Vatican backs teaching Islam in public schools?

[pro_universal]

Mike_D30:

Yeah O.K., you would use your strawmen and red herring’s to discredit Catholics in an attempt to make us no better than MODERN day extremeists killing thousands in America.

No I am not. I am pointing out the what-I-thought-was-not-controversial fact that deviations from religious teaching do not mean that the whole religion embraces the deviation.

Mike_D30:

The only reason you bring it up, is to try to trick people into proving a point. But you have no point. You try to say Christians are doing the exact same thing. They aren’t killing en masse. We are at war with Iraq, and we are a SECULAR country not a Christian country. We have Hindu’s, Christians, atheists, Muslims, and Buddhists. And they are all represented in our Armed Forces.

Right, except that some people here on this forum do not support having any muslims in our country, and would like to turn this into a war against all muslims. That’s what I’m arguing against. I am not and never have claimed that all Americans hate muslims, nor have I claimed that our military does. Using the same reasoning that the “islam is evil because of 9-11” people use, however, would lead muslims to conclude “the US wants to destroy islam because US armies only attack muslim nations.” Let’s not use it ourselves as a start for getting other people not to think this way.

Mike_D30:

You need to re-read your history books son.

I read them just recently, and it’s all here:

yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/mideast/mideast.htm

There you can search all the primary sources for yourself. What I said above is precisely the case; Israel was formed when Jewish militia rebelled against the British mandate, fought them off, and then expelled a bunch of Palestinians from the areas they controlled. Both of those things happened before the Arab league responded in 1948.

 

[murtad]

Shadowcry:

Italy is a secular country and Saudi Arabia is not.

Tell us what you mean by the word “secular” as this word could mean many things. The acceptable definition of secular is physical. A secular government can be religious or irreligious. The USA is an example of a very religious but secular government as you can see from its support of Israel, yet it has great toleration for local Muslims in America. You will never see any Muslim being forced to become Christian as this is against both the Bible and the CCC, the two primary sources of law of the Church.

In Malaysia, we can see how a Hindu man (ie. M. Moorthy) was forced converted to Islam against his free-will, without his non-Muslim family even knowing until his death when the Islamist government seized his body from the Hindu family so it could bury him in a Muslim cemetry. Yes, this is true Islam and practised in Malaysia, the most developed of all Islamic countries today.

 

[Shadowcry]

Well I have already proven my point

 

[cestusdei]

Already the Vatican is arguing that if Muslims want freedom here then Christians should have it in their countries. Reciprocity. I say let’s treat Muslims in the West the way we are treated in Saudi Arabia. How can they complain?

 

[MikeinSD]

cestusdei:

Already the Vatican is arguing that if Muslims want freedom here then Christians should have it in their countries. Reciprocity. I say let’s treat Muslims in the West the way we are treated in Saudi Arabia. How can they complain?

That actually would be a lot of fun. Here in San Diego, there is a large Iraqi community. Lots of $ and property. A quick word to the Christian police and a $500,000 home could be your’s!!! If Spain can do grab Arabic $ in the 15 century, we sure can do it here. The Lord helps those who help themselves…to…$$$$!!

Actually the Iraqi immigrants are mostly Christian. And here in the US, we have the 1st Amendment. So no $ for denouncing US citizens for their faith. Pity.

 

[BryPGuy89]

Mike_D30:

I think it’s appeasement, and it’s very dangerous. Look up your facts preaching the Gospel in Saudi Arabia, or converting a Muslim to Christianity will get you killed. I admire your request for dialougue, which is great. But you are going beyond dialougue and talking about appeasemnt, of which there is no reciprocity from the other side. What is the point of dialogue and ‘udnerstanding’ the other side, if the other side wants essentially nothingto do with understanding you? You may not think that’s the way it is, but that’s the way it is.

I am not ignorant of Islam, I have read the Koran almost cover to cover in the five years I was away from the Church. I’ve also read the Book of Mormon, I was curious, I’ve also read a lot of apologetics from both sides. And there are many great things about Islam and Muslims, this is not what this post is about. It’s about appeasement which makes no sense at all, if you look at the state of Christianity and Catholicism in the past 50 years. Christianity should standing its ground more, and not appeasing a group for political correctness.

I will agree to disagree, I think the path Christianity is on is very dangerous. Apeasement and Islam does not lead to good things.

Pope Benedict XVI calls for the same thing I think the CHurch is doing. As Christians we have to set the example regardless of the earthly outcome, even if we die in the process of creating peace, so be it, we were killde in donig Gods work.

 

[pro_universal]

Reciprocity. I say let’s treat Muslims in the West the way we are treated in Saudi Arabia. How can they complain?

I do believe the golden rule is “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you”, not:

“Do unto others every bad thing you believe they do to you.”

If you believe that Saudi Arabia’s treatment of religious minorities is wrong, why on earth would you want to make western countries more like Saudi Arabia?