Understanding the Trinity

[Servant19]

In that post you said: “God always, always gave His Spirit to abide in us. Yes, it is our free will to either embrace or turn away from this Spirit, but HE ALWAYS also provided a Human Temple to speak His Word.”

What I posted earlier describes that guidance, however what you call Human Temple is not clear, perhaps you mean various prophets, but you have capitalized it which implies something else. There is only one with both human and divine nature in one person, Jesus Christ, per Christianity. Jesus Christ has come and opened the door for us which had been shut from the time Adam was cast out from the delight of Paradise, and God set the Cherubim and the flaming sword, that turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=13501945&postcount=232

According to our Catholic faith, the coming of the only Messiah, Jesus Christ, is the fulfillment and the Church of Christ which subsists in the Catholic Church The Church “is the visible plan of God’s love for humanity,” because God desires “that the whole human race may become one People of God, form one Body of Christ, and be built up into one temple of the Holy Spirit.” (Pope Paul VI, June 22, 1973.) See Lumen Gentium 17:

1. As the Son was sent by the Father,(131) so He too sent the Apostles, saying: “Go, therefore, make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you. And behold I am with you all days even to the consummation of the world”.(132) The Church has received this solemn mandate of Christ to proclaim the saving truth from the apostles and must carry it out to the very ends of the earth.(133) Wherefore she makes the words of the Apostle her own: “Woe to me, if I do not preach the Gospel”,(134) and continues unceasingly to send heralds of the Gospel until such time as the infant churches are fully established and can themselves continue the work of evangelizing. For the Church is compelled by the Holy Spirit to do her part that God’s plan may be fully realized, whereby He has constituted Christ as the source of salvation for the whole world. By the proclamation of the Gospel she prepares her hearers to receive and profess the faith. She gives them the dispositions necessary for baptism, snatches them from the slavery of error and of idols and incorporates them in Christ so that through charity they may grow up into full maturity in Christ. Through her work, whatever good is in the minds and hearts of men, whatever good lies latent in the religious practices and cultures of diverse peoples, is not only saved from destruction but is also cleansed, raised up and perfected unto the glory of God, the confusion of the devil and the happiness of man. The obligation of spreading the faith is imposed on every disciple of Christ, according to his state.(21*) Although, however, all the faithful can baptize, the priest alone can complete the building up of the Body in the eucharistic sacrifice. Thus are fulfilled the words of God, spoken through His prophet: “From the rising of the sun until the going down thereof my name is great among the gentiles, and in every place a clean oblation is sacrificed and offered up in my name”.(135)(22*) In this way the Church both prays and labors in order that the entire world may become the People of God, the Body of the Lord and the Temple of the Holy Spirit, and that in Christ, the Head of all, all honor and glory may be rendered to the Creator and Father of the Universe.

Again, dear Vico, what was the point of life if you lived before Christ, if the “door was shut”, no matter how godly, virtuous and living in humble servitude to the Almighty you were…God created me, only to shut the door in my face…He is lacking justice…love…patience…forbearance…

David’s prayer falls on deaf ears?

I capitalize the word Human Temple as a sign of respect for a major Prophet.

.

 

[Vico]

Again, dear Vico, what was the point of life if you lived before Christ, if the “door was shut”, no matter how godly, virtuous and living in humble servitude to the Almighty you were…God created me, only to shut the door in my face…He is lacking justice…love…patience…forbearance…

David’s prayer falls on deaf ears?

I capitalize the word Human Temple as a sign of respect for a major Prophet.

.

The door is shut for a time.

The Jewish belief is that when the messiah comes to initiate the perfect world of peace and prosperity that the righteous dead will be brought back to life in the Olam Ha-Ba, the world to come. Beliefs in the after life changed through time, but Souls waited in Sheol. Psalm 49:15 says “But God will redeem my soul from the power of Sheol, and will receive me.” The first clear description of resurrection is in Ezekiel from the sixth century BCE.

 

[Servant19]

The door is shut for a time.

The Jewish belief is that when the messiah comes to initiate the perfect world of peace and prosperity that the righteous dead will be brought back to life in the Olam Ha-Ba, the world to come. Beliefs in the after life changed through time, but Souls waited in Sheol. Psalm 49:15 says “But God will redeem my soul from the power of Sheol, and will receive me.” The first clear description of resurrection is in Ezekiel from the sixth century BCE.

Even if it is shut for a time, do you not feel that this is an injustice from God?

May I ask that you consider reading some of the works of Philo? He wrote clearly that the souls of the righteous would go straight to God and find immortality there.

The passage you provided from Psalms 49 is actually a contrasting reference between those "People who have wealth but lack understanding
are like the beasts that perish." (Ps 49:20)

…and those who do are not wealthy and HAVE understanding. Those that have have wealth and lack understanding "They are like sheep and are destined to die;
death will be their shepherd
(but the upright will prevail over them in the morning).
Their forms will decay in the grave,
far from their princely mansions." (Ps 49:14)

This happens there and then to those that are not upright (there is no waiting for a Messiah)

What also happens, there and then, (there is no waiting for a Messiah) according to this chapter of Psalms is "But God will redeem me from the realm of the dead;
he will surely take me to himself." (Ps 49:15)

Jewish teaching does talk about resurrection of the dead when the Messiah comes, but for Philo the doctrine of the resurrection is subservient to that of the immortality of the soul and is seen by him as a figurative way of referring to the latter.

I would humbly offer for your study this passage from the Jewish Encyclopaedia:
jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/12697-resurrection



.

 

[Peter_Plato]

Even if it is shut for a time, do you not feel that this is an injustice from God?

May I ask that you consider reading some of the works of Philo? He wrote clearly that the souls of the righteous would go straight to God and find immortality there.

Jewish teaching does talk about resurrection of the dead when the Messiah comes, but for Philo the doctrine of the resurrection is subservient to that of the immortality of the soul and is seen by him as a figurative way of referring to the latter.

I would humbly offer for your study this passage from the Jewish Encyclopaedia:
jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/12697-resurrection

Perhaps, this is true, but that only shows that prior to Jesus, the righteous had to wait until death to enter the Kingdom of Heaven and to be “Human Temples.”

Jesus’ words about John the Baptist are quite clear.

Truly, I say to you, among those born of women there has risen no one greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the Kingdom of Heaven is greater than John..
(Matt 11: 11)

However, with Jesus we have the possibility of passing from death into eternal life.

Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears my word and believes him who sent me, **has eternal life; **he does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life. (John 5:24)

The ordinary means is Baptism of water and the Holy Spirit.

Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. (John 3:5)

Truly, truly, I say to you, the hour is coming, and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. (John 5 25)

Believing in and carrying out the words of Jesus and being fed by the Bread of Life will bring eternal life.

Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life. I am the Bread of Life. Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that a man may eat of it and not die.** I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; **and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.” (John 6:47-51

If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? He who is of God hears the words of God; the reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.” (John 8:46-7)

Jesus was not merely a prophet, he is one in being with the Father. He is God.

Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” So they took up stones to throw at him; (John 8:57-8)

I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly. (John 10:11)

If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you. (John 15: 18-20)

He had to die to send the Holy Spirit to bring eternal life to those who believe in him and do his will.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. And when he comes, he will convince the world of sin and of righteousness and of judgment: of sin, because they do not believe in me; (John 16: 7-9)

Jesus makes it possible for God to share himself with us so that we may be one in him.

They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. Sanctify them in the truth; thy word is truth. As thou didst send me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. And for their sake I consecrate myself, that they also may be consecrated in truth.

“I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, **that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, **so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. The glory which thou hast given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one, I in them and thou in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that thou hast sent me and hast loved them even as thou hast loved me. **Father, I desire that they also, whom thou hast given me, may be with me where I am, to behold my glory which thou hast given me in thy love for me before the foundation of the world. O righteous Father, the world has not known thee, but I have known thee; and these know that thou hast sent me. **I made known to them thy name, and I will make it known, that the love with which thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.” (John 17:16-25)

 

[TonyBS]

Perhaps, this is true, but that only shows that prior to Jesus, the righteous had to wait until death to enter the Kingdom of Heaven and to be “Human Temples.”
Jesus’ words about John the Baptist are quite clear.
However, with Jesus we have the possibility of passing from death into eternal life.
The ordinary means is Baptism of water and the Holy Spirit.
Believing in and carrying out the words of Jesus and being fed by the Bread of Life will bring eternal life.
Jesus was not merely a prophet, he is one in being with the Father. He is God.
He had to die to send the Holy Spirit to bring eternal life to those who believe in him and do his will.
Jesus makes it possible for God to share himself with us so that we may be one in him.

When the trinity is understood in the “Oneness of God” it can be seen all the passages posted to Glorify Christ also Glorify “All” the Manifestations of God. All are the “First and the Last”, the “Beginning and the End”.

That we misunderstand the intent of the 'Word" and get attached to one specific Revelation of God has been mankind’s failure.

This is a good meditation;

“Even as in the “Beginning that hath no beginnings” the term “last” is truly applicable unto Him who is the Educator of the visible and of the invisible, in like manner, are the terms “first” and “last” applicable unto His Manifestations. They are at the same time the Exponents of both the “first” and the “last.” Whilst established upon the seat of the “first,” they occupy the throne of the “last.” Were a discerning eye to be found, it will readily perceive that the exponents of the “first” and the “last,” of the “manifest” and the “hidden,” of the “beginning” and the “seal” are none other than these holy Beings, these Essences of Detachment, these divine Souls. And wert thou to soar in the holy realm of “God was alone, there was none else besides Him,” thou wilt find in that Court all these names utterly non-existent and completely forgotten. Then will thine eyes no longer be obscured by these veils, these terms, and allusions. How ethereal and lofty is this station, unto which even Gabriel, unshepherded, can never attain, and the Bird of Heaven, unassisted, can never reach!”

The explanation at this link - reference.bahai.org/en/t/b/KI/ki-6.html

Regards Tony

 

[Vico]

Even if it is shut for a time, do you not feel that this is an injustice from God?

May I ask that you consider reading some of the works of Philo? He wrote clearly that the souls of the righteous would go straight to God and find immortality there.

The passage you provided from Psalms 49 is actually a contrasting reference between those "People who have wealth but lack understanding
are like the beasts that perish." (Ps 49:20)

…and those who do are not wealthy and HAVE understanding. Those that have have wealth and lack understanding "They are like sheep and are destined to die;
death will be their shepherd
(but the upright will prevail over them in the morning).
Their forms will decay in the grave,
far from their princely mansions." (Ps 49:14)

This happens there and then to those that are not upright (there is no waiting for a Messiah)

What also happens, there and then, (there is no waiting for a Messiah) according to this chapter of Psalms is "But God will redeem me from the realm of the dead;
he will surely take me to himself." (Ps 49:15)

Jewish teaching does talk about resurrection of the dead when the Messiah comes, but for Philo the doctrine of the resurrection is subservient to that of the immortality of the soul and is seen by him as a figurative way of referring to the latter.

I would humbly offer for your study this passage from the Jewish Encyclopaedia:
jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/12697-resurrection



.

God will not act unjustly, so no.

That Psalm was to show the Sheol was the place of waiting.

There are a number of Jewish opinions through history, and nowadays, even that there is no resurrection.

The Christian faith includes that the descent of Jesus Christ among the dead completed the proclamation of the Gospel and liberated the holy souls who had awaited their Redeemer, and, since that time, we experience the particular judgment immediately upon death of the body, and the Last Judgment will include the resurrection of all the dead.

 

[hasantas]

The Holy Spirit is not the Archangel Gabriel. The Archangel is an angel and the Holy Spirit is God, and Jesus Christ is God, not a messenger The angel is a messenger. Also, the Archangel Gabriel was at the Annunciation.

/INDENT]

Who is God? Father or Jesus or Holy Spirit? Are there three gods?

If Holy Spirit is God then why Holy Spirit traveled in space and seem to be bound physical laws?

35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. Luke 1.

21 Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened,

22 And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased. Luke 3.

God do not get variant forms but God create all forms. Angels can travel in space and can get transformation. The attributes are given in Bible for Holy Spirit do not seem to be belong a god but just an angel!

 

[Servant19]

Perhaps, this is true, but that only shows that prior to Jesus, the righteous had to wait until death to enter the Kingdom of Heaven and to be “Human Temples.”

Jesus’ words about John the Baptist are quite clear.

However, with Jesus we have the possibility of passing from death into eternal life.

The ordinary means is Baptism of water and the Holy Spirit.

Believing in and carrying out the words of Jesus and being fed by the Bread of Life will bring eternal life.

Jesus was not merely a prophet, he is one in being with the Father. He is God.

He had to die to send the Holy Spirit to bring eternal life to those who believe in him and do his will.

Jesus makes it possible for God to share himself with us so that we may be one in him.

Hi Peter,

I think with effective study, one would come to a true realisation that eternal life existed long before Jesus came. Those righteous Jews were still alive, they were not dead in Abraham’s bosom…Jesus simply created an awareness that through Him eternal life is possible. The moment He said “I am” all life went through Him. The Baha’i religion does not deny this Truth.

One must also place emphasis on the reality that the Holy Spirit was well and truly alive and well and being sent to humanity in all it’s glory long before Jesus came also. It is mentioned on numerous occasions in the OT, and I have referenced some quotes in this thread.

Today, of course, the doors of heaven have been flung open by the coming of Baha’u’llah.

“Followers of the Gospel, behold the gates of heaven are flung open. He that had ascended unto it is now come. Give ear to His voice calling aloud over land and sea, announcing to all mankind the advent of this Revelation—a Revelation through the agency of which the Tongue of Grandeur is now proclaiming: ‘Lo, the sacred Pledge hath been fulfilled, for He, the Promised One, is come!’”*

reference.bahai.org/en/t/se/WOB/wob-37.html

Thankyou

.

 

[Vico]

Who is God? Father or Jesus or Holy Spirit? Are there three gods?

If Holy Spirit is God then why Holy Spirit traveled in space and seem to be bound physical laws?

35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. Luke 1.

21 Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened,

22 And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased. Luke 3.

God do not get variant forms but God create all forms. Angels can travel in space and can get transformation. The attributes are given in Bible for Holy Spirit do not seem to be belong a god but just an angel!

The angels are pure spirits with nothing material, quantitative, or sensibly perceptible in their constitution. They are creatures made by God.

God is not three gods but three persons, The Trinity. The Holy Spirit is called Dove, because in this form he descended visibly on Christ in the Jordan (see Mark 1:10) The Catechism gives some explanation of the revelation of the Trinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit:

240 Jesus revealed that God is Father in an unheard-of sense: he is Father not only in being Creator; he is eternally Father in relation to his only Son, who is eternally Son only in relation to his Father: "No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him."64

243 Before his Passover, Jesus announced the sending of “another Paraclete” (Advocate), the Holy Spirit. At work since creation, having previously “spoken through the prophets”, the Spirit will now be with and in the disciples, to teach them and guide them “into all the truth”.68 The Holy Spirit is thus revealed as another divine person with Jesus and the Father.

245 The apostolic faith concerning the Spirit was confessed by the second ecumenical council at Constantinople (381): "We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and giver of life, who proceeds from the Father."71 By this confession, the Church recognizes the Father as “the source and origin of the whole divinity”.72 But the eternal origin of the Spirit is not unconnected with the Son’s origin: "The Holy Spirit, the third person of the Trinity, is God, one and equal with the Father and the Son, of the same substance and also of the same nature. . . Yet he is not called the Spirit of the Father alone,. . . but the Spirit of both the Father and the Son."73 The Creed of the Church from the Council of Constantinople confesses: "With the Father and the Son, he is worshipped and glorified."74

 

[rinnie]

In an effort to not derail another thread, I thought starting a new thread on this topic may be helpful. What does your faith tradition teach regarding the trinity? How do we as Catholics help others understand the trinity?

The easiest way to explain God and the Trinity is this. God revealed himself to us 3 ways. God the Father God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. ONE GOD in 3 ways.

Pretty much God can reveal himself to us in as many ways as he chooses. He has chosen to reveal himself to us these ways.

 

[Peter_Plato]

Hi Peter,

I think with effective study, one would come to a true realisation that eternal life existed long before Jesus came. Those righteous Jews were still alive, they were not dead in Abraham’s bosom…Jesus simply created an awareness that through Him eternal life is possible. **The moment He said “I am” all life went through Him. **The Baha’i religion does not deny this Truth.

Well, no it wasn’t at the “moment” that Christ said “I am” that all life WENT through him. Christ is the eternal WORD through whom all things were made. All things, including all life is, eternally speaking, through him.

That does not mean the resurrection of the dead applied to humankind before Christ’s sacrifice. He said, “I am the Resurrection and the Life” and “No one comes to the Father but through me.”

And, no it is not a “true realization” to say that “eternal life existed long before Jesus came.” Eternal life is “eternal.” Eternal things do not have a past and eternal life has no past, either, in the sense that you suppose it “existed long before Jesus.” This does not mean, however, that human beings were resurrected into eternal life “long before Jesus.” Otherwise the Resurrection of Jesus would to be superfluous.

 

[Peter_Plato]

The easiest way to explain God and the Trinity is this. God revealed himself to us 3 ways. God the Father God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. ONE GOD in 3 ways.

Pretty much God can reveal himself to us in as many ways as he chooses. He has chosen to reveal himself to us these ways.

Well, no actually, this is modalism or Sabellianism. It may be an “easy” way to explain the Trinity, but it has major issues.

The difficulty with comprehending the Trinity is that we are getting into the profound mystery of the interior Life of the Godhead. There is no “easy way” to understand that because, at its profound depth, we won’t understand God because we aren’t God. The Trinity is a revealed truth, which is why all human attempts to “refute” it represent the failures of humans to fully comprehend it.

This series of videos captures some of the best theological and philosophical reasoning surrounding the Trinity…

youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1mr9ZTZb3TWpnOJV09MuEAwbbQNCS6Qf

Any attempts to dismiss the revealed truth of the Trinity as worshiping of three Gods are laughable at best because the concept of the Trinity is treated at a superficial level by those who make such claims – similar to insisting that the wave–particle duality of every elementary particle or quantic entity cannot exhibit the properties of particles and waves because particles, these individuals might claim, just are not waves.

It is in the nature of God to be comprised of Three Divine Persons in the same way that it is in the nature of humanity to be comprised of many persons. This was glimpsed at in the Old Testament in such passages as the creation story where God says, “Let us make man in our image…” That is only a glimpse, however.

This video from the above playlist will provide a more complete and robust explanation of how the Trinity is made obvious in the Old Testament to those who study it.

youtu.be/BNt5NKSse0Y

 

[clem456]

Everything created reflects the realities contained in the Trinity.
Marriage is a great sign of God’s personal, communitarian, and fruitful love.

Scripture reflects the Trinity very well.

“God is love”.

If God is love, and human beings are creatures, how can we say that God is love if we weren’t around for him to love? Yet God is love, for all eternity.

Eternity is not past, present, and future, it is outside of time. God is always in a relationship of love, regardless of the existence of human beings.
Father, Son, and Spirit, three persons united in love fruitfully.

 

[hasantas]

]

The angels are pure spirits with nothing material, quantitative, or sensibly perceptible in their constitution. They are creatures made by God.

Angel Gabriel sometimes came to Muhammad in form of a human. Angels are creatures made by God so they have a body of which substance is not kind of matter we can percept. But it can be realised if substance transform. Many moraly high people could see angels. Angels are not eternal so we can recognise them to incarnate. But God is absolutely eternal with all substance and attributes. If we recognise God to be incarnated that mean we set God in time and matter. God is never in time and matter but He create time and matter. If you put God in time and matter but that helps materialism which suppose matter to be eternal.

God is not three gods but three persons, The Trinity. The Holy Spirit is called Dove, because in this form he descended visibly on Christ in the Jordan (see Mark 1:10) The Catechism gives some explanation of the revelation of the Trinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit:

If God is three persons then there are three gods.

Three persons cannot reconcile in everything. Three principals cannot run a school in order. Not three but even two presidents cannot lead state in order.

So three eternal substance cannot be reconciled through love. Is eternal substance(God) only love? Is it not justice? Is it not omnipotent? etc. I mean we cannot recognise God only through love. God is above everything. So which god is most powerful? Father or Son or Holy Spirit?

There are much but …

240 Jesus revealed that God is Father in an unheard-of sense: he is Father not only in being Creator; he is eternally Father in relation to his only Son, who is eternally Son only in relation to his Father: "No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him."64

243 Before his Passover, Jesus announced the sending of “another Paraclete” (Advocate), the Holy Spirit. At work since creation, having previously “spoken through the prophets”, the Spirit will now be with and in the disciples, to teach them and guide them “into all the truth”.68 The Holy Spirit is thus revealed as another divine person with Jesus and the Father.

245 The apostolic faith concerning the Spirit was confessed by the second ecumenical council at Constantinople (381): "…pped and glorified."74

It is obviously explained in Torah, Bible and Qur’an that God is unique and one! But some people through strained intpretation say that God is three! Which is superior Church or Bible?

Trinity was not recognised by earlier believers who believe in Jesus. Later by impose of Rome which was Pagans generally that Trinity doctrine was established.

And do not forget that Trinity is problematic since it had been made!

 

[Peter_Plato]

]
If God is three persons then there are three gods.

Three persons cannot reconcile in everything. Three principals cannot run a school in order. Not three but even two presidents cannot lead state in order.

So three eternal substance cannot be reconciled through love. Is eternal substance(God) only love? Is it not justice? Is it not omnipotent? etc. I mean we cannot recognise God only through love. God is above everything. So which god is most powerful? Father or Son or Holy Spirit?

There are much but …

It is obviously explained in Torah, Bible and Qur’an that God is unique and one! But some people through strained intpretation say that God is three! Which is superior Church or Bible?

I think the question is better asked as: “Which is superior, the Church’s intepretation of the Bible or your intepretation of the Bible?”

I’ll go with the Church’s because there is much written and much explained through the Scriptures, through the Church Fathers and through the unchanging teachings of the Church through history. Your interpretation requires dismissing both the Church and the Bible since the Bible clearly speaks of God as Three divine Persons, One in Being.

Again, merely because you do not accept the profound nature of the Godhead, does not mean both the Church and the Bible are wrong.

 

[tomarin]

I think the question is better asked as: “Which is superior, the Church’s intepretation of the Bible or your intepretation of the Bible?”

I’ll go with the Church’s because there is much written and much explained through the Scriptures, through the Church Fathers and through the unchanging teachings of the Church through history. Your interpretation requires dismissing both the Church and the Bible since the Bible clearly speaks of God as Three divine Persons, One in Being.

Again, merely because you do not accept the profound nature of the Godhead, does not mean both the Church and the Bible are wrong.

Where does the Bible explicitly describe the Holy Trinity?

 

[Peter_Plato]

Where does the Bible explicitly describe the Holy Trinity?

Implicitly, as in “left with no other logical option.”

See this for the New Testament:
youtu.be/OaXjVU05odE

This for the Old Testament:
youtu.be/BNt5NKSse0Y

And the entire playlist I cited a few posts back (#269) for a complete explanation of the idea and from where it came.

 

[TonyBS]

Implicitly, as in “left with no other logical option.”

See this for the New Testament:
youtu.be/OaXjVU05odE

This for the Old Testament:
youtu.be/BNt5NKSse0Y

And the entire playlist I cited a few posts back (#269) for a complete explanation of the idea and from where it came.

I would suggest Logic is thrown out the door when One God is made exclusive, no matter what Religion we have come to Love.

Then Logically if God is One, then the Trinity should also be Inclusive of this Oneness and Not Exclusive in Bias of One Message.

God Bless and Regards Tony

 

[TonyBS]

I think the question is better asked as: “Which is superior, the Church’s intepretation of the Bible or your intepretation of the Bible?”

I’ll go with the Church’s because there is much written and much explained through the Scriptures, through the Church Fathers and through the unchanging teachings of the Church through history. Your interpretation requires dismissing both the Church and the Bible since the Bible clearly speaks of God as Three divine Persons, One in Being.

Again, merely because you do not accept the profound nature of the Godhead, does not mean both the Church and the Bible are wrong.

Then It is up to us to be One with this Word. Thus one would think that any meaning that promotes the Unity of Man under the Life Giving Word of Gods Religions, would be Logically on the right path.

God Bless and Regards Tony

 

[eddie_too]

no one who rejects Jesus as the Only Son of God is leading any one to a unity of man.