Vote a split ticket?

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maryj said:
Dear Thomas, did you read the link posted from CA? the picture in the Democrats for life reads"Groups that support reducing the abortion rate in america" That is not a Pro-life statement, that is not the beliefs of the catholic church. 55 CATHOLIC member of congress recently issued a" statement of principles" It states in essence that they want to support the churchs’ teachings on moral issues, but they can’t quite bring themselves to do it. Especially when it comes to abortion. They envision a world were every child belongs to a loving family and they agree with the catholic church about the value of human life and the undesirability of abortion.They do not celebrate it’s practice, they are each committed to reducing the number of abortions in this country. COMMITTED to REDUCING the NUMBER OF ABORTIONS. Our one and only COMMITTMENT we have as catholics over this issue is LIFE, the committment to life. Like it or not, one of the biggest committments these “catholics” have made this election year is to make you think they are pro-life, they are not, they are pro-choice no matter how you cut up the political pie. I find it very offensive that a political party would use such strategy, and yes, sir, it is a surprise to me that the democratic party would let it even happen. Talk about lack of morality. I inform myself by finding out the voting records of politicians, and even those can be scued, I will vote for life. We don’t get to be catholic and pro-choice. So if you still think those people standing in that picture holding that poster are pro-life politicians, then you mistaken, and James Carville has done his job.
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Maryj,

It’s nice that you looked at the Democrats for Life homepage, but I would recommend clicking on the ‘About Us’ link to learn what the group is really about and what its goals really are.

Here is the group’s mission statement and goals:

Our Mission

"Democrats for Life of America exists to foster respect for life, from the beginning of life to natural death. This includes, but is not limited to, opposition to abortion, capital punishment, and euthanasia. Democrats for Life of America is one of over 200 member organizations of Consistent Life: an international network for peace, justice and life.

What We Do

We mobilize Democrats at local, state, and national levels to:

elect pro-life Democrats to office
support pro-life Democrats while in an elected position
promote a pro-life plank in the Democratic Party platform
achieve pro-life legislation with the help of national and state pro-life democrats
participate actively in Democratic party functions and offices"

There really isn’t any gray area in those statements. The group clearly states that they oppose abortion and work to promote a pro-life plan in the Democratic platform.

Regarding the posterboard statement, that is a realistic statement. Even if Roe v. Wade were overturned tomorrow and abortion were made illegal in all 50 states, do you honestly believe abortion would go away? Of course not, women could still get illegal abortions or just take a morning after pill like Plan B (which our president approved). While the Dems for Life group are trying to get the pro-choice plank out of the Democratic Party platform, at the same time it promotes a mixture of education and pregnancy assistance in its 95-10 plan as way to reduce the incidence of abortion in general.
 
Thomas_B said:
Maryj,

It’s nice that you looked at the Democrats for Life homepage, but I would recommend clicking on the ‘About Us’ link to learn what the group is really about and what its goals really are.

Here is the group’s mission statement and goals:

Our Mission

"Democrats for Life of America exists to foster respect for life, from the beginning of life to natural death. This includes, but is not limited to, opposition to abortion, capital punishment, and euthanasia. Democrats for Life of America is one of over 200 member organizations of Consistent Life: an international network for peace, justice and life.

What We Do

We mobilize Democrats at local, state, and national levels to:

elect pro-life Democrats to office
support pro-life Democrats while in an elected position
promote a pro-life plank in the Democratic Party platform
achieve pro-life legislation with the help of national and state pro-life democrats
participate actively in Democratic party functions and offices"

There really isn’t any gray area in those statements. The group clearly states that they oppose abortion and work to promote a pro-life plan in the Democratic platform.

Regarding the posterboard statement, that is a realistic statement. Even if Roe v. Wade were overturned tomorrow and abortion were made illegal in all 50 states, do you honestly believe abortion would go away? Of course not, women could still get illegal abortions or just take a morning after pill like Plan B (which our president approved). While the Dems for Life group are trying to get the pro-choice plank out of the Democratic Party platform, at the same time it promotes a mixture of education and pregnancy assistance in its 95-10 plan as way to reduce the incidence of abortion in general.
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what their goals really are??mccl.org/
 
My ticket will be split with Dems and some 3rd party candidates. There may be 1 or 2 at the most Republicans I am pondering but thats about it. House cleaning time has come.
 
maryj said:
what their goals really are??mccl.org/
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Okay, so a pro-life organization in Minnesota has made some claims about the DFLA, but they don’t provide much backup for their claims. Here are questions I would have for them.

First allegation: Some Minnesota politicians endorsed by DFLA score better on a local NARAL scorecard than the MCCL’s scorecard. What criteria do these organizations use to determine whether politicians are pro-life or pro-choice? Did the politicians change after they were endorsed by DLFA, are they still endorsed by DFLA? The website claims that the DFLA endorsed ‘several’ candidates that scored 100% on a NARAL scorecard- what constitutes several? How many politicians nationwide endorsed by DFLA have good pro-life records.

Second allegation: Don’t know much about this Minnesota senator or this bill he didn’t support. Does the senator say why he didn’t support it? Has he supported any other pro-life legislation?

Third allegation: A DFLA director supported some ‘pro-abortion’ candidates. First, what is the source for this information- the MCCL doesn’t provide one. But let’s give the MCCL the benefit of the doubt and say they have a credible source. I doubt these politicians would describe themselves as ‘pro-abortion’ but okay, let’s say they don’t have much of a pro-life record. They say that she donated large amounts of cash to pro-abortion candidates, but what constitutes large? Are these large sums of money ot her? And how much did Ms. Robert contribute to pro-life candidates? The MCCL doesn’t say.
 
Andruschak said:
As an RCIA Candidate, the upcoming elections will be my first in which I am required to take in the question of Pro-life candidates. But that means voting Republican, the party where the rich get richer, the poor get poorer, and we can see how “the LOVE of money is the root of all evil”. :mad:

How about this…vote Republican for those who actually legislate and vote on laws, and Democrat on all other administrative positions that do not directly write and vote on laws?😦
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Please check out this link: fathercorapi.com/PDF/Vote2006.pdf

This should give you the necessary guidance.
 
Thomas_B said:
Okay, so a pro-life organization in Minnesota has made some claims about the DFLA, but they don’t provide much backup for their claims. Here are questions I would have for them.

First allegation: Some Minnesota politicians endorsed by DFLA score better on a local NARAL scorecard than the MCCL’s scorecard. What criteria do these organizations use to determine whether politicians are pro-life or pro-choice? Did the politicians change after they were endorsed by DLFA, are they still endorsed by DFLA? The website claims that the DFLA endorsed ‘several’ candidates that scored 100% on a NARAL scorecard- what constitutes several? How many politicians nationwide endorsed by DFLA have good pro-life records.

Second allegation: Don’t know much about this Minnesota senator or this bill he didn’t support. Does the senator say why he didn’t support it? Has he supported any other pro-life legislation?

Third allegation: A DFLA director supported some ‘pro-abortion’ candidates. First, what is the source for this information- the MCCL doesn’t provide one. But let’s give the MCCL the benefit of the doubt and say they have a credible source. I doubt these politicians would describe themselves as ‘pro-abortion’ but okay, let’s say they don’t have much of a pro-life record. They say that she donated large amounts of cash to pro-abortion candidates, but what constitutes large? Are these large sums of money ot her? And how much did Ms. Robert contribute to pro-life candidates? The MCCL doesn’t say.
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first off MCCL is not some pro-life organization in minnesota, it is the sole Minnesota affiliate of the National Right to Life Committee, I’m sure you would not question NRLC’s ability to determine wether or not an elected official is actually voting pro-life or just stating he is pro-life, two totally different things. See here nrlc.org/News_and_Views/index.html then see if you can find his name here democratsforlife.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=210&Itemid=0. I think one of your 10 questions can be answered there. You can go directly to MCCL’s web page and ask these questions directly to them, just click on About MCCL. I’ll be more than willing to do the leg work for you if necessary, just let me know.
 
maryj said:
first off MCCL is not some pro-life organization in minnesota, it is the sole Minnesota affiliate of the National Right to Life Committee, I’m sure you would not question NRLC’s ability to determine wether or not an elected official is actually voting pro-life or just stating he is pro-life, two totally different things. See here nrlc.org/News_and_Views/index.html then see if you can find his name here democratsforlife.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=210&Itemid=0. I think one of your 10 questions can be answered there. You can go directly to MCCL’s web page and ask these questions directly to them, just click on About MCCL. I’ll be more than willing to do the leg work for you if necessary, just let me know.
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Well, you’re right, I can’t find Sen. Dean Johnson’s name on the DFLA weblink you provided or anywhere else on the DFLA website. I guess the DFLA did drop support for Sen. Johnson, good for them.

Regarding the other politicians. Just out of curiousity I did research voting records on some of those listed, particularly the ones in my area and its good to know that they have clean pro-life records. So at least the DFLA in my state has its act together- so I’m good.
 
maryj said:
Dear Thomas, did you read the link posted from CA? the picture in the Democrats for life reads"Groups that support reducing the abortion rate in america" That is not a Pro-life statement, that is not the beliefs of the catholic church. 55 CATHOLIC member of congress recently issued a" statement of principles" It states in essence that they want to support the churchs’ teachings on moral issues, but they can’t quite bring themselves to do it. Especially when it comes to abortion. They envision a world were every child belongs to a loving family and they agree with the catholic church about the value of human life and the undesirability of abortion.They do not celebrate it’s practice, they are each committed to reducing the number of abortions in this country. COMMITTED to REDUCING the NUMBER OF ABORTIONS. Our one and only COMMITTMENT we have as catholics over this issue is LIFE, the committment to life. Like it or not, one of the biggest committments these “catholics” have made this election year is to make you think they are pro-life, they are not, they are pro-choice no matter how you cut up the political pie. I find it very offensive that a political party would use such strategy, and yes, sir, it is a surprise to me that the democratic party would let it even happen. Talk about lack of morality. I inform myself by finding out the voting records of politicians, and even those can be scued, I will vote for life. We don’t get to be catholic and pro-choice. So if you still think those people standing in that picture holding that poster are pro-life politicians, then you mistaken, and James Carville has done his job.
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Well said. i especially liked this!

"55 CATHOLIC member of congress recently issued a" statement of principles" It states in essence that they want to support the churchs’ teachings on moral issues, but they can’t quite bring themselves to do it. Especially when it comes to abortion"

That preety much sums up the postion of all those catholics who claim to be proilife but vote for pro-abortion canidates.
 
CathCentrist said:
My ticket will be split with Dems and some 3rd party candidates. There may be 1 or 2 at the most Republicans I am pondering but thats about it. House cleaning time has come.
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Will there be any voted for pro-abortion canidates on your “ticket” There will be NONE on mine.
 
estesbob said:
Well said. i especially liked this!

"55 CATHOLIC member of congress recently issued a" statement of principles" It states in essence that they want to support the churchs’ teachings on moral issues, but they can’t quite bring themselves to do it. Especially when it comes to abortion"

That preety much sums up the postion of all those catholics who claim to be proilife but vote for pro-abortion canidates.
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Oh really? Is the statement of principles a voting record? The Catholics Democrats are saying that abortion is undesirable- that is against the teachings of the Catholic Church?

Besides, for me personally, I don’t vote for a candidate based on their religion, I vote according to whether they are likely to do something to promote pro-life issues regardless of party affiliation.
 
SeekerJen said:
Democrats for Life

Again, one should always do one’s homework rather than vote straight-ticket based on common perceptions of the parties.
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Finally a breath of relief for those of us who were concerned that we may have no longer any choice other than Republican. Praise be to thee, Christ, for Republicans, Democrats, Independents, etc. who choose the godly way—the one which leads to life.
 
estesbob said:
Ever notice how noble people make voting for abortionists sound
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This is completely INSULTING! How DARE you question my intentions or what my votes are! Just who do you think you are!

Decrying the hypocricy of Republicans is NOT the same as “voting for abortionists.”
 
estesbob said:
Ever notice how noble people make voting for abortionists sound
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What abortionists in what states are running for election? I don’t even recall any such people running even in past elections.

And, certainly, it would be wrong to vote for any such abortionist/candidate - under any circumstances.
 
Richardols said:
What abortionists in what states are running for election? I don’t even recall any such people running even in past elections.

And, certainly, it would be wrong to vote for any such abortionist/candidate - under any circumstances.
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I think an “abortionist” is someone who hasn’t:
  1. Professed being “pro-life” (mere profession is enough)
  2. Run as a Republican (Democrats, Libertarians, American Independents (who ironically are genuinely pro-life in their beliefs!), etc. need not apply).
I’m not sure, but I think that would be it. Please note that this is my OPINION and I could be wrong. I welcome proof of same.
 
LCMS_No_More said:
I think an “abortionist” is someone who hasn’t:
  1. Professed being “pro-life” (mere profession is enough)
  2. Run as a Republican (Democrats, Libertarians, American Independents (who ironically are genuinely pro-life in their beliefs!), etc. need not apply).
I’m not sure, but I think that would be it. Please note that this is my OPINION and I could be wrong. I welcome proof of same.
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I don’t understand your contention no.2 in the slightest bit. Being a Republican (or whatever) is not the same as being pro-life, though it can and very often does coincide. There is no irony that some Democrats, American Independents, etc., are pro-life but not pro-Republican.
 
prv said:
I don’t understand your contention no.2 in the slightest bit. Being a Republican (or whatever) is not the same as being pro-life, though it can and very often does coincide. There is no irony that some Democrats, American Independents, etc., are pro-life but not pro-Republican.
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No, but it has been SAID here by many that if you vote for a pro-life Democrat, you are still voting “pro-abortion” because the party’s platform says “pro-choice-on-abortion.” It has also been said here that if one votes for a third party candidate, they are essentially voting for the “pro-abortion” candidate. What am I to conclude, then? Only Republicans who say that they are “pro-life” are the only ones we may consider unless both major party candidates are pro-choice-on-abortion, in which case, we should choose the one who appear to be the most “pro-life” (which is usually the Republican because of the Republican Party’s so-called pro-life platform).
 
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