Transgender Bathroom Situation

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exnihilo said:
A man who pretends to be a woman because he really thinks he is a woman is safer than a man who pretends to be a woman but thinks he is a man? Personally I don’t see how either is better.
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Well, a man who believes he is woman (one not interested in having sex with women, but thinks he is a woman) is less likely to sexually assault a woman.
Why does the dress make a difference? Why is it ‘transgender’ people need to put on the culturally dependent clothing of the sex they think they are? If all that matters is that they think they are a woman why can’t everything remain the same? Why can’t a transgender keep his beard and wear pants? It’s like the greater the deception the better it is. Which seems odd. Also it reduces womanhood to clothing and makeup.
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Hey, I’m not defending the notion that a man who believes he is a woman is a woman. He’s sexually confused and needs professional help to straighten out his confusion. But, that’s no longer allowed, or soon won’t be allowed, if the genderless agenda people get their way. It’s not up to me to defend their reasoning, with which I don’t agree. 😉

Personal revulsion is natural, I agree–but it should be for the depravity, not for the person. And, I certainly don’t trust people who are living such delusions, as I stated in my first post. It’s a good reason to keep women’s restrooms exclusively for females–real females.
 
Saphire said:
Thank you everyone for replying. I’m beginning to feel a little bit at ease hearing from other Catholics on the subject. I would have to say that I am uncomfortable around the transgendered because I fear them. I don’t know why I fear them other than they give the impression that it’s ok to make fun of life to the point of drastically changing your appearance. Life is not a joke. I’m female, so a man transgendering to a female makes me think he’s saying “Ha, ha. Look at me. I can be just like you.”, and then laugh some more. I feel the same way about a woman transgendering into a man. Maybe I’m imaging things or being judgmental. Either way, this all makes me run to Jesus.
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You don’t sound hateful, but you do sound irrational.

There’s no reason to fear them. They are not making fun of you, it’s not about you at all. (I’m saying this with love)

They are unfortunately afflicted with gender dysphoria, which makes them extremely uncomfortable in their bodies. They are going through something very difficult and honestly, it’s heartbreaking. They are so uncomfortable that they would spend a lot of money on changing their bodies to ease their discomfort. And even after that, they are not fully ‘okay’. High suicide rates are common. Believe me, they aren’t doing this to ‘make fun of life’.
 
Lea101 said:
I don’t know if you are being like this on purpose but…

A man dressing up as a woman to ogle at girls in the bathroom is not the same as a man dressing up as a woman because of gender dysphoria. As a woman, I’m telling you I would rather have the latter because he has no intention of hurting or objectifying me. Of course I would rather have only women in the room, but yes, there is a ‘better’ situation. A transgender over a pervert any day.

‘uncomfortable’ was the word used. Anyway. If the person is mentally ill and NOT DANGEROUS, I wouldn’t feel uncomfortable at all. Sympathetic would be a more accurate word to use. If you can’t have a loving conversation with them, you should honestly reflect. Aren’t we supposed to love radically, or does it only apply to certain groups of people?
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Most guys who ogle don’t plan to hurt women. Most guys who ogle aren’t perverts, unless you are going to say all ogling is perverted. I do think it is perverted to want to dress as a woman to get into the woman’s room. But it is just as perverted if the man thinks he is a man or thinks he is a woman.

In reality you don’t know if any person is mentally ill or dangerous. A good rule of thumb used to be men who try to get into the women’s room have a problem. I think that still holds universally.
 
Della said:
Well, a man who believes he is woman (one not interested in having sex with women, but thinks he is a woman) is less likely to sexually assault a woman.
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Just because a man thinks he is a woman doesn’t mean he doesn’t want to have sex with a woman. There are plenty of lesbians even among men who think they are a woman. I don’t really know that a transgender is less likely to sexually assault anyone. These people I think are associated with a fair amount of violence. It is the same with homosexuals, but it is improper to point this out.

I know you aren’t defending this but I think it is too easy to give in to the false narrative and be too accepting of this.
Lea101 said:
You don’t sound hateful, but you do sound irrational.
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What a topsy-turvy world where the man who thinks he is a woman is the rational one and the woman who doesn’t like that is irrational.
 
exnihilo said:
Most guys who ogle don’t plan to hurt women. Most guys who ogle aren’t perverts, unless you are going to say all ogling is perverted. I do think it is perverted to want to dress as a woman to get into the woman’s room. But it is just as perverted if the man thinks he is a man or thinks he is a woman.

In reality you don’t know if any person is mentally ill or dangerous. A good rule of thumb used to be men who try to get into the women’s room have a problem. I think that still holds universally.
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I disagree. Both have a problem, but it’s not the same problem. Look at it consistently. A man entering to ogle at women vs a man entering to pee. To say that they’re on the same level is to be obtuse.

We are talking about men who ogle at women in women’s bathrooms. That’s perverted behavior.

You’re focusing on the fact that a man is in the bathroom. I’m focusing on the intention. After all, if I’m going to be annoying about it, there are reasons for a man to enter the ladies’ room that do not make him a creep.
 
Saphire said:
I have a problem sharing a bathroom with a transgendered person. That is not the case happening now, but if I had too, I would chose to leave the bathroom and come back at a later time. I spoke about this to another Catholic who accused me of not loving God. To love God is to love everyone. I told him, it’s not a matter of loving a transgendered person, it’s my inability to socialize with a transgendered to the point of refusing to share a bathroom with someone like that. It’s too much to ask of me right now. They make me uncomfortable. He said that I was still being unGodly. Is this true of me? Do I have to force myself to be able to socialize with the transgendered and conform to sharing a bathroom with them to be Godly? :confused:
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Refusing to share a bathroom with someone of the opposite sex suffering from transgenderism is charitable. Doing otherwise would be to affirm the other in their disordered mental state and prolong their suffering.

Would one tell a kleptomaniac that stealing is moral?
 
exnihilo said:
I don’t really know that a transgender is less likely to sexually assault anyone. .
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I’m sorry, but a transgender in a dress is more likely to be assaulted than a woman is by a transgender.
 
exnihilo said:
What a topsy-turvy world where the man who thinks he is a woman is the rational one and the woman who doesn’t like that is irrational.
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What a reach! I admit I actually laughed out loud at this. I didn’t say the man is rational. OP said that she fears them because she thinks they are making fun of life.

But sure, anything to fit your weird narrative, right? :rolleyes:
 
From what I have read, if someone, man, transgender, or woman, wishes to commit a crime in the bathroom, be it peeping, beating, or even murder, the presence of a “ladies only” sign on the door does not stop them. They go right ahead with their dirty work. With respect to safety of the bathroom, I generally look more at its location, whether there is someone like a store employee or guard within shouting distance, whether the bathroom is busy with many folks going in and out and waiting outside, etc. than at who is going in. If the bathroom is deserted or located in an unsafe spot I will hesitate to use it unless I am having a dire emergency.

I have already used many unisex bathrooms over the last 30 years and my only concern with the “unisex” aspect is that men seem to generally be messier than women in terms of their bathroom use. But I have definitely seen many ladies-only bathrooms that appeared very unsafe in terms of their location, lighting, etc. and I avoided them.
 
Lea101 said:
I disagree. Both have a problem, but it’s not the same problem. Look at it consistently. A man entering to ogle at women vs a man entering to pee. To say that they’re on the same level is to be obtuse.

We are talking about men who ogle at women in women’s bathrooms. That’s perverted behavior.

You’re focusing on the fact that a man is in the bathroom. I’m focusing on the intention. After all, if I’m going to be annoying about it, there are reasons for a man to enter the ladies’ room that do not make him a creep.
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I agree not every man in the ladies room is wrong. But I think it is perverted for a man who thinks he is a woman to use it even if to relieve himself. Because he isn’t just relieving himself he is getting some gratification out of using a bathroom different from his sex.
IWantGod said:
I’m sorry, but a transgender in a dress is more likely to be assaulted than a woman is by a transgender.
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Maybe so. But my point was transgender people themselves probably commit a lot of violence. They are probably more violent than the average person.
Lea101 said:
What a reach! I admit I actually laughed out loud at this. I didn’t say the man is rational. OP said that she fears them because she thinks they are making fun of life.

But sure, anything to fit your weird narrative, right? :rolleyes:
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Fair enough. My apologies.
 
exnihilo said:
Maybe so. But my point was transgender people themselves probably commit a lot of violence. They are probably more violent than the average person.
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Do you have a source for this?

Have you known any transgender people and if so, how many and did they fit this idea you have in your head?

I have known probably 5 or 10 of them and all of them were primarily concerned with not having violence done to themselves. None of them were violent towards others. I went to Mass at a historic church for St. Lawrence’s feast day on Thursday and a transgender person I did not know, but who was visibly trans, was at Mass and hung around for the rosary afterwards and did not act violent or threatening.
 
exnihilo said:
I agree not every man in the ladies room is wrong. But I think it is perverted for a man who thinks he is a woman to use it even if to relieve himself. Because he isn’t just relieving himself he is getting some gratification out of using a bathroom different from his sex.

Maybe so. But my point was transgender people themselves probably commit a lot of violence. They are probably more violent than the average person.

Fair enough. My apologies.
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Well, you are judging them from your healthy mind. To them, using the bathroom that’s assigned to their biological sex is the same as me using a men’s bathroom. They feel very uncomfortable. They can’t help it. It’s something that we both won’t experience.
Also, there are also situations worth thinking about: a biological female (who identifies as a man) using a woman’s bathroom would also frighten women (especially since transgender people can really look like the opposite sex). A biological man (who identifies as a woman) using the men’s room, and assuming that it’s clear that he is a man, imagine what would happen to the guy… :confused: he would be assaulted

If you realize, this situation is a lot more complicated than it looks.

Also, you use the word probably. I am not sure about the statistics for your claim but all I know is that the transgender experience violence more. So if you could back your claims with credible statistics so we could see your view, it would be helpful?

&&lastly, no worries.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
Do you have a source for this?
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No. I just think there probably is. Just like I think there is more violence, particularly genital mutilation and canabalism, associated with homosexuals. I concluded this after observing a theme in news articles. I personally don’t rely solely on studies for issues like this due to the political nature of the subject.
 
exnihilo said:
No. I just think there probably is. Just like I think there is more violence, particularly genital mutilation and canabalism, associated with homosexuals. I concluded this after observing a theme in news articles. I personally don’t rely solely on studies for issues like this due to the political nature of the subject.
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News articles are biased towards the sensational. Transgender people living ordinary peaceful lives are not going to be in the news articles. Unfortunately, I can see where this sort of coverage leads people to assume that entire groups of people (not just transgender, but various other groups) “tend to be more violent”, which makes me sad for the many members of such groups who are not violent or scary and are just ordinary people.
 
exnihilo said:
No. I just think there probably is. Just like I think there is more violence, particularly genital mutilation and canabalism, associated with homosexuals. I concluded this after observing a theme in news articles. I personally don’t rely solely on studies for issues like this due to the political nature of the subject.
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Your mind is subject to confirmation bias and heuristics though. Your mind would be just as unreliable, if not more, than Cnn
 
Lea101 said:
You don’t have to share a bathroom with them, but if they make you uncomfortable in general (ie just standing next to them in public or talking to them) …maybe you should explore the reasons why
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Well, there really is no need to explore the reasons why. Perhaps the OP is of the feeling as many people are,that transgenderism is just not right. And therefore, it makes her uncomfortable to be around them. In a world gone PC, I think it only fair that the “opposite view” also be respected by transgender people, and those that think it is completely normal.
 
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