T
theCardinalbird
Guest
Possibly yes.
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B
buffalo
Guest
Moses may have complied the Pentateuch from tablets he had in his possession that were passed down.
The colophon phrases show a continuity of the historical accounts of the generations.
The colophon phrases show a continuity of the historical accounts of the generations.
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Mike_from_NJ
Guest
If you could, first tell me of Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 which of those accurately reflects the order things came into existence. From there we can discuss whether that is accurate or not.I think you will.
B
buffalo
Guest
Was Genesis wrong about Creation? No.
And we also have Jesus doubling down on historical Genesis and the promise of protection by the Holy Spirit.
And we also have Jesus doubling down on historical Genesis and the promise of protection by the Holy Spirit.
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laylow
Guest
Do you think it is meant to be taken literally?That’s true. But these sorts of threads mainly consist of posters who insist none of it is literal for various reasons.
B
buffalo
Guest
Yes, as to what the author intended to convey.Do you think it is meant to be taken literally?
N
Norseman82
Guest
To me, it shows that one cannot take both accounts super-literally.The two accounts are complementary. One tells the order of creation, the other the importance of man.
B
buffalo
Guest
Please detail.
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joeybaggz
Guest
One must remember that from Abraham to Moses, 1850 to 1250 B.C. every tribe has an elder whose task it was to hand down the history of the tribe orally. Moses wrote Exodus in 1250. He then wrote Genesis second to give an explanation where mankind itself came from. The oral traditions were incorporated into his writing.
Remember, 1250B.C. was a long time prior to Copernicus, Galileo, Darwin, and the other creation scientists and scientific thought itself. Moses’ Genesis was a divinely inspired story encapsulating the truths of creation, if not the scientific facts. That would come later. To attempt to completely understand the factual accuracy and history of Genesis in light of 21st century scholarship is a fools errand.
I think posts like these are simply exercise for the non-believers on this forum to run and play.
Remember, 1250B.C. was a long time prior to Copernicus, Galileo, Darwin, and the other creation scientists and scientific thought itself. Moses’ Genesis was a divinely inspired story encapsulating the truths of creation, if not the scientific facts. That would come later. To attempt to completely understand the factual accuracy and history of Genesis in light of 21st century scholarship is a fools errand.
I think posts like these are simply exercise for the non-believers on this forum to run and play.
B
buffalo
Guest
In the beginning (time), God created the heavens (space) and the earth (matter).
This was Revealed in the beginning and science just confirmed recently.
This was Revealed in the beginning and science just confirmed recently.
T
theCardinalbird
Guest
I just wanted a friendly debate and insight on the issueI think posts like these are simply exercise for the non-believers on this forum to run and play.
B
buffalo
Guest
Dogmas
God the Creator
The Divine Act of Creation
The Beginning or Creation of the World
All that exists outside God was, in its whole substance, produced out of nothing by God. (De fide.)
The world is the work of the Divine Wisdom. (Sent. certa.)
God was moved by His Goodness to create the world. (De fide.)
The world created for the Glorification of God. (De fide.)
The Three Divine Persons are one single, common Principle of the Creation. (De fide.)
God created the world free from exterior compulsion and inner necessity. (De fide.)
God was free to create this world or any other. (Sent. Certa.)
God has created a good world. (De fide.)
The world had a beginning in time. (De fide.)
God alone created the World. (De fide.)
No Creature can, as Principal Cause (causa principalis) that is, from its own power, create something out of nothing. (Sent. communis.)
The Continuous Preservation and Governing of the World
God keeps all created things in existence. (De fide.)
God co-operates immediately in every act of His creatures. (Sent. communis.)
God through His providence, protects and guides all that He has created. (De fide.)
The Divine Work of Creation
The Doctrine of Revelation Regarding Man or “Christian Anthropology”
The first man was created by God. (De fide.)
The whole human race stems from one single human pair. (Sent. certa.)
Man consists of two essential parts–a material body and a spiritual soul. (De fide.)
The rational soul is per se the essential form of the body. (De fide.)
Every human being possesses an individual soul. (De fide.)
Every individual soul was immediately created out of nothing by God. (Sent. Certa.)
A creature has the capacity to receive supernatural gifts. (Sent. communis.)
The Supernatural presupposes Nature. (Sent communis.)
God has conferred on man a supernatural Destiny. (De fide.)
Our first parents, before the Fall, were endowed with sanctifying grace. (De fide.)
The donum rectitudinis or integritatis in the narrower sense, i.e., the freedom from irregular desire. (Sent. fidei proxima.)
The donum immortalitatis, i.e., bodily immortality. (De fide.)
The donum impassibilitatis, i.e., the freedom from suffering. (Sent. communis.)
The donum scientiae, i.e., a knowledge of natural and supernatural truths infused by God. (Sent. communis.)
Adam received sanctifying grace not merely for himself, but for all his posterity. (Sent. certa.)
Our first parents in paradise sinned grievously through transgression of the Divine probationary commandment. (De fide.)
Through the sin our first parents lost sanctifying grace and provoked the anger and the indignation of God. (De fide.)
Our first parents became subject to death and to the dominion of the Devil. (De fide.) D788.
Adam’s sin is transmitted to his posterity, not by imitation, but by descent. (De fide.)
Original Sin consists in the deprivation of grace caused by the free act of sin committed by the head of the race. (Sent. communis.)
God the Creator
The Divine Act of Creation
The Beginning or Creation of the World
All that exists outside God was, in its whole substance, produced out of nothing by God. (De fide.)
The world is the work of the Divine Wisdom. (Sent. certa.)
God was moved by His Goodness to create the world. (De fide.)
The world created for the Glorification of God. (De fide.)
The Three Divine Persons are one single, common Principle of the Creation. (De fide.)
God created the world free from exterior compulsion and inner necessity. (De fide.)
God was free to create this world or any other. (Sent. Certa.)
God has created a good world. (De fide.)
The world had a beginning in time. (De fide.)
God alone created the World. (De fide.)
No Creature can, as Principal Cause (causa principalis) that is, from its own power, create something out of nothing. (Sent. communis.)
The Continuous Preservation and Governing of the World
God keeps all created things in existence. (De fide.)
God co-operates immediately in every act of His creatures. (Sent. communis.)
God through His providence, protects and guides all that He has created. (De fide.)
The Divine Work of Creation
The Doctrine of Revelation Regarding Man or “Christian Anthropology”
The first man was created by God. (De fide.)
The whole human race stems from one single human pair. (Sent. certa.)
Man consists of two essential parts–a material body and a spiritual soul. (De fide.)
The rational soul is per se the essential form of the body. (De fide.)
Every human being possesses an individual soul. (De fide.)
Every individual soul was immediately created out of nothing by God. (Sent. Certa.)
A creature has the capacity to receive supernatural gifts. (Sent. communis.)
The Supernatural presupposes Nature. (Sent communis.)
God has conferred on man a supernatural Destiny. (De fide.)
Our first parents, before the Fall, were endowed with sanctifying grace. (De fide.)
The donum rectitudinis or integritatis in the narrower sense, i.e., the freedom from irregular desire. (Sent. fidei proxima.)
The donum immortalitatis, i.e., bodily immortality. (De fide.)
The donum impassibilitatis, i.e., the freedom from suffering. (Sent. communis.)
The donum scientiae, i.e., a knowledge of natural and supernatural truths infused by God. (Sent. communis.)
Adam received sanctifying grace not merely for himself, but for all his posterity. (Sent. certa.)
Our first parents in paradise sinned grievously through transgression of the Divine probationary commandment. (De fide.)
Through the sin our first parents lost sanctifying grace and provoked the anger and the indignation of God. (De fide.)
Our first parents became subject to death and to the dominion of the Devil. (De fide.) D788.
Adam’s sin is transmitted to his posterity, not by imitation, but by descent. (De fide.)
Original Sin consists in the deprivation of grace caused by the free act of sin committed by the head of the race. (Sent. communis.)
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joeybaggz
Guest
Sorry, I had just read a number of the posts from non-Catholics that I lost sight of the fact that the thread was initiated by a Roman Catholic. Oops.I just wanted a friendly debate and insight on the issue
B
buffalo
Guest
cont’d
Original sin is transmitted by natural generation. (De fide.)
In the state of original sin man is deprived of sanctifying grace and all that this implies, as well as of the preternatural gifts of integrity. (De fide in regard to Sanctifying Grace and the Donum Immortalitatus. D788 et seq.)
Souls who depart this life in the state of original sin are excluded from the Beatific Vision of God. (De fide.)
Original sin is transmitted by natural generation. (De fide.)
In the state of original sin man is deprived of sanctifying grace and all that this implies, as well as of the preternatural gifts of integrity. (De fide in regard to Sanctifying Grace and the Donum Immortalitatus. D788 et seq.)
Souls who depart this life in the state of original sin are excluded from the Beatific Vision of God. (De fide.)
B
buffalo
Guest
Revelation Concerning the Angels or “Christian Angelology”
In the beginning of time God created spiritual essences (angels) out of nothing. (De fide.)
The nature of angels is spiritual. (De fide.)
The angels are by nature immortal. (Sent. communis.)
God set a supernatural final end for the angels, the immediate vision of God, and endowed them with sanctifying grace in order that they might achieve this end. (Sent. Certa.)
The angels were subjected to a moral testing. (Sent. certa. as regards the fallen angels, Sent. communis as regards the good.)
The evil spirits (demons) were created good by God; they became evil through their own fault.
The primary task of the good angels is the glorification and the service of God. (Sent. certa.)
The secondary task of the good angels is the protection of men and care for their salvation. (De fide on the ground of general teaching.)
Every one of the faithful has his own special guardian angel from baptism. (Sent. certa.)
The Devil possesses a certain dominion over mankind by reason of Adam’s sin. (De fide.)
In the beginning of time God created spiritual essences (angels) out of nothing. (De fide.)
The nature of angels is spiritual. (De fide.)
The angels are by nature immortal. (Sent. communis.)
God set a supernatural final end for the angels, the immediate vision of God, and endowed them with sanctifying grace in order that they might achieve this end. (Sent. Certa.)
The angels were subjected to a moral testing. (Sent. certa. as regards the fallen angels, Sent. communis as regards the good.)
The evil spirits (demons) were created good by God; they became evil through their own fault.
The primary task of the good angels is the glorification and the service of God. (Sent. certa.)
The secondary task of the good angels is the protection of men and care for their salvation. (De fide on the ground of general teaching.)
Every one of the faithful has his own special guardian angel from baptism. (Sent. certa.)
The Devil possesses a certain dominion over mankind by reason of Adam’s sin. (De fide.)
J
joeybaggz
Guest
Well, in today’s thinking, those who, by no choice of their own, die in the state of original sin, are given some means of coming to accept the mercy and generosity of God and accomplish entry into eternal life. I like that thought better.Souls who depart this life in the state of original sin are excluded from the Beatific Vision of God. (De fide.)
B
buffalo
Guest
See invincible and vincible ignorance.Well, in today’s thinking, those who, by no choice of their own, die in the state of original sin, are given some means of coming to accept the mercy and generosity of God and accomplish entry into eternal life. I like that thought better.
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thistle
Guest
J
joeybaggz
Guest
I’d rather reflect on the great mercy Jesus showed to the Adulteress, the paralytic, the widow at Nain, Jairus, Bartimaeus, Lazarus, the man born blind, and finally, the Good Thief. I’m tired of academic Catholicism.See invincible and vincible ignorance.
B
buffalo
Guest
Yes, God is all merciful. We must not forget He is perfectly just.
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