Vatican official says "keep abuse confidential"

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Wow, SOUTANE,

So few do confession? I can’t let a day go by and I repent directly to God. Example is in the Lord’s prayer. Can Catholics ask God for forgiveness and that means you can bypass confession? Or do you do both?
That means a lot of sins are not taken care of. That is scarry.

John
 
Soutane said:
“Soutane has made following this thread darn near impossible by all the mega-posting, but back to the topic,”

Not at all i mega-posted because I am sick and tired of Molestation being portrayed in the media and YES in these forums as a Catholic Disease when in fact it is a Societal one.I quoted all those respectable sources as evidence of my theses.Read them or notPNeuton,I could care less.
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If molestation wasn’t done and covered up by whoever, the CC or society there would be nothing to report. Since that doen’t happen there is always going to be these stories to report on, until Jesus comes back. I being one of many who have been molested as a child and it kept covered up say to the news, Keep on reporting whoever it is that does this terrible evil thing. If there is nothing to hide, then be glad thart it is brought out and cleaned up.
 
pnewton said:
Soutane has made following this thread darn near impossible by all the mega-posting, but back to the topic,

I think that’s his intention LOL One certainly can’t deny his dedication to the Church 🙂

Everyone is entitled to absolution.
**
Well. you’d never know it by some of the snotty-smarty-pants members, who should well know who they are. That was my point. How can you tell someone that their person sin can’t be forgiven, but on the other hand say that a child-molester-priest is entitled to absolution? Makes no sense to me.**

The well of mercy knows no bounds. For those who can not every see forgiving child abusers, perhaps it would help that Jesus bound our own ability to be forgiven by how we are willing to forgive others. If a child abuse sin (or murder) is held as an exception to reconciliation, then other serious sinners who turn to God in mercy may equally need to seek mercy and be deterred by the wagging tongue of the priest. The goal is nothing less than Heaven. As horrible as child abuse is, it is not worse than Hell. The Church maintains perspective between the suffering in this life and the suffering for all eternity that is often lost in emotionally charged topics.

**I agree with that. All sinners need abolution. But they need help to cure them of their disease, and the victims need help too. In addition, there needs to be a procedure in place to prevent the priest from doing it again. I believe that the condition to his absolution should be that he turn himself in to his Bishop. He needs PROPER help, not to be shielded from those who would throw him in jail. And he needs to be removed from the parish so that he doesn’t repeat the crime, which is sadly happening. With a crime so vile against children and even adults, simply being absolved is not enough. A simple absolution will not make him do what is right. In addition, the priest should report him to the Pope or the Bishop so that proper action can be taken. This nonsense of not revealing horrific crimes because the so-called “veil of confession” cannot be allowed in cases such as these. The Pope should rethink this and this is something he CAN do, and perhaps if a Pope would have cared enough about the victims, and would have placed this policies before, we wouldn’t have these problems now. Not to this extent.

It’s unfathomable that steps aren’t taken to fix this problem. Talk is cheap, and so are apologies. Make it happen so that those apologies have meaning. Not, “sorry” and then nothing gets done until the next drama unfolds 20 years later. It should be, sorry, and I’m doing this this and this to prove it, and to take steps to prevent it from happening again.**
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From:
catholiceducation.org/articles/religion/re0059.html
“…It is a crime for a confessor in any way to betray a penitent by word or in any other manner or for any reason” (No. 2490). A priest, therefore, cannot break the seal to save his own life, to protect his good name, to refute a false accusation, to save the life of another, to aid the course of justice (like reporting a crime), or to avert a public calamity. He cannot be compelled by law to disclose a person’s confession or be bound by any oath he takes, e.g. as a witness in a court trial. A priest cannot reveal the contents of a confession either directly, by repeating the substance of what has been said, or indirectly, by some sign, suggestion, or action. A Decree from the Holy Office (Nov. 18, 1682) mandated that confessors are forbidden, even where there would be no revelation direct or indirect, to make any use of the knowledge obtained in the confession that would “displease” the penitent or reveal his identity.
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Please note that even the knowledge gained in confession can not be used to entrap a person. The priest mentioned above that took the penitent aside and then taped him committed an offense for which he could, in accordance with Canon Law, be excommunicated for.
 
Soutane said:
“Soutane has made following this thread darn near impossible by all the mega-posting, but back to the topic,”

Not at all i mega-posted because I am sick and tired of Molestation being portrayed in the media and YES in these forums as a Catholic Disease when in fact it is a Societal one.I quoted all those respectable sources as evidence of my theses.Read them or notPNeuton,I could care less.
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One can link to the post one is cutting and pasting like this:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=116150

Read it, or not. I just believe in following the rules.
 
asmrbd said:
Wow, SOUTANE,

So few do confession? I can’t let a day go by and I repent directly to God. Example is in the Lord’s prayer. Can Catholics ask God for forgiveness and that means you can bypass confession? Or do you do both?
That means a lot of sins are not taken care of. That is scarry.

John
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A lot of Catholics are poorly Catechised and feel they can go "direct"to God which they can with venial sins but mortal sins can only be forgiven by Christ through an ordained Catholic Priest who acts in personae Christi.

I must pray the Our Father a dozen times a day but it certainly does not absolve one mortal sin.I know that your tradition is different and that you don’t have the Sacrament of Confession or Reconciliation but that’s just the way it is for Catholics.
Only 20% of Catholics believe in the Real Presence,however those Catholics don’t even meet their Sunday obligation to attend mass.The Church is "claimed"by Cafeteria Catholics,Catholics in name only,Cultural Catholics,Ethnic Catholics,Christmas and Easter Catholics,Dissident Catholics.
There is a devout Remnant in the Church that consists of about 20% of ALL Catholics.
"TO those who much is given,much is expected"I can’t imagine how those 80% expect to be saved by our Lord.That is why in the Divine Mercy Prayer we pray for them.We also pray that prayer for you.(No offense:)0
 
** This nonsense of not revealing horrific crimes because the so-called “veil of confession” cannot be allowed in cases such as these. The Pope should rethink this and this is something he CAN do, and perhaps if a Pope would have cared enough about the victims, and would have placed this policies before, we wouldn’t have these problems now.**
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It is an unfair characterization and an illogical conclusion that somehow lack of caring and compassion is the reason that we have the seal of confession. Rather it is because of compassion that the Seal exists. It is easy to have compassion for friends, loved ones, children and innocent. The Church is called to have compassion on all. This means ministering to the souls of all. Priests are not police and they are not social workers. They must first and primarily try to reconcile all men to God. It is not something all can do. I sure can’t. I work on the public vengence side. Yet I admire those who can forgive more than I can and respect their role.
 
Soutane said:
What in God’s name do you think the Church is doing NOW?
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Code: 
 I would not want to pick on the CC. But news about trials and convictions would help.
I saw a little grass fire Friday outside my subdivision, I quickly called 911 to stop a small fire. We should have the same fervency for pedophiles. I have a daughter and soon a granddaughter, we should act quickly to make things safe.
I will trust your words that action is being done.
 
Adeodatus said:
Because you said “instead”, that is calumny. Aren’t you proud of yourself?
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Well since i didn’t know the meaning of the word until I looked it up I would say no I did not practice calumny so I cannot be proud. I just called it like I saw it. Sorry if it offended you.
 
Adeodatus said:
Because you said “instead”, that is calumny. Aren’t you proud of yourself?
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Sure is bubba.The Catholic Church is doing more to rid itself of this cancer than all other Faiths combined who are just as guilty and culpable;but some people have an agenda and are selective readers.Tweetymom did you read ONE word of my Polemic?
 
“But news about trials and convictions would help.”

Are you KIDDING ME???That news is everywhere it’s absolutely unavoidable.GOOGLE it.
 
Soutane said:
Sure is bubba.The Catholic Church is doing more to rid itself of this cancer than all other Faiths combined who are just as guilty and culpable;but some people have an agenda and are selective readers.Tweetymom did you read ONE word of my Polemic?
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Tried to read some of your POLEMIC, but got lost cause some of it was too long and drawn out for me. See I am a little old lady who knows much sees much,and doesn’t need 5000 words or big un(name removed by moderator)resive words to say what I need to say. But hey thanks
 
tweetymom said:
Sending letters of apoligy, instead of cleaning house.
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The Church is doin much more than that. Every diocese I know has instituted child sexual assault awareness programs, background checks and zero tolerance on those against whom an allegation is substantiated. I think the forest is being missed for the trees here. Precious little information against predators comes through confession and all that is heard is worthless. For those who are not familiar with rules of evidence, hearsay (that is what a third party confession is) is never admissable at any level for anything. Most child predators are not exactly your most godly of folk and will only be found out when someone speaks out. Now, thanks to new policies, this can take the form of inappropriate behavior and not just sexual abuse. A priest that breaks the rules in dealing with kids will stand out a lot more.

Another step that the Church has taken is in disallowing homosexual men to the priesthood. This will have a profound impact, as the large majority of the sexual abuse was same sex abuse.
 
Originally Posted by tweetymom
“Sending letters of apoligy, instead of cleaning house.”

Using the phrase "instead of cleaning house"IS calumnus as you baldly state that we are not cleaning house when in fact we are!
 
pnewton said:
The Church is doin much more than that. Every diocese I know has instituted child sexual assault awareness programs, background checks and zero tolerance on those against whom an allegation is substantiated. I think the forest is being missed for the trees here. Precious little information against predators comes through confession and all that is heard is worthless. For those who are not familiar with rules of evidence, hearsay (that is what a third party confession is) is never admissable at any level for anything. Most child predators are not exactly your most godly of folk and will only be found out when someone speaks out. Now, thanks to new policies, this can take the form of inappropriate behavior and not just sexual abuse. A priest that breaks the rules in dealing with kids will stand out a lot more.

Another step that the Church has taken is in disallowing homosexual men to the priesthood. This will have a profound impact, as the large majority of the sexual abuse was same sex abuse.
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Thank you for that. I agree with all you said. Thank you for your nice and to the point response not a long orate.
 
tweetymom said:
Tried to read some of your POLEMIC, but got lost cause some of it was too long and drawn out for me. See I am a little old lady who knows much sees much,and doesn’t need 5000 words or big un(name removed by moderator)resive words to say what I need to say. But hey thanks
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So have someone read it to you,you might learn something and avoid further accusations of calumny,and learn the truth as to how the Church is excising this cancer and how protestant denominations are just as guilty but are still in the"cover-up"stage; but the Truth will out about Protestant Sin soon as well…
 
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