Urgings to become Muslim

[Augustine]

If I may question, do you realize that we can only call God our Father because His Son told us that?

But I don’t mean to know fully your state of mind. Only personally could that be addressed and I recommend that you seek a spiritual director, perhaps your priest, about it.

Finally, pray and meditate on the Scriptures, perhaps on the Annunciation, when the Trinity was manifest for the first time explicitly.

 

[uglygal]

Here is the proof of how you pray:

Originally Posted by uglygal View Post
I am confused by this because I pray to my Father to lead me and I feel an attraction to Islam. I just want God and to be with Him everyday of my life.* I don’t want***** rosaries**, I don;t want chaplets, devotions, weird writings by saints …** I just want God **my Father and to be as beautiful as I can be for Him by walking and living in the Way of Love.
I’m confused :

You see. You want to limit God’s action on you! You do not totally open yourself to His will.

Thats not true, that’s not how I pray. That’s what the urging feels like

 

[uglygal]

**
and how would you determine I have repented? what would constitute repentance for you? You keep bringing it up despite everything that’s happened in between. I believe that no matter what I do it would not be enough for you.**

I notice you didn’t actually answer my question. Have you repented of that thread? It requires only a yes or no answer.

and you didn’t answer my question, what constitutes repentance?

 

[DJgang]

For you who keep bringing up that I rejected Jesus before … please get over it.

Oh, I’m really over it now. You are the one who is not. urgings to become Muslim, means I’m interest in becoming a Muslim.

Again, I pray for you.

But really, if you want everyone to be over it stop posting about rejecting Jesus and this thread does that worse of all!

 

[mangy_dog]

For some reason I have a re-occuring attraction to Islam. I don’t know why. I pray to God my Father to guide me to Him and I am attracted to Islam.
I wonder what’s going on? I have a very strong devotion to God the Father - I love Him more than anything and trust Him more than anyone. I at times feel I can’t find Him in Christianity … its all about Jesus.
There are also some things I like Islam … the simplicity of faith, prayer, charity and fasting. Freedom from so many doctrines and dogmas and just simple belief in God the Father.
I love Jesus … I believe He is Lord, Messiah, Redeemer, Son of God, the Holy Word and Wisdom of God … but I don’t believe he is God the Father. I don’t believe He is a separate God to the Father. I believe God is purely One - the Father

I am confused by this because I pray to my Father to lead me and I feel an attraction to Islam. I just want God and to be with Him everyday of my life. I don’t want rosaries, I don;t want chaplets, devotions, weird writings by saints … I just want God my Father and to be as beautiful as I can be for Him by walking and living in the Way of Love.
I’m confused

Hello gal,

Michaeljking gives good advice from a very important perspective.
There is plenty of good advice on these threads as it pertains to your particular predicament.
If you want a simpler faith without “complications”…you can have that in catholicism. The knowledge and wisdom of the “details” and dogmas come easily and by themselves, the simpler your faith is. I know because I live a simple faith.

No one goes to the Father except thru Jesus. Start there - Jesus is God. He is not a “separate” God. He and the Father are one. Start with Jesus, He will reveal all that your heart yearns to know about the Father.
Saint Philip had his revelation directly from Jesus - Jn 14: 8-9 - "Philip said to Him, “Master, show us the Father , and that will be enough for us.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you for so long a time and you still do not know me, Philip? whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?”
Complicated?? only if you make it so. I keep it simple. I don’t need to break it into theological dissertations and deep philosophical spirals of the intellect.
That bit of information/revelation must’ve kept Philip busy for the remainder of his natural life.
Don’t go chasing Islam…it’s a dead end.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

 

[rpp]

and you didn’t answer my question, what constitutes repentance?

Aside from the fact the he asked you first, he did, in fact, answer your question. He did not ask to to characterize how you repented, but only if you had.

It would appear rather that you do not desire to answer the question.

Rather than attack the questioner, it would be more charitable to either ignore the post altogether, to replay and say that you choose not to answer or that you do not feel that it is anyone’s business.

I would also add that I it is generally bad manners to bring up something from another thread. As such, I found bpbasilphx’s question
somewhat impertinent.

 

[uglygal]

Aside from the fact the he asked you first, he did, in fact, answer your question. He did not ask to to characterize how you repented, but only if you had.

It would appear rather that you do not desire to answer the question.

Rather than attack the questioner, it would be more charitable to either ignore the post altogether, to replay and say that you choose not to answer or that you do not feel that it is anyone’s business.

I would also add that I it is generally bad manners to bring up something from another thread. As such, I found bpbasilphx’s question
somewhat impertinent.

I’m sorry, I didn;t mean to come across as attacking anyone. My question was to know what ‘repented’ meant according to them, since I already did … and that was posted in another post … and yet the matter is bought up again.

 

[uglygal]

Oh, I’m really over it now. You are the one who is not. urgings to become Muslim, means I’m interest in becoming a Muslim.

Again, I pray for you.

But really, if you want everyone to be over it stop posting about rejecting Jesus and this thread does that worse of all!

see again, its bought up again … that’s why I wanted to know what constitutes repentance, since my repentance obviously isnt good enough for some ppl here

also this post isn’t about rejecting Jesus, its about urgings I have been feeling and that are confusing me.

I’m sorry that I’m perhaps not as solid in the faith as some other people. I’m a person who is struggling with their faith and me asking for opinions and even arguments to deal with / approach these urgings should be proof to you that I don;t want to reject Jesus

 

[marymol]

One of the good thing brought out by O.P is the hunger for Father Love that may be deepest yearning of our hearts !

Our Lord , who made us, know this !

He is the One , who asks us , to call on God , as Father !

( Doubt very much , that in Islam , it is that type a relationship but more of a servile fear, that is prevalent in forces set against the True God as well ! )

The Passover night, when our Lord is about to lay down His life for us, He calls the disciples as - ’ children’ !

Trinity , as i have heard many explaining it, is One of dynamic, ongoing , constant outpouring of love and communion …

Father to Son to Father …in The Holy Spirit …

St.Phillip, who too had pleaded to our Lord -‘show us The Father and that shall be sufficient for us ’ ; our Lord responded - ’ if you have seen Me, you have seen The Father .’

Is it not the Face of the Father that we behold, when we look at our Lord …and since what we offer the Son is also for The Father and The Spirit , offering our Lord , love and reverence , from the heart of a child - would it not be right too !

Repeating the prayer - Glory be to The Father, Son and Holy Spirit ’ , esp. on behalf of Moslems , who are not able to see the eternal , infinite love , of the Three Persons , in the Trinity and of our Lord, who has , through the most humbling Love , in incarnation , taken on our nature , may be ways to make good use of this temptation .

God bless!

Our Lady of Fatima , pray for us !

 

[bpbasilphx]

**I notice you didn’t actually answer my question. Have you repented of that thread? It requires only a yes or no answer.
**

**Either you repented of publicly rejecting Jesus on these board, or you did not.

Seems to me if you had, you would have said so. Instead, you answer a question with another question.**

 

[CentralFLJames]

UGal - please please please - before you go another step down the path of even considering Islam look into the highly dubious character of Mohammad. The character of this man is absolutely horrific. How can you trust that Islam has even the slightest fidelity in describing God’s true nature when the man who brought Islam constantly contradicted himself, modified and expanded teachings (the satanic verses) at whim to gain the loyal following of his militant men. I won’t list the great numbers of unsavory character attributes of Mohammad that are listed all through the Koran. Google the word “Mohammad” with any negative keyword (e.g. fraud, evil, fake, thief, murderer, possessed, mentally ill, pedophile, liar, false, etc.) and start reading some of the shocking words about him that are all stated in the Koran itself. Islam came out 600 years AFTER Christ. The Koran is made up of a combination of obscure Christian apocryphal texts (one verse linked to a proven fake Christian writing), stolen or purchased Judaic writings and moral codes along with Arabic myths/legends and violent early histories of Islam.

Run from Islam - it’s demonic.

I was curious why you can’t accept Jesus? There is absolutely no question that the man Jesus walked this earth since in addition to the Church Fathers and apostles even various historians writers give us objective evidence (Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, and Pliny the Younger). If you can’t trust the gospel accounts in the bible then learn to trust through the early church martyrs who all willingly died for what they absolutely knew to be true.

Pray on it.

James

 

[DJgang]

see again, its bought up again … that’s why I wanted to know what constitutes repentance, since my repentance obviously isnt good enough for some ppl here

also this post isn’t about rejecting Jesus, its about urgings I have been feeling and that are confusing me.

I’m sorry that I’m perhaps not as solid in the faith as some other people. I’m a person who is struggling with their faith and me asking for opinions and even arguments to deal with / approach these urgings should be proof to you that I don;t want to reject Jesus

Your repentence doesn’t have to be good for anyone except God (in three persons, which includes Jesus) and yes, this post, this thread is about rejecting Jesus…again. Don’t you see that Islam rejects Jesus Christ?

UGal, I’ve rejected Jesus in my past. It’s lonely to not have Jesus in your life.

I went through some struggles, I’m sure that we all have, yet when someone tries to help you out, you reject them as well.

I don’t know…I still continue to pray for you. Do you not realize that people that are praying for you right now, just on this forum?

Take a deep breathe. Nothing says that you have to label yourself right now… some things people, here on earth, can not help you with, it takes the help of the Holy Spirit (which is the love of the Father for the Son) maybe you need to look to the Holy Spirit for help, rather than the words of people right now.

However, here, on a Catholic Forum, full of faithful Catholic, we are going to speak out AGAINST your urgings to become Muslim…no one here is going to tell you…yeah, go for it! That would be a sin on our part.

 

[David_Poem]

Your attraction to Islam may not necessarily be the will of Him to whom you prayed, who knows. Christians pray basically this way:

“Our Father, who art in heaven,
Hallowed by Thy name,
Thy Kingdom come
Thy will be done…”

Therefore, when we pray, we pray not that our will be done but that His will be done. So, we try to find out what really is His will.

What do you mean by “simple belief in God the Father”? To believe in God the Father naturally is also to believe in the One He sent, the Son Jesus Christ. And to believe in Jesus Christ naturally is also to believe in the Church that He built, and to believe in the Church that He built naturally is also to believe in the communion of the saints.

Naturally you would be confused because your prayer is not that His will be done but that your own will be done.

sometimes when we are confused about Gods will.All we have to work with is spirtual principles.So just work on your principles.And the confuseion will take of itself.You cant have FAITH,without having trust in God will 4 you.You need COURAGE,to do the right thing without fear.You need HOPE.We cant help you,but God can if you let him.We all will have to stand be for God and give account for our life.Jesus is the way to God .We need him to speak to our Father.If you have time to be confused then you have time to pray.

 

[FCEGM]

. . . .

I’m sorry that I’m perhaps not as solid in the faith as some other people. I’m a person who is struggling with their faith and me asking for opinions and even arguments to deal with / approach these urgings should be proof to you that I don;t want to reject Jesus

Theology for Beginners by Frank Sheed is a book often recommended here. This book has an excellent and very readable section on the Most Holy Trinity and that you might find helpful in understanding (to the best of man’s ability to understand this Divine Mystery) the Church’s teaching on this crucial article of the Catholic Faith.

 

[hasikelee]

Originally Posted by uglygal View Post
I am confused by this because I pray to my Father to lead me and I feel an attraction to Islam. I just want God and to be with Him everyday of my life.* I don’t want***** rosaries**, I don;t want chaplets, devotions, weird writings by saints …** I just want God **my Father and to be as beautiful as I can be for Him by walking and living in the Way of Love.
I’m confused :

There are also some things I like Islam … the simplicity of faith, prayer, charity and fasting. Freedom from so many doctrines and dogmas and just simple belief in God the Father.
I love Jesus … I believe He is Lord, Messiah, Redeemer, Son of God, the Holy Word and Wisdom of God … but I don’t believe he is God the Father. I don’t believe He is a separate God to the Father. I believe God is purely One - the Father

I guess I have a different view of the Muslim faith? Because the Muslims I know lead the most confusing, strict, complex and overbearing religious practices I’ve known. Now, I’m not getting into a discussion of if it’s a good or bad devotion. I am just pointing out that you aren’t making much sense here.

How can you feel that something such as meditating on the passages in the Bible, or saying a chaplet, is too much for your simple love of God, but then feel attracted to a religion that requires you to wash your hands a certain way, sit a certain direction, pray at certain times, etc?

I notice you mention you are confused and you are trying to find your way. So please realize I am asking a sincere question here.

P.s. I also am wondering who taught you that Jesus was God the Father?

 

[uglygal]

Thankyou for people’s help … some points have stuck out to me particularly …

Muslims do not believe that jesus died on the cross, they believe he was magically swapped for Judas at the last minute and that Jesus and Mary Magdalene married, had kids…

I have heard of the magic swapping trick … but do they also believe he married Mary Magdalene? I have never heard that, is that in the Koran or is that a tradition?

Islam is all about submission to a God who is essentially unknowable.

ok, i was not unaware they believe God is unknowable. I was told they believe in a personal god

Forget your opinions about Jesus and read the Gospels. If you open your heart, the Holy Spirit will reveal Christ to you and you will experience his love.

This is a core problem I have in relation to Catholicism. I will try to explain it. When I read the gospels, my own understanding gathered from simply reading the words as you would from any other written text … the Jesus I read about in the gospels is different to the Jesus of Catholicism. I will try to address this later in more detail. I also know that in catholicism we (as lay people) are not allowed to interpret the Bible because if we do we will go to hell, as you can see this gives rise to many problems for me

Christianity on the other hand, teaches that Jesus has already achieved salvation for us. He has opened the door for us. All we have to do is love him. We keep his commandments out of love, not because we feel that we have to in order to achieve redemption.

then why all the talk and threats with hell and declarations of anathema? Why the belief that most people, including catholics, will go to hell (ie. St ? of Port Maurice - their name escapes me at the moment), everyone none-catholic will go to hell where God will torture and torment us for eternity for simply getting our faith wrong If salvation is already attained … why the hellfire and brimstone. This is a serious question one that no-one has answered for me

do you realize that we can only call God our Father because His Son told us that?

With respect I disagree with that. For us to call God Father does not necessitate that He has a Son, a child … to my understanding (which i know according to catholics is nothing since I am a lay person and incapable of interpreting things for myself), God can be called Father as the Loving Creator of all things. There is no necessity for a Son to exist, for as creator God is ‘father’.
That’s my understanding
(though being a Father to a Son would make God radically a Father)

There is plenty of good advice on these threads as it pertains to your particular predicament.
If you want a simpler faith without “complications”…you can have that in catholicism.

Yes there is and I am grateful for the people who do give me good advice
If there is simple faith in catholicism … PLEASE point it out to me because I can’t find it. When I say ‘simplicity’ in Islam I suppose what I am referring to is the five pillars 1.faith, 2.pilgrimage, 3. fasting, 4. charity, 5. prayer. Five simple points to keep a focus on.
In catholicism I have not heard or known anything similar to this. I have heard “love one another”. ok how do you do that?
and thats where it starts … well (deep breath) go to confession every Saturday, go to Mass every day if you can, but don;t go too much or you will sin against the Body and Blood of Christ, pray the rosary, fast on days of obligations, what days are obligations? well there’s pre-Vatican days of obligations and post-vatican II days of obligations, fast three times a week, fast on solemnities, go to church on the Feast of the Assumption, fast for forty days in lent, fast all advent, pray seven times a day with the Divine Office, use holy water to keep the devil away, pray the Divine Mercy chaplet, keep the 3pm Holy Hour, pray the stations of the cross, read the imitation by Thomas Kempis, read the gospel but don;t interpret it! that’s for priests and Bishops, discern your vocation to being single, married, religious, don’t use contraception, don’t have natural feelings of attraction to the opposite gender because that’s lust and you’ll go to hell, examine your conscience everyday, pray three hail Mary’s for graces, pray the chaplet of the Holy Wounds for the conversion of sinners … I don’t intend that to be offensive but that is always what ‘living’ the catholic faith sounds like to me its a recipe for despair because I can’t keep up with it. I have tried and I can’t, and after a while it gets very off putting. As I said before I don;t intend to offend anyone. But if anyone can put simply what and how the catholic faith is to be lived, please please tell me

Maybe a ten-point plan to living the catholic faith

continued …

 

[uglygal]

continued …

How can you trust that Islam has even the slightest fidelity in describing God’s true nature

That’s a good question and I don’t know the answer.

but …
Islam is not from God because the Koran promotes violence … have you ever read the OT? It does the same.

Islam is not from God because why would God care about what we eat and forbidden/ permitted foods … have you ever read the OT? Apparently the catholic god cared then

Islam is not from God because in the Koran God tells ‘believers’ to kill infidels … ever read the OT where God tells the Israelites to genocide non-jews

Islam is not from God because in the Koran God wants people to pray in a certain location (Mecca) … ever read the OT where God wanted people to pray in Jerusalem

Islam is not from God because Muhammad was an imperfect immoral man … ever read the OT about King David, Solomon and his concubines, holy Israelites pillaging cities and raping women

I don’t know what the answers are here but this provides much food-for-thought for me. Catholics believe in the God of the OT to the point that Jesus is the God of the OT, but, the Allah of Islam has very much in common with Yahweh of the OT

I also am wondering who taught you that Jesus was God the Father?

The catholic church. Unless I’ve got it wrong, doesn’t the Catholic church teach that Jesus is God incarnate?

If anyone has answers to these things, feel free to tell me / correct me. Its a mercy, or so I hear

 

[randomguy0187]

If you want simple, here are the precepts of the Catholic Church, as set out in the Catechism (bold emphasis my own):

II. THE PRECEPTS OF THE CHURCH

2041 The precepts of the Church are set in the context of a moral life bound to and nourished by liturgical life. The obligatory character of these positive laws decreed by the pastoral authorities is meant to guarantee to the faithful the very necessary minimum in the spirit of prayer and moral effort, in the growth in love of God and neighbor:

2042 The first precept (“You shall attend Mass on Sundays and holy days of obligation and rest from servile labor”) requires the faithful to sanctify the day commemorating the Resurrection of the Lord as well as the principal liturgical feasts honoring the mysteries of the Lord, the Blessed Virgin Mary, and the saints; in the first place, by participating in the Eucharistic celebration, in which the Christian community is gathered, and by resting from those works and activities which could impede such a sanctification of these days.

The second precept (“You shall confess your sins at least once a year”) ensures preparation for the Eucharist by the reception of the sacrament of reconciliation, which continues Baptism’s work of conversion and forgiveness.

The third precept (“You shall receive the sacrament of the Eucharist at least during the Easter season”) guarantees as a minimum the reception of the Lord’s Body and Blood in connection with the Paschal feasts, the origin and center of the Christian liturgy.

2043 The fourth precept (“You shall observe the days of fasting and abstinence established by the Church”) ensures the times of ascesis and penance which prepare us for the liturgical feasts and help us acquire mastery over our instincts and freedom of heart.

The fifth precept (“You shall help to provide for the needs of the Church”) means that the faithful are obliged to assist with the material needs of the Church, each according to his own ability.

The faithful also have the duty of providing for the material needs of the Church, each according to his own abilities.

Seems pretty simple to me…what do you think?

Your last last couple posts had several misrepresentations of Church teaching, which I am sure other people on the forum are better prepared at discussing that I am.

I will say that some of the things you seem to be overwhelmed with are personal devotions: things like rosaries, chaplets, Marian apparitions, and prayers to saints (and much more) fall into this category. These are encouraged by the Church because they help give a more personalized feel and encourage deeper devotion. They are NOT necessarily required; if you wanted to, you could live your entire life not saying a chaplet of divine mercy or a rosary and still live the Catholic Faith. They are popular because many people have found it has helped them in their own personal faith journeys, but if you feel like these are things that confuse or overwhelm you then you don’t have to do them.

There’s my two cents for now. I would like to interject an interesting tidbit that I learned from my Muslim friends: unmarried men and women are not allowed physical contact with members of the opposite sex. I learned that several years ago when I offered my hand for a handshake to a woman wearing a hijab (I was being introduced to her); embarrassing at first but it made for an interesting conversation

 

[AaronsStaff]

continued …

That’s a good question and I don’t know the answer.

but …
Islam is not from God because the Koran promotes violence … have you ever read the OT? It does the same.

Islam is not from God because why would God care about what we eat and forbidden/ permitted foods … have you ever read the OT? Apparently the catholic god cared then

Islam is not from God because in the Koran God tells ‘believers’ to kill infidels … ever read the OT where God tells the Israelites to genocide non-jews

Islam is not from God because in the Koran God wants people to pray in a certain location (Mecca) … ever read the OT where God wanted people to pray in Jerusalem

Islam is not from God because Muhammad was an imperfect immoral man … ever read the OT about King David, Solomon and his concubines, holy Israelites pillaging cities and raping women

I don’t know what the answers are here but this provides much food-for-thought for me. Catholics believe in the God of the OT to the point that Jesus is the God of the OT, but, the Allah of Islam has very much in common with Yahweh of the OT

The catholic church. Unless I’ve got it wrong, doesn’t the Catholic church teach that Jesus is God incarnate?

If anyone has answers to these things, feel free to tell me / correct me. Its a mercy, or so I hear

Gal, I pray that you do not become Muslim, there is more to it than what you have listed. You said previously that you want a relationship with God the Father, well in Islam God is not percieved to be a father. There was a thread about the Our Father prayer, asking if Jews and Muslims can pray it, and I know a Muslim poster said no, because in Islam, God is not known as a father. Do you also know that Islam, started 600 years after the time of Christ denies his death on the cross, and his ressurection? Not only are these claims untrue, but are just plain unfounded. How can a man born some 600 years after the time of Christ deny the historical truth that he died on the cross? That would be like me denying that Columbus came to the Americas, I have no basis for my claims, and neither did Mohammed. I know Christianity/Catholicism is from God, because it was founded by a perfect person, both God and man, who said that HE was the way the truth and the life. I believe Jesus Christ, and he and his Apostles/followers warned the future generations that false prophets would come; and they indeed have come and certainly more will come. Islam attacks St. Paul, saying that he distorted Christian teaching, well…even if that were true, which it is not…they cannot deny the words of the Lord Jesus Christ himself, who did not teach what Mohammed taught.

Gal, I reccomend you look over Old Testament prophecies concerning Jesus, and pray that God will open you heart to the truth, which is Christ.

 

[marymol]

Posting this with the hope to be of some help to those who might be confused by some of the arguments against our Catholic faith !

Islam, having some in common with our JudeoChristian faith is true ; after all, it is known that Mohammed learned from an Augustinian monk who had fallen away from the Church !

There are some elements that seem deceptively close , like of a counterfiet note , that would take an expert to recognise !

As to the violence seemed to have been advocated in O.T , the few times when Israel itself was asked by God , to do so , such as in exodus , the reason given is that Israel , due to its own sinfulness had become weak and was not able to withstand the strong idolworshipping cultures they had to face !

Total destruction of demonic infested things and persons were the only way for any good to survive in the world !

True , persons like David - who are shown as imperfect persons , ( to contrast with the One sinless Perfect One ) did sin and O.T shows what were to follow even for him (all the troubles with Absalom and so on …; do not remember reading any such righteous judgements ever mentioned in the life of Mohammed , who went from bad to worse !)

With the coming of our Lord Jesus, satan’s power was chained and the followers of our Lord ,has been given power to forgive , to be truly merciful to even their enemies (and be freeed from the poison of long standing hatreds !) after all, here is our Lord , God-Man , killed by His own creatures , yet forgiving them …

Islam has affection and respect for Bl.Mother ( Mariam) ; have read that Fatima apparitions is something Moslems seem to be able to connect and find the true faith …

True, fear about going to hell for eternity because one chose to live for oneself and thus become like a speck of a dried grain of sand , is facing reality !

Yet , ours is a faith that gives hope , in a God who loves to forgive those who repent , and are able to admit our own neediness and brokenness , to say “have Mercy”!

And then be able to extend that mercy to others too …Islam too call for mercy …but strayes out of the The Way , of being truly merciful to others !
God Bless!