Tolerance is satans message

[kev7]

pnewton:

Gotcha. I see what you are saying in regard to sin and tolerance as presented by the media. Let me give a different perspective.

Love of neighbor is an action, not emotion. Often we may not feel any affection toward people whom we are called to love. Tolerance may, in some cases, be the only action we have to express charity to our neighbor. In some circumstances, specific acts of charity may be required. In either case, we should not be judged too much by our emotions over which we have only limited control, as much as our actions.

I think that in order to act upon love Jesus must first be in your heart. You must be filled with the Holy Spirit. That is an emotional experience
You can not act in the manner that Jesus wants without first opening your heart (not your mind) to him.

Tolerance is never an action or an emotion that you should show toward your neighbour. If you are at a loss at what to do with a person (or a sinner) then you must first look into your heart. When you do that you will realize how important it is to pray for them. That act alone is the most powerfull thing you can do. It is the most pure act of charity granted by God.

 

[Other_Eric]

kev7:

Let me put it this way.

Jesus teaches us to love everyone. He also teaches us to reject sin and satan.

If you chose to tolerate someone for their racial, religious, and or cultural differences then you are not following the model christ set forth.

There is a big difference between tolerating someone and loving and praying for them.

We do not tolerate satan. We reject satan and we love our.
Neighbor.

I used to listen to the tolerance retoric proliferated by the media, but now I see it for what it is.

In other words, Satan would rather not see you change your heart. He would much rather see you stay the way you are. When he tells you to be tolerant of others you don’t have to change your heart. All you have to do is accept his evil in the world and practice pluralism and modern relativism. The message is very similar to that of Jesus but it is corupted and twisted.

When was the last time you heard the media say that we should love one another and pray for them?

Sorry, but I just don’t see jesus tolerating those who pursecuted him. I see him loving and praying for them.

Hi kev7!

I think you’ve set up for yourself a false dichotomy. Because I am tolerating someone’s sin does not mean that I approve of it nor does it mean I have ceased to pray for their ultimate conversion. If tolerance is not to be the standard by which we deal with the sins of others and this is the example of Christ, how does one square that with Christ tolerating Himself being nailed to a cross? Certainly the actions of many during the Passion were sinful and Christ, being God, was in a position to do something rather extraordinary about it but He didn’t. Not only did He tolerate this gross injustice but this tolerance did not prevent Him from praying for the forgiveness of His tormentors.

Moreover, I think tolerance, properly understood, compels change within us. It forces us to be patient when things go wrong. It prevents us from rashly taking matters into our own hands and teaches us to rely on God. You are right in that the media has twisted this virtue into something entirely different. The challenge is not to confuse the twisted element with the original virtue.

 

[UnworthySoul]

G.K. Chesterton said, “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” Very true.

 

[Other_Eric]

UnworthySoul:

G.K. Chesterton said, “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” Very true.

Hi UnworthySoul!

Yes, that is one meaning. It can also be the virtue of the humble, can’t it?

 

[UnworthySoul]

Other Eric:

Hi UnworthySoul!

Yes, that is one meaning. It can also be the virtue of the humble, can’t it?

Not in the way we are told to tolerate every pet cause that comes along these days. The truth is many people would rather hide or flat out give up their convictions and principles as long as they are not seen as “mean” or “close-minded” or some other such nonsensical notion of political correctness.

I most certainly do NOT have to be “tolerant” of something that goes against my core convictions. I believe in the Catholic Church, I believe the Catholic Church holds the eternal Truth. I will NOT reject that Truth because someone’s feelings might get hurt.

To those who would put their beliefs aside because they are afraid of what people will think of them, I ask you this: “Why are you Catholic if you are ashamed to be discovered as such? Who can stand against you if you ally yourself with God?”

Humility is something to strive for, but it should NEVER be achieved by betraying the Truth, which is found in the Catholic Church. And certainly not because of some warped idea of moral relativism that proposes the concept that there is no right or wrong.

No, I have convictions, therefore I will not tolerate. I will be courteous and as respectful as is warranted, but I will not concede my convictions because of someone’s feelings.

Truth exists independent of anyone’s personal assent.

 

[kev7]

Other Eric:

Hi kev7!

I think you’ve set up for yourself a false dichotomy. Because I am tolerating someone’s sin does not mean that I approve of it nor does it mean I have ceased to pray for their ultimate conversion. If tolerance is not to be the standard by which we deal with the sins of others and this is the example of Christ, how does one square that with Christ tolerating Himself being nailed to a cross? Certainly the actions of many during the Passion were sinful and Christ, being God, was in a position to do something rather extraordinary about it but He didn’t. Not only did He tolerate this gross injustice but this tolerance did not prevent Him from praying for the forgiveness of His tormentors.

Moreover, I think tolerance, properly understood, compels change within us. It forces us to be patient when things go wrong. It prevents us from rashly taking matters into our own hands and teaches us to rely on God. You are right in that the media has twisted this virtue into something entirely different. The challenge is not to confuse the twisted element with the original virtue.

Where is your faith?

Why should a man who loves God and the virtues of Jesus be tolerant of the Virtues of Satan?

Tolerance is not the virtue that we use to deal with sin. It is also not a virtue period! In order to deal with sin you must love the person and reject the sin. You must not be tolerant of sin! Dealing with people who sin isn’t easy and if you have Jesus in your heart sin will bother you (as it should). The more you love your neighbor the more their sin will bother you and the more you will pray for them. The virtue that you must have is faith (not tolerance). You must be patience with the will of God and the power of the Holy Spirit. All you can do is with a sinner you have tried to reason with is pray and have faith in God and forgiveness. It is in fact your intolerance for sin that will allow you to implant the seed in their minds. It is the Holy Spirit that will make it grow and it is your prayers and your faith that will provide its nourishment. Tolerance does not help you with this only Faith does. The more you have faith in God the more you will have Patience - one cannot exist without the other. Remember, Jesus took peter out again to catch more fish. It was only his faith in Jesus that allowed him to actually catch something. Peter did not simply tolerate his empty boat he showed faith in Jesus.

When Jesus died on the cross he took the sins of the world upon him. At the same time he loved all those who persecuted him. He also loved the world so much that he chose not to take away the choice that God originally gave man. If he acted and prevented evil from harming him he would of taken away the love that god has provided man. God loves us so much that he is not willing to take away our freedom of choice. All of us have the choice to reject God and we only have that choice because God loves us.

Jesus knew that he must endure the suffering of Satan in order to change the world. He was ready and prepared for it and it was a fate that he willingly accepted with love. The reason why Jesus refused to act an stop them is because he loved them (he did not simply tolerate them). Remember, he forgave them all just before he died. He did not say to his father in heaven, “Lord tolerate them for they know not what they do”. He said, “Lord forgive them for they know not what hey do”.

It is not tolerance that helps us to change it is faith and forgiveness.

 

[Other_Eric]

kev7:

Where is your faith?

Why should a man who loves God and the virtues of Jesus be tolerant of the Virtues of Satan?

Tolerance is not the virtue that we use to deal with sin. It is also not a virtue period! In order to deal with sin you must love the person and reject the sin. You must not be tolerant of sin! Dealing with people who sin isn’t easy and if you have Jesus in your heart sin will bother you (as it should). The more you love your neighbor the more their sin will bother you and the more you will pray for them. The virtue that you must have is faith (not tolerance). You must be patience with the will of God and the power of the Holy Spirit. All you can do is with a sinner you have tried to reason with is pray and have faith in God and forgiveness. It is in fact your intolerance for sin that will allow you to implant the seed in their minds. It is the Holy Spirit that will make it grow and it is your prayers and your faith that will provide its nourishment. Tolerance does not help you with this only Faith does. The more you have faith in God the more you will have Patience - one cannot exist without the other. Remember, Jesus took peter out again to catch more fish. It was only his faith in Jesus that allowed him to actually catch something. Peter did not simply tolerate his empty boat he showed faith in Jesus.

When Jesus died on the cross he took the sins of the world upon him. At the same time he loved all those who persecuted him. He also loved the world so much that he chose not to take away the choice that God originally gave man. If he acted and prevented evil from harming him he would of taken away the love that god has provided man. God loves us so much that he is not willing to take away our freedom of choice. All of us have the choice to reject God and we only have that choice because God loves us.

Jesus knew that he must endure the suffering of Satan in order to change the world. He was ready and prepared for it and it was a fate that he willingly accepted with love. The reason why Jesus refused to act an stop them is because he loved them (he did not simply tolerate them). Remember, he forgave them all just before he died. He did not say to his father in heaven, “Lord tolerate them for they know not what they do”. He said, “Lord forgive them for they know not what hey do”.

It is not tolerance that helps us to change it is faith and forgiveness.

Hi kev7!

Well, it appears to me that all you are doing is playing games with words. God permits or tolerates the existence of sin through free will. Carried to the extreme, your scheme makes even God satanic because he tolerates the existence of sin.

If you define tolerance as approval, then you may have a point. However, if you define tolerance as the patience necessary for living in a fallen world, then it is something else. This does not mean that we approve, it does not mean that we cease to pray, it does not even mean that we do not reject the sins of others. Instead we convert the sinner, instruct the ignorant, counsel the doubtful, comfort the sorrowful, bear wrongs patiently, forgive injuries, and pray for the living and the dead.

 

[Ahimsa]

kev7:

Jew_Man_73:

If you chose to tolerate someone for their racial, religious, and or cultural differences then you are not following the model christ set forth.

The reason I included racial in my post was to make a point about people who are only tolerating those of other races. If you are doing that then you are not following the model that Christ set forth. You are following the tolerance message of Satan.

Jesus would haveus love our neighbour regarless of race. Satan would have you simply tolerate them.

The message I hear all the time on TV is you must tolerate people of other races, cultures, religions, and sexual preference.

That is an evil message.

Maybe you should turn off the TV.

 

[LSK]

encounterbooks.com/books/pode/podep.html

This is a book review of the work by Anne Hendershott entitled The Politics of Deviance. Professor Hendershott maintains that, as society loses its ability to define certain behaviors as ‘outside the norm’ for fear of being exclusive and unfeeling towards the needs and wants of the few, society loses its ability to function in a cohesive manner. I read this book and I was very impressed by her conclusions. I think we have, because of the catch word ‘tolerance’, thrown the proverbial baby out with the bathwater. Rather than being clear as to our parameters of what will or will not be tolerated by society we have given legal standing and minority status to behaviors and practices that are truly harmful to us as a whole.

Or somethin’ like that…:whacky:

 

[kev7]

Other Eric:

Hi kev7!

Well, it appears to me that all you are doing is playing games with words. God permits or tolerates the existence of sin through free will. Carried to the extreme, your scheme makes even God satanic because he tolerates the existence of sin.

If you define tolerance as approval, then you may have a point. However, if you define tolerance as the patience necessary for living in a fallen world, then it is something else. This does not mean that we approve, it does not mean that we cease to pray, it does not even mean that we do not reject the sins of others. Instead we convert the sinner, instruct the ignorant, counsel the doubtful, comfort the sorrowful, bear wrongs patiently, forgive injuries, and pray for the living and the dead.

It is the choice of man that creates sin in the world. Sin is spawned from the rejection of God. When man rejects God all manner of sin occurs. God is not responsible for evil and he did not create evil.

Christ is the word of God and he existed before the world was created. The light of Christ does not tolerate darkness. It overpowers evil every time. There is nothing for God to tolerate; the only thing evil can do is hide from God.

When you close your eyes to the light of Christ then it is you that are the instigator of sin. Even if you try to hide from God his light remains. His light will not tolerate any degree of darkness. When you die you will always feel the light of God and if you reject him you will only have yourself to blame for the pain that you feel. Closing your eyes and your heart to God does not affect him and therefore there is nothing that God has to tolerate.

Christ does not tolerate rejection. He loves us all and he always will. His love defeats all your sins and his mercy will destroy the sin. When you love someone you don’t tolerate them. You either love them or you don’t. When you suggest that God tolerates the sinner you are saying that his love is imperfect. Gods love is perfect and it holds no list of rights or wrongs. You can’t have true love for someone if you harbor such a list.

I think that you would agree with me that you can’t love your neighbor if you harbor a list of rights and wrongs. Tolerance implies that there is something about you that the other person doesn’t like.

When you suggest that God has to tolerate the sinner you are placing limits on the power of the Holy Spirit.

My God is all powerful and his light defeats the darkness every time. Light does not tolerate darkness.

In the Kingdom of God tolerance is not a virtue and it is not required. In the Kingdom of God there is nothing to tolerate. Jesus says that the Kingdom of God is at hand. What he means is that everyone should hold the Kingdom of God in their hearts, if you do, there is no need for Tolerance and there is only love.

 

[kev7]

Ahimsa:

kev7:

Jew_Man_73:

Maybe you should turn off the TV.

Yeah. well you are right I should. Regardless, TV and any form of media can change the way people think.

I just wanted to point out that the concept of Tolerating your Neighbors is not the word of god. It is the counterfeit word of Satan.

 

[Other_Eric]

kev7:

It is the choice of man that creates sin in the world. Sin is spawned from the rejection of God. When man rejects God all manner of sin occurs. God is not responsible for evil and he did not create evil.

Christ is the word of God and he existed before the world was created. The light of Christ does not tolerate darkness. It overpowers evil every time. There is nothing for God to tolerate; the only thing evil can do is hide from God.

When you close your eyes to the light of Christ then it is you that are the instigator of sin. Even if you try to hide from God his light remains. His light will not tolerate any degree of darkness. When you die you will always feel the light of God and if you reject him you will only have yourself to blame for the pain that you feel. Closing your eyes and your heart to God does not affect him and therefore there is nothing that God has to tolerate.

Christ does not tolerate rejection. He loves us all and he always will. His love defeats all your sins and his mercy will destroy the sin. When you love someone you don’t tolerate them. You either love them or you don’t. When you suggest that God tolerates the sinner you are saying that his love is imperfect. Gods love is perfect and it holds no list of rights or wrongs. You can’t have true love for someone if you harbor such a list.

I think that you would agree with me that you can’t love your neighbor if you harbor a list of rights and wrongs. Tolerance implies that there is something about you that the other person doesn’t like.

When you suggest that God has to tolerate the sinner you are placing limits on the power of the Holy Spirit.

My God is all powerful and his light defeats the darkness every time. Light does not tolerate darkness.

In the Kingdom of God tolerance is not a virtue and it is not required. In the Kingdom of God there is nothing to tolerate. Jesus says that the Kingdom of God is at hand. What he means is that everyone should hold the Kingdom of God in their hearts, if you do, there is no need for Tolerance and there is only love.

Hi kev7!

Look, it’s very simple. If God did not tolerate evil, then it would not exist. If God could not tolerate the rejection of His creation, then we would not have that option. There would be no free will.

 

[john_ennis]

Other Eric:

Hi kev7!

What would the alternative to tolerance be in real, practical terms? If tolerance is the process by which we learn to put up with someone we would otherwise dislike, why would this necessarily be a counterfeit by Satan? Isn’t it a subset of the Christian virtue of patience? Does the practice of tolerance somehow preclude praying for our enemies and loving our neighbor?

Perhaps, what you mean, is that you dislike the confusion of tolerance with acceptance.

Just as “gay” has become an entirely new word, so has “tolerance,” in many instances. Yes, it used to mean a particular manifestation of patience, and of charity. Things which bothered us, but were in fact not evil, we tolerated.

Now, it usually means we should not consider to be wrong what we know to be wrong. Often, it doesn’t even merely mean we should allow others to live as they like; it means we shouldn’t even SAY an act is wrong, if others are doing it.

In that sense, “tolerance” is a different word–a word at odds with Truth.

Peace.
John

 

[kev7]

Other Eric:

Hi kev7!

Look, it’s very simple. If God did not tolerate evil, then it would not exist. If God could not tolerate the rejection of His creation, then we would not have that option. There would be no free will.

Gods Love for us is intolerant of evil and that evil is defeated eternally. When you suggest that God is waiting around watching the clock and tolerating us you are placing limits on God.

God existed before time and is therefore not subject to it.
The word of God (Christ) existed before the creation and therfore evill always was defeated and it always will be defeated.

 

[pnewton]

kev7:

Gods Love for us is intolerant of evil and that evil is defeated eternally. When you suggest that God is waiting around watching the clock and tolerating us you are placing limits on God.

God is not waiting for the clock to tick off yes evil is ultimately defeated. But God is a long-suffering. God’s grace is greater than all the evil in the world. Call it what you will, but if God did not tolerate our stubborn hearts* for a time*, we would none escape but be would have been zapped to Hell long ago.

 

[kev7]

pnewton:

God is not waiting for the clock to tick off yes evil is ultimately defeated. But God is a long-suffering. God’s grace is greater than all the evil in the world. Call it what you will, but if God did not tolerate our stubborn hearts* for a time*, we would none escape but be would have been zapped to Hell long ago.

The names of those who will be saved were written in the book of life long before creation.

God does not have to tolerate a seed that falls on the rocks. It simply does not grow. The seeds that accept God grow and it is that simple.

God exists outside of time so there is nothing for him to tolerate.

Satan is the only one who has anything to tolerate. He has to tolerate the light of God. Satan is of this world and he is subject to time. God is not.

 

[kev7]

john ennis:

Just as “gay” has become an entirely new word, so has “tolerance,” in many instances. Yes, it used to mean a particular manifestation of patience, and of charity. Things which bothered us, but were in fact not evil, we tolerated.

Now, it usually means we should not consider to be wrong what we know to be wrong. Often, it doesn’t even merely mean we should allow others to live as they like; it means we shouldn’t even SAY an act is wrong, if others are doing it.

In that sense, “tolerance” is a different word–a word at odds with Truth.

Peace.
John

I agree, tolerance has a whole different meaning today .

 

[Other_Eric]

kev7:

I agree, tolerance has a whole different meaning today .

Hi kev7!

Ok, so let’s say that the word tolerance is hopelessly lost. Let’s articulate policy. Let’s say a sinner moves in next door. How does your tolerance-free ethic require you to respond to him?

 

[UnworthySoul]

Your above question is a fallacious one. Tolerance does not equate with acceptance. The same Church teachings of how we are to treat homosexuals applies here. Treat them with respect as human beings but do not give legitimacy to their actions.

 

[pnewton]

kev7:

The names of those who will be saved were written in the book of life long before creation.
…God exists outside of time so there is nothing for him to tolerate.

.

We are not outside of time. We sin over and over confessing the same sins and committing the same sins and still do not diminish the mercy of God. The perfection of Christian tolerance is found in the phrase, “Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.”

Tolerance is not (as Elizabeth out it) the golden standard, but neither should it be dismissed as a way station on the path to perfection. In Eric’s scenario, how do we respond to the homosexual, co-habiting couple or drug addict? Are we so intolerant with the sin that we sacrifice the sinner? Thanks be to God that he has not done that with us.

I am not ready to give in to media abuse of a perfectly good term. How many times must we forgive our brother?

70 X 7

Sounds pretty tolerant to me.