Trusting the Catholic Church

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bobzills said:
OK. But can a good tree bear bad fruit?
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Bob, by your impossible standard, all of Christianity is doomed. The good fruit is the teaching of the church, not the sins of its members. It appears that Christ thought so:
John 6:70 Then Jesus replied, “Have I not chosen you, the Twelve? Yet one of you is a devil!”
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I don’t think that Christ would found His church only to fail because of the sinful men who populated it. He said just the opposite in Matthew 16. His church must be separated from the individual members’ actions. They are held accountable individually, but the church carries on as the pillar and foundation of truth.

Christ’s peace.
 
Randy_Carson said:
You seem to have missed the point.

Individuals - even those in Church leadership - can and do commit sins in the name of the Church.

I would be disinclined to say that the Church AS A WHOLE bears bad fruit. Perhaps you might cite some examples if you feel differently.

However, even if some actions by the Church cross the line (wherever you choose to draw it), why would that surprise you? The Church is a human institution of divine origin.

What is more certain is that the Church has the full authority granted to her by Christ Himself, and this has not changed nor been abrogated in any way. Further, the Church has never and can never teach error in matters of faith and morals.

Divine Authority. Infallible Teaching.

All the “bad fruit” in the world doesn’t diminish these two things one iota.

Hope this helps. :tiphat:
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I said already that I thought that the tree was a good tree. Many of the apples on the tree are good. I just think that it is possible that a good tree may have a few bad apples, for example, a few of the apples may have worms in them.
 
po18guy said:
Bob, by your impossible standard, all of Christianity is doomed. The good fruit is the teaching of the church, not the sins of its members. It appears that Christ thought so: I don’t think that Christ would found His church only to fail because of the sinful men who populated it. He said just the opposite in Matthew 16. His church must be separated from the individual members’ actions. They are held accountable individually, but the church carries on as the pillar and foundation of truth.

Christ’s peace.
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You and Randy Carson have provided compelling answers for Bob; maybe its time for Bob to respond with something other than, “can a good tree bear bad fruit!” —sounding a bit like a broken record… 👍
 
bobzills said:
I said already that I thought that the tree was a good tree. Many of the apples on the tree are good. I just think that it is possible that a good tree may have a few bad apples, for example, a few of the apples may have worms in them.
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If we are all in agreement, what’s the problem?🙂 :confused:
 
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