US Bishops' Conference Largely Disappointed by Debt Ceiling Agreement

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4elise said:
Please take a moment to look at those charts again - if one person has $1000 and they have to pay 50% of that in some form of tax, and another has $1,000,000 and only pays 10% of that in tax - **the case is that the poor are unfairly burdened. ** When people like Romney say 50% pay no federal tax - do you think it is to encourage equity?🤷 - or to get the votes of people who do not look into this any further - and who just say ***“well that’s not fair! We ought to do something about that!” ***
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Your charts do not reflect the refundable tax credits and Govt assistance the poor get the facts are as they are 47% of earners pay no federal income 84% of federal income taxes are paid by top 25%b the class warfare arguments of the left about the greedy rich not paying their fair share falls apart when the truth is revealed
 
rlg94086 said:
I’ve done so…I was called “lukewarm,” remember?

BTW…I think we all are giving our views of what would make the country stronger and enable opportunities for everyone. Who do you think isn’t?
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I think some posts believe that everyone is capable of pulling themselves up by their bootstraps, I don’t think everyone has boots. Another assumption.

There are those who assume everyone who are on welfare ***want to be on welfare. ***

Some suggest that based on individual experience this can be extrapolated to infer that everyone receiving aid do so because the chose to not work -

A lot of assumptions - a lot of judging.
 
4elise said:
I think some posts believe that everyone is capable of pulling themselves up by their bootstraps, I don’t think everyone has boots. Another assumption.

There are those who assume everyone who are on welfare ***want to be on welfare. ***

Some suggest that based on individual experience this can be extrapolated to infer that everyone receiving aid do so because the chose to not work -

A lot of assumptions - a lot of judging.
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Um…fyi…you just made a lot of assumptions and judged a bunch of people.
 
rlg94086 said:
It’s not twisting. It’s pretty simple. Both of us find a starving baby horrendous and unacceptable. However, you are creating a false dichotomy - either support abortion but save the starving babies, or support social programs and allow people to kill their unborn innocents. I wouldn’t allow someone to starve their baby, nor would I allow them to kill their baby.
  1. A baby who lives, as opposed to being aborted, will not necessarily starve. They at least have a chance to live a full life…not so much for the baby who was killed.
  2. Government-run social programs are not the only way to keep a baby from starving.
Giving someone the choice to kill their unborn child, is no different than giving them the choice to kill their toddler, teenager, etc. It is a grave evil, and there is no way you can spin support of those who are in favor of allowing such a choice to be the right way to vote as a Christian.
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Thank you so much for making that point. I have been going round and round with the liberal
spin artists that seem to want to take away Gods Divine Providance as to the future and chances of survival of the poor. We have in our parish a food bank. It is free, we all donate and anyone can get help Catholic or not. And if they cant get there someone will bring it
to them. We don`t get federal funds, and to justify voting for a pro-abortion canidate simply
because they wil promote social programs for those who otherwise might have abortions is
a sin. Abortion is murder and that makes them an accomplice. No spin, just life and death.
Pax
Tom T
 
estesbob said:
Your charts do not reflect the refundable tax credits and Govt assistance the poor get the facts are as they are 47% of earners pay no federal income 84% of federal income taxes are paid by top 25%b the class warfare arguments of the left about the greedy rich not paying their fair share falls apart when the truth is revealed
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I believe you are speaking about the earned income tax credit? The % of this that is returned to the economy has been benefited state and local communities because it is spent - not saved - one article on this topic - and how it impacted one community www2.tbo.com/news/breaking-news/2011/aug/05/4/poor-using-tax-credit-more-bringing-590-million-to-ar-248555/

Please try to consider that this isn’t about ‘class warfare’ - the point that this and other programs that help the poor and the working poor - ***actually not only helps them, but helps the country. ***
 
rlg94086 said:
I’m guessing if you had an answer, you might have replied. But, then, that would be assumptive on my part.
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Ok… sigh - question -

Are you really (not sarcastically) suggesting that we return to Clinton era funding / taxing?
 
rlg94086 said:
Um…fyi…you just made a lot of assumptions and judged a bunch of people.
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Oh my goodness - pointing out the assumptions that have been made on this thread about the poor - perhaps you and I aren’t reading the same thread?
 
4elise said:
Ok… sigh - question -

Are you really (not sarcastically) suggesting that we return to Clinton era funding / taxing?
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I’m all for it! Let’s go. Obviously, there will be some increases to the budget because of interest on the increased debt, but we would either have a surplus or much smaller deficit. Wouldn’t we?

(Why do you keep assuming I’m sarcastic?)
 
4elise said:
Oh my goodness - pointing out the assumptions that have been made on this thread about the poor - perhaps you and I aren’t reading the same thread?
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You’re just assuming they are assumptions.
 
4elise said:
I believe you are speaking about the earned income tax credit? The % of this that is returned to the economy has been benefited state and local communities because it is spent - not saved - one article on this topic - and how it impacted one community www2.tbo.com/news/breaking-news/2011/aug/05/4/poor-using-tax-credit-more-bringing-590-million-to-ar-248555/

Please try to consider that this isn’t about ‘class warfare’ - the point that this and other programs that help the poor and the working poor - ***actually not only helps them, but helps the country. ***
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Totally irrelevant to the point I was making It is hard to claim the "rich " dont pay their “fair” share when neRly half pay no federal income tax
 
estesbob said:
Totally irrelevant to the point I was making It is hard to claim the "rich " dont pay their “fair” share when neRly half pay no federal income tax
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You may have answered, and I missed it, but I asked how they arrived at that percentage. Does it include people who make $12K or less, adult student, unemployed, etc?
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
You may have answered, and I missed it, but I asked how they arrived at that percentage. Does it include people who make $12K or less, adult student, unemployed, etc?
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Everybody required to file a tax return which would inlude individuals who make over 9500 and couples over $18500
 
estesbob said:
Everybody required to file a tax return which would inlude individuals who make over 9500 and couples over $18500
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How do they getaway without paying taxes? Twice, I was unable to pay my taxes on time and I had to pay huge penalties and interest, accrued each month, until I paid them off. IRS was unforgiving, relentless, and borderline brutal in collecting.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
How do they getaway without paying taxes? Twice, I was unable to pay my taxes on time and I had to pay huge penalties and interest, accrued each month, until I paid them off. IRS was unforgiving, relentless, and borderline brutal in collecting.
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In most cases they have tax credits that offset their entire tax liability I deal with the IRS and a daily basis and agree the penalties they levy is excessive
 
estesbob said:
In most cases they have tax credits that offset their entire tax liability I deal with the IRS and a daily basis and agree the penalties they levy is excessive
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There’s a difference of income levels though, between those receiving the tax credits you speak of and those paying the taxes. Do you have the numbers representing the average incomes that don’t pay?
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
There’s a difference of income levels though, between those receiving the tax credits you speak of and those paying the taxes. Do you have the numbers representing the average incomes that don’t pay?
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Not here in my office
 
estesbob said:
No sorry
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Well it seems like it would be an important factor. What is the threshold of deductions, $12k? So anyone that makes less pays no taxes. If they have children, the allowable untaxed income rises with each dependent. It could be that 47% represents low income families, and single people, who could possibly be employed by a percentage of those paying a higher tax because they make so much more. 🤷
 
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