Vatican Calls for Global Authority on Economy

[Bubba_Switzler]

So is Christ a political figure now, here to dictate the petty affairs of men, or did he come to set up the kingdom of God; because that’s what I’m getting from all this…

Although I am strongly opposed to the recommendations of this document, and have argued vociferously here against it on many levels, I am not opposed to the Church officially or unofficially taking a position on worldly matters, particularly when there is a moral dimension, as there almost always is. International finance is not petty and it’s certainly relevant to any worldly kingdom of God (an interesting topic itself).

What I am appalled by is the tendency to brush prudential concerns aside in favor of, what, imprudent morality? What do you call that?

If the Church is going to involve itself in international finance it needs to either bring Catholic economists into the deliberations or send cardinals to economics programs. (The Jesuits love collecting degrees, maybe we can get a Jesuit economist to head up a vatican conference on international investment and trade.)

A good place to start would be with the economic concept of moral hazard.

 

[SpeakInSilence]

Although I am strongly opposed to the recommendations of this document, and have argued vociferously here against it on many levels, I am not opposed to the Church officially or unofficially taking a position on worldly matters, particularly when there is a moral dimension, as there almost always is. International finance is not petty and it’s certainly relevant to any worldly kingdom of God (an interesting topic itself).

What I am appalled by is the tendency to brush prudential concerns aside in favor of, what, imprudent morality? What do you call that?

If the Church is going to involve itself in international finance it needs to either bring Catholic economists into the deliberations or send cardinals to economics programs. (The Jesuits love collecting degrees, maybe we can get a Jesuit economist to head up a vatican conference on international investment and trade.)

A good place to start would be with the economic concept of moral hazard.

I agree, I think the Church can have a position when it comes to these issues, but one must first seek the Kingdom of God first and all else will be supplied. This almost seems like the Church wants to deal with secular materialism.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

I agree, I think the Church can have a position when it comes to these issues, but one must first seek the Kingdom of God first and all else will be supplied. This almost seems like the Church wants to deal with secular materialism.

Agreed, I do not like that.

 

[Bubba_Switzler]

I agree, I think the Church can have a position when it comes to these issues, but one must first seek the Kingdom of God first and all else will be supplied. This almost seems like the Church wants to deal with secular materialism.

I think the idea is to raise international finance above secular materialism and toward the kingdom of God. That’s a worthy aim but, as I said earlier, good intentions are not enough to accomplish that and a religious education, alone, is woefully insufficient to the task.

Can international finance be sanctified? How would that be accomplished?

The idea is certainly worthy of discussion but this document is not very helpful and certainly should not be treated as “the vatican” position on the matter.

 

[SpeakInSilence]

I honestly wish the Pope would say something on this matter, I don’t like how there is this phantom document floating around, and secular minds seems to be making a hay-day out of it.

 

[Swiss_Guy]

Everyone read Varitas et Caritas (or just get the idea of it from Wikipedia like me ).

The pope is calling for the same thing. It’s basically just calling for a better UN that gives poorer/3rd world countries more say. And a UN that can fund countries so they can get out of poverty/out of recession/financial issues.

I think what the Vatican is calling for is a good thing.

 

[_Abyssinia]

I honestly wish the Pope would say something on this matter, I don’t like how there is this phantom document floating around, and secular minds seems to be making a hay-day out of it.

The problem is the mainstream media and Protestant fundamentalists are saying the ‘‘Vatican’’ is pushing a one world government, central bank etc. contributing to conspiracy theories and anti Catholicism. I listened to the Alex Jones radio show, not Alex jones but another host was saying the Vatican pushing one world government/one world bank.

 

[_Abyssinia]

This is interesting. I thought Cardinal Peter Turkson and Archbishop Toso authored the document, but it turns out there was a third person who has contributed to the documents drafting, Prof. Leonardo Becchett. Fr Z on his blog gives information on this Prof.

Fr Z says his well informed Italian friend Fabrizio has info on the Prof and Fr Z says his friend is generally spot in in his experience:

I’ll quote what I said on COL. Trust me this is another “Fisichella” scandal.

Even though it’s not about abortion:  it’s not as if liberty and private property are not rather important inalienable rights of man.

“A socialist economist, a left-wing “Catholic” who’s extremely active with the Democrat Party (formerly known as Partito Comunista Italiano, here’s is profile on the website of the party and other socialist organizations. He even has a [blog](http://felicita-sostenibile.blogautore.repubblica.it/) on the website of the ultra-secularist paper “La Repubblica” which leads the charge against the Catholic Church every time the occasion presents itself. I guarantee you that loyal Catholics – and competent economists – don’t get to spread the truth through blogs on La Repubblica’s website.

Among other things this guy formed a lobby to request the EU to levy crazy taxes on financial transactions which will destroy whatever is left of available capitals, especially for small businesses and small investors, with a trickle-down effect that will further damage an economy brought to collapse by socialist greed for power, money and control.

So basically a Vatican dicastery helped a socialist ideologue to advance his agenda with the imprimatur of the Holy See (obviously he is the ghost writer of the part on financial transactions).

The writings of this guy are quoted by all Marxist organs and groups. [Here](http://sdtv.myblog.it/archive/2009/01/10/gli-studi-sulla-felicita-svelano-i-meccanismi-che-portano-ag.html) is an example taken by a blog of a local group of the Italian “Democratic Left for European Socialism”. I guarantee you these people HATE the Church and of course liberty and property. They are part of a left-wing coalition led by “Niki” Vendola, a militant homosexualist of the former Communist Party.”

Read more: wdtprs.com/blog/2011/10/more-about-the-white-paper-from-the-pontifical-council-for-justice-and-peace/

It does say on the introduction the document that it is also presented by Leonardo Becchetti, professor of political economy at the Roman University of “Tor Vergata” :

news.va/en/news/holy-see-calls-for-reform-of-global-finance

I have no idea who chose this Prof to contribute to the document but is is an odd decision with his history.

 

[Luigi_Daniele]

This is interesting. I thought Cardinal Peter Turkson and Archbishop Toso authored the document, but it turns out there was a third person who has contributed to the documents drafting, Prof. Leonardo Becchett. Fr Z on his blog gives information on this Prof.

Fr Z says his well informed Italian friend Fabrizio has info on the Prof and Fr Z says his friend is generally spot in in his experience:

Read more: wdtprs.com/blog/2011/10/more-about-the-white-paper-from-the-pontifical-council-for-justice-and-peace/

It does say on the introduction the document that it is also presented by Leonardo Becchetti, professor of political economy at the Roman University of “Tor Vergata” :

news.va/en/news/holy-see-calls-for-reform-of-global-finance

I have no idea who chose this Prof to contribute to the document but is is an odd decision with his history.

Thanks so much for the link! I have bookmarked it

(Father Z’s blog, that is)

 

[donsnow]

Good evening, all,

Well, I can only say that even in dire straits the Church should stand by her teachings, including subsidiarity.

Personally, I think a bigger bank is just going to add to the world’s problems. Banks aren’t perfect either and, more than likely, it will become corrupted, too.

In the meantime, it’s just the opinion of the Cardinal, Archbishop and professors who put it together. I agree, we need Catholic Economists to forward the Church’s teaching on Distributism, as differentiated from redistrubition.

Just my comments, so far.

God loves all of you, lurkers, too,
Don

 

[mlz]

This is interesting. I thought Cardinal Peter Turkson and Archbishop Toso authored the document, but it turns out there was a third person who has contributed to the documents drafting, Prof. Leonardo Becchett. Fr Z on his blog gives information on this Prof.

Fr Z says his well informed Italian friend Fabrizio has info on the Prof and Fr Z says his friend is generally spot in in his experience:

Read more: wdtprs.com/blog/2011/10/more-about-the-white-paper-from-the-pontifical-council-for-justice-and-peace/

It does say on the introduction the document that it is also presented by Leonardo Becchetti, professor of political economy at the Roman University of “Tor Vergata” :

news.va/en/news/holy-see-calls-for-reform-of-global-finance

I have no idea who chose this Prof to contribute to the document but is is an odd decision with his history.

This is interesting, but again, I’m telling everyone, pray for the Church and those trying to infiltrate it with error. I know He will protect it, but we also need to be viligant in prayer too.

mlz

 

[Pork_Roll]

The teaching of subsidiarity doesn’t rule out the authorities of international bodies. The church understands this concept well. I doubt our Holy Father would permit a Vatican office to release a statement which is either misguided or wrong.

 

[Bubba_Switzler]

I doubt our Holy Father would permit a Vatican office to release a statement which is either misguided or wrong.

This is a crucial question here. I am looking forward to a clear answer.

Certainly there have been many here and elsewhere who have suggested just the opposite.

 

[gnjsdad]

The question, though, is not whether we need a “globall moral authority…guided by Catholic moral principles”. We’ve had that for around 2000 years since the days when Rome traded with the far east. It’s called the papacy.

The question is whether we need a global political authority to manage and control the global trade, something like the Holy Roman Empire. *That *is what this document is calling for.

You’re right. I stand corrected.

 

[Chipper]

I have no idea who chose this Prof to contribute to the document but is is an odd decision with his history.

Truly amazing.

Now I can calm down finally. Just knowing that this is an attempted infestation by the commie leftwingers, and that they are being exposed, makes me that much more confident that the vatican will eventually release some important statements concerning this (as Fr z says) schizo document on global authority.

 

[rhalie]

According to Pope Benedict XVI in Caritas in Veritate (the encyclical which the Vatican’s Pontifical Council of Justice and Peace says their call for the establishment of a “global public authority” and a “central world bank” is based on) says, “The Church does not have technical solutions to offer[10] and does not claim “to interfere in any way in the politics of States.”[11] She does, however, have a mission of truth to accomplish, in every time and circumstance, for a society that is attuned to man, to his dignity, to his vocation”.

A council document has no authority first of all and since it goes totally against what the pope said in his encyclical (which they claim to be using), I doubt it will go anywhere.

There are plenty of people who work in the Vatican who have ideas on getting involved in politics. This happens all of the time. Ignore this.

RH

 

[Chipper]

The teaching of subsidiarity doesn’t rule out the authorities of international bodies. The church understands this concept well. I doubt our Holy Father would permit a Vatican office to release a statement which is either misguided or wrong.

Look at the press release, the fellas involved stated that it was not the opinion of either the Pope or the magesterium.

So obviously the Pope knew nothing about it.

 

[rhalie]

I don’t see it. Paragraph 67 seems to corroborate our worst fears.

“so that the concept of the family of nations can acquire real teeth. One also senses the urgent need to find innovative ways of implementing the principle of the responsibility to protect[146] and of giving poorer nations an effective voice in shared decision-making. This seems necessary in order to arrive at a political, juridical and economic order which can increase and give direction to international cooperation for the development of all peoples in solidarity…to bring about integral and timely disarmament, food security and peace; to guarantee the protection of the environment and to regulate migration: for all this, there is urgent need of a true world political authority…Obviously it would have to have the authority to ensure compliance with its decisions from all parties, and also with the coordinated measures adopted in various international forums.”

This is even more shocking because it is more encompassing. The Church is calling for a Global authority, with “real teeth” which is “necessary” to arrive at a “political, juridical and economic” ends. This “solidarity” seeks “food security and peace”? It also seeks to protect the “environment” and “regulate migration”?

To accopmplish the above, which relates to virtually everything I do on a daily basis, the Church wants to ensure that the Global entity above has enough “authority” to “ensure compliance”?

Wow…just wow. Did the Occupy Wallstreet Marxists draft this? unbelievable.

You have to realize that this is an encyclical (something that the people of God should think about). I disagree with it, but it is just the pope’s opinion. It is not dogma.

RH

 

[Pirate_Talker]

Thanks for proving my point. Republican/democrat first, catholic second. The pope has written about a global authority explicitly in his encyclical If you have a problem with this, maybe you should go to a tea-party church where they teach the health and wealth gospel.

The irony of this thread is exquisite.

 

[Pork_Roll]

You have to realize that this is an encyclical (something that the people of God should think about). I disagree with it, but it is just the pope’s opinion. It is not dogma.

Ridiculous. We don’t pick and choose as catholics what encyclical to accept and what not to. People on these forums are in denial that the language used in this vatican statement is verbatim from our Holy Father’s encyclical:

for all this, there is urgent need of a true world political authority, as my predecessor Blessed John XXIII indicated some years ago. S**uch an authority would need to be regulated by law, to observe consistently the principles of subsidiarity and solidarity**, to seek to establish the common good

Catholics need to calm down are read the encyclical. It states that this authority would observe consistently subsidiarity. Maybe it’s time conservative catholics spend less time listening to right-wing propaganda on the economy and spiritually and intellectually drink from the deep well of catholic social teaching.