USCCB Pulpit Announcement - help! Not sure I can read it

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If the UCCB believes that universal health care, as in the form of the House Bill is a fundamental human right, I would be very interested to know where, exactly, is this so-claimed Catholic teaching that one’s amount of care will be decided by a panel of 7 “experts,” and if the experts say all the care you get (deserve, or can be afforded you) is ZERO, well that’s just okay. I can’t seem to find that anywhere… could someone point me to it?

Have any of you read this abortion of a health care bill? You DON’T get universal health care, you get distributed health care, which could be none, some, or much. That doesn’t go with anything I’ve ever read coming from JPII (or B-16 either). What they teach is that because each human life is precious, it deserves all efforts to support it. That isn’t anything like what the House Bill offers.

I would ask the question, if the UCCB wants this so badly, why do they allocate so little of their available funding to it? Why are they giving money to pro-abortion causes and political organizations and not purchasing health care with those dollars? It seems very easy for them to demand someone else pay the bill while they don’t want to pay much at all. Perhaps they’d be willing to do away with tax exempt status and pay a small amount, say 2%, as a tax and that could go to fund the health care they are demanding.
 
I would ask the question, if the UCCB wants this so badly, why do they allocate so little of their available funding to it? Why are they giving money to pro-abortion causes and political organizations and not purchasing health care with those dollars? It seems very easy for them to demand someone else pay the bill while they don’t want to pay much at all. Perhaps they’d be willing to do away with tax exempt status and pay a small amount, say 2%, as a tax and that could go to fund the health care they are demanding.
You do realize that any money that the bishops have come from us, through our contributions.
Were are you getting that money is being given to pro-abortion causes, the letter was against the bill because it allowed federal funding for abortion.
It is our call and command from Christ to take care of those in need including health. Perhaps if Catholics properly gave of their treasure, and say supported Catholic hospitals to the fullest, they could then provide the health care need to those in need. Perhaps that should be the message from the bishops as well.

Peace,
FAB
 
Perhaps if Catholics properly gave of their treasure, and say supported Catholic hospitals to the fullest, they could then provide the health care need to those in need. Perhaps that should be the message from the bishops as well.

Peace,
FAB
Do Catholic hospitals solicit charitable donations? I am unsure if the Catholic hospitals in my area are listed as charitable organizations.
 
Do Catholic hospitals solicit charitable donations? I am unsure if the Catholic hospitals in my area are listed as charitable organizations.
It is probably one of the thing your local archdiocese is trying to keep balanced along with all of the other services.
 
Do Catholic hospitals solicit charitable donations? I am unsure if the Catholic hospitals in my area are listed as charitable organizations.
I’m not certain how they are listed, but they are non-profit, and would solicit and take donations.

Peace,
FAB
 
You may find your local Catholikc hospital in your donations to the United Way. If you work for a company that has that plan, you can select where your donation goes.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
+United Way. . . ? . . . maybe not . . . :nope: . . . *they have indulged in a very deceptive and contradictory stance quite opposite to the teachings of the Catholic Church in regard to the sanctity of human life and abortion . . . *

"Oh Mary conceived without sin,
pray for us sinners
who have recourse to thee."
*
"Every Fall as United Way commences its fundraising activities, part of its campaign is to attempt to present itself as an agency which does not fund abortions. Case in point - … North Platte Telegraph has a United Way spokesman calling the fact that United Way supports abortion providing agencies a “myth”. (zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=12984865&BRD=377&PAG=461&dept_id=53181… )

But that is simply NOT true. United Way supports **Planned Parenthood **one of the world’s foremost abortion promoting and performing agencies.

Websites for the United Way chapters in cities such as New York and Toronto demonstrate clearly that the agency funds **Planned Parenthood **of New York City and **Planned Parenthood **of Toronto respectively. Moreover, the New York United Way chapter recommends visitors to its website to both the National Abortion Rights Action League New York office and the office of the National Abortion Federation. The recommendations can be found through the United Way CARES program.

See Planned Parenthood listed as a donor recipient at United Way NYC and Toronto:
unitedwaytoronto.com/who_we_help/agency-list/agency_list.html
unitedwaynyc.org/?id=39&pg=hc

See the United Way NYC CARES program:
unitedwaynyc.org/?id=65

:compcoff: Link: lifesitenews.com/ldn/2004/sep/04092302.html
. . .

:signofcross:
PRAYER TO

**SAINT MICHAEL
THE ARCHANGEL **

**St. Michael the Archangel, **
defend us in battle.
Be our defense against the wickedness
and snares of the Devil.
May God rebuke him,
we humbly pray,
and do
**thou, O Prince of the heavenly hosts, **
by the power of God,
thrust into hell Satan,
and all the evil spirits,
who prowl about the world
seeking the ruin of souls.
Amen.
. . . all for Jesus+
 
+United Way. . . ? . . . maybe not . . . :nope: . . . *they have indulged in a very deceptive and contradictory stance quite opposite to the teachings of the Catholic Church in regard to the sanctity of human life and abortion . . . *

"Oh Mary conceived without sin,
pray for us sinners
who have recourse to thee."
*
"Every Fall as United Way commences its fundraising activities, part of its campaign is to attempt to present itself as an agency which does not fund abortions. Case in point - … North Platte Telegraph has a United Way spokesman calling the fact that United Way supports abortion providing agencies a “myth”. (zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=12984865&BRD=377&PAG=461&dept_id=53181… )

But that is simply NOT true. United Way supports **Planned Parenthood **one of the world’s foremost abortion promoting and performing agencies.

Websites for the United Way chapters in cities such as New York and Toronto demonstrate clearly that the agency funds **Planned Parenthood **of New York City and **Planned Parenthood **of Toronto respectively. Moreover, the New York United Way chapter recommends visitors to its website to both the National Abortion Rights Action League New York office and the office of the National Abortion Federation. The recommendations can be found through the United Way CARES program.

See Planned Parenthood listed as a donor recipient at United Way NYC and Toronto:
unitedwaytoronto.com/who_we_help/agency-list/agency_list.html
unitedwaynyc.org/?id=39&pg=hc

See the United Way NYC CARES program:
unitedwaynyc.org/?id=65

:compcoff: Link: lifesitenews.com/ldn/2004/sep/04092302.html
. . .

:signofcross:
PRAYER TO

**SAINT MICHAEL
THE ARCHANGEL **

**St. Michael the Archangel, **
defend us in battle.
Be our defense against the wickedness
and snares of the Devil.
May God rebuke him,
we humbly pray,
and do
**thou, O Prince of the heavenly hosts, **
by the power of God,
thrust into hell Satan,
and all the evil spirits,
who prowl about the world
seeking the ruin of souls.
Amen.
. . . all for Jesus+

But you’re not giving to the United Way. The way it works is that the United Way has a list of organizations to which it chanels money. There is a form that your HR department has, if your employer participates in the program. You go to the form and you check off your Catholic beneficiaries. The money is sent directly to those organizations. The United Way serves as a banker, if you will.

The way that it works is that the organizations write a proposal for a project, let’s say immunization of poor kids. If the United Way approves the proposal, it commits itself to chanelign money to that organization for that project. If you see such a project on their list, you can ask that your donation be soley sent to that and no one else.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
+**To my mind . . . **the United Way charity has so polluted their name . . . with the blood of multitudes of slain innocent children . . . by their support and funding of the slaughter of innocent babes through the horrific evil of abortion . . . I for one want **NO **part of the duplicitous United Way organization . . .

:bible1: “Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us.” - I Corinthians 5:6-7
There are wonderful charities which do uphold the sanctity of human life and the pro-life teachings of the Catholic Church without equivocation . . . such as Mother Angelica’s EWTN and her priests, brothers and nuns . . . and Father Frank Pavone’s Priests for Life . . . *for the good and well being of my soul in the Lord . . . I’ll just stick to those . . . *

:compcoff: Links: ewtn.com/ and www.priestsforlife.org
Merriam-Webster On-line Dictionary
Main Entry: **du·plic·i·tous **
Pronunciation: \du̇-ˈpli-sə-təs also dyu̇-
Function: adjective
: marked by duplicity : deceptive in words or action
. . . all for Jesus+
. . . Lord God in Heaven above+
. . . preserve us from the duplicity of man+
 
+There are wonderful charities which do uphold the sanctity of human life and the pro-life teachings of the Catholic Church without equivocation . . . such as Mother Angelica’s EWTN and her priests, brothers and nuns . . . and Father Frank Pavone’s Priests for Life . . . for the good and well being of my soul in the Lord . . . I’ll just stick to those . . .

All of the above are good organizations. You won’t get an argument from me on that score. What I was proposing was finding ALL of those Catholic organizations and charities that need our help. Many of them are on the United Way lists.

It is true that Planned Parenthood and others like them are also on their list. But I’m not promoting that we donate to them. I’m suggesting that we find the Catholic ones who need out help. These are also on their lists.

Unfortuantely, the United Way is not selective on who they put on their lists. I’m not sure if want stop them from including these organizations. But I don’t have to support these organizations. There is a way to help our own organizations without helping Planned Parenthood and their ilk.

On that list there are Catholic homes for the aged, Catholic hospices, Catholic hospitals, Catholic family centers, Catholic housing programs, Catholic homes for people with AIDS, Catholic health programs for the poor, Catholic homes for the terminally ill and many other Catholic organizations that need our support.

Many people don’t know where to send their donations, but they have access to these lists through their HR Dept. My proposal is go to the list, select the Catholic organizations. That does not compromise our souls or our moral values. People can donate and circumvent the pro-abortion providers.

I may be mistaken, but there may even be a way sending the donations directlyt to these organizations that we normally don’t hear about using their list. Using the lists does not compromise us. It’s just a way of getting information and getting donations to where they will do some good.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
All of the above are good organizations. You won’t get an argument from me on that score. What I was proposing was finding ALL of those Catholic organizations and charities that need our help. Many of them are on the United Way lists.

It is true that Planned Parenthood and others like them are also on their list. But I’m not promoting that we donate to them. I’m suggesting that we find the Catholic ones who need out help. These are also on their lists.

Unfortuantely, the United Way is not selective on who they put on their lists. I’m not sure if want stop them from including these organizations. But I don’t have to support these organizations. There is a way to help our own organizations without helping Planned Parenthood and their ilk.

On that list there are Catholic homes for the aged, Catholic hospices, Catholic hospitals, Catholic family centers, Catholic housing programs, Catholic homes for people with AIDS, Catholic health programs for the poor, Catholic homes for the terminally ill and many other Catholic organizations that need our support.

Many people don’t know where to send their donations, but they have access to these lists through their HR Dept. My proposal is go to the list, select the Catholic organizations. That does not compromise our souls or our moral values. People can donate and circumvent the pro-abortion providers.

I may be mistaken, but there may even be a way sending the donations directlyt to these organizations that we normally don’t hear about using their list. Using the lists does not compromise us. It’s just a way of getting information and getting donations to where they will do some good.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
Instead of United Way, Catholic Charities does excellant work. It doesn’t go to Catholic Hospitals, to which direct contribution can be made, but is suppoet many organizations which help those in need.

Peace,
FAB
 
If the UCCB believes that universal health care, as in the form of the House Bill is a fundamental human right, I would be very interested to know where, exactly, is this so-claimed Catholic teaching that one’s amount of care will be decided by a panel of 7 “experts,” and if the experts say all the care you get (deserve, or can be afforded you) is ZERO, well that’s just okay. I can’t seem to find that anywhere… could someone point me to it?
I would further ask why, if this is a fundamental human right, bishops are not declaring that it is necessary for every country in the world to implement it. Haiti is 80% Catholic, surely they ought to be held to the same standard as our country which is only 25% Catholic. Why is the Church not pushing Haiti to implement this bill?

Ender
 
I would further ask why, if this is a fundamental human right, bishops are not declaring that it is necessary for every country in the world to implement it. Haiti is 80% Catholic, surely they ought to be held to the same standard as our country which is only 25% Catholic. Why is the Church not pushing Haiti to implement this bill?

Ender
In the teaching of the church it recongizes the dignaty of all. The church does teach that countries of wealth help from our treasure, those countries in need.

The bishops act as the conscience of the faithful instructing us on waht we should be supporting. We believe these teachings are not just from them, but indeed is the Holy Spirit guiding them.
The support is not so much for this particular bill. I am certain they recongize it’s faults, certian they have pointed out two of them, but the bill does recongized the need for everyone to have access to health care and that it is affordable, particularly to those most in need.
Chruch also does not speak to those who are Catholics. It works to provide Spiritual direction to all peoples, no matter what their faith. It also acts to care for all people, Catholic or not.

Peace,
FAB
 
In the teaching of the church it recognizes the dignity of all. The church does teach that countries of wealth help from our treasure, those countries in need.
Let me remind you of what you said earlier:* “What the bishops said in the letter reflects the view of the Church, that all people, just not in the United States, have full access to affordable health care.”

*Isn’t it the obligation of all countries to grant their citizens all basic human rights? Is it or is it not the teaching of the Church? If that is what the Church teaches - and if affordable health care is a basic human right - then Haiti has the same obligation as we do. If your response is that Haiti cannot afford it then you have admitted that countries may decide based on financial considerations whether or not to grant their citizens basic human rights … and that apparently basic human rights aren’t all that basic.

You could respond, as you did above, that the Church calls on wealthy countries to help poor ones. Again, if affordable health care is a basic human right, is it any less a basic human right for Haitians than for Americans, and if we’re going to do our Christian duty don’t we have the obligation to include the Haitians in the coverage the bill provides to Americans? Actually, since the bishops want all immigrants - legal or not - to have access to our health care system, and if that is also the teaching of the Church, then on what basis can we say that the Mexican who sneaks into our country is more deserving of medical care than the one who didn’t? What about the basic human rights of those who didn’t sneak in? How can we grant basic human rights only to those physically on US soil and deny it to everyone else?

Either the bishops are telling us that we are morally obligated to support this bill or they are not. There is no basis for them to say this … so they imply it. I reject the bill and I reject the idea that the bishops opinions on prudential matters … matters.

Ender
 
Instead of United Way, Catholic Charities does excellant work. It doesn’t go to Catholic Hospitals, to which direct contribution can be made, but is suppoet many organizations which help those in need.

Peace,
FAB
The Catholic hospital in my area is not set up as a charitable organization; 501(c)3. The contributions sent to them would not be tax deductable and it is doubtful that they could keep the money.

Also, in a former employer the United Way was the only direct payroll deduction they supported. At first I felt they were limiting me but once I looked at the list of really deserving Catholic and other groups I felt much better. The fact they would partially match my contributions up to a certain level (I forget what %), made me feel really good.
 
… If this was a matter of faith or morals or Church teaching I would read it in a heartbeat because I firmly believe in following the Magisterium and ALL Church teachings on faith and morals, but I think this goes beyond that into politics. I would appreciate your opinions.

usccb.org/healthcare/Abortion_ads/Pulpit_Announcement_and_Prayer.pdf
The original poster on this thread shared the same considerable concern in regard to the Church’s becoming specifically political beyond the holy teachings of the Magisterium re the Holy True Central Mission of the Catholic Church and regarding the conversion of the faith and morals of the children of God within the Church . . . as did . . . Pope John Paul the Great . . . who publically spoke with grave concern about the Church tending in some areas of the world to abandon its true mission and veer . . . ***way off course ***. . . i.e. in-for-and-with Christ . . . re the coversion of individual human souls AND society from the center of the soul of its beings to the circumference. . . into secular political and governmental realms outside of the Church . . . and the deliberate bypassing of the incredible Gift of God of the freewill of man to individually and collectively as a society choose between good and evil . . . right and wrong . . . Christ or Barrabas . . . and attempting to pressure . . . often with force and murderous brutal violence . . . to conquer individuals and societies and revamp them . . . which political activity has essentially come to be known in Catholic circles of this day and age as “liberation theology” . . .
****. . . :coffeeread: . . . ****
Liberation Theology . . .
Infuenced by Marxist social theory, its theologians consider “structural sin” not the Judeo/Christian truth of the inherited sinful fallen nature of each individual man] to be a root cause of poverty and oppression, and consider the primary responsibility of the Church to be its “option for the poor”. Although liberation theology has grown into an international and inter-denominational movement, it began as a movement within the Roman Catholic Church in Latin America in the 1950s - 1970s. It arose principally as a moral reaction to widespread poverty caused by social injustice in that region. It had a widespread influence in Latin America, although its influence diminished after liberation theologians using Marxist concepts were admonished by the Roman Catholic Church’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in 1984 and 1986.
- Wickipedia
At the 1979 Puebla Conference the renown holy Pope John Paul the Great gave the opening speech wherein he sharply criticized radical “liberation theology” as a heretical false teaching sharing . . .

"this conception of Christ,
as a political figure, a revolutionary,
as the subversive of Nazareth,
does NOT tally with the Church’s catechisms."

Sacred :bible1: Scripture speaks of many Jews in our Lord’s time . . . who expected Christ Jesus as their Messiah would come and take over the government immediately as King . . . and who never understood or accepted the concept of the salvivic true nature of the **“kingdom of God” ****within **concept . . . which is God’s true and only pathway of salvation for mankind . . .

:bible1:
But seek ye first the kingdom of God,
and his righteousness;
and all these things shall be added unto you."
Matthew 6:33

*In dedication to the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart . . . *
. . . all for Jesus+
. . . thank you Holy Mother Mary+
. . . thank you Holy Mother Church+
 
Instead of United Way, Catholic Charities does excellant work. It doesn’t go to Catholic Hospitals, to which direct contribution can be made, but is suppoet many organizations which help those in need.

Peace,
FAB
Unfortunately, in many places not all ministries are under the umbrella of Catholic Charities for legal reasons. Those that are not under their umbrella have to fend for themselves. People don’t always know that some of these ministries even exist. But when you go to a list and you spot them, you can designate your donation to them. I know that the United Way and the United Jewish Appeal work this way. I’m not sure about Salvation Amy and Good Will, they may too. I have never dealt with them or been in any ministry that gets donations through them.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
I would further ask why, if this is a fundamental human right, bishops are not declaring that it is necessary for every country in the world to implement it. Haiti is 80% Catholic, surely they ought to be held to the same standard as our country which is only 25% Catholic. Why is the Church not pushing Haiti to implement this bill?

Ender
They are. But that’s a different conference of bishops. We don’t hear what they are saying. The same is being promoted by CELAM in Latin America, which is their conference.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
You do realize that any money that the bishops have come from us, through our contributions.
Yes, I do. That’s why I am voicing my opinion about how they spend those dollars and what they seem to be demanding we spend our tax dollars on.
Were are you getting that money is being given to pro-abortion causes, the letter was against the bill because it allowed federal funding for abortion.
In the last couple years, the monies collected from the annual drive for the UCCB charities has been examined by watchdog agencies. Two years ago, they pointed out that certain groups who received funding also funded things such as abortion and political efforts to enhance a pro-choice position. Some of these groups fund both sides of the abortion issue, so you could argue that all Catholic dollars went to pro-life efforts while some other dollars funded abortion, but the point was the Church shouldn’t be funding those associations at all since we have no true accounting from them and we cannot be sure our money went where it was supposed to go.

After this exposure, the UCCB looked into it, declared there was some oversight in the process and assured us it was fixed. It was NOT fixed, as the following year (last year) the same thing happened. Now we have another assurance it’s all fixed, yet no one in the management of those efforts was rebuked or replaced. Adding to this doubt is the fact that each and every one of the key players the UCCB has managing these fund allocations has direct links to ACORN and other organizations of left-leaning politics that have no compunction to support any pro-life views at all. The UCCB has not given any real information to go on to assure anyone the problem has really been addressed. The first time we heard it was “fixed” it was not… so it’s not unreasonable to have some doubts about this.
It is our call and command from Christ to take care of those in need including health.
True, and it’s also our call to feed the hungry, but that doesn’t mean ANY means of doing so is justified. Forcing food down their throats, for example, would not meet this goal in my view, yet it can be argued that IS feeding the hungry.

Likewise with this health care bill. Making a bill that provides distributed (not universal) health care that is so expensive it causes massive unemployment and a huge monetary burden on people is not good sense and not smart Catholicism in my opinion because it has the potential to do more harm in another area the Church sees as a basic right, that is, the right of people to earn a living and support their families. You can’t do that unemployed.

Right now our nation has, at largest estimate, some 39 million uninsured. That out of about 300 million. So one in ten, roughly, do not have health insurance of some form. The estimated cost for the government to just simply BUY all those people an insurance policy is about 370 billion dollars. So… please explain why it’s a good idea to spend 1.6 trillion (and that’s just for the first 10 years), totally revamp the entire health care industry making it all but impossible to make a profit, causing massive business restructuring (layoffs, downsizing) if not putting them out of business altogether.

Why not just spend the same amount we would allocate for one year’s operations in Afghanistan and simply buy all the uninsured insurance? Then we meet the Church’s ideal of health care for all, as we all would have insurance and it only costs us the same as one year of war, without any of the unemployment fallout.

This bill is not about just giving health care to all, its about imposing a socialistic ideal on people who don’t want a socialistic form of government. It’s about stripping profit from companies and doctors and anyone else who makes a good living out of some Lenninistic notion that those who work hard and take risks should benefit no more from their efforts than the fellow who sits on his duff demanding he be given a slice of pie.

There is a reason people with the wealth to do so come to the US for their medical care. You don’t see Saudi Princes running to Canada and England for their bypass surgeries, do you? Why do you suppose that is? It’s because the quality of the care flourishes in an environment where people can invent a new widget or procedure, investing lots of their cash and time to perfect it, then make a profit. You remove that incentive and there is no reason for anyone to take that kind of risk. If the government mandated that Apple sell the I-Phone for no more than $50, they would never have made one, and the same will be true of medical innovations if we turn our system into a bloated, inefficient, uncompassionate, rationed, bureaucracy.
Perhaps if Catholics properly gave of their treasure…
Peace,
FAB
Our local Catholic hospital, who is constantly claiming there are no funds available to provide indigent care, has just purchased millions of dollars of real estate and is building two new multi-hundreds-of-millions hospitals (sections of the same main hospital). They also build an enormous medical office facility for doctor’s offices and such. Sorry, but I find it very hard to believe they can’t stitch up a few cuts and provide some xrays and medications, inoculations and such without charities handing them money. I know some of the people who run this place and I know the kind of bonuses they get paid to keep cost low, and some are 4 or 5 times what I make in a year.

Where is the UCCB calling for fairness in that kind of operation from a place that has “Catholic” carved in the sign outside? The silence seems deafening when it comes to something that close to home, home being those who authorize that word Catholic being on the sign.
 
Regarding the discussion of United Way and selecting where your donations go, Br. JREducation has it exactly right. You can specify who gets your dollars and how much.

But if you really want to have choice, go down to the local United Way office and volunteer to sit on one of their allocation committees. They are constantly in need of people to serve in this role. Part of keeping their operation honest and above reproach is to place the money decisions into the hands of committees made up of ordinary citizens in the community who benefits from those funds. You go down and sign up, they tell you a time to show up and you sit and listen to proposals from various groups vying for the money. They present what they want to do with it, what they have done with it, and one requirement to get further funding is they have to show tangible results, meaning numbers of people helped and an explanation of how they helped.

When they are done, YOU help decide who get the bucks, how much, and who doesn’t. It is a very good investment of your time if you have concerns about where all those dollars that are not specifically allocated go.
 
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