University student confused about the Catholic faith

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Hi everyone,

I was born and brought up Catholic, but within the past year have become “confused” about the faith. I’ve only really gotten into all this the past few years, in spite of having parents who aren’t well catechized and thus didn’t catechize their kids well (they aren’t much help on these kinds of things at all). Last September I started my first year of university, and in the first week met and subsequently became close friends with a Protestant who raised questions I haven’t been able to satisfactorily answer for myself. Being at a secular school was a new experience for me–I’d grown up in the Canadian Catholic system–and anytime a Christian and I clicked I wasn’t about to throw away the opportunity to get close to someone who understood where I was coming from on moral issues like chastity and with whom I could share my faith.

I don’t consider myself Catholic at this point, but am still doing research into my questions–the role of tradition, papal infallibility, salvation by faith alone or faith plus works, the immaculate conception/assumption/etc. of Mary, and praying to her and the saints are the main issues. I mean, I want to make sure that if the Catholic Church is what it claims it is, I get back there yesterday. Over the past ten months I’ve been to various non-Catholic churches–Lutheran, Presbyterian, Pentecostal, and Baptist–and have been doing research on them from time to time; none of them seemed a good match. Either way, I’ve made sure not to take their communion–or, for that matter, the eucharist when I’ve gone to Mass, because I see no reason to compound my sin (if my having left the Catholic Church is mortal) by taking it unworthily. There are various things about these different denominations that I like–in particular, the long sermons and the inspiring singing–but definitely things that I disagree with. I definitely feel out of place at a Pentecostal service with their over-emphasis on gifts of the spirit/charisms, think the double predestination of Presbyterianism is erronious, and don’t view baptism or communion as merely symbolic as do Baptists.

All of this has been causing me a lot of anguish the past several months; I want to know the truth, have been reading online material and watching YouTube videos, and be where God wants me to be. If for some reason I die before the Holy Spirit helps me “figure things out”… will I go to hell… because I once was but no longer am a member of the Catholic Church? If out of my own myopia, pride, ignorance, or folly, I don’t “jump back in” before I die–let’s say in a car accident–what’s going to happen?

Thanks for any (name removed by moderator)ut,
T.
 
Welcome! I’m a fourth year university student and came from the same sort of background (from western Canada). University can definitely be a time where faith can become confusing but usually that has to do with not knowing what exactly you believe in.

Maybe we can help you out here. You’ve listed a bunch of beliefs, and some of them you can read about in Catholic Answers faith tracts, but maybe we can help you understand them if you can tell us why you are unsure.
 
Typical - Catholic students who cannot defend their faith. I have proposed that apologetics be part of Catholic curricluum for a long time.

Start Here
 
Welcome! I’m a fourth year university student and came from the same sort of background (from western Canada). University can definitely be a time where faith can become confusing but usually that has to do with not knowing what exactly you believe in.

Maybe we can help you out here. You’ve listed a bunch of beliefs, and some of them you can read about in Catholic Answers faith tracts, but maybe we can help you understand them if you can tell us why you are unsure.
Thanks for the welcome. 🙂 I guess I should have made myself clearer: what really concerns me is the question, “What if I die before this all (I hope) clicks and I go back to being Catholic? I mean, leaving is a mortal sin, and those with mortal sin on their soul go to hell… Is there some kind of ‘get out of jail free’ card for people in the situation I’ve described?”

I don’t expect to be spoon-fed answers to my questions–we have Google for a reason. 🙂 But since you asked… one of the things that troubles me is the emphasis on Mary. I agree she was the mother of God in the sense that she brought Jesus, with both a divine and human nature, into the world. I don’t think that praying to her for intercession itself is wrong or constitutes “worship”. But this YouTube debate I found here (please remove the spaces)–

http :// www. youtube. com/ watch?v=tClS31hNmII

–really got me thinking. The non-Catholic guy made some seemingly valid points, and I should watch the debate again and make note of what they were.
 
Thanks for the welcome. 🙂 I guess I should have made myself clearer: what really concerns me is the question, “What if I die before this all (I hope) clicks and I go back to being Catholic? I mean, leaving is a mortal sin, and those with mortal sin on their soul go to hell… Is there some kind of ‘get out of jail free’ card for people in the situation I’ve described?”

I don’t expect to be spoon-fed answers to my questions–we have Google for a reason. 🙂 But since you asked… one of the things that troubles me is the emphasis on Mary. I agree she was the mother of God in the sense that she brought Jesus, with both a divine and human nature, into the world. I don’t think that praying to her for intercession itself is wrong or constitutes “worship”. But this YouTube debate I found here (please remove the spaces)–

http :// www. youtube. com/ watch?v=tClS31hNmII

–really got me thinking. The non-Catholic guy made some seemingly valid points, and I should watch the debate again and make note of what they were.
And check his website out.

Dr Mark Miravalle: The Meaning of Coredemptrix
 
Typical - Catholic students who cannot defend their faith. I have proposed that apologetics be part of Catholic curricluum for a long time.

Start Here
Thanks for the link. I’ll be sure to take a look at it shortly.

And I’m not exactly proud to have finally admitted defeat (at least temporarily) either. It wasn’t for lack of trying–I didn’t give up that easily. It definitely showed me the flaws in the Catholic curriculum; when I raised the issue of why so few students seem to graduate as practicing Catholics with my school chaplain, she said, “Part of the problem is that the parents don’t emphasize it either.” It just seems like a vicious circle–no one appears immune from living in a secular culture like that in Canada.

When I pointed out the passage where Jesus said, “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church” to my friend, she wanted to know how you got papal infallibility out of that. The only thing that comes to mind now is the “What you bind on Earth will be bound in heaven” passage, but papal infallibility–the establishment of an office with this charism–doesn’t seem to follow from that either. There must be some logical explanation for all this, and I hope that I’ll find an answer in one of the links posted in this thread.
 
Thanks for the link. I’ll be sure to take a look at it shortly.

And I’m not exactly proud to have finally admitted defeat (at least temporarily) either. It wasn’t for lack of trying–I didn’t give up that easily. It definitely showed me the flaws in the Catholic curriculum; when I raised the issue of why so few students seem to graduate as practicing Catholics with my school chaplain, she said, “Part of the problem is that the parents don’t emphasize it either.” It just seems like a vicious circle–no one appears immune from living in a secular culture like that in Canada.

When I pointed out the passage where Jesus said, “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church” to my friend, she wanted to know how you got papal infallibility out of that. The only thing that comes to mind now is the “What you bind on Earth will be bound in heaven” passage, but papal infallibility–the establishment of an office with this charism–doesn’t seem to follow from that either. There must be some logical explanation for all this, and I hope that I’ll find an answer in one of the links posted in this thread.
** Papacy/infallibility
** Mt 10:1-4; Mk 3:16-19; Lk 6:14-16; Acts 1:13; Lk 9:32 … Peter always mentioned first, as foremost apostle.
Mt 18:21; Mk 8:29; Lk 12:41; Jn 6:69 … Peter speaks for the apostles.
Acts 2:14-40 … Pentecost: Peter who first preached.
Acts 3:6-7 … Peter worked first healing.
Acts 10:46-48 … Gentiles to be baptized revealed to Peter.
Jn 1:42 … Simon is Cephas (Aramaic: Kepha for rock).
Mt 16:18-19 … “on this Rock … keys … bind … loose”
Is 22:22; Rev 1:18 … keys as symbol of authority.
Jn 21:17 … “feed my sheep”
Lk 22:31-32 … “Simon … strengthen your brethren”.
Lk 10:1-2, 16; Jn 13:20; 2 Cor 5:20; Gal 4:14; Acts 5:1-5 … “vicars” (substitutes) of Christ.
Mk 6:20; Lk 1:70,2:23; Rom 12:1; Act 3:21, 1 Cor 7:14; Eph 3:5; Col 1:22 … humans can be holy (“call no one holy”).
 
Typical - Catholic students who cannot defend their faith. I have proposed that apologetics be part of Catholic curricluum for a long time.

Start Here
It is sad. My wife had 12 years Catholic school and she is very confused about the chuch and only learned some things from me years later. They are good at telling them what not to do (like cross your legs or wear make up) but not the depth of the faith.

Of course the fact that the nun who was a principle at her grade school got dismissed for theft and a priest at her high school was dismissed for having an affair with a male student, coupled with th lack of valuable teaching has her in somewhat skeptical too often.
 
It is sad. My wife had 12 years Catholic school and she is very confused about the chuch and only learned some things from me years later. They are good at telling them what not to do (like cross your legs or wear make up) but not the depth of the faith.

Of course the fact that the nun who was a principle at her grade school got dismissed for theft and a priest at her high school was dismissed for having an affair with a male student, coupled with th lack of valuable teaching has her in somewhat skeptical too often.
no hijacking now…
 
Thanks for the welcome. 🙂 I guess I should have made myself clearer: what really concerns me is the question, “What if I die before this all (I hope) clicks and I go back to being Catholic? I mean, leaving is a mortal sin, and those with mortal sin on their soul go to hell… Is there some kind of ‘get out of jail free’ card for people in the situation I’ve described?”

I don’t expect to be spoon-fed answers to my questions–we have Google for a reason. 🙂 But since you asked… one of the things that troubles me is the emphasis on Mary. I agree she was the mother of God in the sense that she brought Jesus, with both a divine and human nature, into the world. I don’t think that praying to her for intercession itself is wrong or constitutes “worship”. But this YouTube debate I found here (please remove the spaces)–

http :// www. youtube. com/ watch?v=tClS31hNmII

–really got me thinking. The non-Catholic guy made some seemingly valid points, and I should watch the debate again and make note of what they were.
Pray for God to help you understand the full ness of truth. Is there a Neumann center at your university or a Priest you can discuss with. The truth is no one can sufficiently answer your question regarding your salvation. I would like to think if you trust in him and work toward understanding the church as you migrate back you are fine.

It doesn’t seem like you are resisting because of pride, rather confussion and lack of faith. Many people have asked and answered these questions.

I would say for me, I put the burden of proof on non catholcs simply because the early Fathers taught much closer to catholic theology, and you really would need to accept that Jesus allowed his church to be hijacked for at least 1000 years without any alternative.
 
no hijacking now…
Thanks for the link. I’ll be sure to take a look at it shortly.

And I’m not exactly proud to have finally admitted defeat (at least temporarily) either. It wasn’t for lack of trying–I didn’t give up that easily. It definitely showed me the flaws in the Catholic curriculum; when I raised the issue of why so few students seem to graduate as practicing Catholics with my school chaplain, she said, “Part of the problem is that the parents don’t emphasize it either.” It just seems like a vicious circle–no one appears immune from living in a secular culture like that in Canada.

When I pointed out the passage where Jesus said, “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church” to my friend, she wanted to know how you got papal infallibility out of that. The only thing that comes to mind now is the “What you bind on Earth will be bound in heaven” passage, but papal infallibility–the establishment of an office with this charism–doesn’t seem to follow from that either. There must be some logical explanation for all this, and I hope that I’ll find an answer in one of the links posted in this thread.
The links on this sight are good for papal infallibility, especially understanding what it is and more importantly what it isn’t.
 
Got to head to bed…

but as a former Baptist who was received into full Communion with the Catholic Church…it is the Church that Jesus of Nazareth founded…

And Jesus of Nazareth is the Lord …the Way the Truth and the Life…

two quick suggestions:

ignatius.com/Products/JAEC-H/jesus-the-apostles-and-the-early-church.aspx

ignatius.com/Products/CTT-P/crossing-the-tiber.aspx

and read Pope Benedict XVI…wonderful!

Here are a few from Easter:

vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/messages/urbi/documents/hf_ben-xvi_mes_20080323_urbi-easter_en.html

vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/messages/urbi/documents/hf_ben-xvi_mes_20090412_urbi-easter_en.html

vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/audiences/2008/documents/hf_ben-xvi_aud_20080326_en.html
 
Thanks for the link. I’ll be sure to take a look at it shortly.

And I’m not exactly proud to have finally admitted defeat (at least temporarily) either. It wasn’t for lack of trying–I didn’t give up that easily. It definitely showed me the flaws in the Catholic curriculum; when I raised the issue of why so few students seem to graduate as practicing Catholics with my school chaplain, she said, “Part of the problem is that the parents don’t emphasize it either.” It just seems like a vicious circle–no one appears immune from living in a secular culture like that in Canada.

When I pointed out the passage where Jesus said, “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church” to my friend, she wanted to know how you got papal infallibility out of that. The only thing that comes to mind now is the “What you bind on Earth will be bound in heaven” passage, but papal infallibility–the establishment of an office with this charism–doesn’t seem to follow from that either. There must be some logical explanation for all this, and I hope that I’ll find an answer in one of the links posted in this thread.
I was going to mention Lk 22:31-32. Doesn’t it seem odd that Jesus explicitly says He’s prayed for Peter, but no one else specifically?

Also, when Paul refers to Cephas in his letters, he’s talking about Peter. Cephas means rock (as in “on this rock …”).
 
To the OP:

Perhaps the list of Popes will help:

newadvent.org/cathen/12272b.htm

With this, we Catholics can trace ourselves back to St. Peter and thus to Jesus. Have you noticed that only Catholics can do this? :rolleyes: Furthermore, all Bishops can be traced back to one of the 12 Apostels if you do enough research 🙂

As to Mary:
There are many great points to be made about her, so ask away and I’ll try my best to answer 👍
 
I love to recommend Scott and Kimberly Hahn’s book Home Sweet Rome. Easy read, lots of apologetics information wrt Protestantism, and the authors are very enthusiastic 🙂

I too was barely catechized as a child–my mother left the Church when I was young–and so when I “got religion,” I didn’t know anything about the differences in denominations. So I went to whichever church was most convenient… but after a couple of years, there was something missing. The Protestant books were sort of like a flat circle and I didn’t feel like I was learning *more. *I decided I needed to pray more intensely so went to a Catholic bookstore to get a Rosary (that had stuck with me–Mary was looking out for me!) and saw this book. That was on Wednesday. That Sunday I went to the Catholic Church 🙂

I also recommend the Baltimore Catechism as a sort of beginner’s catechism to get an overview. The Catechism of the Catholic Church is a wonderful resource, but written for people who already know a lot so I like to suggest it after the BC. (Both of these are online)
 
Another welcome to the forums! Your faith, as you have noticed, is under fire in the secular world. Not only from agnostics or atheists, but from our brothers and sisters in Christ as well! Notice that all, even those with good intentions, are asking you to believe less than you do now - not more. How can you believe too much about God and His Church? Impossible!

Two things came to mind: Is there a Cardinal Newman centre on or near campus? This would be the first place to go. It is the go-to centre for Catholics and those interested in the faith. They have a lot of resources there to help you become reacquainted with your faith. Their will be a priest(s) there, and masses are celebrated. Our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament is also there and I can only encourage you most strongly to go spend time with Him for enlightenment.

An excellent and handy resource is the Essential Catholic Survival Guide available on this site. It explains and defends the Catholic faith in short, concise chapters that are subject specific. You may purchase it either alone or in combo with other helpful publications. Personally, I would choose the Guide and subscription to This Rock magazine.

shop.catholic.com/search.php?mode=search&page=1

Christ’s peace be with you as you challenge and test your faith. It is more than up to the challenge, as the evil one has been trying to destroy it for almost 2,000 years.
 
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