Vasectomy prayer answered - yikes!

[JLCecilia]

RRRG! I let DH know that my request for privacy stands firm: when he has the procedure done, we’ll send the kids to his folks for the first night, but I don’t want him telling his parents when he’s having the procedure b/c I really just don’t want to talk to them about it. That’s why I hate to take the money b/c then there’s an entitlement to information. DH said when he was talking to his mom, she shared w/ him that one of his cousins had had the procedure done. I love his mom, but if someone gossips TO you, they’ll gossip ABOUT you. You won’t convince me that she hasn’t already told her sisters what DH is considering. Then I’m curious WHO brought the subject up: was DH telling his mom that he found someone to do the procedure, or did his mom just bring it up out of the blue?

I really have no room to talk here, I’ve confided in 2 of my GFs about DH, not sure how he’d feel about THEM knowing, but he’s told at least one of his brothers, if not both, without asking me first. I feel like we’re filing for bankruptcy or something equally embarrassing, like we just couldn’t hack it and we’re finally copping to it. Public announcement, we screwed up, but don’t worry, we’re gonna fix it!

 

[JLCecilia]

I told DH I didn’t want to accept the money and he blew up b/c I had accepted a good amount of money from my folks against his wishes/behind his back for braces. Game over, I’m out. He yelled/cussed me out and our DS (7yo) heard us. The only card I have left is that this dr requires me to be there. I would really prefer to just abstain till we get our tax return and pay for it ourselves, but if DH’s in a hurry, we could just get a credit card and put it on there, but he doesn’t want to pay interest. Now I’m the complicated one who can’t make up her mind. I told him that if he’s been talking to his family about all of this already, it’s sure to get out that his parents paid for it and it will never matter how much we paid them back.

I know 8 months of abstinence seems like a long time from this side of things, but w/ a new baby and a new school year (not to mention breastfeeding), it will fly by. At least for me. I kept using the word ‘wait’ instead of abstain and DH wasn’t catching my meaning and accused me of wanting to end our marriage if I risk getting pregnant again. Believe me, I don’t want anymore children in this ****** marriage either, but it isn’t going to kill us to abstain, esp. w/ our feelings toward one another not likely to change anytime soon.

DH has NEVER helped get the kids ready in the mornings and it’s a real source of stress for me. He also does not help me get them to bed early enough in the evenings to help the getting up process go smoother. Add to the mix a breastfeeding baby that needs to be held constantly and the fact that my now 2 school-aged children are never to school on time PLUS packing 2 lunches and I can say with all confidence that abstinence will not be a problem from my end. And w/ the psycho rip he’ll likely see me as if he so much as looks at me should cool HIS hormones too.

I have never felt more alone in my life. I don’t have ANYONE to confide in the way DH has been confiding in his mom and brother. I should be the one he talks to, but I’m just a demanding rip, so I can understand his need to confide in his family. It just feels like they’re all in our bedroom (at which DH rolls his eyes). I tried talking to my GF, but really no matter how great a listener she is or how consoling, DH and I still have ea. other to deal w/ at the end of the day. How I am going to host his family for dinner on Sunday for DS’s birthday? I can honestly see our family dinner outing for DS’s bday on Monday end up just being me and the kids. Then there’s the delivery of #4. How’s that gonna go? How are we going to accept visitors w/ the way things are btwn us? You can bet anything I needed from DH to get done around the house is off the table now, I dare not ask him for a single thing.

This is gonna be tough.

 

[gh4]

I mean, how can a person get a part of their bodies removed think that this is normal?

Ever had a hot appendix? They REMOVE it from your body. A bad Gall Bladder, they REMOVE it from your body. Bad uterus, etc. and so forth. In today’s society removing organs from the body is a pretty common thing. Tons of “ectomies” going on all the time.

One of the surgeries I watched, WAY back when I was a student nurse, was a vasectomy. They remove a teensy tiny piece of the vas deferens and they cauterize the ends. Vasectomies do not entail the removal of the testes like the vet does when they neuter a dog or cat or horse etc. Now a days men just get a local for the surgical pain and it takes only minutes for the procedure. Tylenol for pain afterwards.

When my late husband had his vasectomy years ago, it was done at the urologists office. Done on a Friday, and back to work on Monday. No reason to avoid his children over the weekend, easy recovery, had a cold beer or soda and used it as an ice bag between sips. My husband was not Catholic nor was I at the time.

 

[Cojuanco]

I have struggled with figuring this out and I’ve decide that it is not my sin. I don’t even fully hold DH responsible since faith is a gift he has yet to embrace. I really think it is just fear and ignorance (not in a negative way) that has led him to this decision. Hell, I’M scared! I sometimes blame myself for how things have played out b/c after the 3rd baby in 3.5 we FINALLY had a real talk about NFP and it wasn’t until then that I fully acknowledged that the entire weight of NFP was on my shoulders alone. I know God will hold DH responsible on some level, but, I knew I this was my job for the good of our family. In the 3 years we were able to space out this last pregnancy, I had really made my peace with this. I guess I got overconfident

Ut, thank you from the bottom of my heart for your candid testimony. I could just picture DH sitting across from me saying your very words. It really helped to get a guy’s perspective. Prayers to you and your family! Funny how alike our spacing is!

Thank you for the thoughtful responses. DH mentioned to me this weekend that he will have to re-apply for tuition help for the next semester and has considered using that money for his vasectomy. Don’t ask me how, it’s all legit b/c it’s money we’ll be paying back after he finishes school. I have no doubt, the way things are going, there will be something else more urgent requiring the use of that money.

Please keep up the prayers for BOTH of us.

You’re actually more correct than you think. It’s not a sin on your part, nor would it be if you decided to have relations. Taking him there however, I’m not so sure about. I’d ask a priest on that issue.

 

[HouseArrest]

I told DH I didn’t want to accept the money and he blew up b/c I had accepted a good amount of money from my folks against his wishes/behind his back for braces. Game over, I’m out. He yelled/cussed me out and our DS (7yo) heard us. The only card I have left is that this dr requires me to be there. I would really prefer to just abstain till we get our tax return and pay for it ourselves, but if DH’s in a hurry, we could just get a credit card and put it on there, but he doesn’t want to pay interest. Now I’m the complicated one who can’t make up her mind. I told him that if he’s been talking to his family about all of this already, it’s sure to get out that his parents paid for it and it will never matter how much we paid them back.

I know 8 months of abstinence seems like a long time from this side of things, but w/ a new baby and a new school year (not to mention breastfeeding), it will fly by. At least for me. I kept using the word ‘wait’ instead of abstain and DH wasn’t catching my meaning and accused me of wanting to end our marriage if I risk getting pregnant again. Believe me, I don’t want anymore children in this ****** marriage either, but it isn’t going to kill us to abstain, esp. w/ our feelings toward one another not likely to change anytime soon.

DH has NEVER helped get the kids ready in the mornings and it’s a real source of stress for me. He also does not help me get them to bed early enough in the evenings to help the getting up process go smoother. Add to the mix a breastfeeding baby that needs to be held constantly and the fact that my now 2 school-aged children are never to school on time PLUS packing 2 lunches and I can say with all confidence that abstinence will not be a problem from my end. And w/ the psycho rip he’ll likely see me as if he so much as looks at me should cool HIS hormones too.

I have never felt more alone in my life. I don’t have ANYONE to confide in the way DH has been confiding in his mom and brother. I should be the one he talks to, but I’m just a demanding rip, so I can understand his need to confide in his family. It just feels like they’re all in our bedroom (at which DH rolls his eyes). I tried talking to my GF, but really no matter how great a listener she is or how consoling, DH and I still have ea. other to deal w/ at the end of the day. How I am going to host his family for dinner on Sunday for DS’s birthday? I can honestly see our family dinner outing for DS’s bday on Monday end up just being me and the kids. Then there’s the delivery of #4. How’s that gonna go? How are we going to accept visitors w/ the way things are btwn us? You can bet anything I needed from DH to get done around the house is off the table now, I dare not ask him for a single thing.

This is gonna be tough.

Can the two of you postpone the conversation until 6 weeks after the baby is born? I cannot imagine going through all that stress when getting ready to deliver. Of course post partum may not be much better but still…

There will definitely be doctor ordered abstinence until then, so what is the hurry?

 

[HouseArrest]

DH has decided once and for all to have a vasectomy after achieving our 4th unplanned pregnancy in our first 7.5 yrs. Naturally, I’ve been praying for him to have a change of heart, but as circumstances go, that isn’t necesary. We just plain can’t afford it right now. So, prayer answered, for now.

To be honest, as opposed to it as I am, I was actually looking forward to a less stressful postpartum phase and planned on giving up my charting (maybe, we’ll see). In a perfect world, I would be open to as many babies as God wants, but my heart is closed to it since there is no sign that I may ever get to stay home w/ my babies. I resent having to send a fourth child off to daycare. I thought for sure being open to babies, God would work things out. I know our family is still young and God may still open that door in the next couple of years, but I want it NOW!

Prior to this pregnancy I had made peace with not having any more babies. DH didn’t want anymore and the only way I was going to have more is if I could stay at home. We have also been wanting to fix up our home and it seems like that will never happen now. I have had a really hard time accepting this pregnancy. I look at my body and think “What the heck are you doing?!”

Really freaked out about this postpartum episode, but I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it. It’s either total abstinence (at least on my part), or appeasing DH in ways that’ll have me in the confessional every week. Been there many times before and I’m not a fan!

So from a few posts down, you say your husband is in school? So eventually your income situation is going to change? Maybe his stress level will go down as well. Maybe this can be postponed for those reasons?

 

[Michael_Allen]

vasectomy prayer answered - yikes!

Personally I think vasectomy can be a sensible way forward at a certain time in a marriage. Within a faithful marriage that has produced children, many may decide in good conscience that vasectomy is a sensible way to manage the family within the circumstances each couple live. It’s obviously not something to be rushed into though.

Accepting that others will have a different opinion.

God bless you both +

 

[JLCecilia]

So from a few posts down, you say your husband is in school? So eventually your income situation is going to change? Maybe his stress level will go down as well. Maybe this can be postponed for those reasons?

He has at least another year of school left, no chance getting him to put the procedure off that long. He’s wanting to schedule the procedure during my maternity leave so I won’t have to take time off work and perhaps our periods of required abstinence will sync up, thereby cutting the required ‘wait.’

Funny thing, though, he told me last night that it could take up to a year for the procedure to ‘take.’ So really, he’s still going to be riding my coattails and depending on my NFPing for that time. Let’s not even think about the alternatives during that time (withdrawl) - they’re neither morally permissable, nor physically desireable for me and may lead to prolonged abstinence if bad manners in the bedroom become a habit.

 

[mwncheesehead]

Personally I think vasectomy can be a sensible way forward at a certain time in a marriage. Within a faithful marriage that has produced children, many may decide in good conscience that vasectomy is a sensible way to manage the family within the circumstances each couple live. It’s obviously not something to be rushed into though.

MA, this isn’t a Catholic position: vasectomy (contraception and thus a mortal sin if done with full consent of the will) is not “sensible” and you shouldn’t be encouraging something gravely opposed to Catholic teaching as “sensible.” Good grief .

 

[MamaJewel]

This is insane! Reading your posts remind me of my horrible marriage. You can’t ask him to do things now…you’re the psycho…yada, yada. Lord, please don’t let me get banned for saying this. JL, you are being abused emotionally and trying to carry on a sacramental marriage in such a situation. Please, talk to your confessor about how you are being treated. Passive aggression by a husband can make you crazy!

If you don’t want to be part of his vasectomy, tell him to go to the local health dept or planned parenthood and get one there. Do you have family or friends to stay with? I went through a similar relationship accepting blame for everything and trying to make things better for over 20 years. It’s not healthy.

You’ve got to take care of yourself first, so you will be able to be there for your little ones. Put on your oxygen mask first. Your husband is as responsible for the children as you are and he doesn’t want to act as such. He’s got you running around like a mad-woman. Step back and focus on you and the kids. Let him fend for himself. I love you, sister in Christ and I speak humbly from my broken heart.

 

[HouseArrest]

He has at least another year of school left, no chance getting him to put the procedure off that long. He’s wanting to schedule the procedure during my maternity leave so I won’t have to take time off work and perhaps our periods of required abstinence will sync up, thereby cutting the required ‘wait.’

Funny thing, though, he told me last night that it could take up to a year for the procedure to ‘take.’ So really, he’s still going to be riding my coattails and depending on my NFPing for that time. Let’s not even think about the alternatives during that time (withdrawl) - they’re neither morally permissable, nor physically desireable for me and may lead to prolonged abstinence if bad manners in the bedroom become a habit.

I guess I just don’t understand… withdrawal is not morally permissible? neither is a vasectomy?

Really - one year? It is such a short time…

 

[gh4]

Funny thing, though, he told me last night that it could take up to a year for the procedure to ‘take.’

That’s not quite true. My husband had to go back twice and provide a sperm sample and both were negative for sperm. I am guessing about 6 or 8 weeks for us. But 2-3 months at the outside would be my best guess. He will be scheduled for having his semen tested, and he’ll have to have 2 negatives before he’s considered sterile.

 

[JLCecilia]

That’s not quite true. My husband had to go back twice and provide a sperm sample and both were negative for sperm. I am guessing about 6 or 8 weeks for us. But 2-3 months at the outside would be my best guess. He will be scheduled for having his semen tested, and he’ll have to have 2 negatives before he’s considered sterile.

This is possibly the worst thing I’ve ever heard, and one of those things that, unless you really research, might never occur to someone before a consultation - hence why the consult AND surgery SHOULD NOT occur on the SAME DAY!!! The means of obtaining a specimen here are morally reprehensible. I have no doubt that DH isn’t practicing abstinence along w/ me (though I have no proof except our past), but to give consent to the absolute act itself is just beyond me.

I’ve heard of naprotechnology practices obtaining a man’s specimen from the woman after a natural act of intercourse (as a moral means of obtaining the specimen), but I doubt if that’s an option here. I’ll have to ask, but it means taking a risk if he isn’t ‘negative.’

 

[gh4]

This is possibly the worst thing I’ve ever heard, and one of those things that, unless you really research, might never occur to someone before a consultation - hence why the consult AND surgery SHOULD NOT occur on the SAME DAY!!! The means of obtaining a specimen here are morally reprehensible. I have no doubt that DH isn’t practicing abstinence along w/ me (though I have no proof except our past), but to give consent to the absolute act itself is just beyond me.

I’ve heard of naprotechnology practices obtaining a man’s specimen from the woman after a natural act of intercourse (as a moral means of obtaining the specimen), but I doubt if that’s an option here. I’ll have to ask, but it means taking a risk if he isn’t ‘negative.’

I’m sorry it bothers you, but it is the way it is. A man who is not Catholic would have little problem getting a sample. You can use a condom without spermicide in it to obtain the sample as well. Actually I took the samples in to the Doc since my DH had to work. And yes, he obtained them “that way.” It’s part of the surgery procedure. A man must be checked to make sure that he’s sterile, and the only way to do that is to obtain a sample. I’m pretty sure there would be a rather large cost to obtaining the sample from the man’s wife, that option was never offered to us.

 

[JLCecilia]

I’m sorry it bothers you, but it is the way it is. A man who is not Catholic would have little problem getting a sample. You can use a condom without spermicide in it to obtain the sample as well. Actually I took the samples in to the Doc since my DH had to work. And yes, he obtained them “that way.” It’s part of the surgery procedure. A man must be checked to make sure that he’s sterile, and the only way to do that is to obtain a sample. I’m pretty sure there would be a rather large cost to obtaining the sample from the man’s wife, that option was never offered to us.

As a middle ground, although I’m certain I would need confession, I MIGHT consider the condom route (as disgusting as that is). Would confession even be valid if I’m fully consenting? I’m not sure what’s worse, turning a blind eye while DH does it himself, or participating in it (he would probably rather go the ‘traditional’ former route per the surgeon’s office than make a scene going about the latter). At least if we were together there would be a LITTLE dignity and SOME sense of how climax is supposed to be reached (together and not in isolation).

I may need to track down another priest (besides my own) for counseling on this matter. I don’t trust my priest to maintain my privacy.

 

[JLCecilia]

This is insane! Reading your posts remind me of my horrible marriage. You can’t ask him to do things now…you’re the psycho…yada, yada. Lord, please don’t let me get banned for saying this. JL, you are being abused emotionally and trying to carry on a sacramental marriage in such a situation. Please, talk to your confessor about how you are being treated. Passive aggression by a husband can make you crazy!

If you don’t want to be part of his vasectomy, tell him to go to the local health dept or planned parenthood and get one there. Do you have family or friends to stay with? I went through a similar relationship accepting blame for everything and trying to make things better for over 20 years. It’s not healthy.

You’ve got to take care of yourself first, so you will be able to be there for your little ones. Put on your oxygen mask first. Your husband is as responsible for the children as you are and he doesn’t want to act as such. He’s got you running around like a mad-woman. Step back and focus on you and the kids. Let him fend for himself. I love you, sister in Christ and I speak humbly from my broken heart.

Thank you, I’m doing my best at what Dr. Ray calls a one-sided marriage. I try not to think about how unfair DH’s behavior is b/c it only frustrates me and I really have no control over it anyway. But, after it’s piled up for awhile, I just have to vent. In the end, I just have to rely on the kids to be more responsible for themselves and help me out since I don’t have a real partner.

No, I don’t have family or friends where we live. DH’s family actually tends to side w/ me (even though he has me convinced that I’m the difficult/unrealistic standards nut) just for the simple fact that they’re all perfectly aware of how much I do and how little DH does. IMO, if anybody’s going anywhere, it’s DH back to his folks (if there ever comes a time for that, and I’ve seriously thought about it before). I don’t see why the kids and I should have to uproot when HE’S the problem, not us.

 

[Cojuanco]

As a middle ground, although I’m certain I would need confession, I MIGHT consider the condom route (as disgusting as that is). Would confession even be valid if I’m fully consenting? I’m not sure what’s worse, turning a blind eye while DH does it himself, or participating in it (he would probably rather go the ‘traditional’ former route per the surgeon’s office than make a scene going about the latter). At least if we were together there would be a LITTLE dignity and SOME sense of how climax is supposed to be reached (together and not in isolation).

I may need to track down another priest (besides my own) for counseling on this matter. I don’t trust my priest to maintain my privacy.

Good answer.

 

[gh4]

As a middle ground, although I’m certain I would need confession, I MIGHT consider the condom route (as disgusting as that is). Would confession even be valid if I’m fully consenting? I’m not sure what’s worse, turning a blind eye while DH does it himself, or participating in it (he would probably rather go the ‘traditional’ former route per the surgeon’s office than make a scene going about the latter). At least if we were together there would be a LITTLE dignity and SOME sense of how climax is supposed to be reached (together and not in isolation).

I may need to track down another priest (besides my own) for counseling on this matter. I don’t trust my priest to maintain my privacy.

Um, you obtain the sample at home, put it in the fridge until you are ready to leave the house and then just drop it off at the docs office. We were never given any other option.

 

[JLCecilia]

I was a little nervy about FIL on Sunday b/c he insisted on staying behind a little longer after the rest of our company was leaving and I thought ‘great, here it comes: he’s going to make a production of giving us the money along w/ a puff-chested speech.’ So I busied myself shooing the kids off for a nap to avoid it. As it turns out, he waited till DH went out to their house later to help out w/ some things.

The only thing I can think of to pray for now in my Novena to St. Joseph is that DH will continue to drag his feet making the appt. or that they won’t be able to get him in for several months and that the Good Lord will put every obstacle in between us and that appt. I don’t know how pure my intentions are here (maybe tinged just a little w/ frustration), but I think a little abstinence might be good for our marriage. Then again, DH probably isn’t doing that as it is anyway and would just continue along whatever path he’s on now, but at least I wouldn’t have to feel used by someone who wants nothing else to do w/ me.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

Would confession even be valid if I’m fully consenting?

But are you fully consenting? It doesn’t seem to me to be the case. This is your husband’s decision and you are forced to go along with it. I would still confess the whole thing and explain the circumstances. Better to be on the safe side, that’s always my policy. But I don’t think you are sinning here.

Talking to another priest sounds like a good idea.