping people you talk about them as if you know what is in their hearts. Im sorry but i don’t believe this is what God wants us to do, even if im not Catholic this doesn’t make me a less human being.

I don’t need anyones approval except GOD. I don’t think changing my faith will send me to hell. Nope!

Eden did not make it seem like you’re a bad person nor did they make a judgment on what’s in your heart nor accuse you of being less human. They brought up a very important point though and that’s why they “keep trying to argue about this topic.” Jesus promised that His true teachings would be preserved throughout all of history with the help of the Holy Spirit in His Church. So, do you have this gift of infallibility? If not, then you don’t know whether or not you’re right or wrong. But you should know since Our Lord said so. As for changing your faith sending you to hell…let’s just say that I’ll be praying for you.

 

[exoflare]

TrustInTheLord:

Did i ever mention that the Pastor is only a teacher, not the Pope who is trying to be JESUS.

Reading the bible is good for your soul, if you want to learn the right way to live, who is the only one we can trust to show us this " THE LORD JESUS" which is God’s only son. Does God have to tell you to go to church every sunday or does the church have to tell you this? Hmm…I go to my church because that is where i know God will be. And i read the bible because God says to follow his son Jesus. Obviously that is what the bible talks about, if you ever read it.

That paragraph is just one big non-answer. You’re dancing around the subject here. First you make a wild ad-hominem remark that the Pope is trying to be Jesus (what is your proof of this?) and then you say we must read the bible because it talks about Jesus. So is this your criteria - “if it talks about Jesus, it is a guide for your life”? The Quran mentions Jesus quite a few times… why don’t we read IT as our guide for life?

 

[TrustInTheLord]

JSmitty2005:

Yeah. Why should you read the Bible? Because your pastor told you to? It sounds like he’s your pope.

I read the bible because God would want us to and he put it here on earth for a reason, which is to follow his only son The Lord Jesus Christ.

I didn’t say the Pastor is the Pope, THE PASTOR is actually only a teacher. Okay. Let’s not get ourselves more confused on this one.

 

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

the Pope who is trying to be JESUS.

Shouldn’t we all strive to be Christ-like?

Reading the bible is good for your soul, if you want to learn the right way to live, who is the only one we can trust to show us this " THE LORD JESUS" which is God’s only son.

Agreed.

Does God have to tell you to go to church every sunday or does the church have to tell you this?

Where does God tell anyone in the Bible to go to church on Sunday? Before you look, it’s not there. Sunday worship was a determination of the Catholic Church to commemorate the Resurrection. So, whether you knew it or not, you’ve been going to Church on Sundays because the Church said so.

Hmm…I go to my church because that is where i know God will be. And i read the bible because God says to follow his son Jesus.

So you read the Bible because the Bible tells you to read it? The Koran and the Book of Mormon both claim to be the Word of God, but the only book in the New Testament that claims inspiration is the Apocalypse. How do you know that it’s really the Word of God? What if there’s a book in it that’s not inspired? What if there are other books out there that are inspired but aren’t in the Bible? Who has the authority to infallibly determine the canon of Scripture?

Obviously that is what the bible talks about, if you ever read it.

I hope you’re not judging anyone.

 

[exoflare]

TrustInTheLord:

I read the bible because God would want us to and he put it here on earth for a reason, which is to follow his only son The Lord Jesus Christ.

I didn’t say the Pastor is the Pope, THE PASTOR is actually only a teacher. Okay. Let’s not get ourselves more confused on this one.

LOL there is only one person on here that is confused, so don’t worry about it.

“Because God would want us to” based on what… something your pastor told you? You didn’t answer us where Jesus ever mentioned the Bible anyway. By your own “logic” you are putting your pastor’s word over Jesus!

By the way, in the Bible, Jesus tells the apostles to call no man “teacher” as you have just done… how do you respond to that?

 

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

I read the bible because God would want us to

How do you know?

and he put it here on earth for a reason

The Bible didn’t just fall out of Heaven one day. Jesus Christ didn’t write anything down nor did He ask any of the Apostles to write anything down, so why do you put all your trust in the Bible? He left us with 12 men to lead His teaching Church, not a book.

 

[TrustInTheLord]

exoflare:

That paragraph is just one big non-answer. You’re dancing around the subject here. First you make a wild ad-hominem remark that the Pope is trying to be Jesus (what is your proof of this?) and then you say we must read the bible because it talks about Jesus. So is this your criteria - “if it talks about Jesus, it is a guide for your life”? The Quran mentions Jesus quite a few times… why don’t we read IT as our guide for life?

It doesn’t matter what i say, you know what is true for yourself.

I am not God, you would need to ask him yourself, maybe he will come into your dreams one day. Send his angels or something to guide you. Who would you like to follow the church, the Pope or The Lord JESUS?

 

[exoflare]

TrustInTheLord:

It doesn’t matter what i say, you know what is true for yourself.

I am not God, you would need to ask him yourself, maybe he will come into your dreams one day. Send his angels or something to guide you. Who would you like to follow the church, the Pope or The Lord JESUS?

Oh, boo-hoo…

Now why don’t you actually face the questions you were given rather than evading them.

 

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

It doesn’t matter what i say, you know what is true for yourself.

Truth is not relative. For example, something cannot be true for me and yet be false for you. That is as long as it applies to doctrine and morals. This is the same kind of logic that pro-death advocates often use. “You may be against abortion…that’s your truth, but that’s not true for me.” C.S. Lewis said that relativism would “damn our souls and end our species” and the pope has said that we’re living in a “dictatorship of relativism.” Relativism undermines the entire Christian faith. If truth is relative, then there’s no morality. If there’s no definitive right and wrong, then there’s no such thing as sin. If there’s no such thing as sin, then what are we to repent of and what did Jesus come to die for? If relativism is true, then Jesus died for nothing. But we all know that relativism is a philosophical fallacy that can be disproven fairly easily. You did know that, right?

 

[TrustInTheLord]

JSmitty2005:

How do you know?

The Bible didn’t just fall out of Heaven one day. Jesus Christ didn’t write anything down nor did He ask any of the Apostles to write anything down, so why do you put all your trust in the Bible? He left us with 12 men to lead His teaching Church, not a book.

Are you saying th bible is just a book? Maybe to you that is all, but to me it is more then that, It is Holy and if you ever read what JESUS and his apostles went through you wouldn’t say it is nothing. The bible didn’t fell from the sky it was written by Jesus apostles, and they were chosen by God.

When you buy a computer do you just throw away the manual? i don’t think so, you probably would need that right? I may assume you would read through it for all the right reasons. I don’t understand why you can’t see the big picture, i rather put my trust on God’s chosen apostles then on MEN alone who is not chosen by God himself!

 

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

Who would you like to follow the church, the Pope or The Lord JESUS?

Jesus, the Church, and the Pope are not all mutually exclusive. You’re forming a false dichotomy of either Jesus or the Church/pope. It doesn’t work that way, as I’ve clarified above.

 

[TrustInTheLord]

exoflare:

Oh, boo-hoo…

Now why don’t you actually face the questions you were given rather than evading them.

GOD BLESS

 

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

Are you saying th bible is just a book?

I don’t recall saying any such thing. The Bible is not a book though, it’s a library.

Maybe to you that is all, but to me it is more then that, It is Holy and if you ever read what JESUS and his apostles went through you wouldn’t say it is nothing. The bible didn’t fell from the sky it was written by Jesus apostles, and they were chosen by God.

Actually Luke, Mark, Jude, and James were all not Apostles. Paul wasn’t one of the 12 either. They were all disciples of the Apostles though. And they were all MEN ALONE. Of the Apostles, only a few of them decided to write anything so it obviously wasn’t on the top of their priorities.

When you buy a computer do you just throw away the manual? i don’t think so, you probably would need that right? I may assume you would read through it for all the right reasons.

I don’t understand the comparison you’re trying to make. What’s the computer? (Do you mean Christianity?) Obviously you’re trying to say that the Bible is the manual which is a poor comparison considering that it wasn’t always around. In fact, it wasn’t compiled in the canon that we have (at least the one us Catholics have) until the Council of Hippo (AD 393) and the Council of Carthage (AD 397) and then approved by…guess who?..the pope! You see, by putting your faith in the Bible alone, you’re really trusting the Church whether you realize it or not. On the other hand, by putting our faith in the Church, Bible, and Sacred Tradition, Catholics are really trusting Our Lord Jesus Christ because He promised that His Church would be led into all truth.

I don’t understand why you can’t see the big picture, i rather put my trust on God’s chosen apostles then on MEN alone who is not chosen by God himself!

I don’t understand why you can’t see the big picture either! So you’ll put your trust in the Apostles who were chosen by God even though they were men alone but you reject the idea that any kind of similar office (specifically that of bishop) would continue in their stead after they died? That just seems unreasonable. I don’t think that God would just leave us hanging.

 

[TrustInTheLord]

exoflare:

LOL there is only one person on here that is confused, so don’t worry about it.

“Because God would want us to” based on what… something your pastor told you? You didn’t answer us where Jesus ever mentioned the Bible anyway. By your own “logic” you are putting your pastor’s word over Jesus!

By the way, in the Bible, Jesus tells the apostles to call no man “teacher” as you have just done… how do you respond to that?

I think you need to read the bible again, it says call no man FATHER. Okay now. Doesn’t the Catholic church have priests? Hmm…you call the priest FATHER. Why is it sinful to call someone TEACHER! God is the only FATHER. You don’t make sense at all. Why would JESUS tell us to read the bible, isn’t obvious already that is the only wayfor all of us to find the truth. God chosen 12 apostles for JESUS, and they wrote about the Lord Jesus teachings. You really need help on this. I can see you don’t even know what you are saying. But i hope and pray you will someday understand.

 

[Eden]

TrustInTheLord:

Like i said i don’t need anybody’s approval, and I am not going to play GOD. My own mother who is raised as a catholic all her life respects my faith. Why are you judging me?


I did not leave the church, i would still go to a Catholic church with my family, i just found another church that teaches more about the bible. And i like it. Is that a sin against God?

I know not to put anyone down, as Jesus taught us to love one another, i will do as he says.

So, has TrustInTheLord answered whether or not he has the charism of infallibility? I’ve tried to wade through all of this and all I see are buzzwords to avoid answering such as the infamous “judging”.

If you have answered that whether or not you have infallibility on matters of faith and morals already, TITL, please direct me to the post number.

 

[JSmitty2005]

TrustInTheLord:

I think you need to read the bible again, it says call no man FATHER. Okay now. Doesn’t the Catholic church have priests? Hmm…you call the priest FATHER. Why is it sinful to call someone TEACHER! God is the only FATHER. You don’t make sense at all.

Actually if you read it in its context it says, “But you are not to be called ‘rabbi,’ for you have one teacher, and you are all brethren. And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. Neither be called ‘masters,’ for you have one master, the Christ” (Matt. 23:8–10) So, if you’re going to take it literally, you can’t call anyone rabbi (or teacher), father, or master. This includes your biological father too. I don’t think that this is the way that it was to be interpreted though considering that Jesus called Abraham our father and Paul (I think it was him) said that he had become a father to his disciples. You don’t make sense at all. It would be hipocritical to only interpret that one verse that way and not the rest. Read this.

Why would JESUS tell us to read the bible, isn’t obvious already that is the only wayfor all of us to find the truth. God chosen 12 apostles for JESUS, and they wrote about the Lord Jesus teachings.

No, it’s not really that obvious at all to me. You have yet to make a case for the Bible alone. As I said before, not all 12 wrote anything. Actually very few of them wrote anything. Furthermore, there are “non-Apostles” that have their writings in the Bible. What’s up with that?

You really need help on this. I can see you don’t even know what you are saying. But i hope and pray you will someday understand.

I think you’re the one in need of help. You’re the one that seems to not know what you’re saying probably because you’re not sure what you believe. I hope and pray that some day you will come to know the Truth.

 

[Eden]

TrustInTheLord:

I think you need to read the bible again, it says call no man FATHER. Okay now. Doesn’t the Catholic church have priests? Hmm…you call the priest FATHER. Why is it sinful to call someone TEACHER! God is the only FATHER. You don’t make sense at all. Why would JESUS tell us to read the bible, isn’t obvious already that is the only wayfor all of us to find the truth. God chosen 12 apostles for JESUS, and they wrote about the Lord Jesus teachings. You really need help on this. I can see you don’t even know what you are saying. But i hope and pray you will someday understand.

All of your questions are addressed in the CA library. For instance, call no man father:

catholic.com/library/call_no_man_father.asp

I think you think you are presenting something new.
But the Church has been answering heresies for almost 2,000 years. And do-it-yourself Christians come here and make the same arguments over and over on these forums without researching at CA before posting.

 

[TrustInTheLord]

JSmitty2005:

I don’t recall saying any such thing. The Bible is not a book though, it’s a library.

Actually Luke, Mark, Jude, and James were all not Apostles. Paul wasn’t one of the 12 either. They were all disciples of the Apostles though. And they were all MEN ALONE. Of the Apostles, only a few of them decided to write anything so it obviously wasn’t on the top of their priorities.

I don’t understand the comparison you’re trying to make. What’s the computer? (Do you mean Christianity?) Obviously you’re trying to say that the Bible is the manual which is a poor comparison considering that it wasn’t always around. In fact, it wasn’t compiled in the canon that we have (at least the one us Catholics have) until the Council of Hippo (AD 393) and the Council of Carthage (AD 397) and then approved by…guess who?..the pope! You see, by putting your faith in the Bible alone, you’re really trusting the Church whether you realize it or not. On the other hand, by putting our faith in the Church, Bible, and Sacred Tradition, Catholics are really trusting Our Lord Jesus Christ because He promised that His Church would be led into all truth.

I don’t understand why you can’t see the big picture either! So you’ll put your trust in the Apostles who were chosen by God even though they were men alone but you reject the idea that any kind of similar office (specifically that of bishop) would continue in their stead after they died? That just seems unreasonable. I don’t think that God would just leave us hanging.

I can see it is obvious we will never see eye to eye, so let’s just end this madness.

I still have much to learn about our God, and his son the Lord Jesus, all i know is that i want my soul to go to heaven when i die.

I have much respect for the Catholic believers, even if i don’t agree on their teachings. I like the Lord JESUS teachings made more sense to me.

All the church that believes in God and his son the lord Jesus is my family.

 

[Eden]

Since you use the Bible as your sole guidebook to faith, I would encourage you to research who set the canon of scripture, how they determined which writings were inspired, and what year the canon was set.

You do realize that the Bible did not drop out of the sky, right? I think this history will be useful in your search.

God bless.

 

[TrustInTheLord]

Eden:

All of your questions are addressed in the CA library. For instance, call no man father:

catholic.com/library/call_no_man_father.asp

I think you think you are presenting something new.
But the Church has been answering heresies for almost 2,000 years. And do-it-yourself Christians come here and make the same arguments over and over on these forums without researching at CA before posting.

Yea i was just answering someone else’s question who says that call noone teacher. Okay. I just corrected the person. Where have you been? Please i am not fighting here. So let’s not cut my head off again.