Update on PennitentMan: My wife is

[LittleDeb]

I should add that even under stress, your fertility signs should indicate that you are fertile (ie continuous mucous) or at least be unclear enough to warrant waiting if you are trying to space babies. I can’t remember how many days of no mucous you have to have to be “safe” (4?) but I know the trap I’ve fallen into is “knowing” what my typical cycle is and assuming this one is going to be the same and then “taking a chance” with the number of days. This may not have been what happened, but I know it’s happened here You can’t assume that the current cycle is going to mirror other cycles.

Jennifer

I was thinking that too. Anti-histamines for allergies might be having an effect on her mucous. It might have looked dry while she was actually dried out from the medication. I like cross-check methods because of that.

And I personally think that it is God’s way of keeping us on our toes. Example: “I am not sure I want to be together tonight. What is driving that or stopping that? Does God want us together tonight? Is it a fear of creating life? Do I not want unity? Are we lacking unity in our marriage?” Marriage is about procreation and unity. For us, whether or not I am fertile actually has very little to do with abstinence. It is a factor, but not even a major factor. NFP just gives us a window into God’s plan.

 

[PennitentMan]

Thank you for all your responses people, it really warms my heart. Thanks for the support.

To address a few of the points made here, my wife was not privvy to very much of the stress I posted here. Appart frm the few talks we had, she doesn’t know the extent of my anguish. I know her and it just won’t help.
Anyway, so no, she was not under stress at all, it was a relatively stress-free time for her for quite the while.

Also, she didn’t have any unusual medications, appart fro mthe occasional Tylenol .

And for sperm surviving…that would be highly unlikely, since the little guy would have had to stay alive for quite the phenominal length of time…if you now what I mean.

I can just hear the echoes in my wifes womd for the last month:
“Stay’n alive, Stay’n alive, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Stay’n aliiiiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiiiive, Aaaaaaaah Yeah!” :dancing: :dancing:

 

[exiled]

Thank you for all your responses people, it really warms my heart. Thanks for the support.

To address a few of the points made here, my wife was not privvy to very much of the stress I posted here. Appart frm the few talks we had, she doesn’t know the extent of my anguish. I know her and it just won’t help.
Anyway, so no, she was not under stress at all, it was a relatively stress-free time for her for quite the while.

Also, she didn’t have any unusual medications, appart fro mthe occasional Tylenol .

And for sperm surviving…that would be highly unlikely, since the little guy would have had to stay alive for quite the phenominal length of time…if you now what I mean.

I can just hear the echoes in my wifes womd for the last month:
“Stay’n alive, Stay’n alive, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Stay’n aliiiiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiiiive, Aaaaaaaah Yeah!” :dancing: :dancing:

You’re adorable. How could your wife not warm up to such humor?

 

[vluvski]

I can just hear the echoes in my wifes womd for the last month:
“Stay’n alive, Stay’n alive, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Stay’n aliiiiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiiiive, Aaaaaaaah Yeah!” :dancing: :dancing:

Hilarious. Just evidence, then, that God can do whatever he wants, whenever he wants. He knows what He is doing. Maybe the pregnancy, despite the nausea etc… will be exactly the jump start you both need to get back into a wholesome sexual relationship for both of you.

I totally agree with comments about mucus drying up then coming back. There have been situations where if I had not been temping or had bent the rules by just one day, I could have landed it smack on target for baby making.

PM, if you don’t mind, I’d like to include your stats in my NFP thread. Just looking for amount of time practiced, method failures, and user errors. Yours really does sound like a genuine method failure, and yes, they do happen!

 

[LittleDeb]

And for sperm surviving…that would be highly unlikely, since the little guy would have had to stay alive for quite the phenominal length of time…if you now what I mean.

I can just hear the echoes in my wifes womd for the last month:
“Stay’n alive, Stay’n alive, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah, Stay’n aliiiiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiii, Ahhiiiiiiiiiive, Aaaaaaaah Yeah!” :dancing: :dancing:

God has truly blessed you in your humorous response to a tough situation. If you are a true method failure, I am very honored to meet you. The rest of us experience little miracles. You are privy to a huge one! God bless you all!

 

[whatevergirl]

Congratulations to you PM. I think that you and your wife have much to celebrate…remember why you married her…and maybe the romance you seek will come back. Sometimes, I sense a negative slant on your wife…and that’s never productive. (not judging you, just an observation) I realize you’re venting…but now with a baby on the way–you both have a lot to look forward to…and your wife loves you. She just might have trouble showing it the way you would like…keep talking…keep praying…keep loving. Good luck!

 

[katieandpaul]

Not to be insensitive to you, PM, but God is Good! I absolutely LOVE hearing stories of His glorious works. We have our own little miracle! After 2+ years of TTC, a doctor telling us NOT to TTC (whatever), and a complete adoption homestudy…we were blessed with our little one! He’s already 13 months and it seems like YESTERDAY! Sometimes it’s completely out of our hands.

I do understand your worries…for my entire pregnancy, I worried that my body would not be able to support my growing baby. He knew better - and homefully He will bless us again!

 

[monicatholic]

Penitent Man, you and your wife have participated with God in the creation of an eternal soul. there is nothing else you and she can ever do that will last forever except for procreation of little ones that will live forever through the grace of Baptism. God has ALWAYS planned for this little baby of yours! in obedience and trust, you were open to HIS plan!

i wept when i found myself again pregnant in 1997. i had had enough. i felt duped by God that NFP had failed. i felt stupid in front of our neighbors that i was pregnant again. i felt sad for myself, sorry for my husband and worried for our other kids that we would have no time or energy for them.

during my 5th month of that pregnancy, weeping, praying and vomiting (i was still 24 hour sickened at 5 months) i had a profound conversion experience. it was entirely centered around the theme of LIFE. had i not been pregnant under such duress, i suspect i would have missed that life-changing moment. In God’s world, nothing is wasted-- not even my reluctance to accept.

the child of that pregnancy is sunshine to us. she is thoroughly pleasant, friendly and loving. what would we do without her?

several years later, after prayerfully, PRAYERFULLY considering our lives, my husband and I, like you, really believed we had grave reason to avoid pregnancy. that’s when the NFP chart was sent up to the archdiocese-- the one percent unexplained failure. we were pregnant again. clearly God had done what HE pleased. we look at her and wonder what we were thinking? avoid HER? avoid bringing HER into the world? God has always planned for her.

PM, i really understand. attempted avoidance NFP babies can make us weep. but weeping endures only for a night. joy comes in the morning. and morning lasts a whole lot longer!

matter of fact, our newest baby is middle named JOY. she didn’t come in the morning, but weeping has ceased. (so has sleeping-- she is nursing in my arms just now, but ahhh, that’s another story. one that likewise weeping, will only last a while.)

peace!

 

[PennitentMan]

Thanks for that post, I really appreciate it.

I know I should rejoyce, I have been trying to for a while now, but I just can’t.

I have all these questions that I can’t ignore. I hate myself for feeling this way, but I can’t help it.
I’m tense, stressed, depressed, upset. It’s really ridiculous, but I can’t help it.
Maybe I had a rough few days, but in my mind it goes like this:

Why did we get pregnant now?

We are living in a small appartment on 1 income, with a special needs child.
We have no family support structure. No family of friends nearby.
We will now have to move.
My wife is not handling the morning sickness together with caring for our child now, very well.

We also went through some terrible times earlier in life that still leaves me drained at times.

This is almost too much for me. And to top it off, we were having marital intimacy problems and the one time we were intimate, we got pregnant…

Why???

 

[Em_in_FL]

Thanks for that post, I really appreciate it.

I know I should rejoyce, I have been trying to for a while now, but I just can’t.

I have all these questions that I can’t ignore. I hate myself for feeling this way, but I can’t help it.
I’m tense, stressed, depressed, upset. It’s really ridiculous, but I can’t help it.
Maybe I had a rough few days, but in my mind it goes like this:

Why did we get pregnant now?

We are living in a small appartment on 1 income, with a special needs child.
We have no family support structure. No family of friends nearby.
We will now have to move.
My wife is not handling the morning sickness together with caring for our child now, very well.

We also went through some terrible times earlier in life that still leaves me drained at times.

This is almost too much for me. And to top it off, we were having marital intimacy problems and the one time we were intimate, we got pregnant…

Why???

Oh wow… I’m so sorry you’re suffering so much. I can truly hear your anxiety. I’m so sorry.
Maybe you should contact your parish or talk to your priest about any support they could offer you… either in counseling, or finding volunteers to help your wife during the day with your child?.. You may not have a family support structure, but you do have your parish. Ask for help!.. They won’t slam the door in your face.

At the very least, I’m praying for you. I hope God will lead you to a better place in life through these difficult times.

 

[Mirror_Mirror]

Thanks for that post, I really appreciate it.

I know I should rejoyce, I have been trying to for a while now, but I just can’t.

I have all these questions that I can’t ignore. I hate myself for feeling this way, but I can’t help it.
I’m tense, stressed, depressed, upset. It’s really ridiculous, but I can’t help it.
Maybe I had a rough few days, but in my mind it goes like this:

Why did we get pregnant now?

We are living in a small appartment on 1 income, with a special needs child.
We have no family support structure. No family of friends nearby.
We will now have to move.
My wife is not handling the morning sickness together with caring for our child now, very well.

We also went through some terrible times earlier in life that still leaves me drained at times.

This is almost too much for me. And to top it off, we were having marital intimacy problems and the one time we were intimate, we got pregnant…

Why???

PM,

First of all I wanted to echo the sentiments of all the other posters who have extended their congratulations to you! What a blessing! Maybe it is not the answer to you prayers, specifically, but it is an answer. Remember this “God does not give us more than we can handle.” Trust me when I tell you that it is not the easiest thing to trust in. I am not sure if you are familiar with my situation (living in seperate states from my pregnant wife and kids due to work), but I find those words hard right now. I know that God has put me here for a reason, but right now, I am completely fried. I am done with this living apart stuff, but right now, my hands are tied and I cannot change it. That is for a different discussion (you can see my post here about being Frustrated) and I will not derail your thread.

No one, aside from God, can know why you are put in this situation. I wish I had the magic words that would make you feel better, but the truth of the matter is that I do not. I share in your frustrations, on a different level, but know that when things look the darkest, God is the strongest. Again, that is not easy to see, trust me I know, but He is. You have to lean on Him and give up your frustrations to Him. Adoration is a great place to do that. Go in there and tell Him everything, pour your heart out to Him.

When the world knocks you down, make sure you land on your knees!

In prayer!

 

[PennitentMan]

Go in there and tell Him everything, pour your heart out to Him.

I pursed my heart out to him daily this last little while and again this morning…

Maybe it’s the weekend I had…

I’ll have to up my anti-depressant dosage.

 

[gam197]

Congratulations!

I hope you will use this time to be more intimate with your wife and resolve some of these issues first and not focus on the other issues as yet.

You have had a problem with intimacy as many couples do. She is already pregnant so there should be no excuse as to why she cannot have sex whenever. It is up to her now. No excuses. She is called to submission. So she has morning sickness. So she may be upset that she is pregnant again. So there may be financial concerns. NOT NOW.

 

[Dan_Grelinger]

The two or three times in my life I have been in such a state, I finally surrendered. They were not happy surrenders. I wish I could surrender willingly, happily, like we hear of the saints doing. No, they were, “Well, if you are going to mess with me Lord, then just do it, I am not going to fight it anymore! I give up!” Hindsight is 20/20, and looking back at those times, I have seen that two things happened.

First, I see now that God wanted me to surrender to His will. The more I fought it, the more difficult it became for me, until I felt I could just not take it anymore. That is the only reason I could surrender; I had run out of all other reasonable responses. Anything that was left to do was utterly unreasonable. By my act of surrender, I gave God the glory that He is due. I acknowledged that His love for me was real. When I fought Him and despaired, I was not believing that He was all knowing, all loving, and all powerful. Why else would I fight or despair, but to deny that he either did not know what I really needed, or did not care enough about me to do anything, or was not able to.

Secondly, amazing unexplainable things happened. The thing that I was struggling with at that time of my life suddenly, quickly and astonishingly was solved. These challenges were many of the things that many of us suffer from, marital, fertility, employment. Poof, all of sudden, miraculously, the problem was resolved. And I could not even take credit for it! I am a problem solver by nature (an engineer by education) and this was the most unexpected outcome. By ‘giving up’ on the problem, it was resolved. This does not happen in the phyical world all by itself.

Only after I surrendered in desperation. The sciptures talk about purification. I now believe that one is purified by desparation and surrender.

Sincerely, Dan

 

[PennitentMan]

Congratulations!

I hope you will use this time to be more intimate with your wife and resolve some of these issues first and not focus on the other issues as yet.

You have had a problem with intimacy as many couples do. She is already pregnant so there should be no excuse as to why she cannot have sex whenever. It is up to her now. No excuses. She is called to submission. So she has morning sickness. So she may be upset that she is pregnant again. So there may be financial concerns. NOT NOW.

Thanks for the congratulations.

Well, since she has gotten pregnant, we have only had intercourse once…so it’s pretty much in line with how things were before. I have to say that she initiated it, so that’s something, but it’s almost 2 months now with intercourse only once.
She feels terribly ill most of the time, so much so that I can’t even sit next to her on the couch at times.

I have to say, She’s taking this much more in her stride than I am. I’m the one with the problem, it seems.

It just feels like it’s too much, you know?

 

[Mirror_Mirror]

Well, since she has gotten pregnant, we have only had intercourse once…so it’s pretty much in line with how things were before. I have to say that she initiated it, so that’s something, but it’s almost 2 months now with intercourse only once.

One is better than none. Sorry just trying to be the “glass is half full guy” here. I am not trying to make light of your situation, I just try to find something lighthearted to say.

And, hey, she initiated it. Take heart the hormones usually kick in right at the first part of the second trimester!

If life throws you lemons, make lemonade.

 

[PennitentMan]

The two or three times in my life I have been in such a state, I finally surrendered. They were not happy surrenders. I wish I could surrender willingly, happily, like we hear of the saints doing. No, they were, “Well, if you are going to mess with me Lord, then just do it, I am not going to fight it anymore! I give up!” Hindsight is 20/20, and looking back at those times, I have seen that two things happened.

First, I see now that God wanted me to surrender to His will. The more I fought it, the more difficult it became for me, until I felt I could just not take it anymore. That is the only reason I could surrender; I had run out of all other reasonable responses. Anything that was left to do was utterly unreasonable. By my act of surrender, I gave God the glory that He is due. I acknowledged that His love for me was real. When I fought Him and despaired, I was not believing that He was all knowing, all loving, and all powerful. Why else would I fight or despair, but to deny that he either did not know what I really needed, or did not care enough about me to do anything, or was not able to.

Secondly, amazing unexplainable things happened. The thing that I was struggling with at that time of my life suddenly, quickly and astonishingly was solved. These challenges were many of the things that many of us suffer from, marital, fertility, employment. Poof, all of sudden, miraculously, the problem was resolved. And I could not even take credit for it! I am a problem solver by nature (an engineer by education) and this was the most unexpected outcome. By ‘giving up’ on the problem, it was resolved. This does not happen in the phyical world all by itself.

Only after I surrendered in desperation. The sciptures talk about purification. I now believe that one is purified by desparation and surrender.

Sincerely, Dan

Thanks Dan.

I’m trying to surender this to God, but I still despair. I don’t know why.

The advice I got from a priest was that God loves a happy giver, so I have to smile and change my attitude.

I can smile on the outside, but I can’t force myself to be happy inside about something that I’m feeling depressed about.

How can I change my own feelings inside? Why would my priest tell me to change my feelings like that, like it was a switch?
is it that easy? Am I missing something?

 

[PennitentMan]

I think I’m really in a slump today, and i think my posts reflect it, and maybe even fuel it.

I’ll not post here for a little while, maybe untill I feel better.

see you all later.
PM

 

[monicatholic]

dear penitent man,

there is so much about your worry, anxiety and fear that my husband and i understand.

our newest, our Joy, is special needs, too. likwise we have a 22 year old, who spiritually, is special needs in the way of spiritual wasteland and raging drug and pornography addiction.

our income is terrible.

but you are bereft of the very thing that God has given us to re-ratify the sacrament of marriage. i will pray mostly for your wife and you to reconnect as ONE because for the married person, it is that unity, with an abundance of God’s grace poured on, that makes the trials bearable.

offer your lonliness for your wife’s healing and conversion in this. this sacrifice is a most powerful prayer. … the husband is to his family as Christ is to His Church-- sacrificing his life for her sanctity.

finally-- why?
because it pleased God to bring another eternal soul into the world and because, as the catechism reminds us, each child can make the parents better people.

you are becomming better people. that always hurts. crucibles are like that.

rejoice! God has seen fit to purify you, the son he loves!!!

 

[Dan_Grelinger]

Thanks Dan.

I’m trying to surender this to God, but I still despair. I don’t know why.

The advice I got from a priest was that God loves a happy giver, so I have to smile and change my attitude.

I can smile on the outside, but I can’t force myself to be happy inside about something that I’m feeling depressed about.

How can I change my own feelings inside? Why would my priest tell me to change my feelings like that, like it was a switch?
is it that easy? Am I missing something?

Yes, I know about the ‘happy giver’ advice. I think that this is the ultimate in honoring God. It is darn hard sometimes though. I used to think that if you did not surrender to God in a positive frame of mind, that your surrender was not good, was not pleasing to Him.

But, based on my experiences, I now believe that any surrender, as long as it is total surrender, total acceptance of what God plans on doing for (to?) you, will do.

Was Christ a ‘happy giver’ at His time of surrender? I doubt it. ‘Happy givers’ don’t sweat drops of blood! Watching “The Passion of the Christ”, I saw Jesus surrender in the fashion that I have before. "Please, oh please, don’t put me through this! Help me fix it some other way!

“Oh, allright, I surrender everything, to what in all appearances, may be my demise.”

It is in dying, that we come to life. A paradox often used in scripture. When I accepted my ‘death’ (and that is what it felt like), that was when I was released.

Sincerely,

Dan