True Sabbath Day

[jimmy]

SDA2RC:

Jimmy,
I agree… that is why I said in communion through either perfectly or imperfectly. However, not all protestant baptism is valid, and the point that I was referring to was someone who said that all who believe in Christ are part of the Church. One is only part of the church through her communion with the Church… not through belief. Many protestants are in an imperfect communion with the church or partial communion with teh church, they are certainly part of the Church, then again, they do more than just believe, their sacrament of baptism must be valid etc.

Hope that I am making myself clear as mud… LOL But I think we pretty much agree!

Brandon

You are clear as mud . I agree 100% with the whole post.

 

[twagler]

The Bible does NOT say he rose on the first day. It says he was gone already.

 

[SDA2RC]

twagler:

The Sabbath was made for MAN, not man for the Sabbath. This does not say made for the Jews.
Okay I will try to explain this again. You must read CAREFULLY. John 19:14 says it was preparation of the Passover, NOT the weekly Sabbath.
Now read Mark 16:1. “And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might annoint him.”
Luke 23:56
“And they returned, and prepared spies and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.”
Do you see? They bought the spices after the sabbath and prepared them before the sabbath? How is that? TWO SABBATHS. Thursday was Passover, a high holy day, also known as a Sabbath. This is where John 19:14 comes into play.
Moreover, Friday evening to Sunday morning does NOT equal 3 days and 3 nights. Matt. 12:40 says 3 days and 3 nights. So if Jesus was crucified on Wednesday evening, that means he would have risen Saturday evening.
Where does the Bible say that he rose ON Sunday morning? It doesn’t. It says he was already gone.
If you still cannot understand my argument, I will try to elaborate further.

Trav,

I hope you don’t mind if I respond to some of this too… I know it was directed to Jimmy.

The Sabbath was made for MAN, not man for the Sabbath. This does not say made for the Jews. <<

First, the commandments were only given to the Jews, not the Gentiles, if the Sabbath was made for all mankind, it seems unfair and very illogical that God would only give it to a small minority of folks.

Second, Christ’s ministry was to the Jews, in fact when Christ sent out his apostles he was sending them to only the Jews, and he made this very clear and specific. His words must be evaluated in that light. When I am giving a message to my family and say all the girls must use the upstairs bathroom and keep the seat down, and all the boys must use the downstairs bathroom and can leave the seat up… what does this mean? Does it mean that every person on the world must use my bathroom and must separate in my house depending on Gender? NO!! The Audience was my family and therefore the gender references only apply to my family. In the same way, Christ was ministering to the Jews… his Apostles initially ministered to the Jews, his references to the laws were applying specifically to the Jews. Just like when I spoke to my family, it was only to my family, even though I used a much larger gender qualifier, so the same is with Christ. He used a larger gender qualifier like “man” but at the same time, was only speaking to the Jews.

Third, if you insist on this being a literal commandment for all men, then it must be taken literally on all other accounts, which means that since it was only made for MAN, then WOMAN does not need to observe the Sabbath. I am sure you would agree that the Jews and even Modern Sabbatarians would view this as absurd. You need to be consistent… either it was allegorical reference to all his audience (ie Jews) or it was a literal reference to all MAN… which means it does not apply to women. You cant pick and choose.

Continued…sorry all for the long post!!

 

[SDA2RC]

Finally, Jews did not even expect non-jews to keep the Sabbath unless they had been circumcised. Therefore, when Christ said this, the jewish audience KNEW it only applied to them. You see, Peter and the Apostles settled the Sabbath issue when they decided that we didn’t need to be circumcised, since only those circumcised were supposed to keep the Sabbath.

Here is some SDA research from Jewish Sources on this exact matter:

The Noachian laws are also listed in Midrash Genesis Rabbah 16:6 (Soncino ed., p. 131), Sanhedrin 56 a, b; and Midrash Song of Songs Rabbah 1:2(5) (Soncino ed. pp. 26-7) (ibid., p. 74).

Gentiles could be considered righteous if they observed these laws, which did not include the Sabbath. Nor did they include restrictions about pork. Rabbi Judah could say that there was a time for the ``sons of Jacob when unclean beasts were still permitted to them’’ (Hullin 7:6, as quoted in Maxwell and Damsteegt, p. 74

The rabbis did not think that the Sabbath had been given to Gentiles: ``Why does it say, `The Lord hath given you’’ (Ex. 16:29)? To you hath he given it [the Sabbath], but not to the heathen. It is in virtue of this that the Sages stated Sanh. 56b] that if some of the heathen observed the Sabbath, then not only do they not receive any reward [but they are even considered to be transgressing]’’ (Midrash Exodus Rabbah 25:11 [Soncino ed., p. 314], as quoted in Maxwell and Damsteegt, p. 74).

``A non-Jew who observes the Sabbath whilst he is uncircumcised incurs liability for the punishment of death. Why? Because non-Jews were not commanded concerning it… The Sabbath is a reunion between Israel and God, as it is said, `It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel’ (Ex. 31:17); therefore any non-Jew who, being uncircumcised, thrusts himself between them incurs the penalty of death… **The Gentiles have not been commanded to observe the Sabbath’’ **(Midrash Deuteronomy Rabbah 1:21 [Soncino ed., pp. 23-4], as quoted in Maxwell and Damsteegt, p. 75).

Further evidence of the antiquity of this rabbinic understanding comes from the second-century B.C. book of Jubilees: **The Creator of all blessed it, but he did not sanctify any people or nations to keep the Sabbath thereon with the sole exception of Israel. **He granted to them alone that they might eat and drink and keep the Sabbath thereon upon the earth’’ (Jubilees 2:31, James Charlesworth, ed., The Old Testament Pseudepigrapha, [New York: Doubleday, 1985], vol. 2, p. 58).

Based on these quotes above, we can see from the Jewish writings and from Adventist documents by Maxwell, that Gentiles were never expected to keep the Sabbath. This is the understanding of the Jews, to whom the Sabbath was given, and who Christ never corrected on this matter. So, this begs the question, why do Adventist’s and others keep the Sabbath rather than the Lords day,

Okay I will try to explain this again. You must read CAREFULLY. John 19:14 says it was preparation of the Passover, NOT the weekly Sabbath.<<

Hmm… the versions I looked at said it was the Day of preparation of Passover week, not that it was the day of preparation of Passover. It seems it was just saying it was Friday of Passover Week?

Do you see? They bought the spices after the sabbath and prepared them before the sabbath? How is that? TWO SABBATHS. Thursday was Passover, a high holy day, also known as a Sabbath. This is where John 19:14 comes into play.<<

Ahhh… I see… are you sure they didn’t just run out of spices Friday night while preparing and then go buy more to finish after the Sabbath? This makes as much sense to me…

Cont once more… but smaller this time.

 

[SDA2RC]

Continued from previous message… sorry again for the long post!!

Moreover, Friday evening to Sunday morning does NOT equal 3 days and 3 nights. Matt. 12:40 says 3 days and 3 nights. So if Jesus was crucified on Wednesday evening, that means he would have risen Saturday evening. <<

I think the 3 days and 3 nights thing was already explained in another thread… it is obvious throughout the Bible that the use of this kind of time keeping was very non literal. Do you disagree… because if so I think there are other examples that we should look at??

Where does the Bible say that he rose ON Sunday morning? It doesn’t. It says he was already gone.<<

Mark 16:9, it says: Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons. NASB

Peace…

brandon

 

[SDA2RC]

twagler:

The Bible does NOT say he rose on the first day. It says he was gone already.

As I pointed out in my previous post… this is not true my friend…

Mark 16:9 . Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons. NASB

Peace, Brandon

 

[jimmy]

twagler:

The Bible does NOT say he rose on the first day. It says he was gone already.

No, it does not say he was gone already. One of the accounts says that Mary came on the first day of the week and saw the stone roled away and a man was sitting there. None of the acounts say he was gone already.

 

[twagler]

None of the accounts say (except Mark 16:9, which we will look at later) that he was risen on Sunday. They clearly state that when they arrived early in the morning while it was still dark, they found the stone rolled away and no body. As for the man sitting in the tomb–that was NOT Jesus, read the next verse.

Okay, Mark 16:9, it says: Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons. NASB

Two things here. First of all, it says HAD risen–pluperfect. Second, was there any punctuation in the original texts of the Bible? No. Therefore, what would it look like with the comma in a different spot. Let’s see.

Now after He had risen, early on the first day of the week He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.

Still work? Yep. This is secondary, however, due to the HAD risen.

The KJV of John 19:14 does not say week. I wonder what the original Greek says, I would very much like to find out.

Now to the issue of the Sabbath only belonging to the Jews. The Man/Woman debate is no good. Did God not say after Adam sinned that he would destroy man? Was he planning on leaving the women? I think during biblical times the man represented the household, that is why it only says that the sabbath was made for man.

Anyway, you say that God only gave the commandments to the Jews. What about the manna test, which occurred a few weeks prior.
Now examine the account in Exodus 16:1-30. The people of Israel were “murmuring” against God because they wanted more food. So God said, “I will… TEST them, whether they will walk in My LAW or not” (v. 4). Interesting. Because this is more proof that God’s law was definitely in effect even BEFORE the giving of the Old Covenant at Mount Sinai!

As for buying more spices on Sunday morning…ehhh. It IS possible, I’ll give you that. But I really think they would have bought a sufficient amount the first time.

 

[twagler]

Also, how does Friday evening to Sunday morning (before dark) constitute even 3 partial days? FriDAY, SaturDAY, and it never gets to the DAY portion of Sunday, since it was still dark when they rolled the stone away.

 

[Stephen_Korsman]

SDA2RC:

As far as John 19… it appears to me that it mentions the preperation day… i have always understood this to be Friday the day before Saturday, the Jewish Sabbath. If you are looking for something more… let me know?

Hi

Two good resources on the timing of the crucifixion, one from an Adventist who has influenced and been influenced by the Church of God groups, are:

english.sdaglobal.org/dnl/bacchi/books/cruxifix.pdf

bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm

They explain the preparation day = Friday issue quite well.

God bless,
Stephen

 

[jimmy]

twagler:

None of the accounts say (except Mark 16:9, which we will look at later) that he was risen on Sunday. They clearly state that when they arrived early in the morning while it was still dark, they found the stone rolled away and no body. As for the man sitting in the tomb–that was NOT Jesus, read the next verse.

Okay, Mark 16:9, it says: Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons. NASB

Two things here. First of all, it says HAD risen–pluperfect. Second, was there any punctuation in the original texts of the Bible? No. Therefore, what would it look like with the comma in a different spot. Let’s see.

Now after He had risen, early on the first day of the week He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.

Still work? Yep. This is secondary, however, due to the HAD risen.

The KJV of John 19:14 does not say week. I wonder what the original Greek says, I would very much like to find out.

Your interpretation of Mark 16;9. The greek uses the word [anastaV , which is a participle in the aurist tense, active voice, singular, masculine, and in the nominative. It would be translated was risen. Had risen does not really contradict but it is not really translated correctly. The version you show translates it as a verb, but it is a participle. I think the Douay Rheims version is a little more accurate on this verse.

9 But he rising early the first day of the week, appeared first to Mary Magdalen, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Here is the Greek bible online.

greekbible.com/

The fact that all four gospels say that they came on the first day of the week implies that Jesus rose on the first of the week. To argue that Jesus rose on the Sabbath is unscriptural and it is unhistorical. As I have shown in past posts, the first century Christians did not recognize the Sabbath, but the Lord’s Day.

I see your point, but you are being unconsistent with what you assume the scriptures to imply.

I am not sure what you mean with John 19;14 not saying week in the KJV. That is not used in any version of the bible I don’t think, because the word has no meaning in the sentence.

 

[SDA2RC]

Trav,

None of the accounts say (except Mark 16:9, which we will look at later) that he was risen on Sunday. …As for the man sitting in the tomb–that was NOT Jesus, read the next verse.<<

True… only Mark 16:9 reports that it was on the first day of the week. In addition to that, none of the reports say it was on the 7th day either. So… lets look at some other evidences… First… Matthew 28 1-10 tells us that it was on the first day of the week, AFTER the SABBATH, that there was a violent Earthquake and the Angel of God came and rolled the stone away… it was only then that the guards fled! So unless Christ was resurrected in secret… this was the event and it was AFTER the SABBATH and ON THE FIRST DAY…

Second,

Luke Chapter 24 says:

1On the first day of the week, very early in the morning, the women took the spices they had prepared and went to the tomb….

13Now that same day two of them were going to a village called Emmaus,…

21but we had hoped that he was the one who was going to redeem Israel. And what is more, it is the third day since all this took place.

Ok… look at these verses… first… this all happened on the first day… second, on the First day (vs 13) the Apostles told Jesus that it was the third day and the day they expected Christ to rise. So… tell me, the Apostles say the third day, the day they expected Christ to arise, was the first day. They lived with him, talked to him, ate with him… I think they probably knew what to expect and when in this matter. Now… you Trav, no disrespect, but you are trying to tell me that you know more about what day Christ rose on that the Apostles… I don’t buy it… Mark 16 says it was the first day of the week, Matthew 28 says the Angel rolled back the stone on the first day of the week, and that the gaurds fled on the first day of the week, finally, Luke 24 tells us that the Apostles expected Christ to rise on the third day after his death and that it was the first day of the week. I am seeing a pattern here are you?

Finally… the Didache, Letter of Barnabas, and several other writings written by first century Christians who were taught by the Apostles themselves in most cases, also bear witness to the fact that Christ rose on the 1st day of the week. These are people who were taught by the Apostles and lived in the same generation as the Apostles. I have to admit, I take their word over yours!!

… Two things here. First of all, it says HAD risen–pluperfect.<<

Yes… it said he HAD risen because it was being written decades after the event took place, so it had to be written in a past tense. The question is… when HAD he risen, well the next phrase answers that for us… “on the first day of the week.”

Cont…

 

[SDA2RC]

…Let’s see. Now after He had risen, early on the first day of the week He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons. Still work?..<<

Yes… very secondary… let me tell you why… First other versions do not allow the same musical comma trick, so then you get into which translation is correct… or do we? All major translations that I look at have translated it basically the same. So… you are asking me to believe that you know better than the hundreds of Greek and Bible scholars that have translated this verse… and therefore I should believe your rendition of the punctuation… ok… Maybe I could do that?? However, when I see the rest of the evidence, ie. Writings of those close to the time period, writings of other apostles as quoted above, etc…etc… I think that it all lines up much better than. Therefore I have to defer to the experts on this one, I do not see any overwhelming evidence to say they were wrong, and in fact I see much evidence in support of their choice in translation.

Now to the issue of the Sabbath only belonging to the Jews. …<<

Precisely… This was not a literal term… it was a term that “represented” the households. What household… the household of God, His Chosen People… who were they? They were the same people Christ was speaking to… THE JEWS!!!

On one hand you are saying that it was not literal… it was representative, but on the other hand you are saying that MAN literally means all mankind… You are flip flopping on your own principle.

Anyway, you say that God only gave the commandments to the Jews<<

Actually… I don’t say this… the Bible does!!! If you can show me in the Bible where there were Gentiles gathered around Mt. Sinai then I will gladly retract it… however, I think you will agree. That it was only Jews that were present!

.>>What about the manna test, which occurred a few weeks prior. <<

What about it… it was the Jews he tested right?

Now examine the account in Exodus 16:1-30. The people of Israel were “murmuring” against God because they wanted more food. So God said, “I will… TEST them, whether they will walk in My LAW or not” (v. 4). Interesting. Because this is more proof that God’s law was definitely in effect even BEFORE the giving of the Old Covenant at Mount Sinai! <<

Yes… lets examine that account… Lets look at vs. 4 specifically… “ 4Then the LORD said to Moses, "Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a day’s portion every day, that I may test them, whether or not they will walk in My instruction.”

So he is giving them instructions on how to Gather Manna… he has to tell the specifically do not gather some on the 7th day. (obviously they did not know yet) and then He says… Now that I have told them what to do, I will see if they will do what I say.

Sorry… but this is no evidence of a pre-knowledge of the law. In fact, quite the opposite, Moses and God have to explain the concept to them. God just says he wants to use this one little thing to see if they are willing to obey him. Which of course they were not, hence 40 years of walking around

Lets look at vs. 23: “then he said to them, “This is what the LORD meant: Tomorrow is a sabbath observance, a holy sabbath to the LORD Bake what you will bake and boil what you will boil, and all that is left over put aside to be kept until morning.”
Did you see that… Moses had to EXPLAIN in a very basic sense what it meant… What the 7th day was, what they needed to do. There was no pre-knowledge of this law… this was new to them!

As for buying more spices on Sunday morning…ehhh. It IS possible, I’ll give you that. But I really think they would have bought a sufficient amount the first time.<<

Well… maybe if they were planning for a death… however, I think they may not have ran to the market Friday afternoon,?

Peace
B

 

[jimmy]

Stephen Korsman:

Hi

Two good resources on the timing of the crucifixion, one from an Adventist who has influenced and been influenced by the Church of God groups, are:

english.sdaglobal.org/dnl/bacchi/books/cruxifix.pdf

bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm

They explain the preparation day = Friday issue quite well.

God bless,
Stephen

I went to the second link and saw the Ignatius and Justin quotes and I just had to look them up. Those are great proofs in themselves of the ressurection being on Sunday.

 

[jimmy]

SDA2RC actually reminded me of something I wanted in my earlier post. There is no comma in the Greek to make that a secondary statement. I think the comma was put there to make the translation more accurate with the participle. Here is the greek text for Mark 16;9

[anastaV de prwi prwth sabbatou efanh prwton maria th magdalhnh, par hV ekbeblhkei epta daimonia.

As you can see, the comma is much further down the line if you want to make it a secondary sentence.

 

[twagler]

You make very good points. I will continue to read and try to learn.

I must wonder still, however, why all this talk of the sabbath only applying to Jews? Why, then, didn’t the CC just abolish the sabbath completely, instead of just transferring it to Sunday?

Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R.,*** The Converts Catechism of Catholic Doctrine*** (1957), p. 50.

          "**Question**: Which is the Sabbath day?
      "**Answer**: Saturday is the Sabbath day.

       "**Question**: Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
      "**Answer**: We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic           Church transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday.

The “sabbath” is still being observed?

 

[jimmy]

twagler:

You make very good points. I will continue to read and try to learn.

I must wonder still, however, why all this talk of the sabbath only applying to Jews? Why, then, didn’t the CC just abolish the sabbath completely, instead of just transferring it to Sunday?

Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R.,*** The Converts Catechism of Catholic Doctrine*** (1957), p. 50.

"Question: Which is the Sabbath day?

"Answer: Saturday is the Sabbath day.

"Question: Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
"Answer: We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday.

The “sabbath” is still being observed?

It is transferred to honor the Lord’s Day.

 

[jimmy]

Here is the quote from Ignatius that speaks of Jesus raising on the first day of the week. It is from his epistle to the Tralians.

**

Chapter IX.-Reference to the History of Christ.

Stop your ears, therefore, when any one speaks to you at variance with60 Jesus Christ, who was descended from David, and was also of Mary; who was truly born, and did eat and drink. He was truly persecuted under Pontius Pilate; He was truly crucified, and [truly] died, in the sight of beings in heaven, and on earth, and under the earth. He was also truly raised from the dead, His Father quickening Him, even as after the same manner His Father will so raise up us who believe in Him by Christ Jesus, apart from whom we do not possess the true life.

Stop your ears, therefore, when any one speaks to you at variance with61 Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who was descended from David, and was also of Mary; who was truly begotten of God and of the Virgin, but not after the same manner. For indeed God and man are not the same. He truly assumed a body; for "the Word was made flesh,"62 and lived upon earth without sin. For says He, "Which of you convicteth me of sin? "63 He did in reality both eat and drink. He was crucified and died under Pontius Pilate. He really, and not merely in appearance, was crucified, and died, in the sight of beings in heaven, and on earth, and under the earth. By those in heaven I mean such as are possessed of incorporeal natures; by those on earth, the Jews and Romans, and such persons as were present at that time when the Lord was crucified; and by those under the earth, the multitude that arose along with the Lord. For says the Scripture, "Many bodies of the saints that slept arose,"64 their graves being opened. He descended, indeed, into Hades alone, but He arose accompanied by a multitude; and rent asunder that means65 of separation which had existed from the beginning of the world, and cast down its partition-wall. He also rose again in three days, the Father raising Him up; and after spending forty days with the apostles, He was received up to the Father, and "sat down at His right hand, expecting till His enemies are placed under His feet."66 On the day of the preparation, then, at the third hour, He received the sentence from Pilate, the Father permitting that to happen; at the sixth hour He was crucified; at the ninth hour He gave up the ghost; and before sunset He was buried.67 During the Sabbath He continued under the earth in the tomb in which Joseph of Arimathaea had laid Him. At the dawning of the Lord’s day He arose from the dead, according to what was spoken by Himself, "As Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly, so shall the Son of man also be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth."68 The day of the preparation, then, comprises the passion; the Sabbath embraces the burial; the Lord’s Day contains the resurrection.
**
ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-18.htm#P1725_293735

 

[SDA2RC]

twagler:

I must wonder still, however, why all this talk of the sabbath only applying to Jews? Why, then, didn’t the CC just abolish the sabbath completely, instead of just transferring it to Sunday?

While I do not presume to speak for the Church, I will tell you my understanding of this as a prior sabbatarian. The 7th day Sabbath was a type of the rest that we would find in Christ. After Christ died, it was possible for us to enter into his Spritual rest which was far better than a physical rest. Furthermore, this spiritual rest is eternal, not just one day. When we look at this, of what value is the Jewish Sabbath, it is only a Glimpse of what we now have. It is like two lovers who have never seen each other and exchange pictures… finally, when they meet, the man refuses to look at the girl and instead continues to only see her through the picture. The picture was only a glimpse of the real person, who is soo much more. When you have the person with you, the picture is useless.

Likewise, the Sabbath was a glimpse of the spiritual rest that Christ would give us when he came. Now that he has come and given this to us, why would one continue to deny this and only look at the glimpse?

Christ secured our spirual rest on the Cross. Furthermore, the Jewish Sabbath was also a day for them to cease their religious works… ie temple services, offereing etc. and enjoy the fruits of their religious services and rituals… namely the grace and forgiveness they had secured through the ritual given by God.

When Christ died, he completed the ritual and work once and for all, so the Sabbath rest was not longer needed weekly, the spiritual fruits were now eternal.

As for Sunday… Christ’s resurrection was the final act that secured our spiritual rest… it was the Day that Christ conquered death. This is the point of the entire Gospel, all in one event. It became a day to celebrate what Christ did for us on the Cross. The catechism says it well when it says:
2174 Jesus rose from the dead "on the first day of the week."104 Because it is the “first day,” the day of Christ’s Resurrection recalls the first creation. Because it is the “eighth day” following the sabbath,105 it symbolizes the new creation ushered in by Christ’s Resurrection. For Christians it has become the first of all days, the first of all feasts, the Lord’s Day (he kuriake hemera, dies dominica) Sunday:
We all gather on the day of the sun, for it is the first day [after the Jewish sabbath, but also the first day] when God, separating matter from darkness, made the world; and on this same day Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead.106

Sunday - fulfillment of the sabbath

2175 Sunday is expressly distinguished from the sabbath which it follows chronologically every week; for Christians its ceremonial observance replaces that of the sabbath. In Christ’s Passover, Sunday fulfills the spiritual truth of the Jewish sabbath and announces man’s eternal rest in God. For worship under the Law prepared for the mystery of Christ, and what was done there prefigured some aspects of Christ:107

Those who lived according to the old order of things have come to a new hope, no longer keeping the sabbath, but the Lord’s Day, in which our life is blessed by him and by his death.108

Finally, one note… you are quoting from the Converts Catechism… I am not familiar with it, it may be a great catechism… however, the official Catholic Catechism is at the Vatican Site. The link is vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM you will probably get a better understanding of Catholicism and also a better reaction from Catholics if you use this in your quotes. This catechism is the one that actually represents the offical positions of the Church. Others may be approved for local use by a bishop, however, this is THE Church Catechism.

Also, one more question I have for you… what if…
What if your wrong? What if you are denying the authority of the only Church God founded?

This is a question with Eternal consequences… I would encourage you to study what Christ founded and why…

Also, what if… what if you are holding on to a Sabbath that denies the very spiritual rest that his Death on the cross secured for us? What if?

Peace to you,
Brandon

 

[twagler]

What does the author of Hebrews 4 mean then, when he talks about a need to “enter into rest?”