Warned about abuse, Vatican failed to defrock priest [NYT]

[Corki]

Here is a list I have composed of individuals who should be defrocked and/or stand civil trial for the abuses against the boys Murphy perpetrated.

Unnamed priest #1 in Madison, WI
Unnamed priest #2
Rev. Tom Schroeder
The two nuns of St. John’s school who knew about the abuses and did little or nothing to help these boys
Father Walsh
Archbishop Albert Gregory Meyer of Milwaukee,
Archbishop William E. Cousins
Archbishop Rembert G. Weakland
Pope Benedict XVI

Criminal/Civil lawsuits:
Members of the Milwaukee police department who turned a deaf ear
E. Michael McCann, the district attorney of Milwaukee County
DA Assistant, William Gardner

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////

I left off Cardinal Bertone!

WOW! Might I ask what your credentials are for determining this without a tribunal, civil charges or even identifying the individuals? You must be both a legal expert (in civil and canon law) but clairvoyant as well.

 

[anode]

WOW! Might I ask what your credentials are for determining this without a tribunal, civil charges or even identifying the individuals? You must be both a legal expert (in civil and canon law) but clairvoyant as well.

Weakland asked for the Cardinal’s intervention. Archbishops Meyer and Cousins* were *negligent–they’re dead, aren’t they? The two Milwaukee bishops Fliss and Sklba were dismayed at the slap-on-the-wrist approach from Bertone.

But Bertone undoubtedly was representing the Cardinal. The response of the Congregation to Archbishop Weakland’s request for adjudication and advice was not pro-active in the least. It was slow and reluctant, eventually relying on Murphy’s advanced age and declining health to postpone a trial, until finally, and conveniently, I must say, Murphy died.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Hi again,

There is a poll on msnbc asking if Pope Benedict is too compromised to continue. Of over 15,000 votes almost 80% say “yes”

Lux

 

[Corki]

Weakland asked for the Cardinal’s intervention. Archbishops Meyer and Cousins* were *negligent–they’re dead, aren’t they? The two Milwaukee bishops Fliss and Sklba were dismayed at the slap-on-the-wrist approach from Bertone.

But Bertone undoubtedly was representing the Cardinal. The response of the Congregation to Archbishop Weakland’s request for adjudication and advice was not pro-active in the least. It was slow and reluctant, eventually relying on Murphy’s advanced age and declining health to postpone a trial, until finally, and conveniently, I must say, Murphy died.

And none of that adds up to circumstances that would result in an ordained priest or bishop being “defrocked” or put on trial without investigation, tribunal procedures and due process.

 

[pnewton]

It isn’t random that pedophile priests were hidden across the globe shows; it’s a conspiracy.

Spoken like a Dan Brown novel.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Weakland asked for the Cardinal’s intervention. Archbishops Meyer and Cousins* were *negligent–they’re dead, aren’t they? The two Milwaukee bishops Fliss and Sklba were dismayed at the slap-on-the-wrist approach from Bertone.

But Bertone undoubtedly was representing the Cardinal. The response of the Congregation to Archbishop Weakland’s request for adjudication and advice was not pro-active in the least. It was slow and reluctant, eventually relying on Murphy’s advanced age and declining health to postpone a trial, until finally, and conveniently, I must say, Murphy died.

And none of that adds up to circumstances that would result in an ordained priest or bishop being “defrocked” or put on trial without investigation, tribunal procedures and due process.

The so-called priest admitted his guilt when he asked for compassion. The people were crying for justice and atonement. This priest should have been defrocked—no trial was necessary. he confessed in writing. He was given compassion—where was the compassion for the victims? This to me, is the most damaging fact.

The priorities were not what is needed for the spiritual leader.

Lux

 

[Thekla]

Spoken like a Dan Brown novel.

No. It’s spoken like a Catholic. When across the globe, you have priests raping and molesting children and the hierarchy of the Church covering for them, you have a conspiracy.

I’m not talking about a conspiracy to abuse children, I’m talking about a conspiracy to hide the problem.

 

[Corki]

The so-called priest admitted his guilt when he asked for compassion. The people were crying for justice and atonement. This priest should have been defrocked—no trial was necessary. he confessed in writing. He was given compassion—where was the compassion for the victims? This to me, is the most damaging fact.

The priorities were not what is needed for the spiritual leader.

Lux

I am 99% sure that even with a confession, a priest cannot be “defrocked” without following a process as laid out in canon law. (Canon lawyers, feel free to correct me here) His plea for compassion, which is where his confession lay, was just days before his death. The process could hardly have been carried out poshumously.

 

[pnewton]

No. It’s spoken like a Catholic. When across the globe, you have priests raping and molesting children and the hierarchy of the Church covering for them, you have a conspiracy.

I’m not talking about a conspiracy to abuse children, I’m talking about a conspiracy to hide the problem.

Then by your definition, all law enforecement is also in conspiracy. But still, some folks will use words as they will without regard to their meaning. Do you have one shred of evidence that these the hierarchy of the Church, as a group, ever got together to hid any thing? If you do, please share it because it would be ground breaking news. Even the most anti-God of media hasn’t come up with that one yet, although Dan Brown may be working it together in his next book.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

I am 99% sure that even with a confession, a priest cannot be “defrocked” without following a process as laid out in canon law. (Canon lawyers, feel free to correct me here) His plea for compassion, which is where his confession lay, was just days before his death. The process could hardly have been carried out poshumously.

With a confession, the trial could certainly have been put on the fast track. It was over six months before the death, and Weakland had written 2 years before. Something should have been done, especially with such a demand for justice, as Weakland reported. Please don’t minimize—I am disturbed enough over the whole situation. Benedict has never shown that he had his priorities right. Where was the concern for over 200 victims?

SuZ

 

[Writer]

Anyone alive who knew about this in our hierarchy, and did nothing…(there would need to be an investigation of course) should step down. You should not be permitted to hold a position in the clergy, if you have commited crimes against children. It’s outrageous to me, but if we started taking action LIKE THAT, maybe the Church wouldn’t be mocked and torn to bits in the media. We just keep writing checks to the victims, which if a good thing and understandable, and necessary–but we need to go beyond that. Anyone who knew about crimes against kids and had a hand in those priests being permitted to carry on such atrocities elsewhere, should be required to step down. I don’t care how far that ends up going…it’s wrong that someone can hold a position within our clergy, who was responsible for either perpetrating or enabling priests to perpetrate abuse against kids in various other parishes, once discovered. God forgives, and so should we. But, there needs to be justice for those who were abused that goes beyond money. (

Well said… Time for a very aggressive cleaning of the Lord’s house. For every one of these sins against children, there are reprecussions far into the future–not just the direct victims, but the indirect victims. The betrayal is gut-wrenching indeed.

 

[Paul1961]

Proof of a conspiracy?

Conspiracy or gross incompetence.

Take your pick.

 

[Hans2010]

I say again, this is not about theology or religion, it is about law. If a Pastor at some parish shot and killed a parishioner, would the hierarchy of our Church simply sweep it under the rug and move him to another parish, even to another country? I don’t believe that it would. If that is true, then, this begs the question, “why is the abuse of children not taken as a serious violation of the civil law, let alone religious law? Why would our Church do this when it involves the most innocent amongst us; those Christ so clearly cherished.

In this mornings Phila. Inquirer, there is a letter to the editor that mentions something I had completely forgotten…the transfer of Cardinal Bernard Law from Boston to Rome and his appointment to the Basilica of St. Mary, an important church there… I believe that it is exactly this kind of response in the past that has severely wounded our Church and caused this evil to flourish. This is WHY we are where we are now.

I do not know what our Pope did, or did not know about this, but in the end, he IS Peter on earth, with all of the obligations that fall upon such shoulders. It IS his obligation to find out exactly what happened and it IS his obligation to strip away the Priesthood from anyone who has committed such crimes, or covered up such crimes, or in any way contributed to the harm of the innocents.

If this means that many Bishops and Cardinals are defrocked for concealing this evil, together with the Priests who actually carried out these acts, then so be it. You do not cure cancer by removing only the surface, you dig it out and you destroy it.

We have no right to call ourselves Christ’s church if we do not do this. And one must wonder if this Pope is Peter on earth if he does not rise to this task.

 

[pnewton]

I say again, this is not about theology or religion, it is about law. If a Pastor at some parish shot and killed a parishioner, would the hierarchy of our Church simply sweep it under the rug and move him to another parish, even to another country? I don’t believe that it would.

They might move such a priest, if he was no billed, or found not guilty in a court of law. Surely such a thing would not happen if he was convicted.

 

[spn82756]

They migh move such a priest, if he was no billed, or found not guilty in a court of law. Surely such a thing would not happen if he was convicted.

I’m not sure that is the best answer. Many pedophiles in the general public are never convicted. We have an obligation to stand for immorality and against sin.

Cardinal Law is an example of one who failed miserably. Bishop Weakland is a close second.

How do we convince those that are not Catholic…that we are the true Church? We must stand up to God’s laws.

Steve

 

[pnewton]

I’m not sure that is the best answer. Many pedophiles in the general public are never convicted.

The question I responded to was not about pedophiles, but a priest who shot someone. In either case, some affirmative ruling needs to be made that something happened.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

They might move such a priest, if he was no billed, or found not guilty in a court of law. Surely such a thing would not happen if he was convicted.

Not exactly true. The Dallas Charter does not requrie a conviction, it only requries that the accusation be “credible.” If a bishop finds an accusation credible he then suspends the priest and applies to Rome for the priest to be permanently removed from ministerial priesthood.

However, let’s say a priest was accused and in the coure of trial it became obvious that the priest is innocent then, yes, he’d be moved to some other diocese if he wanted to continue in priesthood. But even then I’m not sure how many bishops would be willing to take him.