Turkey strikes back at Syria after mortar kills five

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NATO has issued a statement regarding these incidents.
In view of the Syrian regime’s recent aggressive acts at NATO’s southeastern border, which are a flagrant breach of international law and a clear and present danger to the security of one of its Allies, the North Atlantic Council met today, within the framework of Article 4 of the Washington Treaty, and discussed the continuous shelling of locations in Turkey adjacent to the Turkish-Syrian border by the Syrian regime forces.
The most recent shelling on 3 October 2012, which caused the death of five Turkish citizens and injured many, constitutes a cause of greatest concern for, and is strongly condemned by, all Allies.

In the spirit of indivisibility of security and solidarity deriving from the Washington Treaty, the Alliance continues to stand by Turkey and demands the immediate cessation of such aggressive acts against an Ally, and urges the Syrian regime to put an end to flagrant violations of international law.
nato.int/cps/en/SID-E1EB0209-69BD68DB/natolive/news_90447.htm
 
NATO is nothing more than a military alliance and should be dissolved, or at least, the US should leave

Jim
 
It has widely been suspected that the rebels in Syria have operated out of bases in Turkey. Syria may well be justified in striking Turkey. I hope the antiwar movement is organized in the various NATO countries.
 
It could just be a skirmish, as happens on a regular basis between Israel and Palestine but without turning into war.

It really depends I suppose on how bold Ankara is next in its actions. NATO support will certain give them more confidence if they do want to take further action.

I recall that Syria shot down a Turkish plane a month back as well.

Under the terms of the NATO alliance I am led to believe that the rest of the member states would be bound to defend Turkey if it did go to war with Syria? I believe it functions on a kind of collective security ie if one NATO member is attacked and made war on then the rest are also by default attacked and go to war as well.

So I sincerely hope that Turkey is able to quieten down the situation.
 
Under the terms of the NATO alliance I am led to believe that the rest of the member states would be bound to defend Turkey if it did go to war with Syria? I believe it functions on a kind of collective security ie if one NATO member is attacked and made war on then the rest are also by default attacked and go to war as well…
Yes, precisely the same sort of ridiculous pact that resulted in WW1. Nation upon nation declaring war on each other all because they had treaties with the two who started it. Such treaties didn’t serve their intended purpose as a deterrent to war then and they won’t today. The Syrian Regime has been backed into a corner and it will lash out with whatever its got until it can’t anymore. We need a tempered response and, so far, I think Turkey has been more than accommodating and patient. I hope they continue to be so.
 
It has widely been suspected that the rebels in Syria have operated out of bases in Turkey. Syria may well be justified in striking Turkey. I hope the antiwar movement is organized in the various NATO countries.
I am no fan of either side in the Syria conflict (Assad is clearly a dictator who has committed crimes against humanity and is aided by his ally Iran; and the rebels are partly composed of radical Islamists and Al-Qaeda), my sympathy is naturally with innocent Syrian civilians, however Syria has already gunned down a Turkish plane a month ago and now this. I am also no fan of Turkey but I can certainly understand how the government must be feeling right now. It is essentially facing acts of war on its borders by the Assad regime.

As already stated I hope that Turkey deals with this mindful that any declaration of war would maybe drag in the rest of NATO and so act in view of peace and avoiding war at all cost.
 
It has widely been suspected that the rebels in Syria have operated out of bases in Turkey. Syria may well be justified in striking Turkey. I hope the antiwar movement is organized in the various NATO countries.
That was my first thought.

As far as the news reports that I have read thus far, Syria has not claimed responsibility and is looking into the source of the shelling. It may just be another deceptive tactic on the part of the rebels who have a proven track record in this conflict of commiting massacres and atrocities against civilians and then blaming them on the Syrian army. What one person calls Syria artillery another person calls rebel mortars.

Turkey’s response makes no sense. They are now amping up the calls for a larger cross-border retalitation yet there is no evidence as of yet that Syria was behind the shelling. Of course, it does make sense when you realize that the West is just itching to get into Syria and would benefit from this type of provocation.
 
It could also be Turkey letting the Kurds in Syria know where they stand.

Jim
 
Yes, precisely the same sort of ridiculous pact that resulted in WW1. Nation upon nation declaring war on each other all because they had treaties with the two who started it. Such treaties didn’t serve their intended purpose as a deterrent to war then and they won’t today. The Syrian Regime has been backed into a corner and it will lash out with whatever its got until it can’t anymore. We need a tempered response and, so far, I think Turkey has been more than accommodating and patient. I hope they continue to be so.
I don’t think it’ll come to that unless Assad is simultaneously backed into the coastal region of his own country by Syrian rebels. Then, he might lash out with his ace-in-the-hole, his chemical weapons. If even one poison gas shell got fired onto Turkish territory, Turkey would probably take that as a casus belli and cross the border in force. Then it’d be NATO vs Syria&Iran, with the Gulf Arab states standing on the sidelines as cheerleaders for NATO.
 
It has widely been suspected that the rebels in Syria have operated out of bases in Turkey. Syria may well be justified in striking Turkey. I hope the antiwar movement is organized in the various NATO countries.
I hope that the antiwar movement in Syria is organized and they do not get killed by the Syria. 🤷🤷
 
if 5 people were killed in Turkey by Syrian mortar fire this could develop into something more than a skirmish. i don’t know how long now this fighting in Syria has gone on, but i wish it would end. i am sure the Syrian people are wanting the fighting to stop!
 
Turkey is more than capable of handling this without US or NATO help, but I’m curious as to why Syria thought it would be a good idea to start mortaring their neighbor.

Somebody wants this whole thing to escalate. Who, and why?
 
Turkey is more than capable of handling this without US or NATO help, but I’m curious as to why Syria thought it would be a good idea to start mortaring their neighbor.

Somebody wants this whole thing to escalate. Who, and why?
Probably al Qaeda factions among the rebels. They’d probably love to lure NATO and Iran into a head-to-head battle. And if one could trace their funding, one would probably find it leads back to Saudi sources. Both sides are being played by Riyadh.
 
Turkey is more than capable of handling this without US or NATO help, but I’m curious as to why Syria thought it would be a good idea to start mortaring their neighbor.

Somebody wants this whole thing to escalate. Who, and why?
good question! :hmmm:
 
Riyadh’s a big part of it, and if you noticed, the US government wasn’t too upset when the Saudis and Bahrain crushed there own attempted Arab Springs. Then again that comes with the territory when the US considers you an important ally in the War on Terror.
 
I got a laugh out of how the NYTs is reporting it in their article “Turkey Strikes Back After Syrian Shelling Kills 5 Civilians” nytimes.com/2012/10/04/world/middleeast/syria.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&.

They are reporting that Turkey has shelled targets in Syria after “a” (meaning one, uno) mortar round was lauched into Turkey from Syria killing 5 civilians. Earlier reports said that it was Syrian “artillery” that was responsible but now we are being told that it was “a” mortar round.

In response to this one mortar round, the origin of which in unclear, NATO has called “an emergency meeting on Wednesday evening to discuss the crisis, as Turkey’s civilian and military leaders said Parliament would consider a motion on Thursday to permit further military action within Syria.”

Erdogan said:

“This atrocious attack was immediately responded to adequately by our armed forces in the border region, in accordance with rules of engagement.” “Targets were shelled in locations identified by radar.”

Now last time I checked, mortars don’t require radar especially one indiscriminate mortar round.

The calls for escalation continue:

“The conflict in Syria is spilling well over its borders,” said Andrew Tabler, a Syria analyst at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. “I don’t see how the Obama administration continues policy as usual after this.”

And then this gem:

In Washington, George Little, the Pentagon press secretary, called the Syrian attack on Turkish territory “yet another example of the depraved behavior of the Syrian regime, and why it must go.”

And then to top things off there was the predictable response from the Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said she was “outraged” by the mortar attack in Turkey.

So, here are the facts:

Initial reports say Syrian artillery was “shelling” across the border, but that storyline is quickly changed to “a” mortar round.

Syria denies responsibility.

Syria is then demonized by NATO and our State Department who aren’t interested in discovering who actually launched the mortar round, but are interested in escalation at all costs, regardless of the fact that the “rebels” would have the most to gain from such a mortar attack.
 
hillary has been OUTRAGED by a lot of things lately - the anti-muslim video, the death of our ambassador and now the 5 deaths in turkey.
 
It seems Turkey is not willing to settle with a tit-for-tat exchange of fire.
Turkish artillery hit targets near Syria’s Tel Abyad border town for a second day on Thursday, killing several Syrian soldiers according to activists and security sources, after a mortar bomb fired from the area killed five Turkish civilians.
Turkey’s government said “aggressive action” against its territory by Syria’s military had become a serious threat to its national security and sought parliamentary approval for the deployment of Turkish troops beyond its borders.
“Turkey has no interest in a war with Syria. But Turkey is capable of protecting its borders and will retaliate when necessary,” Ibrahim Kalin, a senior adviser to Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan, said on his Twitter account.
“Political, diplomatic initiatives will continue,” he said.
reuters.com/article/2012/10/04/us-syria-crisis-idUSBRE88J0X720121004
 
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