Trickle down economics

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Excessive taxation is unjust according to it as well.

There’s a need for taxation. Not disputing that.
 
Because you can satisfy people’s basic needs and say “you have enough, if you want more go earn it yourself”

When someone has gone and earned things for themselves you cannot take it arbitrarily.

Not really sure why this is a difficult concept to grasp.

What YOU earn, you make the rules for. What someone gets through charity, they are not in charge and can’t decide how much they should get. He who has the gold makes the rules. It’s the way of the world.
 
So should unearned income be subject to at least the same rates and rules as earned income?
 
Not necessarily. Encouraging investment is a good thing. Working class people with 401k’s would be hurt pretty bad if unearned income was taxed as high as earned when they hit retirement
 
JanSobieskiIII said:
Not necessarily. Encouraging investment is a good thing. Working class people with 401k’s would be hurt pretty bad if unearned income was taxed as high as earned when they hit retirement
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Money from 401k’s are taxed at ordinary income rates.
 
If anyone is looking to improve themselves by learning what the Church teaches on the topic, I have a few links. The first is from Our Sunday Visitor following the release of Evangelii Gaudium but Pope Francis.

https://www.osv.com/OSVNewsweekly/B...-Francis-says-economy-should-benefit-all.aspx

This is the encyclical.

http://w2.vatican.va/content/france...sortazione-ap_20131124_evangelii-gaudium.html
We can no longer trust in the unseen forces and the invisible hand of the market. Growth in justice requires more than economic growth, while presupposing such growth: it requires decisions, programmes, mechanisms and processes specifically geared to a better distribution of income, the creation of sources of employment and an integral promotion of the poor which goes beyond a simple welfare mentality. I am far from proposing an irresponsible populism, but the economy can no longer turn to remedies that are a new poison, such as attempting to increase profits by reducing the work force and thereby adding to the ranks of the excluded.
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Finally, if one is going to blow off Pope Francis as some liberal that’s just passing through. This document builds directly on the encyclical of Pope Benedict, which he wrote to build upon an encyclical by Pope Paul VI.

http://w2.vatican.va/content/benedi...ben-xvi_enc_20090629_caritas-in-veritate.html

We can have our own opinion about equality in all things, but the Catholic Church teaches a preferential option for the poor, drawn directly from Sacred Scripture in the history of salvation found in the Old Testament, and drawn from the life and teaching of Jesus in the New.
 
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But that is because it wasn’t taxed when it was put into the plan. Since the theory being that when one takes it out, they will be in a lower tax bracket, they will pay less money in taxes on it
 
sallybutler said:
But that is because it wasn’t taxed when it was put into the plan. Since the theory being that when one takes it out, they will be in a lower tax bracket, they will pay less money in taxes on it
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True. The poster seemed to be claiming that we needed lower tax rates on unearned income in order to get people to put money into 401ks.
 
I am actually of the opinion that unearned income should be taxed at the same rate as earned income, if not higher. 🙂
 
Y’all should read some Milton Friedman and FA Hayek. They’re a good read.
 
sallybutler said:
I am actually of the opinion that unearned income should be taxed at the same rate as earned income, if not higher. 🙂
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Funny thing is interest income is taxed at ordinary income rates but many dividends are not.
 
JanSobieskiIII said:
Because you can satisfy people’s basic needs and say “you have enough, if you want more go earn it yourself”

When someone has gone and earned things for themselves you cannot take it arbitrarily.
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Who said anything about “arbitrary?”
Not really sure why this is a difficult concept to grasp.

What YOU earn, you make the rules for.
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Not true. The super rich do not get to make the rules on his much they get taxed.
 
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jfz178 said:
There is another segment who are not wanting handouts, but rather are looking for opportunities. If the people with money have the same amount of money they always have had, they will spend what they are spending and the opportunities remain the same. If they get more money, they spend/invest more money and that creates opportunity. Ultimately the success of a capitalist economy is based on consumer and investor confidence and the resulting increased desire to spend and invest.
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I think this is definitely an issue, and it points to a bigger problem than just handing money out. There are ways to create opportunities past just giving out money.

One issue that occurs to me though is knowledge asymmetry. I think this is a major issue with the U.S. system of higher education. Are we really going to rely on 18 year olds with no real life experience to be able to predict what’s going to be a good job that they’re going to be good at? I sure was under a lot of misinformation at 18.

So one thing I think could help is a better structure to connect people with opportunities. An opportunity isn’t any good unless the person knows it’s there, believes they have a chance at it, and knows how to take advantage of it. One complaint I’ve made is that many places catering to the poor seem to be confused if asked about anything beyond a low-end, part-time, dead-end job.

Opportunity is also motivating. If I think my options are “stay home on welfare and just get my basic needs met”, or “work my tail off for a low-income jobs and just get my basic needs met”, I’m going to be a lot more inclined towards the former, unless I expect some further future opportunity from the latter.

And of course there’s always exceptions. I’ve mentioned my own life before because I had major health problems very young. That means I end up just starting out, but having something that both puts some limits on my working abilities and is a major extra expense. In that case my opportunities are going to be a lot harder, or I’ll need extra support to have the same opportunities someone without those problems would.

It also means that encouraging things that help the poor is a viable strategy. One issue around here is that it’s more profitable to build high-value condos than regular apartment buildings. But to make those profitable they have to charge higher rents. So those with lower incomes have to live farther out and spend more time commuting and more money on gas in order to get a good rental. Housing near the jobs and a good public transit system would effectively give the working poor more money and better job options.

We also have to remember, 50% of the population will be below the mean. There will always be a bottom 10% even if everyone works as hard as they can, because that’s what “bottom 10% means”. So we have to be careful, because the fact that there’s an opportunity for someone doesn’t mean there’s an opportunity for everyone.
 
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