Trump Thread

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GaryTaylor said:
So we can judge Donald but not Hillary by Catholic teaching?

Really what page is that on of the CCC?

Now you want to embrace a theocracy you abandoned pages ago. Qualify all this. 😊
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No, please try to keep up.

We’re judging all by Catholic morality or none by Catholic morality.

Trump and the Clintons are not Catholic and never were. Trump’s wife is Catholic, but not practicing.
 
jtauke said:
What about Trumps supports torture, murder of the families of “suspected” terrorists, and violence at his rallies? He epitomizes a culture of death.
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There are legitimate points to argue on the issue of torture. The only thing I can say is that if someone kidnaps my son, I’d probably be willing to do A LOT! I think people are tired of the softness of our present government and want to win. That said, trump has enough common sense to not break the law. If he wants to expand the law there are procedures to go through. Waterboarding IMO is not an extreme measure on terrorist murderers.

On violence at his rallies. out of millions of trump supporters who have been there, only one has actually done anything violent after being flipped the bird. That’s a good ratio of peacefulness you are neglecting.
 
jtauke said:
What about Trumps support of torture, murder of the families of “suspected” terrorists, and violence at his rallies? He epitomizes a culture of death.
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I think this got lost, deliberately or otherwise.

Will a Trump supporter please answer?
 
Lily_Bernans said:
I think his children subscribe to the “follow the money” theory. LOL
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Like the Culture of death democrats thus the root of all evil? LOL. Are we talking theocracy again or no, or just when CC teaching is convenient?

jtauke I allowed to squirm out of that but I see no such hope for you according to our conversation today. :rotfl:
 
queenofheartscv said:
Money can’t buy competence and the ability to work together successfully as leaders of Trump’s company.
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Uh, yeah it can. Money can buy all the schooling, tutors, and support you need to make your children competent.

And the children would be crazy to turn away from daddy warbucks.
 
queenofheartscv said:
There are legitimate points to argue on the issue of torture. The only thing I can say is that if someone kidnaps my son, I’d probably be willing to do A LOT! I think people are tired of the softness of our present government and want to win. That said, trump has enough common sense to not break the law. If he wants to expand the law there are procedures to go through. Waterboarding IMO is not an extreme measure on terrorist murderers.

On violence at his rallies. out of millions of trump supporters who have been there, only one has actually done anything violent after being flipped the bird. That’s a good ratio of peacefulness you are neglecting.
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Waterboarding seems pretty extreme to me, and as a Roman Catholic theology professor, I can testify that it violates the dignity of the human person:

“Waterboarding is a form of water torture in which water is poured over a cloth covering the face and breathing passages of an immobilized captive, causing the individual to experience the sensation of drowning. Waterboarding can cause extreme pain, dry drowning, damage to lungs, brain damage from oxygen deprivation, other physical injuries including broken bones due to struggling against restraints, lasting psychological damage, and death.[1] Adverse physical consequences can manifest themselves months after the event, while psychological effects can last for years.[2]”

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding

If waterboarding is not extreme, what would you classify as extreme?
 
Lily_Bernans said:
I think this got lost, deliberately or otherwise.

Will a Trump supporter please answer?
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Oh no not at all perish the thought, in fact I was waiting for the exact point of his dialogue to be addressed and elaborated upon. Far by me to assume what another is suggesting and read minds. I don’t have that degree nor do they give them out.

But I’m sure there’s a articulated point to be made. But I only read accusations and an indictment sheet with no support of whats actually being referred to or said? If theres a point post the source and quote the point least we “assume”., I know you heard about assuming. LOL.
 
Lily_Bernans said:
Waterboarding seems pretty extreme to me, and as a Roman Catholic theology professor, I can testify that it violates the dignity of the human person:

“Waterboarding is a form of water torture in which water is poured over a cloth covering the face and breathing passages of an immobilized captive, causing the individual to experience the sensation of drowning. Waterboarding can cause extreme pain, dry drowning, damage to lungs, brain damage from oxygen deprivation, other physical injuries including broken bones due to struggling against restraints, lasting psychological damage, and death.[1] Adverse physical consequences can manifest themselves months after the event, while psychological effects can last for years.[2]”

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding

If waterboarding is not extreme, what would you classify as extreme?
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From what I can tell, most of us consider it extreme if it is done to us and justified if it is done to others. I know that may sound cynical, but that is my impression of most discussions around this and other moral questions.
 
queenofheartscv said:
There are legitimate points to argue on the issue of torture.
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The only thing I can say is that if someone kidnaps my son, I’d probably be willing to do A LOT!
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And you would have to answer to God for taking those measures.
Waterboarding IMO is not an extreme measure on terrorist murderers.
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“suspected” terrorists who were found guilty before being proven so. Ever been waterboarded? I’m sure you’d change your tune about how extreme it is after a few minutes.
On violence at his rallies. out of millions of trump supporters who have been there, only one has actually done anything violent after being flipped the bird. That’s a good ratio of peacefulness you are neglecting.
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And you’re neglecting Trumps own words. “I’d like to punch them in the face”, “I wish they’d leave here in a stretcher”, “I’ll pay your legal fees if you hit a protester”

Strange that you leave out the part about murdering the families of suspected terrorists…Please respond to this statement by Trump as well.
 
Lily_Bernans said:
Waterboarding seems pretty extreme to me, and as a Roman Catholic theology professor, I can testify that it violates the dignity of the human person:

“Waterboarding is a form of water torture in which water is poured over a cloth covering the face and breathing passages of an immobilized captive, causing the individual to experience the sensation of drowning. Waterboarding can cause extreme pain, dry drowning, damage to lungs, brain damage from oxygen deprivation, other physical injuries including broken bones due to struggling against restraints, lasting psychological damage, and death.[1] Adverse physical consequences can manifest themselves months after the event, while psychological effects can last for years.[2]”

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding
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One doesn’t need to be a theology professor to know that a lot of things violate the dignity of the human person, but nobody makes a political argument out of them. Few even argue that burning and maiming people with hellfire missiles violates their human dignity, or condemn the current perp in the White House for doing it.

I don’t know that the Wikipedia definition of what waterboarding CAN be tells us anything about the way it was actually done. Never have I seen anything saying that the three people upon whom it was practiced sustained any of the damage in the Wiki segment cited. Nor, have I seen reports of such consequences happening to the many people who have undergone it voluntarily.
 
sallybutler said:
From what I can tell, most of us consider it extreme if it is done to us and justified if it is done to others. I know that may sound cynical, but that is my impression of most discussions around this and other moral questions.
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Thank you for answering. Queenofheartscv does not consider it extreme, so I was wondering what she would consider extreme?

I can’t think of too much else that would be worse other than crucifixion, and I mean no disrespect to Christ in saying that. He suffered the ultimate suffering.

But back to Trump.

Queenofheartscv, what would you consider extreme?
 
queenofheartscv said:
There are legitimate points to argue on the issue of torture. The only thing I can say is that if someone kidnaps my son, I’d probably be willing to do A LOT! I think people are tired of the softness of our present government and want to win. That said, trump has enough common sense to not break the law. If he wants to expand the law there are procedures to go through. Waterboarding IMO is not an extreme measure on terrorist murderers.

On violence at his rallies. out of millions of trump supporters who have been there, only one has actually done anything violent after being flipped the bird. That’s a good ratio of peacefulness you are neglecting.
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Um…Maybe he only has one. However, I think one is enough. I don’t see that happening at other rallies. The point is, he encourages his supporters to respond with violence. Look at his tomato quote, telling the supporters to “knock the *** out of them”. Seems to be asking for violence there. And offering to pay lawyer fees? Really? time.com/4203094/donald-trump-hecklers/
 
GaryTaylor said:
Oh no not at all perish the thought, in fact I was waiting for the exact point of his dialogue to be addressed and elaborated upon. Far by me to assume what another is suggesting and read minds. I don’t have that degree nor do they give them out.

But I’m sure there’s a articulated point to be made. But I only read accusations and an indictment sheet with no support of whats actually being referred to or said? If theres a point post the source and quote the point least we “assume”., I know you heard about assuming. LOL.
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Trump supports torture, murder of the families of “suspected” terrorists, and violence at his rallies. He epitomizes a culture of death.

Please Rationalize this with our faith.
 
Ridgerunner said:
One doesn’t need to be a theology professor to know that a lot of things violate the dignity of the human person, but nobody makes a political argument out of them. Few even argue that burning and maiming people with hellfire missiles violates their human dignity, or condemn the current perp in the White House for doing it.

I don’t know that the Wikipedia definition of what waterboarding CAN be tells us anything about the way it was actually done. Never have I seen anything saying that the three people upon whom it was practiced sustained any of the damage in the Wiki segment cited. Nor, have I seen reports of such consequences happening to the many people who have undergone it voluntarily.
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Would you try to undergo it to see?
 
jtauke said:
Uh, yeah it can. Money can buy all the schooling, tutors, and support you need to make your children competent.

.
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Oh, not at all. Many are those who inherited money but who are not competent at anything.
 
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